GDT: Game 25: Denver Avalanche vs. Shining Stars | Sunday, December 3rd, 6pm MT
- Thread starter Pokecheque
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I think the thing that bothers me the most about our team is the absolute lack of hockey IQ and cohesiveness that surrounds this team.
1st goal Nieto makes a bonehead drop pass at the blue line the defender wasn't expecting, that gives their best player a breakaway down 1-0.
2nd goal Barberio just needs to get the puck out but makes a terrible decision to pass to Girard which leads to a turnover and another goal, down 2-0.
3rd goal Bernier has a meltdown, not to mention Ghetto was super lazy down 3-1 after we get momentum from Rantanen's goal
4th goal, another bad turnover only moments after going down 3-1, just can't happen.
5th goal Kerfoot just needs to get the puck out, but tries to make the hardest play possible, turnover which gives Dallas a 2 on 0 on Varly and game over.
But it goes beyond that, it would be a miracle if I saw us connect on 4+ consecutive passes, no one is on the same page. One player will be going one way and the pass to him will be going the other way. We have way too many skilled finesse players who always try the complicated play instead the basic play, which lead to what we saw tonight lots of bad turnover and bad goals against. We have players that are mentally checked out because they can't even receive basic passes without fumbling them away and turning the puck over.
NHL teams don't fumble around passes on a PP, look at Dallas tonight, when they had a PP it was crisp pass after crisp pass which leads to a decent chance. Our PP is one good pass, then a fumbled one then a rushed shot from the point that Barrie gets block about 50 ft from the net and an easy clear. Rinse repeat.
I hate to say it but these kids need to grow up, this isn't juniors, this the NHL you've got to be focused at all times and use your brain. Cut the cute shit and start playing like men.
1st goal Nieto makes a bonehead drop pass at the blue line the defender wasn't expecting, that gives their best player a breakaway down 1-0.
2nd goal Barberio just needs to get the puck out but makes a terrible decision to pass to Girard which leads to a turnover and another goal, down 2-0.
3rd goal Bernier has a meltdown, not to mention Ghetto was super lazy down 3-1 after we get momentum from Rantanen's goal
4th goal, another bad turnover only moments after going down 3-1, just can't happen.
5th goal Kerfoot just needs to get the puck out, but tries to make the hardest play possible, turnover which gives Dallas a 2 on 0 on Varly and game over.
But it goes beyond that, it would be a miracle if I saw us connect on 4+ consecutive passes, no one is on the same page. One player will be going one way and the pass to him will be going the other way. We have way too many skilled finesse players who always try the complicated play instead the basic play, which lead to what we saw tonight lots of bad turnover and bad goals against. We have players that are mentally checked out because they can't even receive basic passes without fumbling them away and turning the puck over.
NHL teams don't fumble around passes on a PP, look at Dallas tonight, when they had a PP it was crisp pass after crisp pass which leads to a decent chance. Our PP is one good pass, then a fumbled one then a rushed shot from the point that Barrie gets block about 50 ft from the net and an easy clear. Rinse repeat.
I hate to say it but these kids need to grow up, this isn't juniors, this the NHL you've got to be focused at all times and use your brain. Cut the cute shit and start playing like men.
Oh they were hitting plenty tonight. Are you forgetting the big smack Z laid near the beginning of the game? There were plenty of licks given. Even MacKinnon was being a bit of a punk (and that's when he's playing his best). A lack of physicality is not the issue, unless we're talking about Barberio in the corners.
But I do agree they're a bit one-dimensional when it comes to offense. They simply can't sustain drives in the attacking zone, and they depend way too much on the power play and offense off the rush. This team just doesn't cycle well and they seem abysmally slow pouncing on rebounds. They also depend a little too much on moving the puck up high and getting shots through traffic from the points--and the opposition knows this now. I also feel like this team has more momentum-killing line changes than any other team in the NHL. That's on the coach. Is he not that concerned with this team retaining possession and creating multiple scoring chances?
Don't think I need to call out the goats for this game, I'm sure a few of you beat me to it. I think it's pretty clear who will be sitting once Landy comes back.
And while I thought he was abysmal on the power play I thought this was one of Barrie's better games in a long while. However, I think Anton Lindholm is playing like a guy who has no business in the NHL, and Barberio isn't much better. Once again he makes a telegraphed outlet pass to a guy up high in the zone with a forechecker bearing down hard, which led to the goal late in the 1st. I won't miss that guy once he's gone.
shadow1
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- Nov 29, 2008
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I didn’t think the Avs played that bad - at least, until I shut it off after the Kerfoot mistake. But you have to win home games against teams who played last night...as opposed to getting blown out.
As I said recently, Colorado’s lack of depth up front is showing lately. They’re a three line team, and sometimes - like tonight - a two line team.
As I said recently, Colorado’s lack of depth up front is showing lately. They’re a three line team, and sometimes - like tonight - a two line team.
John Eichel da GOAT
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- Oct 7, 2008
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We really weren't THAT bad. The Devils game was much much worse. The only difference in this game was the Stars showing up. They capitalized on every chance they got and outside of goal 3 and the empty net, they were all pretty good goals.
