GDT: GDT #35 New York Islanders vs Buffalo Sabres | December 23rd | 7:30 PM | F/7-1 L

IslesNorway

Registered User
Apr 9, 2007
9,534
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Nittedal, Norway
I think there is lots of factors at play here and probably some we do not even think about. This team has profound organizational issues and they need addressing ASAP. It's hard to figure out what is on the coach and what is on the players when you have two games like these, but something is wrong, very wrong.

It starts with retiring Lou. Bring in a new GM with no affiliation with this organization who can start the retool by getting rid of " problem" players, whoever they may be. Trade away Plams and Nelson as fast as they can and see what is available out there for other players. IMHO, the only player who should be untouchable is Sorokin. It needs to happen now before the rot sets in properly.
 
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The Real JT

The crowd called out for more
Jul 2, 2018
8,412
8,038
Connecticut
In the words of Warner Wolf “If you had the Islanders +5 1/2 goals, you lost!”

Been away from NY sports television for quite a while now but I remember that. He can't still be on the air, is he?!
He’s not on the air any longer and my guess is he’d be 90 if he’s still alive.

He was definitely entertaining. He was an early adopter of video highlights (“Let’s go to the video tape!) and one of the few sportscasters (other than Jimmy the Greek) who spoke about gambling back in the day.
 

Rehabguy

In ROY I trust
Oct 2, 2011
5,248
2,069
My guess is Lou’s hire of Roy is backfiring. A number of the glue players under Trotz have moved on. He over invested in certain players. Lambert was a relaxed coach, something players alluded to for more offense. Lou said the team was ‘inconsistent’ under Lambert. Out went Lambert, in goes Mr aggressive.

Well, this team is consistently crap under Roy. My next guess is a number of these players (yeah, the same ones) have moved on mentally from Roy, they thought it was great to have a HOFer as coach, but now? Not so much.

Trade out of this core asap. Rebuild/retool, whatever, the core ain’t gonna work as they are 100% a main problem.


Teams with goofball/meddlers/absent owners and poor management never do anything consistently but lose. That’s across all sports. The Isles really had a 30+ year run of it.
Why are your assessments of this team so backwards? Roy can’t predict that the team in front of him would be out nearly half his defense and 2 critical forwards to start a quarter of the season. We are lucky to have any shot of even making the playoffs still under those conditions. To blame Roy for the start of this season is just foolish.

The blame does fall squarely on Lou for bringing in Lambert in the first place and for constructing such a mentally weak team. All these issues with the team from the pathetic power play to the late period collapses were present long before Roy took over. The guy had so much to fix from the basic premise that the idea is to play to win and get away from Trotz pusher mentality. This play not to lose mentality has morphed into a fear of losing mentality.

I don’t think Roy has been here a full year yet but he’s going to have to pull a rabbit out of his hat as he did to finish out the last season and get this teams heads collectively out of their asses. This Dr Jeckyl and Mr Hyde performances they have going on has to stop. As I said when he was hired Roy’s biggest challenge will have to be the Islanders mental game. One night before they showed how good they could be the next showed how bad they can be. It’s all mental issues and not being ready. Yes this will ultimately fall on Roy’s shoulders but the damage Lambert and to a lesser extent Trotz has done to the already fragile state of this roster will take a while to fix.

One of the biggest weaknesses of this team is the lack of presence of a pugilist who gets under the skin of the opposing team to put this team in the right state of mind to battle. Someone who’s cocksure of himself and lets the other team know it and force his own teammates into a battle. Look at this line up. They’re all a bunch of Boy Scouts. Not one player with a mean bone in his body. Too gentlemanly like they let the opposing teams walk all over them.

The biggest danger from all of this is that, as you are trying to do, Roy is made the scapegoat in all of this; Lou fires him and launches this team's suck state into perpetuity.
 
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scottywiper

Registered User
Dec 2, 2018
8,978
4,765
Why are your assessments of this team so backwards? Roy can’t predict that the team in front of him would be out nearly half his defense and 2 critical forwards to start a quarter of the season. We are lucky to have any shot of even making the playoffs still under those conditions. To blame Roy for the start of this season is just foolish.

The blame does fall squarely on Lou for bringing in Lambert in the first place and for constructing such a mentally weak team. All these issues with the team from the pathetic power play to the late period collapses were present long before Roy took over. The guy had so much to fix from the basic premise is the idea is to play to win and get away from Trotz pusher mentality. This play not to lose mentality has morphed into a fear of losing mentality.

