Grub's Canucks & NHL News, Rumours, and & Fantasy GM | Chaotic Times

[wonton15]

View attachment 964355

Bolds everything but the 8x$15M??

 

[Vector]

We're straying real deep into the speculation department.

Mods are asleep everyone post their JT thin blue line pics.

The f*** you talking about? I deleted that shit the moment you decided it was a good idea.

 

[supercanuck]

Give it up with the injury nonsense that literally everyone involved has said is not a factor in Pettersson's play. The f***ing GM just came out and ripped Pettersson's compete and preparation a couple weeks ago.

Like, Miller was the guy who was *actually* injured when he was benched FFS.

The coach came out like last week and said he wasn't though. No excuses either for JT.

 

[Bobby9]

Can we not send both EP and JT to a shaman in Mexico for a ayahuasca trip and hopefully shatter both of their egos and return as best friends

Miller has been providing a lot of cover for EP40, on and off the ice, it will be interesting to see how EP40 performs once that cover is gone and inferior players and less media fronting personalities are in Miller's place.

I don't think it bodes well for Pettersson, the team, or EP40 as a tradable asset come summer.

Nobody will miss Miller on the ice more than EP40.

He is gonna get ventilated.

 

[Peen]

I was posting on the rangers board this morning and I realized when I was typing that Suter hasn't been discussed since he went on that stupid heater and everyone was saying to sign him.

I really like him as a 7th forward but he's going to get more than 7th forward money this summer.

Wonder what we could get for him. And if we can take that and flip that at the draft for something with term and less money than what he'll get on his next deal.

 

[arttk]

Give it up with the injury nonsense that literally everyone involved has said is not a factor in Pettersson's play. The f***ing GM just came out and ripped Pettersson's compete and preparation a couple weeks ago.

Like, Miller was the guy who was *actually* injured when he was benched FFS.

Like I said, you keep on ignoring the data. @ohnoeszz did an analysis about how Petey just don’t have the acceleration to get to the right spots and you just ignored it and blame it on compete. We see him dogging it and he’s just slow right now and lack any of the acceleration we’ve seen from him in the past. I
Beyond that, you would rather believe the coaching staff is giving one preferential treatment. Truth is if effort is truly the one and only issue with Petey then they would’ve sat his ass a long time ago.

I think they want Petey to figure out a play style that works even when he is injured and playing at like 70-80% of what the body can offer because long term that is without a doubt a better outcome. but I think we are seeing that he can’t really overcome the lack of acceleration because of his knee.

How about Marner to the Canucks, 8x$15M?

Sasson Suter Marner
DeBrusk Pettersson DiGiuseppe

Wtf

 

[Nick Lang]

This is what I've suspected from the start as well.

Pettersson basically didn't compete for 50 games and no-showed the playoffs and was handled with the softest kid gloves and then Miller has a bad couple games and gets benched and embarrassed by the coach, and probably (and justifably) blew up as a result.

The coaching staff seemed to have a 'JT can handle it, and it worked last time a couple years ago' attitude to benching him, but nobody likes being benched and if I was in Miller's shoes I would have been absolutely f***ing choked after watching Pettersson get coddled while his play and compete level was much worse.

If think it's Miller's giving up on the puck, visibly pouting and quitting on his teammates that's a no go with RT. I agree with that line. Petterson has looked uninterested and not at his best like all players but I don't see him quitting mid play and making donkey moves with the puck in dangerous spots like Miller, or spazzing out when the going gets rough.

Miller deserved to be benched at times imo. However, this should have nothing whatsoever to do with Petterson either. If that's his attitude than yeah that's completely unacceptable in my books. Can't have that kind of crap on the team.

 

[MS]

The coach came out like last week and said he wasn't though. No excuses either for JT.

Not now, but back in October and the run-up to the initial benching Miller was clearly injured (rumoured neck/shoulder stuff). Didn't play the entire preseason. Wasn't taking faceoffs for a while. Had a couple occasions when he went to the dressing room mid-game.

 

[bossram]

Miller is a big, tough, fiery North American, and that's the difference. Racism and xenophobia very much exist.

This is still largely the same fanbase that wanted to trade the *Sedin Sisters*

Absolutely. Miller throws tantrums at teammates and pouts his way off the ice, but the dumbest 40% of the fanbase love it because JT is "passionate" and "fiery", And then ignore his every-other-game controller disconnected moments.

