Post-Game Talk: GM 52 | Wings def. Canucks | 3-2 (OT) (Suter, Chytil) | No Power Plays for You.
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thecupismine
Registered User
- Apr 1, 2007
- 2,949
- 2,842
Some positive signs tonight, even if the result wasn't there. Thought they were unlucky to not come away with the win, but the team's top talent is clearly lacking with Hughes out of the lineup (more on that later).
Puck moving was worlds better, and D-Petey showed they shouldn't take him out of the lineup any time soon. I know people have mentioned Edler, but that really did remind me of his first few games in the league. Not every game is going to be like that, but that glimmer of upside is massive for this team's future. M-Petey already making a big difference too.
Chytil showing some chemistry with Garland was nice to see. The good thing about Chytil is his speed up the middle - that's been sorely lacking for a while now, and his ability to carry the puck through the neutral zone was noticeable. Thought Joshua played fine, but very much was the third wheel there and behind the play at times.
O'Connor showing he's a much better fit than Heinen (who I didn't mind as a player unlike some others here) given the style of play Tocchet wants. Big, fast on the forecheck, etc. Perfect bottom 6 forward for this team, very much fits the mold of what they acquired in Sherwood (albeit not nearly as good obviously).
On the minus side, OG Petey was...yeah. Seeing Miller pop off in NY while Petey lingers here is rough. His linemates didn't do him any favors, but man you're supposed to be the big dog now.
Debrusk is notoriously streaky, but he needs to start engaging in the play more when not scoring. I also love Boeser, dude is all class, but with Miller gone I can see them flipping him to find a winger with either more heft to his game or is speedier. Have a hard time seeing management signing a premier sidekick player when he doesn't have much chemistry with anyone now that Miller is gone.
Puck moving was worlds better, and D-Petey showed they shouldn't take him out of the lineup any time soon. I know people have mentioned Edler, but that really did remind me of his first few games in the league. Not every game is going to be like that, but that glimmer of upside is massive for this team's future. M-Petey already making a big difference too.
Chytil showing some chemistry with Garland was nice to see. The good thing about Chytil is his speed up the middle - that's been sorely lacking for a while now, and his ability to carry the puck through the neutral zone was noticeable. Thought Joshua played fine, but very much was the third wheel there and behind the play at times.
O'Connor showing he's a much better fit than Heinen (who I didn't mind as a player unlike some others here) given the style of play Tocchet wants. Big, fast on the forecheck, etc. Perfect bottom 6 forward for this team, very much fits the mold of what they acquired in Sherwood (albeit not nearly as good obviously).
On the minus side, OG Petey was...yeah. Seeing Miller pop off in NY while Petey lingers here is rough. His linemates didn't do him any favors, but man you're supposed to be the big dog now.
Debrusk is notoriously streaky, but he needs to start engaging in the play more when not scoring. I also love Boeser, dude is all class, but with Miller gone I can see them flipping him to find a winger with either more heft to his game or is speedier. Have a hard time seeing management signing a premier sidekick player when he doesn't have much chemistry with anyone now that Miller is gone.
Hansen
tyler motte simp
vadim sharifijanov
Registered User
- Oct 10, 2007
- 30,221
- 18,803
i think the new guys made me see a couple underlying system issues more clearly
with mp3, when he had the puck in our zone you could see him try to quickly read the breakout and see no options so he had to flip it out
and a bunch of times garland has the puck and is spinning around trying to do everything can to not pass the puck back to the point, but chytil is standing there wondering why garland isn’t passing to him
what this shows me is that the system makes the game hard for our players. a good system simplifies the game for them. yes, juulsen, forbert, desharnais, and myers most of the time can’t make a breakout pass to save their lives. but the forwards are also rarely in a good position to take a good breakout pass without hughes already having beaten one or two guys to create a mismatch. you could see it on mp3’s face, he’s like, wtf? i think when they were figuring out how this team plays, they got way too reliant on hughes being hughes and it was designed around having him back there, but what about the 35 minutes a game he’s not on the ice?
i think it’s the same in the o-zone. is it that they always pass it back to the point instead of taking it to the middle because they are lazy or lack confidence? or is it that the system doesn’t open up high percentage options? so garland is unique because he has figured out a way to always keep the puck moving towards the goal line, but as a fairly low vision player, he has robotically trained himself to do this without collaborating with his teammates. again, in his first shift you could see it on chytil’s body language. he was going, wtf?
that said, obviously ep2 was excellent and looks like he should stay in the lineup for good. i thought hronek had a fabulous game. and maybe just maybe mp3 and myers can form an octopus pair.
but best case scenario is still either acquiring a RD who can credibly play with hughes, or willander being that guy, so we can run mp3 and hronek on the second pair, and let whichever two of ep2, soucy (who can play either side), and myers is playing best be the third pair.