We didnt finish our chances and the Stars kept us to the outside for the majority of the game. Kudos to them.
We didnt finish our chances and the Stars kept us to the outside for the majority of the game. Kudos to them.
While I didn't think we were terrible tonight, I dont see how one can possibly think the New Jersey game was worse.
We only allowed 2 goals that game. We were actually very strong Defensively from start to finish in that one. One brain fart from Zadorov and a PK break down was it.
Tonight we had multiple breakdowns, poor plays, mistakes, etc. New Jersey game was one of our stronger Defensive games all year. We just couldn't score.
- Apr 25, 2006
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The truth is, on paper we're a bottom 10 (possibly bottom 5) team in the league and we should expect losing. I think we've been playing OK for what we have.
I don't disagree, but that doesn't mean roll over and die for other teams either. We can still work hard and give 100% every night, which we weren't even remotely close to this evening.
The Kingslayer
Registered User
Exactly. The one thing every team can control is working hard. We didnt work hard enough tonight especially playing a team that came off a shootout the night before. Inexcusable to come out flat the way we did.
- Apr 25, 2006
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Despite the score AVS weren't dominated and that's all I ask this year. We've got bad players that usually cost us games. When it's not Barberio it's Nieto's turnovers or Bernier letting everything in...etc
While yes Barberio, Nieto and Bernier had big blunders guys like Barrie, Kerfoot and Girard didn't have particularly stunning games either with many errors costly turnovers and fumbled pucks. I can't really pick one individual that I thought played well. I thought some players were OK, but overall it was mainly a trash game that I saw lots of players kind of pack it in once we got down, much like last season.
You've got a team that played the night before and didn't get into town until probably like 2am or later, you're rested and come out flat and lose 7-2 that is simply unacceptable IMO.
- Apr 25, 2006
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We dictated the play for 50 minutes and shots were 29-28. Score doesn't reflect that but we weren't getting outplayed and Stars are a much better team.
UncleRisto
Not Great, Bob!
Foppa2118
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- Oct 3, 2003
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I need to both critique and praise Bednar for what he did in this game. I’ll start with the critique.
I was talking recently about how the Avs are partially to blame for the league being stricter on the Avs suspensions than they are with other teams, because their head coach and GM don’t complain whatsoever. This lets them know they can do whatever they want, while other coaches and GM's work the league and officials to get an advantage on the next call.
This carries over to officiating within games as well. Here is a perfect example.
It starts with a chincy penalty called at the end of the 2nd period by the linesman who should have dropped the puck, or at the very least threw out Spezza who cheated with his right foot. Instead the linesman held on to the puck and called a penalty on a face-off outside the zone that should have just been over and done with, because it didn't hold a big advantage to anyone.
Camera cuts to Bednar who couldn’t care less. Most coaches in the league would be yelling or at least talking to the ref here trying to work them for the next power play. Let them know that was a BS call and they need to make up for it.
Then come a series of penalties on the same sequence of play that could have been called if the refs were looking to even things up and give the Avs a PP, but we’re let go.
First it’s Lindholm taking a high hit that snaps his head back, and directly causes a turnover that leads to a partial 2 on 1 against. Then it’s Lindholm again skating through the slot behind the play, who takes a little hook around the waist from Radulov that could have been called if the refs were looking to even up the calls. Then it’s another too many men call let go where the puck again hits the 6th man’s foot.
Finally after all of those are let go by the refs during the same sequence without a whistle, Dallas scores a backbreaker to make it 5-2. Goal never would have happened if the refs were looking to give the Avs a PP to make up for that chincy face-off call.
On the bright side, I need to praise Bednar for what looks to be a realization that he was ruining Zadorov with his hardass treatment. I've been preaching for a while now that this has never worked with him, and he needs a coach to pump his tires to get him to believe in how good he can be.
He had played a couple pretty good games in a row and was on his way to having a great game last game, but then made that bad turnover that cost the team a goal.
Instead of putting Z in the doghouse, he put him right back out on the ice, and played him a ton the rest of the game. Ended up being 2nd in ice time behind EJ.
If he would have benched him after that play, I think he might have lost confidence in himself again, and played a scared game tonight, but instead he looked very strong and confident again in himself and his reads to make big hits and jump into the play.
Kudos to Bednar for setting aside his ego and making an adjustment on something that I think was really hurting Zadorov’s development. Hopefully they both keep it up.
I was talking recently about how the Avs are partially to blame for the league being stricter on the Avs suspensions than they are with other teams, because their head coach and GM don’t complain whatsoever. This lets them know they can do whatever they want, while other coaches and GM's work the league and officials to get an advantage on the next call.
This carries over to officiating within games as well. Here is a perfect example.
It starts with a chincy penalty called at the end of the 2nd period by the linesman who should have dropped the puck, or at the very least threw out Spezza who cheated with his right foot. Instead the linesman held on to the puck and called a penalty on a face-off outside the zone that should have just been over and done with, because it didn't hold a big advantage to anyone.