Quoted for truth but I see people doing it to Miller now based on their own extrapolation of what little information we’ve been given as well.

If I see one more “that’s what fans doooooo” I might puke. We are so willing to dole out everyone else’s lack of accountability and ignore our own. I’m just as guilty, most of us are adult fans now.

I just call it like I see it.

 

[Bobby9]

Like I said, you keep on ignoring the data. @ohnoeszz did an analysis about how Petey just don’t have the acceleration to get to the right spots and you just ignored it and blame it on compete. We see him dogging it and he’s just slow right now and lack any of the acceleration we’ve seen from him in the past. I
Beyond that, you would rather believe the coaching staff is giving one preferential treatment. Truth is if effort is truly the one and only issue with Petey then they would’ve sat his ass a long time ago.

I think they want Petey to figure out a play style that works even when he is injured and playing at like 70-80% of what the body can offer because long term that is without a doubt a better outcome. but I think we are seeing that he can’t really overcome the lack of acceleration because of his knee.


Wtf

Thats great. What if that data is wrong?

 

[bossram]

Both guys clearly have major personality issues.

Miller has poor emotional control that becomes toxic when things are going wrong for him and Pettersson stops competing and turns into a sulky pissbaby when things are going wrong for him. Take your pick.

Harsh disagree. It's not equivalent.

For this season, I strongly disagree that Petey has not been competing. He's trying. He's doing most of the right things. He's still hitting, blocking shots, making good defensive reads. Obviously he's not been as effective as he's expected to be. But he still has baseline professionalism on the ice (and off).

Miller literally just stops playing every other game. Pouts his way off the ice with his controller disconnected moments. Some of the laziest instances I've ever seen in the NHL are from him.

 

[krutovsdonut]

I was posting on the rangers board this morning and I realized when I was typing that Suter hasn't been discussed since he went on that stupid heater and everyone was saying to sign him.

I really like him as a 7th forward but he's going to get more than 7th forward money this summer.

Wonder what we could get for him. And if we can take that and flip that at the draft for something with term and less money than what he'll get on his next deal.

he's had an uneven season and i think is not getting more than a third or a b prospect which is unlikely to be worth it to deplete the roster of centres. i don't think we can afford to re-sign him but i also don't think our playoff fate will be sufficiently decided by the tdl so he will not go anywhere, especially if we trade miller.

 

[bossram]

Miller has been providing a lot of cover for EP40, on and off the ice, it will be interesting to see how EP40 performs once that cover is gone and inferior players and less media fronting personalities are in Miller's place.

I don't think it bodes well for Pettersson, the team, or EP40 as a tradable asset come summer.

Petey played better during the stretch management told JT to take a hike.

 

[Bobby9]

Harsh disagree. It's not equivalent.

For this season, I strongly disagree that Petey has not been competing. He's trying. He's doing most of the right things. He's still hitting, blocking shots, making good defensive reads. Obviously he's not been as effective as he's expected to be. But he still has baseline professionalism on the ice (and off).

Miller literally just stops playing every other game. Pouts his way off the ice with his controller disconnected moments. Some of the laziest instances I've ever seen in the NHL are from him.

Miller's has more extremes. He plays amazing and then terrible.

EP40 just disappoints continuously.

 

[bossram]

Miller's has more extremes. He plays amazing and then terrible.

EP40 just disappoints continuously.

Again, no disagreement Petey has disappointed.

The argument from others is that Petey is "not competing". I don't think a guy that's "not competing" would be the team's best defensive forward overall and block shots consistently.

We know that every other game Miller throws a fit and just literally decides to stop playing.

 

[MS]

If think it's Miller's giving up on the puck, visibly pouting and quitting on his teammates that's a no go with RT. I agree with that line. Petterson has looked uninterested and not at his best like all players but I don't see him quitting mid play and making donkey moves with the puck in dangerous spots like Miller, or spazzing out when the going gets rough.

Miller deserved to be benched at times imo. However, this should have nothing whatsoever to do with Petterson either. If that's his attitude than yeah that's completely unacceptable in my books. Can't have that kind of crap on the team.

Like, I'm pretty sure if any of us had a coworker who was mailing it in day after day for months while the boss did nothing and you were picking up their slack, and then you take a long lunch once and get written up ... you'd be choked.