we’re also one impact forward short. would love to see boeser flipped for someone’s first rounder, then turned around and flipped for a boeser replacement. but we still need someone on top of that. i’m enthusiastic about chytil but is he really a 2C?
for now, the configuration i’d go with is
hoglander ep1 karlsson
debrusk chytil boeser
doc suter garland
joshua bluegers sherwood
until joshua rounds into shape and we can reunite him with garland and whichever of suter and bluegers is feeling it. for petey, i’d much rather have him asserting himself with two lower skilled guys who move their feet and have hands that aren’t completely stone than failing with two name brand guys who contribute nothing. there was that one shift in the third where debrusk remembered he is a professional hockey player and he actually played like he wanted to do something. otherwise, we might as well have being playing 4-on-5. and boeser, love the guy but he’s back to playing like his dad is dying. the puck is just dying on his stick. and hopefully having a really stout bottom six makes up for the obvious holes in the top six.
the ideal scenario is probably something like
debrusk ep1 [acquisition]
suter [acquisition] hoglander
joshua chytil garland
doc bluegers sherwood
but man, how are we going to get that 2C and who’s got one? and can he be horvat, pretty please?
with mp3, when he had the puck in our zone you could see him try to quickly read the breakout and see no options so he had to flip it out
and a bunch of times garland has the puck and is spinning around trying to do everything can to not pass the puck back to the point, but chytil is standing there wondering why garland isn’t passing to him
what this shows me is that the system makes the game hard for our players. a good system simplifies the game for them. yes, juulsen, forbert, desharnais, and myers most of the time can’t make a breakout pass to save their lives. but the forwards are also rarely in a good position to take a good breakout pass without hughes already having beaten one or two guys to create a mismatch. you could see it on mp3’s face, he’s like, wtf? i think when they were figuring out how this team plays, they got way too reliant on hughes being hughes and it was designed around having him back there, but what about the 35 minutes a game he’s not on the ice?
i think it’s the same in the o-zone. is it that they always pass it back to the point instead of taking it to the middle because they are lazy or lack confidence? or is it that the system doesn’t open up high percentage options? so garland is unique because he has figured out a way to always keep the puck moving towards the goal line, but as a fairly low vision player, he has robotically trained himself to do this without collaborating with his teammates. again, in his first shift you could see it on chytil’s body language. he was going, wtf?
that said, obviously ep2 was excellent and looks like he should stay in the lineup for good. i thought hronek had a fabulous game. and maybe just maybe mp3 and myers can form an octopus pair.
but best case scenario is still either acquiring a RD who can credibly play with hughes, or willander being that guy, so we can run mp3 and hronek on the second pair, and let whichever two of ep2, soucy (who can play either side), and myers is playing best be the third pair.
we’re also one impact forward short. would love to see boeser flipped for someone’s first rounder, then turned around and flipped for a boeser replacement. but we still need someone on top of that. i’m enthusiastic about chytil but is he really a 2C?
for now, the configuration i’d go with is
hoglander ep1 karlsson
debrusk chytil boeser
doc suter garland
joshua bluegers sherwood
until joshua rounds into shape and we can reunite him with garland and whichever of suter and bluegers is feeling it. for petey, i’d much rather have him asserting himself with two lower skilled guys who move their feet and have hands that aren’t completely stone than failing with two name brand guys who contribute nothing. there was that one shift in the third where debrusk remembered he is a professional hockey player and he actually played like he wanted to do something. otherwise, we might as well have being playing 4-on-5. and boeser, love the guy but he’s back to playing like his dad is dying. the puck is just dying on his stick. and hopefully having a really stout bottom six makes up for the obvious holes in the top six.
the ideal scenario is probably something like
debrusk ep1 [acquisition]
suter [acquisition] hoglander
joshua chytil garland
doc bluegers sherwood
but man, how are we going to get that 2C and who’s got one? and can he be horvat, pretty please?
Last edited:
Rick Rocket
Regetstred User
- May 22, 2008
- 1,656
- 704
Man, without Quinn this team just labours at creating offense. The most creative players were the newbies - a breath of fresh air seeing Chytil and DOC actually carrying the puck. We'll see how long it takes for Tocc to coach that out of them.
They deserved to win the game for sure, but they have to get better at creating chances.
They deserved to win the game for sure, but they have to get better at creating chances.
sting101
Registered User
- Feb 8, 2012
- 17,551
- 17,049
Was at the game.
