German Prospects for the NHL Draft

[Bombay66]

it is a bit off-content, but what speaks against the same youth system which is used by the US Youth Hockey Program and also used now by the Slovak federation with an impressive impact on the draft picks, i am talking about a national U17 and U18 team which is participating every week for example at the DNL or maybe even an Oberliga-Team...there should be some monetary compensation of course for the youth clubs maybe even a premium to set some goal for these clubs to get their players in the national elite teams U17 and U18

Of couse the national training locations in Füssen had to be modernsied and combined with a youth academy for school but this is the way to go in my perspective, if you look at the u17 div leagues and even the dnl the level of opponents is too shaky to get some proper competition for the elite players and the direct way to an DEL or DEL2 team is too difficult because of so many foreign players at these leagues

maybe a u16 Team for the DNL and an U18 Team for the Oberliga with 2-3 overaged players, the oberliga has some proper professional competition level, and this league is heavily looking for new teams to join, I would rather watch a DEB U18 Elite Team than some Dutch teams to be honest

those players should of course stay for example an official Mannheim youth player and be optional to get a call up for the DEL Team every week

 

[pgfan66]

it is a bit off-content, but what speaks against the same youth system which is used by the US Youth Hockey Program and also used now by the Slovak federation with an impressive impact on the draft picks, i am talking about a national U17 and U18 team which is participating every week for example at the DNL or maybe even an Oberliga-Team...there should be some monetary compensation of course for the youth clubs maybe even a premium to set some goal for these clubs to get their players in the national elite teams U17 and U18

Of couse the national training locations in Füssen had to be modernsied and combined with a youth academy for school but this is the way to go in my perspective, if you look at the u17 div leagues and even the dnl the level of opponents is too shaky to get some proper competition for the elite players and the direct way to an DEL or DEL2 team is too difficult because of so many foreign players at these leagues

maybe a u16 Team for the DNL and an U18 Team for the Oberliga with 2-3 overaged players, the oberliga has some proper professional competition level, and this league is heavily looking for new teams to join, I would rather watch a DEB U18 Elite Team than some Dutch teams to be honest

those players should of course stay for example an official Mannheim youth player and be optional to get a call up for the DEL Team every week

Been saying this for a long time. The US model won't work because the U17 wouldn't be good enough but the Slovak model should work. Keep players' rights with their club teams and allow players to move between their club and the national development program. Have the U18 (or even U19) development program play an exhibition schedule vs. DNL, Oberliga, some junior teams in other countries and if it's going well maybe one day DEL2. Perhaps leave Füssen and go use Red Bull's facilities in Munich instead or build a German version of the RB academy in Salzburg. It was touched on in the Bissl Hockey podcast's WJC preview episode too (in case you are or understand German).

 

[Maverick41]

I was going through a lot of stats, videos and notes recently for the next update of my rankings and with the recent World Juniors in mind, I thought I'd share my thoughts on the next few years (2007 to 2012). Obviously that latter ones aren't entirely serious anything beyond 2009 is almost entirely based on stat comparisons, which are highly unreliable.

2007:
Still looks like a good year for German hockey. Sure, some prospects I had higher hopes for did not develop that well, but Lewandowski and Händel are still a couple of legit prospects for the draft, and I can see about a dozen others have decent pro careers at home or maybe even in one of the better European leagues. Defense is thin after Händel, but there is still pretty good depth at forward and even a couple of goalies that have DEL upside at least.

2008:
There is some talent at the top, but at least as of now not at the level of 2007, and the depth is actually not looking great. On defense things look sort of alright, and I wouldn't be shocked if they came close to the 07 group in that area, but the forwards offer little beyond Krestan and I am not really sold on any of the goalies either.

2009:
This group could come close to or possibly even eclipse the 07s, both in terms of top end talent and depth, although the latter seems unlikely. At the same point in time the group of 07s I was really excited about was quite a bit bigger than it is for the 09s, but if their development goes better they could catch up eventually. I like that this group appears to be more balanced with the depth. The top-end talent is almost all forwards, but there are a lot of interesting defensemen in this group. Can't really speak to the goalies, no idea where I would rank them.


From here on out it gets a little silly, but I thought I'd give it a try. We'll see how my assessments hold up (probably not well).

