Goalies with the most upset series wins

[pnep]

Goalies, Most Times Upsetted in PO Series (Seasons: 1917-2024; Played min. 25% Team Games per Series)

Goalies_PO_Series_Upsetted

tinyurl.com

Goalies, Most Times Upsetted in PO Series (Seasons: 1917-2024; Played min. 25% Team Games per Series; min. 10% Team PTS DIF)

Goalies_PO_Series_Upsetted_min_10%

tinyurl.com

Skaters, Most Times Upsetted in PO Series (Seasons: 1917-2024; Played min. 25% Team Games per Series)

Skaters_PO_Series_Upsetted

tinyurl.com

Skaters, Most Times Upsetted in PO Series (Seasons: 1917-2024; Played min. 25% Team Games per Series; min. 10% Team PTS DIF)

Skaters_PO_Series_Upsetted_min_10%

tinyurl.com

 

[Michael Farkas]

I gotta say, any stat where Carey Price is the best and Chris Osgood/Andy Moog are the worst...that might be the best stat of all time haha

 

[JackSlater]

Goalies, Most Times Upsetted in PO Series (Seasons: 1917-2024; Played min. 25% Team Games per Series)

Goalies_PO_Series_Upsetted

tinyurl.com

Goalies, Most Times Upsetted in PO Series (Seasons: 1917-2024; Played min. 25% Team Games per Series; min. 10% Team PTS DIF)

Goalies_PO_Series_Upsetted_min_10%

tinyurl.com

Skaters, Most Times Upsetted in PO Series (Seasons: 1917-2024; Played min. 25% Team Games per Series)

Skaters_PO_Series_Upsetted

tinyurl.com

Skaters, Most Times Upsetted in PO Series (Seasons: 1917-2024; Played min. 25% Team Games per Series; min. 10% Team PTS DIF)

Skaters_PO_Series_Upsetted_min_10%

tinyurl.com

Seeing Osgood there did not surprise me but did make me sad.

 

[Hockey Outsider]

pnep, thanks (as always) for sharing the data so readily. No surprises in seeing Vernon, Fleury and Osgood near the top of the first table (most times upset in the playoffs).

If I can make one more request - are you able to show these tables (underdog wins and/or upset losses) as a percentage of the qualifying series (ie underdog wins, divided by the number of series where they were the underdog)? Some of the names near the top are surprising (ie Lidstrom with the most upset losses ever - that might be literally true, but it's also a reflection of him playing so many series on strong teams over the course of his career).

One of the other big suprises - Brodeur has far more appearances than I expected on both lists (underdog wins and upset losses). He has a reputation of being such a steady, reliable goalie. I would have thought he'd have far fewer appearances on either list.

 

[MadLuke]

One of the other big suprises - Brodeur has far more appearances than I expected on both lists (underdog wins and upset losses). He has a reputation of being such a steady, reliable goalie. I would have thought he'd have far fewer appearances on either list.

if every series had an underdog, the combined list total become almost how many time you won or lost a series, player like Lidstrom-Brodeur just got involved in a giant amount of them

 

[JianYang]

OP is using the term upset very liberally.

Just looking at that lundqvist list, how would the wins against montreal be considered upsets? They were toss ups, and in the case of 2014 and losing price in game 1, the Rangers were favourites.

Speaking of price, I would put him at 4 upsets

2014: Boston
2020: Pittsburgh
2021: Toronto, Vegas

But it would be a larger list if I used it as liberally as the OP.

 

[Hockey Outsider]

if every series had an underdog, the combined list total become almost how many time you won or lost a series, player like Lidstrom-Brodeur just got involved in a giant amount of them

That's true. But if we make the two refinements I've been talking about (ie looking at it on a percentage basis, and adding a minimum threshold of 5-10% difference in win percentage), Lidstrom and Brodeur probably drop off the list. That would distinguish "true" underdogs (ie Curtis Joseph?) from players who just played in a lot of series.