I don’t think Roy has been here a full year yet but he’s going to have to pull a rabbit out of his hat as he did to finish out the last season and get this teams heads collectively out of their asses. This Dr Jeckyl and Mr Hyde performances they have going on has to stop. As I said when he was hired Roy’s biggest challenge will have to be the Islanders mental game. One night before they showed how good they could be the next showed how bad they can be. It’s all mental issues and not being ready. Yes this will ultimately fall on Roy’s shoulders but the damage Lambert and to a lesser extent Trotz has done to the already fragile state of this roster will take a while to fix.

One of the biggest weaknesses of this team is the lack of presence of a pugilist who gets under the skin of the opposing team to put this team in the right state of mind to battle. Someone who’s cocksure of himself and lets the other team know it and force his own teammates into a battle. Look at this line up. They’re all a bunch of Boy Scouts. Not one player with a mean bone in his body. Too gentlemanly like they let the opposing teams walk all over them.

The biggest danger from all of this is that, as you are trying to do, Roy is made the scapegoat in all of this; Lou fires him and launches this team suck state into perpetuity.
What has Roy improved? Special teams have got way worse? What was that goalie pull? I don't really have a strong opinion on him but he's not blameless.
Id say this team plays almost bruise free hockey.
The fourth line used to hit and wear down teams. Now no one does
 

SRBisles

Registered User
Nov 27, 2015
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Long Island
What has Roy improved? Special teams have got way worse? What was that goalie pull? I don't really have a strong opinion on him but he's not blameless.
Id say this team plays almost bruise free hockey.
The fourth line used to hit and wear down teams. Now no one does
Roy’s pressers and general attitude this season give the vibe of a coach who knows his roster isn’t good enough and is biding time until actual changes can be made.
 

scottywiper

Registered User
Dec 2, 2018
8,978
4,765
Roy’s pressers and general attitude this season give the vibe of a coach who knows his roster isn’t good enough and is biding time until actual changes can be made.
It feels like there is a power struggle between Roy and Lou. And it looked like that goalie pull was designed to send a message.
 

YearlyLottery

The Pooch Report
Feb 7, 2013
11,571
8,002
South Carolina
What has Roy improved? Special teams have got way worse? What was that goalie pull? I don't really have a strong opinion on him but he's not blameless.
Id say this team plays almost bruise free hockey.
The fourth line used to hit and wear down teams. Now no one does

The roster simply is not good enough. Roy also came in last year, got this team on an insane run, and they made the playoffs. This team missing out on the playoffs and getting a top draft pick is what is best for business.
 

Nassau Revisited

Registered User
Jun 16, 2017
3,793
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Roy’s pressers and general attitude this season give the vibe of a coach who knows his roster isn’t good enough and is biding time until actual changes can be made.
Roy looks like he has given up less than a year on the job. He has not fixed any of the problems we saw with Lambert. People are soft nowadays and a coach that is hard on players does not last long anymore .

The roster is not good enough and that is on Lou but I am not so sure Roy is the answer either
 

Torrey Redux

Please!
Apr 25, 2022
462
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Philadelphia, PA
Whatever the roster weaknesses are, and there are plenty, does not give Roy a pass. His comments about his lack of attention to the PK alone - and the results of that lack of attention - are reason enough to question his coaching ability and decision making. Ultimately, this was a hit and hope hire by Lou of a guy who had been out of the league for 8 years and with only 3 years of NHL head coaching experience before that. The bottom line is that he has done nothing to instill confidence in me that he should be the guy going forward, either upstairs or behind the bench.
 

scottywiper

Registered User
Dec 2, 2018
8,978
4,765
Whatever the roster weaknesses are, and there are plenty, does not give Roy a pass. His comments about his lack of attention to the PK alone - and the results of that lack of attention - are reason enough to question his coaching ability and decision making. Ultimately, this was a hit and hope hire by Lou of a guy who had been out of the league for 8 years and with only 3 years of NHL head coaching experience before that. The bottom line is that he has done nothing to instill confidence in me that he should be the guy going forward, either upstairs or behind the bench.
Pretty much it, for me.
 