2010:
There are few kids I like in this group, but it feels a little more like 2008 in terms of overall depth, but more skewed towards forwards. I haven't found any defensemen I am really intrigued by, but who knows what happens in the next couple of years.

2011:
It seems like the uneven years tend to look better than the even ones. There's not really any standout talent as far as I can tell from limited viewings, but a lot of kids at both forward and defense that look good. For now I would expect this to be a deep group that lacks high-end talent.

2012:
This one is only based on numbers, no viewings at all (I had seen a bit of the 2010s and 2011s). So, the only thing I'll say is that Henry Szymanski, Danny Penkin and Toni Martinovic have put up some interesting numbers over the last couple of years.

 

[Bra Wavers]

Sorry to hijack the thread.........I love the detailed discussion of German prospects.
I am a fan of the Peterborough Petes and I'm doing some research for the CHL Import draft in July.
I was excited to see Rio Kaiser come to the Petes after the WJC and happy to see that former Pete, Liam Kirk is having success playing in Germany.
I have a feeling that the Petes will select a 2008 German player and/or a player who has played with the RB Academy.

Looking for some insight on these players (rank them and likelihood that they could come overseas to play next year):

Vyacheslav Permitin
Tobias Krestan
Maximilian Strauß
Lukas Greil
Quirin Schlager
Lukas Buschbeck
Moussa Hackert

 

[Maverick41]

Sorry to hijack the thread.........I love the detailed discussion of German prospects.
I am a fan of the Peterborough Petes and I'm doing some research for the CHL Import draft in July.
I was excited to see Rio Kaiser come to the Petes after the WJC and happy to see that former Pete, Liam Kirk is having success playing in Germany.
I have a feeling that the Petes will select a 2008 German player and/or a player who has played with the RB Academy.

Looking for some insight on these players (rank them and likelihood that they could come overseas to play next year):

Vyacheslav Permitin
Tobias Krestan
Maximilian Strauß
Lukas Greil
Quirin Schlager
Lukas Buschbeck
Moussa Hackert

There are others here who have usually better insight about which players might be considering playing overseas, than I do.

So, the following is purely guess work and my opinion on the quality of the players.

I don't really see Tobias Krestan leaving Sweden to play in North America until after his draft year, Of the others I don't think anyone will have a big impact, although Greil and Permitin might be worth picking if you can get them to commit, which should be possible.
I would not expect any of the rest to succeed in the OHL or any of the other CHL leagues.
While they all have some intriguing qualities, there seem to be too many holes in their games. Of course you never know, how they would adapt to a new surrounding. I recall being very skeptical of Sebastian Uvira heading to Oshawa, but while he was not a star player he acquitted himself pretty well in his first season, and after a weaker start in second season he did well after he was traded to Plymouth.

I would rank them like this:
Tobias Krestan
Lukas Greil
Vyacheslav Permitin

Maximilian Strauß / Quirin Schlager
Moussa Hackert / Lukas Buschbeck

The four guys I ranked lower are really close for me. Schlager had been dropping a bit in my rankings, so did Hackert, while both Strauß and Buschbeck have risen a bit. As for the top 3, the gaps between them aren't huge but they are there. With that being said, my gut feeling would be that Permitin might be the one best suited for playing in the CHL.

 

[Bra Wavers]

There are others here who have usually better insight about which players might be considering playing overseas, than I do.

So, the following is purely guess work and my opinion on the quality of the players.

I don't really see Tobias Krestan leaving Sweden to play in North America until after his draft year, Of the others I don't think anyone will have a big impact, although Greil and Permitin might be worth picking if you can get them to commit, which should be possible.
I would not expect any of the rest to succeed in the OHL or any of the other CHL leagues.
While they all have some intriguing qualities, there seem to be too many holes in their games. Of course you never know, how they would adapt to a new surrounding. I recall being very skeptical of Sebastian Uvira heading to Oshawa, but while he was not a star player he acquitted himself pretty well in his first season, and after a weaker start in second season he did well after he was traded to Plymouth.

I would rank them like this:
Tobias Krestan
Lukas Greil
Vyacheslav Permitin

Maximilian Strauß / Quirin Schlager
Moussa Hackert / Lukas Buschbeck

The four guys I ranked lower are really close for me. Schlager had been dropping a bit in my rankings, so did Hackert, while both Strauß and Buschbeck have risen a bit. As for the top 3, the gaps between them aren't huge but they are there. With that being said, my gut feeling would be that Permitin might be the one best suited for playing in the CHL.

Thanks for your response!
Are there any other top end 2008 born German players that I'm missing?

How about these 2007s?

Dustin Willhöft........great skill, but is he big enough to play in the OHL?​

Rihards Griva​

Gustavs Griva........I'm guessing the brothers would have to be a package deal? ​

Elias Schneider​

Max Ziergiebel​

Mateu Späth​

 

[Maverick41]

Thanks for your response!
Are there any other top end 2008 born German players that I'm missing?

How about these 2007s?

Dustin Willhöft........great skill, but is he big enough to play in the OHL?​

Rihards Griva​

Gustavs Griva........I'm guessing the brothers would have to be a package deal? ​

Elias Schneider​

Max Ziergiebel​

Mateu Späth​

Let's start with the 07s.
I am a huge Willhöft fan, so I want to say he would do well, despite his small stature, but it is certainly a risk. Skill and skating ability are there but he is tiny.

I would agree that the Griva twins should be a package deal. I have watched them a lot and together they are more than the sum of their parts. I like them, but I am a bit skeptical if they could cut it in the OHL. If you have only a spot for one I would probably go with Gustavs, but neither one of them is really a line driver. If they cannot be paired with one of those they would likely disappoint.

Schneider is difficult for me to judge, and I think he may choose to stay in Germany anyway as I could see him get more of a shot in the DEL next season.
If he goes overseas I think he has an ok chance to succeed, but is far from a sure thing.

Ziergiebel certainly has some skill and is not a bad skater. But for his size I am not sure if his skill and skating are good enought to play in the OHL.

Späth lost a lot of development time due to injury/illness over the last few years, and unfortunately it shows. I think he might be getting back on track, but now looks to be more of a late bloomer, and I don't think he'd be ready for the OHL at this point.

About other 08s:
I'll just throw out 4 names that I believe could maybe play a decent role in the OHL.

Daniel Kettler: Left shooting defenseman, with decent size (6'2'' or 6'3'' I think). Skating could be better, especially when it comes to acceleration and agility. Solid outlet pass. His defensive play needs to be more consistent, but is usually solid to good (mind you the competition he is facing at the moment is much weaker than the OHL)

Aurelius Pizka: Another left shooting defender. He is on the smaller side, but doesn't play that way. He is currently playing in Sweden and has developed very well there the last couple of years. Surprisingly good along the boards given his smaller stature. Good skater and good passer. Also patient with the puck which gives him the potential to be PP QB (though I don't know if that would translate to the OHL level). Among German defensive prospects he has one of the better point shots and isn't afraid to use it, but it still needs to get a lot better for it to really become a weapon.

Mats Geppert: Geppert is kind of destined to be underrated. He does everything really well, but he has no absolute elite stand out skills. His biggest strength in my view is his IQ on the ice. And like I said there are few holes in his game (at least for the level he is currently playing at). All that makes him very consistent. I must have watched around 15-20 games of his over the last couple of years, and in the worst game of his, he was ok. You always get a solid effort from him and he makes few mistakes. He's not the greatest goal scorer that is certainly an area he needs to work on some more.

Darian Rolsing: Probably the most intriguing of the bunch. Big right shooting defenseman. Good, mobile skater for his size. He is not as huge as Kaiser, but I think he currently stands a 6'6'' and at least to me he is the much more talented defenseman. He is playing in Finland this season and recently played for the German U18 team, while being eligible for the U17 team. He as a ton of upside and already posesses some solid offensive skill. His defensive game has also improved noticeably as he uses his size and reach more effectively now. He is prone to some seriously stupid turnovers and needs to learn to keep it simple sometimes and not take unnecessary risks. I have seen him many times relying on his skill and skating ability to dangle and skate himself out of trouble, and it has often worked for him, but sometimes it doesn't and those instances can be infuriating. But those are growing pains not uncommon with young defensemen I believe.

 

[Bra Wavers]

Let's start with the 07s.
I am a huge Willhöft fan, so I want to say he would do well, despite his small stature, but it is certainly a risk. Skill and skating ability are there but he is tiny.

I would agree that the Griva twins should be a package deal. I have watched them a lot and together they are more than the sum of their parts. I like them, but I am a bit skeptical if they could cut it in the OHL. If you have only a spot for one I would probably go with Gustavs, but neither one of them is really a line driver. If they cannot be paired with one of those they would likely disappoint.