 

[The Panther]

Mike Vernon is such a weird goalie in terms of career achievements vs. major disappointments.

For the Good:
-- Conn Smythe trophy
-- #1 goalie for two Cup winners on TWO different teams (extremely rare), and four times in Cup Finals
-- Goalie for the NHL's 1st overall (RS) club four times for two different teams (extremely rare)
-- 1st-team All Star once, Vezina finishes of 2, 4, ,4
-- Out-dueled prime Patrick Roy in the playoffs twice

For the Bad:
-- #1 goalie for biggest playoff choke team c.1987 to 1994
-- Career GSAA of -34.5
-- Ditched by Calgary in favor of Trevor Kidd (himself one of the biggest busts of all-time)
-- Never selected for Team Canada in a best-on-best

 

[carjackmalone]

Steve penny had two or three

 

[The Panther]

Steve penny had two or three

...before the penny dropped.

 

[quietbruinfan]

Cujo was the first name that came to my mind as well. Smith is surprising and I know you used point differential as a filter, but Boston in 80 was definitely not an upset. isles were beginning their dynasty and Boston was very old by that time. 82 is debatable as well as the isles were in the middle of their dynasty and deeper than Boston. Yes Boston had a great regular season, but they are generally overachievers in the regular season.

I am not sure the Buffalo series are upsets because again the Isles were quite a strong team. 76 maybe but not 82 for sure. That said, Smith definitely elevated his game in the playoffs. In fact I have always thought Arbour should have played Smith over Resch-particularly in 78-79 versus the Leafs......(Smith did not like practice and that made it tricky for Arbour to use him though.)

One name I do not see here is Osgood. But I suppose the Wings were so strong they rarely had the chance for an upset. Osgood like Smith definitely got better in the playoffs.

 

[pnep]

pnep, thanks (as always) for sharing the data so readily. No surprises in seeing Vernon, Fleury and Osgood near the top of the first table (most times upset in the playoffs).

If I can make one more request - are you able to show these tables (underdog wins and/or upset losses) as a percentage of the qualifying series (ie underdog wins, divided by the number of series where they were the underdog)? Some of the names near the top are surprising (ie Lidstrom with the most upset losses ever - that might be literally true, but it's also a reflection of him playing so many series on strong teams over the course of his career).

One of the other big suprises - Brodeur has far more appearances than I expected on both lists (underdog wins and upset losses). He has a reputation of being such a steady, reliable goalie. I would have thought he'd have far fewer appearances on either list.

PO Series WL DIF As Underdog (Seasons: 1917-2024; Played min. 25% Team Games per Series)

WL_DIF_AS_UNDERDOG

tinyurl.com

PO Series WL DIF As Underdog (Seasons: 1917-2024; Played min. 25% Team Games per Series; min. 10% Team PTS DIF)

WL_DIF_AS_UNDERDOG10

tinyurl.com

PO Series WL DIF As Favorite (Seasons: 1917-2024; Played min. 25% Team Games per Series)

WL_DIF_AS_FAVORITE

tinyurl.com

PO Series WL DIF As Favorite (Seasons: 1917-2024; Played min. 25% Team Games per Series; min. 10% Team PTS DIF)

WL_DIF_AS_FAVORITE10

tinyurl.com

data: 1.33 MB file on MEGA

 

[Crosby2010]

Smith and Price surprise me. I was trying to think off the top of my head the 5 teams Smith beat who had at least 10 more points in the regular season. Three are in 1980, Boston in 1983 and surprisingly Washington in 1985. I guess you can look at it with context, as the 1980 Isles were truly a great team but struggled earlier in the year, hence the 91 points vs. three teams well over 100+. But hey, those were all good teams he beat, all without home ice advantage.