Miller handled a benching very well previously two seasons ago and responded with the best play of his career in the 1.5 seasons after that, and I think Tocchet misjudged the situation and went back to that well again at a time where the benching was bound to feel really unfair to Miller. Like, nobody else on this team got benched. Myers didn't get benched no matter what. Boeser didn't get benched no matter what. Pettersson didn't get benched no matter what. But because Miller is 'tougher' or better able to handle it or something he gets singled out.

In terms of their play, Miller even at his worst is still mostly competing and producing but then has random isolated plays where he just quits on the play. Even in that LA game, there was one play where he had a monster of a backcheck to negate an odd-man rush, and then just a godawful effort on a goal a few shifts later. Pettersson just goes into the void and doesn't compete for months. Miller's individual moments look worse but I think the whole overall 'thing' from Pettersson is worse.

 

[Wisp]

If Miller isn’t getting the best value in a return, then I’d keep him and start shopping Pettersson.

Only one of them have to go to fix the locker room issue. IMO, it should be whoever fetches us the best possible return.

You're going to be trading Miller 6 months anyways. Trading Pettersson isn't going to stop Miller from being volatile. It'll be some new drama down the road and we'll be doing this all over again.

Just get what you can for JT and send him on his way. The volatility is costing him way more to keep him at this point.

 

[MS]

Again, no disagreement Petey has disappointed.

The argument from others is that Petey is "not competing". I don't think a guy that's "not competing" would be the team's best defensive forward overall and block shots consistently.

We know that every other game Miller throws a fit and just literally decides to stop playing.

He's competed better in this most recent stretch of non-production but his compete in the last 30 games of last year + first 10-15 games of this year was utterly abysmal. Worse than anything in JT Miller's career. By a mile.

 

[Bgav]

So was the trade: Chytl, Lindgren, Sykora, Chemlar + 1st?

 

[Dana Murzyn]

One of management's "mistakes" was digging themselves out of the Benning mess a year earlier than anyone imagined possible and artificially raising expectations (including maybe their own). They're still holding a lot of JB's crappy cards -- and they got dealt some doozies this year -- so I'm willing to cut them some slack.

 

[xtr3m]

Depends on how badly Miller blew up at coaching and management. There is a line you don’t cross and if you do, management has to take action. Not taking action back then would’ve been worse for coaching and management because you don’t want to end up being seen as playing favorites.

Even if Miller did blow up the management completely... mismanaged it making it a PR disaster.

 

[valkynax]

Hmm, it's a whole lot of nothing in the end.

Whatever, let the puck and ice do the talking. So far the results on ice have been far less than impressive to put it lightly. Winning will cool things off, consistent winning will solve everything.

And again, I am not against denying a trade offer that makes no sense. But if the losing continues and trades are no attainable, they have to figure out other ways to help the team.

 

[pitseleh]

Miller handled a benching very well previously two seasons ago and responded with the best play of his career in the 1.5 seasons after that, and I think Tocchet misjudged the situation and went back to that well again at a time where the benching was bound to feel really unfair to Miller. Like, nobody else on this team got benched. Myers didn't get benched no matter what. Boeser didn't get benched no matter what. Pettersson didn't get benched no matter what. But because Miller is 'tougher' or better able to handle it or something he gets singled out.

I disagree. He was benched after he was too busy yelling at Pettersson to take away a passing lane from the guy he was supposed to be defending. He’s had a bunch of boneheaded plays before and after that but never gotten benched. I don’t think the situations are really comparable.

 

[MS]

Like I said, you keep on ignoring the data. @ohnoeszz did an analysis about how Petey just don’t have the acceleration to get to the right spots and you just ignored it and blame it on compete. We see him dogging it and he’s just slow right now and lack any of the acceleration we’ve seen from him in the past. I
Beyond that, you would rather believe the coaching staff is giving one preferential treatment. Truth is if effort is truly the one and only issue with Petey then they would’ve sat his ass a long time ago.

I think they want Petey to figure out a play style that works even when he is injured and playing at like 70-80% of what the body can offer because long term that is without a doubt a better outcome. but I think we are seeing that he can’t really overcome the lack of acceleration because of his knee.


Wtf

I've explained multiple times the issues with the Edge data but you guys just don't want to hear it.

And per your initial point, the notion that the Canucks would know that their $11 million superstar was injured but would consistently deny it, allow him to get savaged for his poor play when they could easily take that heat off him, and then repeatedly criticize his compete and preparation ... makes literally zero sense. Take your head out of the sand, man.

 

[TruGr1t]

Allvin and Rutherford’s approach to trading JT Miller: