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General COVID-19 Talk #4 MOD Warning

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RonM11 said:
An update: Omicron sub-variants BA.5, BA.2.75, BA.4.6

www.nature.com

Will ‘Centaurus’ be the next global coronavirus variant? Indian cases offers clues

The BA.2.75 variant is rising fast in the country, but hospitalization rates are low so far.
www.nature.com www.nature.com
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I'm always really interested to see how it evolves, and these latest strains seem to so far be playing the expected pattern--eluding vaccines/boosters to some degree due to differences, but also becoming generally less lethal. Hoping it stays that way, the article mentions a lot of places have reallly scaled back their tracking so if a bad strain were to show up we'd likely be slow to react/respond.
 
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Raccoon Jesus said:
I'm always really interested to see how it evolves, and these latest strains seem to so far be playing the expected pattern--eluding vaccines/boosters to some degree due to differences, but also becoming generally less lethal. Hoping it stays that way, the article mentions a lot of places have reallly scaled back their tracking so if a bad strain were to show up we'd likely be slow to react/respond.
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I agree. BA.5 is definitely less lethal and less likely to cause a person to be hospitalized. It's early yet, but it remains to be seen if BA.2.75 becomes the next dominant strain in the U.S. after BA.5, and whether it acts in the same way. BA.4.6 just came onto the radar. If these various Omicron sub-variants continue the pattern of reduced lethality and hospitalization (especially through the fall and winter months), perhaps we can finally be free of this pathogen.

Sure hope so. I have put off a return trip to China with my wife to see the relatives for over three years now. China, of course, has to be rid of the virus in order to entertain tourists at a reasonable cost and procedure, and their current COVID-19 policy, along with the high airfare, make it impossible presently.
 
Raccoon Jesus said:
I'm always really interested to see how it evolves, and these latest strains seem to so far be playing the expected pattern--eluding vaccines/boosters to some degree due to differences, but also becoming generally less lethal. Hoping it stays that way, the article mentions a lot of places have reallly scaled back their tracking so if a bad strain were to show up we'd likely be slow to react/respond.
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It should continue to get less lethal because the virus evolves to survive and killing its host doesn’t help it. Which you probably know… I’m just killing time 😉
 
Herby said:
I’m sure there will be apologies given to people who were shamed and labeled as taking horse de-wormers on social media and by the mainstream media.

Right?
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Exactly how would Ivermectin have helped Pfizer and Moderna makes billions of dollars on a vaccine that people were mandated to take in order to keep their jobs? I know you understand the plot of the play.
 
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Herby said:
I got the vax and booster pretty early, since I am a T1 diabetic.

I think based on the experience of the first ones I personally will take a wait and see approach on newer vaccines. The first ones and how they were marketed and sold to us still leaves a bitter taste in my mouth.

Hopefully it works great and is free of any long term side effects.
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Why? Everyone should have seen this from the very start, when Moderna wrote a press release in June 2020 to promote their vaccine, well in advance of proving their studies. They manipulated their stock. Pharmacy companies are full of vermin in upper management, and this is to be expected. They are also full of ethical scientists who perfect the actual vaccines themselves.

It is the same discussion I had with my own daughter. Just because Big Pharma is full of assholes a the top of the food chain doesn't translate into useless and ineffective vaccines. I already knew about Big Pharma from investigating various companies in the realm in a prior job. A lot of scumbags. But a lot of dedicated scientists too, and that's why I trust the vaccines.
 
RonM11 said:
Why? Everyone should have seen this from the very start, when Moderna wrote a press release in June 2020 to promote their vaccine, well in advance of proving their studies. They manipulated their stock. Pharmacy companies are full of vermin in upper management, and this is to be expected. They are also full of ethical scientists who perfect the actual vaccines themselves.

It is the same discussion I had with my own daughter. Just because Big Pharma is full of assholes a the top of the food chain doesn't translate into useless and ineffective vaccines. I already knew about Big Pharma from investigating various companies in the realm in a prior job. A lot of scumbags. But a lot of dedicated scientists too, and that's why I trust the vaccines.


Sounds promising, but the article didn't indicate a timetable for human studies.
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Why did I get the vaccine? Well it was suggested by my endocrinologist at the time . He now tells me he is not suggesting it for any of his otherwise healthy diabetic patients under 50.

I don’t have as negative a view on big pharma as most do. The insulins now are amazing and even more importantly the technology has made my life a lot easier to live. They have done some bad things for sure, but for me it’s a positive view. I just wouldn’t trust a state controlled pharmaceutical bureaucracy to produce the same kind of life changing products.

I am just so unlikely to die from Covid and considering that we were lied to by politicians about it stopping the spread, I (and my doctor) don’t feel the need for me to have it with all the unknown long and short-term side effects.

If I were my parents age my answer is probably different, but a big difference between 70 and 40.
 
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AbsentMojo said:
Interesting that NIH now lists ivermectin as being under evaluation as a potential treatment Antiviral Therapy | COVID-19 Treatment Guidelines
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Herby said:
I’m sure there will be apologies given to people who were shamed and labeled as taking horse de-wormers on social media and by the mainstream media.

Right?
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Did either of you read the study?

This study was finalized over four months ago with the COVID-19 Treatment Guidelines Panel recommending against the use of Ivermectin in the treatment of COVID-19:

Recommendation​

  • The Panel recommends against the use of ivermectin for the treatment of COVID-19, except in clinical trials (AIIa).
 
Herby said:
Why did I get the vaccine? Well it was suggested by my endocrinologist at the time . He now tells me he is not suggesting it for any of his otherwise healthy diabetic patients under 50.

I don’t have as negative a view on big pharma as most do. The insulins now are amazing and even more importantly the technology has made my life a lot easier to live. They have done some bad things for sure, but for me it’s a positive view. I just wouldn’t trust a state controlled pharmaceutical bureaucracy to produce the same kind of life changing products.

I am just so unlikely to die from Covid and considering that we were lied to by politicians about it stopping the spread, I (and my doctor) don’t feel the need for me to have it with all the unknown long and short-term side effects.

If I were my parents age my answer is probably different, but a big difference between 70 and 40.
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Not for a diabetic, Herby. You might as well be 80 when it comes to COVID-19. If I were you, I'd get a second opinion as to the vaccines. I am triple-boosted myself, just having taken the bivalent vaccine a week ago. Yet, I still wear my KN-95 every time I go shopping and when I go to a restaurant I eat in a patio, unless the restaurant itself has socially distant tables inside. I won't stop living during these times, but I'm extra careful too.
 
RonM11 said:
Not for a diabetic, Herby. You might as well be 80 when it comes to COVID-19. If I were you, I'd get a second opinion as to the vaccines. I am triple-boosted myself, just having taken the bivalent vaccine a week ago. Yet, I still wear my KN-95 every time I go shopping and when I go to a restaurant I eat in a patio, unless the restaurant itself has socially distant tables inside. I won't stop living during these times, but I'm extra careful too.
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The high number of deaths for diabetics are a result of most diabetics being type 2, and most of those being anywhere from moderately overweight to morbidly obese. I am a T1 diabetic and weigh what I weighed when I graduated college 16 years ago. I make good choices on what I eat and exercise regularly. A T1 diabetic with well-controlled blood-sugar levels who is not overweight is less likely to die from Covid than a non-diabetic who is overweight. They weren't sure of that early on so suggested the vaccine for all T1's, but younger and healthier T1's did ok.

This is for another discussion, but it is truly unfortunate that despite what has happened with Covid (in addition to everything else) that we as a society continue to not only minimize the dangers of being overweight but now in some ways glorify it. It's not ok, it's prematurely killing people similarly to how smoking did a generation ago and it's taboo to discuss it because you are "fat shaming".

As for the rest, well I respect people making their own decisions. That is what I believe in not only for this, but for everything. No one should be shamed if they choose to get it, or choose to wear a mask. But no one should lose their jobs or be shamed if they choose not to.

But really what it comes down to, was that it was rushed earlier than previous types of vaccines and that it doesn't stop the spread, and that we were lied to about that part of it. If there was a vaccine that made it so you had an extremely small chance of getting it, I'd be more on board with getting it myself. But if you see value in it and think any potential risks are worth it for you I am all for you getting it.
 
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Herby said:
The high number of deaths for diabetics are a result of most diabetics being type 2, and most of those being anywhere from moderately overweight to morbidly obese. I am a T1 diabetic and weigh what I weighed when I graduated college 16 years ago. I make good choices on what I eat and exercise regularly. A T1 diabetic with well-controlled blood-sugar levels who is not overweight is less likely to die from Covid than a non-diabetic who is overweight. They weren't sure of that early on so suggested the vaccine for all T1's, but younger and healthier T1's did ok.

This is for another discussion, but it is truly unfortunate that despite what has happened with Covid (in addition to everything else) that we as a society continue to not only minimize the dangers of being overweight but now in some ways glorify it. It's not ok, it's prematurely killing people similarly to how smoking did a generation ago and it's taboo to discuss it because you are "fat shaming".

As for the rest, well I respect people making their own decisions. That is what I believe in not only for this, but for everything. No one should be shamed if they choose to get it, or choose to wear a mask. But no one should lose their jobs or be shamed if they choose not to.

But really what it comes down to, was that it was rushed earlier than previous types of vaccines and that it doesn't stop the spread, and that we were lied to about that part of it. If there was a vaccine that made it so you had an extremely small chance of getting it, I'd be more on board with getting it myself. But if you see value in it and think any potential risks are worth it for you I am all for you getting it.
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That's good not weighing any more than you did in college almost 20 years later. Nice Michigan beanie! ;-)

stephen-furst-animal-house.jpg
 
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RonM11 said:
Did either of you read the study?

This study was finalized over four months ago with the COVID-19 Treatment Guidelines Panel recommending against the use of Ivermectin in the treatment of COVID-19:

Recommendation​

  • The Panel recommends against the use of ivermectin for the treatment of COVID-19, except in clinical trials (AIIa).
Click to expand...
Yes I read it. Re-read my post. I wrote its under evaluation and considered a worthwhile area of research by the NIH. That is a far cry from its mainstream reputation perpetuated by some hysterics in the media - which is noteworthy.
 
AbsentMojo said:
Yes I read it. Re-read my post. I wrote its under evaluation and considered a worthwhile area of research by the NIH. That is a far cry from its mainstream reputation perpetuated by some hysterics in the media - which is noteworthy.
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They had always said that, though. The shaming was for people actually literally--wait for it--grabbing and eating horse-dewormer because that was the only readily available over-the-counter version and they thought themselves smarter than it.

I mean the things this page have hit on is that while people vociferously disagree there's some real common ground for MOST people (or at least respect for disagreement) and the actual science is pretty reasonable, it's the reporting of it that's stupidly extreme, as you point out, and unfortunately most of the reaction here and elsewhere has been to the insane reporting.

I'd also add that it's a mature and reasonable viewpoint--even for science--to change its mind upon further evidence but the most common response to evolving discourse is "these idiots don't know what they're doing" and it's more than unfortunate.
 
Just got back from my like 4th visit to Urgent Care this year.

I wish I could come in for something cool like needing stitches or a broken bone but it's always something incredibly awkward I'm having done to me. :help:
 
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