Price leading everyone with 6 series surprised me. I suspected 3 of them are in 2021, but just two of them were. The others are 2014 vs. Boston, 2020 vs. Pittsburgh. I can't figure out the other ones. He did play in 2010 vs. Washington, but this was Halak's series to win. I can't figure out who the other 2 upsets at 10+ points differential would be.

 

[pnep]

Price leading everyone with 6 series surprised me. I suspected 3 of them are in 2021, but just two of them were. The others are 2014 vs. Boston, 2020 vs. Pittsburgh. I can't figure out the other ones. He did play in 2010 vs. Washington, but this was Halak's series to win. I can't figure out who the other 2 upsets at 10+ points differential would be.

Price PO Series Upsets (Played min. 25% Team Games per Series; min. 10% Team PTS DIF)

Season	series	Player	Team	Team_PTS	VS_Team	VS_Team_PTS	Games_Team	Games	Games_%	PTS_DIF
2009	200903011	Price Carey	MTL	88	WSH	121	7	2	28.57%	-27.27%
2013	201303021	Price Carey	MTL	100	BOS	117	7	7	100.00%	-14.53%
2019	201903002	Price Carey	MTL	71	PIT	86	4	4	100.00%	-17.44%
2020	202003017	Price Carey	MTL	59	TOR	77	7	7	100.00%	-23.38%
2020	202003031	Price Carey	MTL	59	VGK	82	6	6	100.00%	-28.05%

​

Smith PO Series Upsets (Played min. 25% Team Games per Series; min. 10% Team PTS DIF)

Season	series	Player	Team	Team_PTS	VS_Team	VS_Team_PTS	Games_Team	Games	Games_%	PTS_DIF
1979​	197903024​	Smith Billy	NYI	91​	BOS	105​	5​	5​	100.00%​	-13.33%​
1979​	197903032​	Smith Billy	NYI	91​	BUF	110​	6​	5​	83.33%​	-17.27%​
1979​	197903041​	Smith Billy	NYI	91​	PHI	116​	6​	6​	100.00%​	-21.55%​
1982​	198203031​	Smith Billy	NYI	96​	BOS	110​	6​	6​	100.00%​	-12.73%​
1984​	198403014​	Smith Billy	NYI	86​	WSH	101​	5​	4​	80.00%​	-14.85%​

 

[BraveCanadian]

Smith and Price surprise me. I was trying to think off the top of my head the 5 teams Smith beat who had at least 10 more points in the regular season. Three are in 1980, Boston in 1983 and surprisingly Washington in 1985. I guess you can look at it with context, as the 1980 Isles were truly a great team but struggled earlier in the year, hence the 91 points vs. three teams well over 100+. But hey, those were all good teams he beat, all without home ice advantage.

Price leading everyone with 6 series surprised me. I suspected 3 of them are in 2021, but just two of them were. The others are 2014 vs. Boston, 2020 vs. Pittsburgh. I can't figure out the other ones. He did play in 2010 vs. Washington, but this was Halak's series to win. I can't figure out who the other 2 upsets at 10+ points differential would be.

The Isles were also known for “learning the lesson” of not going all out in the regular season after peaking high in the regular season and failing. They then made sure they had something in the tank for the playoffs.

Same with the Oilers. They coasted in the regular season a lot of the time and turned it up in the playoffs.

Back in the days of so many teams qualifying it was less of a risk to try and throw the switch.

 

[Crosby2010]

Price PO Series Upsets (Played min. 25% Team Games per Series; min. 10% Team PTS DIF)

[TABLE=collapse]
[TR]
[TD]Season[/TD]
[TD]series[/TD]
[TD]Player[/TD]
[TD]Team[/TD]
[TD]Team_PTS[/TD]
[TD]VS_Team[/TD]
[TD]VS_Team_PTS[/TD]
[TD]Games_Team[/TD]
[TD]Games[/TD]
[TD]Games_%[/TD]
[TD]PTS_DIF[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]

2009​

[/TD]

[TD]

200903011​

[/TD]

[TD]Price Carey[/TD]
[TD]MTL[/TD]

[TD]

88​

[/TD]

[TD]WSH[/TD]

[TD]

121​

[/TD]

[TD]

7​

[/TD]

[TD]

2​

[/TD]

[TD]

28.57%​

[/TD]

[TD]

-27.27%​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]

2013​

[/TD]

[TD]

201303021​

[/TD]

[TD]Price Carey[/TD]
[TD]MTL[/TD]

[TD]

100​

[/TD]

[TD]BOS[/TD]

[TD]

117​

[/TD]

[TD]

7​

[/TD]

[TD]

7​

[/TD]

[TD]

100.00%​

[/TD]

[TD]

-14.53%​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]

2019​

[/TD]

[TD]

201903002​

[/TD]

[TD]Price Carey[/TD]
[TD]MTL[/TD]

[TD]

71​

[/TD]

[TD]PIT[/TD]

[TD]

86​

[/TD]

[TD]

4​

[/TD]

[TD]

4​

[/TD]

[TD]

100.00%​

[/TD]

[TD]

-17.44%​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]

2020​

[/TD]

[TD]

202003017​

[/TD]

[TD]Price Carey[/TD]
[TD]MTL[/TD]

[TD]

59​

[/TD]

[TD]TOR[/TD]

[TD]

77​

[/TD]

[TD]

7​

[/TD]

[TD]

7​

[/TD]

[TD]

100.00%​

[/TD]

[TD]

-23.38%​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]

2020​

[/TD]

[TD]

202003031​

[/TD]

[TD]Price Carey[/TD]
[TD]MTL[/TD]

[TD]

59​

[/TD]

[TD]VGK[/TD]

[TD]

82​

[/TD]

[TD]

6​

[/TD]

[TD]

6​

[/TD]

[TD]

100.00%​

[/TD]

[TD]

-28.05%​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

Smith PO Series Upsets (Played min. 25% Team Games per Series; min. 10% Team PTS DIF)

[TABLE=collapse]
[TR]
[TD]Season[/TD]
[TD]series[/TD]
[TD]Player[/TD]
[TD]Team[/TD]
[TD]Team_PTS[/TD]
[TD]VS_Team[/TD]
[TD]VS_Team_PTS[/TD]
[TD]Games_Team[/TD]
[TD]Games[/TD]
[TD]Games_%[/TD]
[TD]PTS_DIF[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]

1979​

[/TD]

[TD]

197903024​

[/TD]

[TD]Smith Billy[/TD]
[TD]NYI[/TD]

[TD]

91​

[/TD]

[TD]BOS[/TD]

[TD]

105​

[/TD]

[TD]

5​

[/TD]

[TD]

5​

[/TD]

[TD]

100.00%​

[/TD]

[TD]

-13.33%​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]

1979​

[/TD]

[TD]

197903032​

[/TD]

[TD]Smith Billy[/TD]
[TD]NYI[/TD]

[TD]

91​

[/TD]

[TD]BUF[/TD]

[TD]

110​

[/TD]

[TD]

6​

[/TD]

[TD]

5​

[/TD]

[TD]

83.33%​

[/TD]

[TD]

-17.27%​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]

1979​

[/TD]

[TD]

197903041​

[/TD]

[TD]Smith Billy[/TD]
[TD]NYI[/TD]

[TD]

91​

[/TD]

[TD]PHI[/TD]

[TD]

116​

[/TD]

[TD]

6​

[/TD]

[TD]

6​

[/TD]

[TD]

100.00%​

[/TD]

[TD]

-21.55%​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]

1982​

[/TD]

[TD]

198203031​

[/TD]

[TD]Smith Billy[/TD]
[TD]NYI[/TD]

[TD]

96​

[/TD]

[TD]BOS[/TD]

[TD]

110​

[/TD]

[TD]

6​

[/TD]