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Throttle

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Sep 22, 2020
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Why are your assessments of this team so backwards? Roy can’t predict that the team in front of him would be out nearly half his defense and 2 critical forwards to start a quarter of the season. We are lucky to have any shot of even making the playoffs still under those conditions. To blame Roy for the start of this season is just foolish.

The blame does fall squarely on Lou for bringing in Lambert in the first place and for constructing such a mentally weak team. All these issues with the team from the pathetic power play to the late period collapses were present long before Roy took over. The guy had so much to fix from the basic premise is the idea is to play to win and get away from Trotz pusher mentality. This play not to lose mentality has morphed into a fear of losing mentality.

I don’t think Roy has been here a full year yet but he’s going to have to pull a rabbit out of his hat as he did to finish out the last season and get this teams heads collectively out of their asses. This Dr Jeckyl and Mr Hyde performances they have going on has to stop. As I said when he was hired Roy’s biggest challenge will have to be the Islanders mental game. One night before they showed how good they could be the next showed how bad they can be. It’s all mental issues and not being ready. Yes this will ultimately fall on Roy’s shoulders but the damage Lambert and to a lesser extent Trotz has done to the already fragile state of this roster will take a while to fix.

One of the biggest weaknesses of this team is the lack of presence of a pugilist who gets under the skin of the opposing team to put this team in the right state of mind to battle. Someone who’s cocksure of himself and lets the other team know it and force his own teammates into a battle. Look at this line up. They’re all a bunch of Boy Scouts. Not one player with a mean bone in his body. Too gentlemanly like they let the opposing teams walk all over them.

The biggest danger from all of this is that, as you are trying to do, Roy is made the scapegoat in all of this; Lou fires him and launches this team suck state into perpetuity.
Was Roy blind when he took the job on the roster? Or was it that he was ostracized forever and Lou extended an olive branch hoping this would work. Roy saw an opportunity to get in league, get air cover from Lou, possibly see that Lou is gonna l e on at some point, for Roy this was ALL upside.

Except, he’s done no better than Lambert. Lambert figured out that the 3rd/4th lines were dying and were ineffective. The first two lines are made up of players that are not good enough to carry a team, make big moments happen, etc.

The flaws of the first two lines were masked by the 3rd and 4th wearing down opponents and the two lines being optimistic. Now? All lines are exposed.

As a unit once an upon a time, it worked. Once the team tilted in the direction it’s currently on, the Isles ‘core’ players are not good enough horses for the ride.

Is that on Lou? Sure. He invested in these players. What does Vegas do? They upgrade and get out from under guys like this. Lou keeps them.

The Isles are trending into Montreal Canadians - a mess of a team, not much there, sort acting like a rebuild, sort of trying to compete. In another market, MTL is essentially CLB without a 100 year history. Just a reminder, MTL had their very own Barzal in Kovalev and went nowhere with him…
 
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seafoam

Soft Shock
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May 17, 2011
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Things haven’t been the same since this day…this was our amulet that held all the winning pedigree. Bring it back…

 
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Rehabguy

In ROY I trust
Oct 2, 2011
5,248
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What has Roy improved? Special teams have got way worse? What was that goalie pull? I don't really have a strong opinion on him but he's not blameless.
Id say this team plays almost bruise free hockey.
The fourth line used to hit and wear down teams. Now no one does
Roy has improved the Isles system of play the moment he took over this team. That said, he should not be held blameless for the futile powerplay he inherited nor the weak powerkill. With more time if things do not improve with this healthy roster yes I would start looking at Roy. But when you put things in the proper context, Roy inherited an already anemic offense compounded by injuries to two critical players who play a big part in the Islander's offense and for a long stretch to start the season he was missing half his defense. Let's be real folks. Roy needs more time. Lou is out of time.
 
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Rehabguy

In ROY I trust
Oct 2, 2011
5,248
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Roy looks like he has given up less than a year on the job. He has not fixed any of the problems we saw with Lambert. People are soft nowadays and a coach that is hard on players does not last long anymore .

The roster is not good enough and that is on Lou but I am not so sure Roy is the answer either
I'm sold on Roy. I see whats happening to this lineup on a day to day basis. I'm not going to make him the scape goat for unfortunate situations. But he needs to get specialty teams going. The PP has been terrible going all the way to the Trotz era of hockey. When will this get fixed I don't know. Personally I wish it were he running the team from top to bottom. I don't know when they started this specialty assistant coaches nonsense but when Arbour ran the team, it was all him- regular play, PP and PK.
 