Top line did very little. Debrusk poor skill and anticipation. Another one of his maddening stretches is making everyone worse. Looks like a 4th liner when like this. Boeser struggled to find precision but is still an excellent link player settles things down and barely missed a couple shots. 40 made some good plays in all 3 zones and a few good set ups but not nearly the impact you hope for. Not a play driver not fast weak poor on draws and currently unable to execute....cue more pages of excuses for this guy......Will need PPG in last 30 games to get to 60pts now and an uptick to get 20 goals. Given his role an absolute disaster season after last years disaster
Garland was buzzing all night as usual. Some chemistry issues. Chytil looks good. Great skater strong skilled. Nice goal great first game. Do question his hockey IQ and ability to create with others. Great opportunity for him here and so far so good. Joshua needs to play 4th line and just get up and dwn the wing until he finds another gear
Suter was excellent in all 3 zones and was the catalyst for his lines great play. O'Connor is really fast and big reminds me a bit of Shawn Matthias. See what kind of consistency and smarts he can play with. Looks to be a upgrade on Heinen. Sherwood as per usual just brings it. Was the best line IMO.
Blueger as per usual is an almost impeccable defensive player. Hoglander was stuck in and has been playing much better. Would have liked to see his speed and energy with 40 and 9. Karlsson has actually had a decent run of games this time around and is mostly keeping up and strong around the walls and to the net.
M.Pettersson is much like Myers in that he just has that calm veteran presence and then also comes with incredible length and quality mobility. Very good player him and Myers were excellent outside of a couple hiccups. Not sure i'm gonna like his contract and term. Given DPetey's advanced play it's looks like a waste of a 1st rounder and i think they overpaid to begin with.
D.Petey was fantastic. Started to show some of his physical game. Got an assist. Skating is excellent. Smart positionally Passes are hard and fast. Heavy shot.A few miscues as he learns tendencies and timing....but wow kid is a player and really popped tonight. Everyone was talking about it. Hronek is as per usual a excellent defender and skater. A bit like Debrusk in that he's much more tools than tool box though.
Lankinen looked a little shaky and no PP opportunities didn't help
Lots of size speed and energy pushed into the lineup today which was nice to see but the book is out on how much execution and talent can be squeezed. Top of the order looks lacking
Top line did very little. Debrusk poor skill and anticipation. Another one of his maddening stretches is making everyone worse. Looks like a 4th liner when like this. Boeser struggled to find precision but is still an excellent link player settles things down and barely missed a couple shots. 40 made some good plays in all 3 zones and a few good set ups but not nearly the impact you hope for. Not a play driver not fast weak poor on draws and currently unable to execute....cue more pages of excuses for this guy......Will need PPG in last 30 games to get to 60pts now and an uptick to get 20 goals. Given his role an absolute disaster season after last years disaster
Garland was buzzing all night as usual. Some chemistry issues. Chytil looks good. Great skater strong skilled. Nice goal great first game. Do question his hockey IQ and ability to create with others. Great opportunity for him here and so far so good. Joshua needs to play 4th line and just get up and dwn the wing until he finds another gear
Suter was excellent in all 3 zones and was the catalyst for his lines great play. O'Connor is really fast and big reminds me a bit of Shawn Matthias. See what kind of consistency and smarts he can play with. Looks to be a upgrade on Heinen. Sherwood as per usual just brings it. Was the best line IMO.
Blueger as per usual is an almost impeccable defensive player. Hoglander was stuck in and has been playing much better. Would have liked to see his speed and energy with 40 and 9. Karlsson has actually had a decent run of games this time around and is mostly keeping up and strong around the walls and to the net.
M.Pettersson is much like Myers in that he just has that calm veteran presence and then also comes with incredible length and quality mobility. Very good player him and Myers were excellent outside of a couple hiccups. Not sure i'm gonna like his contract and term. Given DPetey's advanced play it's looks like a waste of a 1st rounder and i think they overpaid to begin with.
D.Petey was fantastic. Started to show some of his physical game. Got an assist. Skating is excellent. Smart positionally Passes are hard and fast. Heavy shot.A few miscues as he learns tendencies and timing....but wow kid is a player and really popped tonight. Everyone was talking about it. Hronek is as per usual a excellent defender and skater. A bit like Debrusk in that he's much more tools than tool box though.
Lankinen looked a little shaky and no PP opportunities didn't help
Lots of size speed and energy pushed into the lineup today which was nice to see but the book is out on how much execution and talent can be squeezed. Top of the order looks lacking
Tocc's addiction to Juulsen is costing this team points. I don't understand.
Good debuts across the board. The new forwards added noticeable and effective speed. Need to keep it up now, but showed a glimpse of whar could be.
3Petey's play was eye opening. Just exactly what this d corp needed. Any concerns I had about his puck moving have been put to bed. So many smart smart plays from him tonight.
Only 1 game but I feel better about the results from the wheeling and dealing than I did yesterday.