[TD]

6​

[/TD]

[TD]

100.00%​

[/TD]

[TD]

-12.73%​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]

1984​

[/TD]

[TD]

198403014​

[/TD]

[TD]Smith Billy[/TD]
[TD]NYI[/TD]

[TD]

86​

[/TD]

[TD]WSH[/TD]

[TD]

101​

[/TD]

[TD]

5​

[/TD]

[TD]

4​

[/TD]

[TD]

80.00%​

[/TD]

[TD]

-14.85%​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

I don't think you can give Price credit for 2010. He played just one full game, lost it. He played part of another game in which they lost, but Halak took the loss instead. It isn't even like they were sharing the net. Price was bounced out and Halak won all of the games in that series.

 

[JianYang]

Price PO Series Upsets (Played min. 25% Team Games per Series; min. 10% Team PTS DIF)

[TABLE=collapse]
[TR]
[TD]Season[/TD]
[TD]series[/TD]
[TD]Player[/TD]
[TD]Team[/TD]
[TD]Team_PTS[/TD]
[TD]VS_Team[/TD]
[TD]VS_Team_PTS[/TD]
[TD]Games_Team[/TD]
[TD]Games[/TD]
[TD]Games_%[/TD]
[TD]PTS_DIF[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]

2009​

[/TD]

[TD]

200903011​

[/TD]

[TD]Price Carey[/TD]
[TD]MTL[/TD]

[TD]

88​

[/TD]

[TD]WSH[/TD]

[TD]

121​

[/TD]

[TD]

7​

[/TD]

[TD]

2​

[/TD]

[TD]

28.57%​

[/TD]

[TD]

-27.27%​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]

2013​

[/TD]

[TD]

201303021​

[/TD]

[TD]Price Carey[/TD]
[TD]MTL[/TD]

[TD]

100​

[/TD]

[TD]BOS[/TD]

[TD]

117​

[/TD]

[TD]

7​

[/TD]

[TD]

7​

[/TD]

[TD]

100.00%​

[/TD]

[TD]

-14.53%​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]

2019​

[/TD]

[TD]

201903002​

[/TD]

[TD]Price Carey[/TD]
[TD]MTL[/TD]

[TD]

71​

[/TD]

[TD]PIT[/TD]

[TD]

86​

[/TD]

[TD]

4​

[/TD]

[TD]

4​

[/TD]

[TD]

100.00%​

[/TD]

[TD]

-17.44%​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]

2020​

[/TD]

[TD]

202003017​

[/TD]

[TD]Price Carey[/TD]
[TD]MTL[/TD]

[TD]

59​

[/TD]

[TD]TOR[/TD]

[TD]

77​

[/TD]

[TD]

7​

[/TD]

[TD]

7​

[/TD]

[TD]

100.00%​

[/TD]

[TD]

-23.38%​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[TR]
[TD]

2020​

[/TD]

[TD]

202003031​

[/TD]

[TD]Price Carey[/TD]
[TD]MTL[/TD]

[TD]

59​

[/TD]

[TD]VGK[/TD]

[TD]

82​

[/TD]

[TD]

6​

[/TD]

[TD]

6​

[/TD]

[TD]

100.00%​

[/TD]

[TD]

-28.05%​

[/TD]
[/TR]
[/TABLE]

Smith PO Series Upsets (Played min. 25% Team Games per Series; min. 10% Team PTS DIF)

Season	series	Player	Team	Team_PTS	VS_Team	VS_Team_PTS	Games_Team	Games	Games_%	PTS_DIF
1979​	197903024​	Smith Billy	NYI	91​	BOS	105​	5​	5​	100.00%​	-13.33%​
1979​	197903032​	Smith Billy	NYI	91​	BUF	110​	6​	5​	83.33%​	-17.27%​
1979​	197903041​	Smith Billy	NYI	91​	PHI	116​	6​	6​	100.00%​	-21.55%​
1982​	198203031​	Smith Billy	NYI	96​	BOS	110​	6​	6​	100.00%​	-12.73%​
1984​	198403014​	Smith Billy	NYI	86​	WSH	101​	5​	4​	80.00%​	-14.85%​

For price, it looks like the table is picking up the wrong seasons. It is lagging by one year across the board.