SI

Registered User
Feb 16, 2013
7,939
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Why are your assessments of this team so backwards? Roy can’t predict that the team in front of him would be out nearly half his defense and 2 critical forwards to start a quarter of the season. We are lucky to have any shot of even making the playoffs still under those conditions. To blame Roy for the start of this season is just foolish.

The blame does fall squarely on Lou for bringing in Lambert in the first place and for constructing such a mentally weak team. All these issues with the team from the pathetic power play to the late period collapses were present long before Roy took over. The guy had so much to fix from the basic premise is the idea is to play to win and get away from Trotz pusher mentality. This play not to lose mentality has morphed into a fear of losing mentality.

I don’t think Roy has been here a full year yet but he’s going to have to pull a rabbit out of his hat as he did to finish out the last season and get this teams heads collectively out of their asses. This Dr Jeckyl and Mr Hyde performances they have going on has to stop. As I said when he was hired Roy’s biggest challenge will have to be the Islanders mental game. One night before they showed how good they could be the next showed how bad they can be. It’s all mental issues and not being ready. Yes this will ultimately fall on Roy’s shoulders but the damage Lambert and to a lesser extent Trotz has done to the already fragile state of this roster will take a while to fix.

One of the biggest weaknesses of this team is the lack of presence of a pugilist who gets under the skin of the opposing team to put this team in the right state of mind to battle. Someone who’s cocksure of himself and lets the other team know it and force his own teammates into a battle. Look at this line up. They’re all a bunch of Boy Scouts. Not one player with a mean bone in his body. Too gentlemanly like they let the opposing teams walk all over them.

The biggest danger from all of this is that, as you are trying to do, Roy is made the scapegoat in all of this; Lou fires him and launches this team's suck state into perpetuity.
Because he knows nothing about the game and comes on this board responding to every post - trolling and flaming. It is best just to ignore/block the poster.
 

SI

Registered User
Feb 16, 2013
7,939
4,157
Roy has improved the Isles system of play the moment he took over this team. That said, he should not be held blameless for the futile powerplay he inherited nor the weak powerkill. With more time if things do not improve with this healthy roster yes I would start looking at Roy. But when you put things in the proper context, Roy inherited an already anemic offense compounded by injuries to two critical players who play a big part in the Islander's offense and for a long stretch to start the season he was missing half his defense. Let's be real folks. Roy needs more time. Lou is out of time.

With the way things are trending, we might see a new GM, and that GM would have every right to clean house and bring in their own people. That said, I really like what Patrick Roy has done so far. The more aggressive system is a step in the right direction, goals against are down (if you exclude empty-netters), and the 5v5 play has been solid. However, the special teams are a disaster.

A new GM might decide to clean house, or they could stick with Roy (it is Patrick ROY) and give him a chance to work with a retooled roster.

My biggest concern? Ending up with another recycled GM.
 
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Rehabguy

In ROY I trust
Oct 2, 2011
5,248
2,069
Was Roy blind when he took the job on the roster? Or was it that he was ostracized forever and Lou extended an olive branch hoping this would work. Roy saw an opportunity to get in league, get air cover from Lou, possibly see that Lou is gonna l e on at some point, for Roy this was ALL upside.

Except, he’s done no better than Lambert. Lambert figured out that the 3rd/4th lines were dying and were ineffective. The first two lines are made up of players that are not good enough to carry a team, make big moments happen, etc.

The flaws of the first two lines were masked by the 3rd and 4th wearing down opponents and the two lines being optimistic. Now? All lines are exposed.

As a unit once an upon a time, it worked. Once the team tilted in the direction it’s currently on, the Isles ‘core’ players are not good enough horses for the ride.

Is that on Lou? Sure. He invested in these players. What does Vegas do? They upgrade and get out from under guys like this. Lou keeps them.

