Gary Bettman: 25 years and counting

[BrainyBomber]

Another sad indictment of Bettman as the age of the average hockey fan in the US has skyrocketed from 33 to 49 since 2000. Far more than any other sport.

So much for growing the game: The sports with the oldest — and youngest — TV audiences

 

[TheLegend]

Another sad indictment of Bettman as the age of the average hockey fan in the US has skyrocketed from 33 to 49 since 2000. Far more than any other sport.

So much for growing the game: The sports with the oldest — and youngest — TV audiences

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Those stats don’t mean a whole lot unless you compare that to the growth in viewership.

For all anyone knows the older age groups could have migrated to the NHL from other sports and skewed them.

And then again you’re only looking at viewership in the media. Does the age of live attendance to games match that demographic as well??

It’s one thing to grab a single stat out of context just to prove a point. But it’s another to show it’s relevance.

 

[mouser]

Another sad indictment of Bettman as the age of the average hockey fan in the US has skyrocketed from 33 to 49 since 2000. Far more than any other sport.

So much for growing the game: The sports with the oldest — and youngest — TV audiences

View attachment 122557

So you’re saying the NHL has a lower average audience age then the MLB and NFL?

 

[Bookie21]

So you’re saying the NHL has a lower average audience age then the MLB and NFL?

Yes he is. That's positive news for the NHL

 

[BrainyBomber]

Those stats don’t mean a whole lot unless you compare that to the growth in viewership.

For all anyone knows the older age groups could have migrated to the NHL from other sports and skewed them.

And then again you’re only looking at viewership in the media. Does the age of live attendance to games match that demographic as well??

It’s one thing to grab a single stat out of context just to prove a point. But it’s another to show it’s relevance.

No problem to answer your question there hasn't been any growth in viewership hence the terrible national TV deal. It's actually gone down 12% this decade.

I was merely trying to illustrate the failed growth arguments another way

 

[BrainyBomber]

So you’re saying the NHL has a lower average audience age then the MLB and NFL?

lol nice shovelling but no that's always been the case and now Bettman has squandered the once massive margin.

Any rational person can see that the American NHL TV audience has skyrocketed in age by a full third since 2000. Hence Bettman is failing miserably at bringing in the crucial young viewers needed to grow the game, which underpins his entire sun belt strategy.

 

[MNNumbers]

lol nice shovelling but no that's always been the case and now Bettman has squandered the once massive margin.

Any rational person can see that the American NHL TV audience has skyrocketed in age by a full third since 2000. Hence Bettman is failing miserably at bringing in the crucial young viewers needed to grow the game, which underpins his entire sun belt strategy.

Assuming that figures are correct, it means that it is the very same people watching now, and everyone is 16 years older. If, in 5 more years, the number is 54 for NHL, that would ready be bad

 

[TheTotalPackage]

Assuming that figures are correct, it means that it is the very save people watching now, and end is 16 years older. If, in 5 more years, the number is 54 for NHL, that would ready be bad

That's the first thing that caught my eye. The average age of NHL viewers has grown completely linear with the time period. The WNBA had the next biggest gap, and I don't think it is far fetched to suggest that that league hasn't made any inroads with new fans.

I found it impressive that the average age of NBA viewers has remained pretty much flat.

 

[TheLegend]

^^^ Sticking to the viewership angle.

I wonder how much is being considered here towards streaming versus broadcast??? Or are those numbers above taking that into consideration??

The younger set these days seem to move towards streaming things to various devices than those who started into watching via broadcast.

 

[edog37]

He is judged by the big three and the I thought the goal was the large TV contract?

He got the largest US TV contract in NHL history.

 

[Melrose Munch]

He got the largest US TV contract in NHL history.

compared to the other leagues its nothing. and the mls got a 4 billion offer a while back, just fyi. still gate driven, not good enough.

 

[MNNumbers]

compared to the other leagues its nothing. and the mls got a 4 billion offer a while back, just fyi. still gate driven, not good enough.

tbh,
That 4B offer included a whole lot more than TV rights, because it included a somewhat merger with the now-almost-defunct NASL and included a promotion/relegation arrangement as well. It really could hardly be called a real offer.

Wikipedia suggests that MLS currently receives 90M/yr total. Compared to the NHL....200M/yr US + 533M/yr CAD...I'd call that about 675M/yer US, with the exchange rate figured in. That means MLS and NHL are not YET comparable.

But, it's also true that the 675M (est) that NHL receives does not compare to NBA, MLB or NFL

 

[Bookie21]

tbh,
That 4B offer included a whole lot more than TV rights, because it included a somewhat merger with the now-almost-defunct NASL and included a promotion/relegation arrangement as well. It really could hardly be called a real offer.