DPetey looked great. First time this group has actually looked like an NHL defense without 43 in the lineup. Curious what the top 6 will look like coming out of the 4NFO.
EP played good in the 3rd but was pretty quiet in the first 40. Didn't help that the trio just doesn't work. Only line that really clicked, especially early, was DOC-Suter-Sherwood. Rest need some tweaking.
One of 74 or 6 needs to be with Chytil. Dak needs to be with his buddy on the 4th. Just too behind the play to be in the top 6. Personally always thought he'd take most of the season to catch up, and he's just not there yet.
I'm not in the group calling for Tocchet's here, but I didn't like his roster decisions tonight. Get not shuffling much tonight, especially considering we were carrying play. But hope he tries some different looks on Tuesday.
Good effort but we're getting too late in the season to be satisfied with that.
3Petey's play was eye opening. Just exactly what this d corp needed. Any concerns I had about his puck moving have been put to bed. So many smart smart plays from him tonight.
Only 1 game but I feel better about the results from the wheeling and dealing than I did yesterday.
DPetey looked great. First time this group has actually looked like an NHL defense without 43 in the lineup. Curious what the top 6 will look like coming out of the 4NFO.
EP played good in the 3rd but was pretty quiet in the first 40. Didn't help that the trio just doesn't work. Only line that really clicked, especially early, was DOC-Suter-Sherwood. Rest need some tweaking.
One of 74 or 6 needs to be with Chytil. Dak needs to be with his buddy on the 4th. Just too behind the play to be in the top 6. Personally always thought he'd take most of the season to catch up, and he's just not there yet.
I'm not in the group calling for Tocchet's here, but I didn't like his roster decisions tonight. Get not shuffling much tonight, especially considering we were carrying play. But hope he tries some different looks on Tuesday.
Good effort but we're getting too late in the season to be satisfied with that.
Svencouver
Registered User
I feel like this phenomena of acquisitions coming onto this team and having that Gordon Ramsay Kitchen Nightmares "wtf?" reaction to how things are done here and how our players are used to playing has been a thing for 3 or 4 years at least
The supposedly tired Wings forechecked the crap out of the rested home team. I’m starting to think this coaching staff doesn’t know how to deal with 3v3.
Svencouver
Registered User
Funnily enough, I do think that Suter is the closest thing this team has to a true play driving Crosby-like all-situations true Center. No one else really drives the play down the middle in all 3 zones like he does and I think he's actually pretty important part of our already thin C depth. We should look at keeping him if we can, tbh.
LickTheEnvelope
Weird time to be a Canucks fan 2024
Ironically it feels like with Willander and a Signed M. Pettersson the D may round into form, while sadly the offense is now a big now-show.
This has been going on since last season. At this point it's on management for not taking his toy away.
That being said, Juulsen was solid tonight. Was probably good for him to get away from Juulsen.
3 games left before 4 nations. i can see brock being dealt beforehand. the new guys were good. speed kills. let them setlle for a few more games before saying anything negative about their games. debrusk was invisible. ep40 was okay brock had chances but looks slow and lost.. the defense is miles better even without qh43. marcus petterson can skate the puck out. same with dpetey. trades doesnt look too bad afterall. still need another RHD and a top 6 center.
PuckMunchkin
Very Nice, Very Evil!
Spindly as hell.
I had those AdMech infiltrator guys. Their name escapes me. They were like assembling a water bug.
Not as convoluted as your Necron here.
I am toxic
. . . even in small doses
PuckMunchkin
Very Nice, Very Evil!
So what is the correct way to be critical of his play?
Mentioning his knee injury makes you guys froth at the mouth. "Excuses from fan bois?!?!!?!??! Not on my watch!"
Mentioning anything related to whats happening around him gets a tantrum. "But he has 11 million so why doesnt he use that money to score goals?!"
Can you list the concepts that are acceptable when evaluating his poor performance?
There are no more acceptable "concepts".
If he was injured he wouldn't be playing and the #1 issue "around him" has been dealt with.
There is no excuse for him missing that chance in OT, a play he needs to regularly convert on if he's going to take up 10% of the cap. Full stop.
Miller is playing on a line with Panarin who's better than Brock and DeBrusk combined. Even on a shitty season Panarin has 15 points over the 2nd NY scorer with 56 pts in 50 games. For now, it's the best fit for Miller as long as he behaves himself.
In the summer, JR should go all in on Rantanen if Carolina does not extend him by then. Going after Marner would be a mistake.
me2
Go ahead foot
MPetterson is one of the more consistent players out there. I expect exactly the same player for the next few years as the last few. Hronek was a bit up and down in Detroit and battles injuries, he'll be less consistent.
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