The Isles are trending into Montreal Canadians - a mess of a team, not much there, sort acting like a rebuild, sort of trying to compete. In another market, MTL is essentially CLB without a 100 year history. Just a reminder, MTL had their very own Barzal in Kovalev and went nowhere with him…
Roy dug himself in a hole following his Colorado stint. He's got a fiery personality. Nothing wrong with that but he knew his job was on the line the moment he took it given Lou's history of just letting coaches go left and right. Right now Ledecky and Malkin should have a say in the matter in regards to hiring or firing of coaches and Lou should be on a short lease. I am under the impression that Roy would rather be working for another GM but took the job given that Lou was the only one calling. When the team is winning it looks unstoppable, when the team is losing it usually means they've reverted back to playing on their heels. I haven't seen evidence that the team losses were a result of the system of play Roy has implemented since he got here. It seems more or less mental lapses to finish off 3rd periods and a string of ill timed injuries have done this team in far too many times this season. I still think if they can string a number of wins together they will be right in it by the end. The worse case scenario is that Lou impulsively fires Roy before he himself is sent packing.

With the way things are trending, we might see a new GM, and that GM would have every right to clean house and bring in their own people. That said, I really like what Patrick Roy has done so far. The more aggressive system is a step in the right direction, goals against are down (if you exclude empty-netters), and the 5v5 play has been solid. However, the special teams are a disaster.

A new GM might decide to clean house, or they could stick with Roy (it is Patrick ROY) and give him a chance to work with a retooled roster.

My biggest concern? Ending up with another recycled GM.
I see the same thing. Good post.
 

Torrey Redux

Please!
Apr 25, 2022
462
389
Philadelphia, PA
I'm sold on Roy. I see whats happening to this lineup on a day to day basis. I'm not going to make him the scape goat for unfortunate situations. But he needs to get specialty teams going. The PP has been terrible going all the way to the Trotz era of hockey. When will this get fixed I don't know. Personally I wish it were he running the team from top to bottom. I don't know when they started this specialty assistant coaches nonsense but when Arbour ran the team, it was all him- regular play, PP and PK.
Do you also want him to personally run scouting and ticket sales? Perhaps the merchandise shop? Roy has zero NHL GM experience, he's never even been an assistant. Do you want a comp? How about the beloved BT in Nashville. He may become a great GM someday, but as a rookie, it would be hard to f**k up worse.

Where did this notion of Roy as GM even begin? It makes zero sense.
 

Throttle

Registered User
Sep 22, 2020
6,215
4,632
Because he knows nothing about the game and comes on this board responding to every post - trolling and flaming. It is best just to ignore/block the poster.
Can you provide more stats please? I find it very helpful.
 

Rehabguy

In ROY I trust
Oct 2, 2011
5,248
2,069
Do you also want him to personally run scouting and ticket sales? Perhaps the merchandise shop? Roy has zero NHL GM experience, he's never even been an assistant. Do you want a comp? How about the beloved BT in Nashville. He may become a great GM someday, but as a rookie, it would be hard to f**k up worse.

Where did this notion of Roy as GM even begin? It makes zero sense.
I meant he should coach the team top to bottom. He already personally knows dual positions as GM/coach do not work.
 

Throttle

Registered User
Sep 22, 2020
6,215
4,632
Still waiting on your PP system you have yet to clear up - boss.
Do you earn more points for play message board coach or something?

Isles don’t shoot the puck at the net. Other teams do. Not that hard.
 

SI

Registered User
Feb 16, 2013
7,939
4,157
Do you earn more points for play message board coach or something?

Isles don’t shoot the puck at the net. Other teams do. Not that hard.

Can you tell me more about this power play that plays lower in the zone? Is that how you described it?

And no, I don’t get more points for this—I just have a thirst for justice. Especially for those who come onto this board and try to hijack it. I take particular offence when it’s done by people who clearly don’t understand the game and aren’t held accountable.

BTW, Maty says Merry Christmas.
 
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Throttle

Registered User
Sep 22, 2020
6,215
4,632
Can you tell me more about this power play that plays lower in the zone? Is that how you described it?

And no, I don’t get more points for this—I just have a thirst for justice. Especially for those who come onto this board and try to hijack it. I take particular offence when it’s done by people who clearly don’t understand the game and aren’t held accountable.

BTW, Maty says Merry Christmas.
Message board justice, honorable profession. Message board coaching tactics pays well.

Sure, you shoot the puck at the net, 2/3 guys near the net seek to take the rebound and put it in. Rocket science. Except the D can’t hit the net and certain forwards want to play needle in a haystack to the detriment of the team.

If the PO has been crap Lou’s tenure, then maybe look at the players you think so highly of and maybe there’s AN answer there.

Just remember, you brought yourself into this considering you were ignoring me. Guess you were not.
 

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