Wikipedia suggests that MLS currently receives 90M/yr total. Compared to the NHL....200M/yr US + 533M/yr CAD...I'd call that about 675M/yer US, with the exchange rate figured in. That means MLS and NHL are not YET comparable.

But, it's also true that the 675M (est) that NHL receives does not compare to NBA, MLB or NFL

Agree on MLS and NHL not being on the same level. They receive over $500 million a year more. Add to that the putrid MLS ratings, appox 250,000..... Is not good. NHL averaged 1.29 million on NBC this year and 420,000 overall across the NBC platform. I won't even mention the Canadian ratings, because MLS isn't even in the same stratosphere

 

[eddygee]

Agree on MLS and NHL not being on the same level. They receive over $500 million a year more. Add to that the putrid MLS ratings, appox 250,000..... Is not good. NHL averaged 1.29 million on NBC this year and 420,000 overall across the NBC platform. I won't even mention the Canadian ratings, because MLS isn't even in the same stratosphere

To be fair it's not as big a gap as you are making out. MLS actually could surpass NHL's NBCSN's 302K in broadcast cable ratings. If trends continue it will only be a few more years before MLS surpass the combined NBCSN and NBC average of 417k just like the Premier League has already done. Last check they are averaging about 280k cable ratings this year, and unlike NHL they are posting yearly gains in TV viewership, I wouldn't be surprised if MLS got anywhere from $300-450 mil per yr from the their next US TV deal in 2022 not counting their Canada TV right and Global TV rights being that there last rights fee jumped 5 1/2 fold. They don't get put on OTA like we have NHL on NBC 12+ games they have only 5 or so games on FOX average around 650k. Its simple math they are expected to grow to 32 teams now have 23. I know we will get Seattle and most likely Houston but lets not bury our heads in the sand.

 

[Fenway]

To be fair it's not as big a gap as you are making out. MLS actually could surpass NHL in non over the air cable ratings last check they are averaging about 280k cable ratings this year, and unlike NHL they are posting yearly gains in TV viewing numbers. I wouldn't be surprised if MLS got $300-450 mil per yr from the their next tv deal in 2022 they way that league is growing. They don't get put on OTA like we have NHL on NBC 12+ games they have only 5 or sogames on FOX and they average around 650k

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In the US there is really no MLS team that has huge local ratings.

 

[eddygee]

In the US there is really no MLS team that has huge local ratings.

Just Portland, Seattle and Atlanta that I know. They have to do a better job to be a solidified long term player but they are steadily increasing their national presence 23 teams to 28 then to 32.

 

[Fenway]

Just Portland, Seattle and Atlanta that I know. They have to do a better job to be a solidified long term player but they are steadily increasing their national presence 23 teams to 28 then to 32.

The New England Revolution televise every game and local radio on a major station and they still are a distant 5th in the Boston market.

I am guessing the NHL wants at least $500M a year with the next contract and maybe more

 

[ChuckLefley]

It’s interesting that nobody noted that every sport on that least(except one or two) has skewed upward in age. Logically that says our population is getting older, not that the NHL has no younger fans. Another misdirection play by the people who hate Bettman.

 

[Killion]

It’s interesting that nobody noted that every sport on that least(except one or two) has skewed upward in age. Logically that says our population is getting older, not that the NHL has no younger fans. Another misdirection play by the people who hate Bettman.

.... ah, actually Chuck; no. Logically what this suggests is that for a variety of reasons not least of which is cost to attend a game & so on & so on..... the game is no longer accessible & therefore as relevant to all levels of society... not that the NHL ever really was beyond the old Rust Belt & Canada. Minor Pro, the old Western League, PCHA, PHL, AHL, IHL, Can Am & others that have come & gone, others still thriving.

However sure, I'm all for growth, applauded, liked all of the Expansions since 67/68 (though not the way they did it & the speed with which they did it. Seriously handicapping the incoming teams by way of Drafts etc. Fixed somewhat with Vegas though $500M a Hell of a hit. Sky high over-priced let alone $650M. But hey; its biz & if they can get it. Honestly, dont really have a problem with Gary Bettman, Prickly Pair however he's just the Commissioner, does the bidding of the BOG's, when hired mandated with 3 tasks;

1) Bring in Cost Certainty (CAP - Check)
2) Oversee preexisting Expansion plans (Check)
3) Grow Central Revenues, Secure a lucrative Broadcast Contract (Check... though work still to be done)

He's done a great job. Of the Big 4 by far the best Commissioner IMO. Dont like the way he's handled any number of issues & files but ok. His jobs pretty tough. Like Herding Cats & damned no matter what he does. Yet he smiles through it all, totally dedicated. Smart as a whip. But there are problems here, problems with growth, problems with a wide range of issues and no, this isnt a "disinformation" thread, Board. Just a lot of interested & concerned people who have questions, who like to talk things out, fascinated by the BOH & Sport.