Camera cuts to Bednar who couldn’t care less. Most coaches in the league would be yelling or at least talking to the ref here trying to work them for the next power play. Let them know that was a BS call and they need to make up for it.
Then come a series of penalties on the same sequence of play that could have been called if the refs were looking to even things up and give the Avs a PP, but we’re let go.
First it’s Lindholm taking a high hit that snaps his head back, and directly causes a turnover that leads to a partial 2 on 1 against. Then it’s Lindholm again skating through the slot behind the play, who takes a little hook around the waist from Radulov that could have been called if the refs were looking to even up the calls. Then it’s another too many men call let go where the puck again hits the 6th man’s foot.
Finally after all of those are let go by the refs during the same sequence without a whistle, Dallas scores a backbreaker to make it 5-2. Goal never would have happened if the refs were looking to give the Avs a PP to make up for that chincy face-off call.
On the bright side, I need to praise Bednar for what looks to be a realization that he was ruining Zadorov with his hardass treatment. I've been preaching for a while now that this has never worked with him, and he needs a coach to pump his tires to get him to believe in how good he can be.
He had played a couple pretty good games in a row and was on his way to having a great game last game, but then made that bad turnover that cost the team a goal.
Instead of putting Z in the doghouse, he put him right back out on the ice, and played him a ton the rest of the game. Ended up being 2nd in ice time behind EJ.
If he would have benched him after that play, I think he might have lost confidence in himself again, and played a scared game tonight, but instead he looked very strong and confident again in himself and his reads to make big hits and jump into the play.
Kudos to Bednar for setting aside his ego and making an adjustment on something that I think was really hurting Zadorov’s development. Hopefully they both keep it up.
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Vaslof
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- Feb 1, 2017
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Would not have been an empty seat in the house had they gone for buckets instead.
Vaslof
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Thing is that Zadorov played well in that game despite giving up the goal. The circumstances are completely different compared to when his overall play was abysmal. It's not necessarily Bednar changing anything in how he handles things. Also you can't really say for sure that his methods aren't working when we have a clearly reinvigorated Zadorov at our hands. Would he have taken those steps forward if there hadn't been consequences earlier in the season? I think the idea is to have a certain level of base competency before they're given the go-ahead, so as to not have them go from mistake to mistake to mistake and crushing their confidence. I get that it's important to feed on the successes and not ruin a good thing, but ice time alone doesn't automatically make anyone better (see our D-core last year, if anything they all got progressively worse).
UncleRisto
Not Great, Bob!
Things are starting to look at bit tougher :-( and the timing of Landeskog's suspension was terrible.
Dallas is looking great right now though and not easy to face for any team, perhaps currently one of the top 5 teams in the entire league having won 7 of 8 last games, they have officially turned the season around (which I didn't really expect).
I haven't been very active here lately, watching hockey is looking good right now though with my new Oled TV. ;-) What about Nemeth's mysterious injury, I'm confused, anybody knows the status? :-( :-(
Dallas is looking great right now though and not easy to face for any team, perhaps currently one of the top 5 teams in the entire league having won 7 of 8 last games, they have officially turned the season around (which I didn't really expect).
I haven't been very active here lately, watching hockey is looking good right now though with my new Oled TV. ;-) What about Nemeth's mysterious injury, I'm confused, anybody knows the status? :-( :-(
tigervixxxen
Optimism=Delusional
Anyone watch that MacKinnon after hours interview? He specifically said Bednar being even keel helps him because he's an emotional player.
Yes I watched it , it is also mentioned he cut some weight and got in great shape.
Ararana
Registered User
The Mack even keel stuff has been very evident this year. Props to Bednar then
And this is a perfect example of why advanced stats are so hit or miss. Because we visually did not outplay the Stars for 50 minutes last night. It wasn't one of those games where we played harder, outworked and out chanced the other team and just ran into a hot goalie and got some fluky bounces to go against us.
The Avs last night were soft, got tons of weak shots from the half boards and point that had no chance of going in, and had tons of mental blunders from all sorts of players that lead to easy chances for the Stars and/or killed any momentum we might of had, and couldn't generate anything on a consistent basis.
The Avs act like every game is a junior hockey game where you can make super fancy finesse plays instead of the basic plays. Some nights it works and we score in bunches other nights like this one and the game against NJ we look like a bunch of individuals who are all on different pages fumbling and/or missing passes, giving away bad turnovers that lead to prime chances and getting tons of weak shots from a mile away with no traffic in front of the net, This team needs to grow up and start playing like 23 men on a team that all have to be on the same page to make the right plays to generate consistent play, not 23 individual kids trying fancy junior shit.
tigervixxxen
Optimism=Delusional
Possession is one thing, doing something with it is another but it is something they very much needed improvement in. Ever since their return from Sweden their possession numbers have been better. Getting out of the d zone faster has helped with that. Shots against are down as well. We've seen what happens when they go to lower event hockey, they can't figure out how to then generate offense and haven't been good 5v5 lately.
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