Also, he was the backup for the Washington series. That series should be credited to halak.

Price also had a close call in 2011 with Boston. That one went to game 7 OT, and would have 100% been considered an upset even though the difference was only 7 points just based on the fact montreal played that series without their #1 dman.

 

[Bear of Bad News]

For price, it looks like the table is picking up the wrong seasons. It is lagging by one year across the board.

I believe pnep's taxonomy assigns a year to the start of the season (so "2009" is actually 2010, et cetera).

Agreed on Halak (that appears to be what Games% covers in the table, although in this specific case those Price games are a liability instead of an asset).

 

[McGarnagle]

For price, it looks like the table is picking up the wrong seasons. It is lagging by one year across the board.

Also, he was the backup for the Washington series. That series should be credited to halak.

Price also had a close call in 2011 with Boston. That one went to game 7 OT, and would have 100% been considered an upset even though the difference was only 7 points just based on the fact montreal played that series without their #1 dman.

They were also without Pacioretty after Chara destroyed him in March. That Habs team had no firepower up front, Plekanec led them in scoring with 57 points. But Gionta and Camalleri were sneaky good at getting these timely goals in the playoffs.

Bruins have gotten very unlucky with breaks, bounces, injuries, etc. over the years, but 2011 was the one time they got a lot of luck their way. They really had to dig deep to win games 4 and 5. Michael Ryder making that glove save early in the game, then Thomas's diving save in OT right before Horton scored, etc.

The Bruins were the better team in game 7, but Price was phenomenal. I'd say he outplayed Tim Thomas that night, it never should've gone to OT. (The refs making up a phantom penalty on Bergeron late in the third to give Subban the opportunity to tie it didn't help). Price robbed more than a handful of scoring chances in the third and OT. And on the other side I forget who it was who shot the puck but there was one chance that Montreal had that trickled through the crease past Thomas in OT and just missed going in.

Goes to show how much of the playoffs comes down to luck, or blind chance at least. At some point these teams are evenly matched enough that random variance will just determine results and legacies. If Montreal won that series, Claude Julien and Peter Chiarelli would've been fired, 100%. But they not only survived, they won the cup.

 

[JianYang]

They were also without Pacioretty after Chara destroyed him in March. That Habs team had no firepower up front, Plekanec led them in scoring with 57 points. But Gionta and Camalleri were sneaky good at getting these timely goals in the playoffs.

Bruins have gotten very unlucky with breaks, bounces, injuries, etc. over the years, but 2011 was the one time they got a lot of luck their way. They really had to dig deep to win games 4 and 5. Michael Ryder making that glove save early in the game, then Thomas's diving save in OT right before Horton scored, etc.

The Bruins were the better team in game 7, but Price was phenomenal. I'd say he outplayed Tim Thomas that night, it never should've gone to OT. (The refs making up a phantom penalty on Bergeron late in the third to give Subban the opportunity to tie it didn't help). Price robbed more than a handful of scoring chances in the third and OT. And on the other side I forget who it was who shot the puck but there was one chance that Montreal had that trickled through the crease past Thomas in OT and just missed going in.

Goes to show how much of the playoffs comes down to luck, or blind chance at least. At some point these teams are evenly matched enough that random variance will just determine results and legacies. If Montreal won that series, Claude Julien and Peter Chiarelli would've been fired, 100%. But they not only survived, they won the cup.

Habs had good special teams that year. 7th on PP and 7th on PK, and of course the Jacques Martin structure.

Cammalleri was good but he had a guy lafleur level run the year before.