Schneider is difficult for me to judge, and I think he may choose to stay in Germany anyway as I could see him get more of a shot in the DEL next season.
If he goes overseas I think he has an ok chance to succeed, but is far from a sure thing.

Ziergiebel certainly has some skill and is not a bad skater. But for his size I am not sure if his skill and skating are good enought to play in the OHL.

Späth lost a lot of development time due to injury/illness over the last few years, and unfortunately it shows. I think he might be getting back on track, but now looks to be more of a late bloomer, and I don't think he'd be ready for the OHL at this point.

About other 08s:
I'll just throw out 4 names that I believe could maybe play a decent role in the OHL.

Daniel Kettler: Left shooting defenseman, with decent size (6'2'' or 6'3'' I think). Skating could be better, especially when it comes to acceleration and agility. Solid outlet pass. His defensive play needs to be more consistent, but is usually solid to good (mind you the competition he is facing at the moment is much weaker than the OHL)

Aurelius Pizka: Another left shooting defender. He is on the smaller side, but doesn't play that way. He is currently playing in Sweden and has developed very well there the last couple of years. Surprisingly good along the boards given his smaller stature. Good skater and good passer. Also patient with the puck which gives him the potential to be PP QB (though I don't know if that would translate to the OHL level). Among German defensive prospects he has one of the better point shots and isn't afraid to use it, but it still needs to get a lot better for it to really become a weapon.

Mats Geppert: Geppert is kind of destined to be underrated. He does everything really well, but he has no absolute elite stand out skills. His biggest strength in my view is his IQ on the ice. And like I said there are few holes in his game (at least for the level he is currently playing at). All that makes him very consistent. I must have watched around 15-20 games of his over the last couple of years, and in the worst game of his, he was ok. You always get a solid effort from him and he makes few mistakes. He's not the greatest goal scorer that is certainly an area he needs to work on some more.

Darian Rolsing: Probably the most intriguing of the bunch. Big right shooting defenseman. Good, mobile skater for his size. He is not as huge as Kaiser, but I think he currently stands a 6'6'' and at least to me he is the much more talented defenseman. He is playing in Finland this season and recently played for the German U18 team, while being eligible for the U17 team. He as a ton of upside and already posesses some solid offensive skill. His defensive game has also improved noticeably as he uses his size and reach more effectively now. He is prone to some seriously stupid turnovers and needs to learn to keep it simple sometimes and not take unnecessary risks. I have seen him many times relying on his skill and skating ability to dangle and skate himself out of trouble, and it has often worked for him, but sometimes it doesn't and those instances can be infuriating. But those are growing pains not uncommon with young defensemen I believe.

Thanks for all of this feedback.
Much appreciated.

 

[Chapin Landvogt]

How about these 2007s?

Dustin Willhöft........great skill, but is he big enough to play in the OHL?​

Rihards Griva​

Gustavs Griva........I'm guessing the brothers would have to be a package deal? ​

Elias Schneider​

Max Ziergiebel​

Mateu Späth​

Can't top anything @Maverick41 has to say about these guys and more. Top information there.

I will say that if Willhöft were to go the OHL route, I can absolutely see him being what Dominik Kahun was for Sudbury back in the day. The size is concerning but no less than his Hlinka Gretzky Cup performance convinced me he could be a contributor in Canadian juniors.

Also, since you originally mentioned the RB Juniors program as well, I'd definitely say that Austrian Leon Kolarik - a 2026 draft-eligible player - is going to be wanted by a number of programs in NA and Northern Europe. He is with the Unlimited Sports Management group based in Switzerland, which features several ex Austrian internationals as agents including Peter Kasper, who is naturally Marco Kasper's father.

Ian Scherzer, who like Marco was with the Rögle program, is now in the USHL and heading to U of Miami next season.

In light of Austrian Gregor Biber playing for Rögle's SHL team this season and having been drafted last summer, everyone is assuming that Rögle is front and center on bringing Kolarik into the fold.

But if he is most inspired by the Marco Rossi route, then the group will certainly be letting respective CHL clubs know about his availability for the import draft.

Another Austrian to keep an eye on would be Kolarik's current linemate (and RB captain at the age of 18), Adrian Gesson.