 

[ChuckLefley]

.... ah, actually Chuck; no. Logically what this suggests is that for a variety of reasons not least of which is cost to attend a game & so on & so on..... the game is no longer accessible & therefore as relevant to all levels of society... not that the NHL ever really was beyond the old Rust Belt & Canada. Minor Pro, the old Western League, PCHA, PHL, AHL, IHL, Can Am & others that have come & gone, others still thriving.

However sure, I'm all for growth, applauded, liked all of the Expansions since 67/68 (though not the way they did it & the speed with which they did it. Seriously handicapping the incoming teams by way of Drafts etc. Fixed somewhat with Vegas though $500M a Hell of a hit. Sky high over-priced let alone $650M. But hey; its biz & if they can get it. Honestly, dont really have a problem with Gary Bettman, Prickly Pair however he's just the Commissioner, does the bidding of the BOG's, when hired mandated with 3 tasks;

1) Bring in Cost Certainty (CAP - Check)
2) Oversee preexisting Expansion plans (Check)
3) Grow Central Revenues, Secure a lucrative Broadcast Contract (Check... though work still to be done)

He's done a great job. Of the Big 4 by far the best Commissioner IMO. Dont like the way he's handled any number of issues & files but ok. His jobs pretty tough. Like Herding Cats & damned no matter what he does. Yet he smiles through it all, totally dedicated. Smart as a whip. But there are problems here, problems with growth, problems with a wide range of issues and no, this isnt a "disinformation" thread, Board. Just a lot of interested & concerned people who have questions, who like to talk things out, fascinated by the BOH & Sport.

You ignore the facts I presented about all sports.

 

[Killion]

You ignore the facts I presented about all sports.

No, I didnt ignore that, I decided not to address Birthrates but if you wish.... There have been 2 major declines, in 1936 at the height of the Great Depression & during the 1970's, another low in 76 at the height of the oil crisis and in both cases, major unemployment. Very likely another in the 2000's from which we are still recovering some 8yrs later. Birthrates remain robust & combined with immigration obviously an awful lot more people in both Canada & the US so I'm not exactly sure what it is your arguing Chuck. Huh?

More people, more younger people than ever before though the % in comparison to older people per 1000 during the flood of the Baby Boom era did temporarily at least somewhat tilt that scale however.... they then went on to have children, and now their childrens children along with a massive influx from Mexico & Latin America in the US, former Soviet States, the far East, China & Hong Kong etc.... which then leads into yet another conversation, that of integration.... and.... economics. Disposable income. Wealth. Costs to attend a game. Costs to put your kids on the ice, field, diamond & so on & so on. I'm not an Economist, a Sociologist, a Statistician. Are you?

 

[ChuckLefley]

You’re still ignoring the facts I presented. Every sport, with one or two exceptions is getting older, it’s not the NHL exclusively. That says a lot, but the Bettman haters (and you apparently) choose to ignore that.

 

[Killion]

You’re still ignoring the facts I presented. Every sport, with one or two exceptions is getting older, it’s not the NHL exclusively. That says a lot, but the Bettman haters (and you apparently) choose to ignore that.

To date all youve' presented is opinion. Lets see the numbers, demographics.

 

[ChuckLefley]

To date all youve' presented is opinion. Lets see the numbers, demographics.

Perhaps you should go read the full thread before posting anymore, as it’s clear you didn’t read the thread. Post #76 would be a good one to really focus on.

Feel free to apologize after you go back and read.

 

[MNNumbers]

Chuck,

If I may.....

A close look at those numbers tells you several things:
1- Viewership of most sports is getting older. This is not surprising given the enjoyment that the youth have with tablets and phones.
2- Given #1 to be true, look closely at the numbers....
2a - In the 10 years between 06 and 16, the average viewer's age became 4-5 years older in almost every sport. Let's call that "Normal given the digital age."
2b - In the specific cases of Horse Racing, NASCAR and NHL, the move is 7-9 years. That means that those sports have NOT attracted as much younger viewership. Immediately that tells you that NHL better be examining the best way to monetize streaming capabilities through their app, because that is the only way to get any money from the younger crowd.
2c - Even more disconcerting is the rise from avg age 33 to 49 in the 16 years between '00 and '16. In that range, NHL is the outlier. This suggests even more that NHL has an issue connecting with younger fans.

I wouldn't paint the trend as 'catastrophic', but those numbers do suggest that NHL has an issue to work on.

That, connected with the growing trend of cord cutting both suggest to me that the next US TV contract may be worth less, rather than more. NHL really needs a way to monetize streaming, or it will have even more revenue disparity across the league than it does now. And, I think the powers that be have their heads in the sand about it.