Post-Game Talk: GAME 14 - When the skies of November turn gloomy - Hogtown 4 BRUINS 0

[BruinDust]

There are various ways to have success. If they were able to be a defensive club first and work on the offense and in the meantime getting a couple of offense oriented players it could work. Sweeney has had a lot of success but the only time he really outfitted a monster team, Monty had no idea what to do with the weapons.
But no, the defensive game is moot and the offense follows.


Yes that PP "play" is a failing strategy that McAvoy in particular
keeps trying and trying with no success.
When will they learn?

If they can clean up the defensive side they go from a bottom feeder to a mid-range club.

Bruins fans need to accept the fact this is a bottom-tier team offensively. Even with the 15 goals from Game 1/2 and the Colorado game, their GF per game would of put them 30th in GF last season. Down with the likes of Anaheim and San Jose.

They have no forward(s) who can push the D back off the rush consistently. Watch other games, piles of goals scored off the rush and from mid-range/high slot. Goalies getting beaten clean with shots. There is none of that here, and they are basically forced to go east-west all the time to hit open nets because the shooting ability is so weak and not up to NHL standards.

This is a forward group built for the NHL from 5-10 years ago. Times have changed.

 

[Aussie Bruin]

Scotty Bowman in his prime couldn't make this team a capable offensive club. They just don't have the talent.

I do think there's a narrow window in which this group can be capable offensively. On the basic premise that if last year's could, so can this year's. But last season's overachieved on the back of career years for Zacha and Coyle, Frederic and Geekie playing near the upper limits of their ability, handy contributions from DeBrusk and Heinen, and Marchand being a year younger. Now all these guys have reverted to the mean, left or, in Brad's case, simple aged, and Lindholm is not moving the needle either. An underperforming Pasta just makes it worse. Lack of talent, speed and finish, which means we are relying on a lot of guys to really play out of their skin to get results. Last year we got that, to a point at least, now we're not.

Sweeney is asking a lot of this roster and a lot of its coaches. He's built a roster that's very much against trend in the league. The Bruins are an outlier which instantly makes it harder to succeed. Not impossible, just difficult. I don't think Monty has done very well either but it's looking more and more likely that he will wear blame some of which at least should be directed higher up. I don't think there are any quick fixes here but they will surely try one (or two) before facing up to the longer term consequences.

 

[ae530]

I do think there's a narrow window in which this group can be capable offensively. On the basic premise that if last year's could, so can this year's. But last season's overachieved on the back of career years for Zacha and Coyle, Frederic and Geekie playing near the upper limits of their ability, handy contributions from DeBrusk and Heinen, and Marchand being a year younger. Now all these guys have reverted to the mean, left or, in Brad's case, simple aged, and Lindholm is not moving the needle either. An underperforming Pasta just makes it worse. Lack of talent, speed and finish, which means we are relying on a lot of guys to really play out of their skin to get results. Last year we got that, to a point at least, now we're not.

Sweeney is asking a lot of this roster and a lot of its coaches. He's built a roster that's very much against trend in the league. The Bruins are an outlier which instantly makes it harder to succeed. Not impossible, just difficult. I don't think Monty has done very well either but it's looking more and more likely that he will wear blame some of which at least should be directed higher up. I don't think there are any quick fixes here but they will surely try one (or two) before facing up to the longer term consequences.

Bruins fans we have to face the inevitable. This team cannot score

 

[BruinDust]

I do think there's a narrow window in which this group can be capable offensively. On the basic premise that if last year's could, so can this year's. But last season's overachieved on the back of career years for Zacha and Coyle, Frederic and Geekie playing near the upper limits of their ability, handy contributions from DeBrusk and Heinen, and Marchand being a year younger. Now all these guys have reverted to the mean, left or, in Brad's case, simple aged, and Lindholm is not moving the needle either. An underperforming Pasta just makes it worse. Lack of talent, speed and finish, which means we are relying on a lot of guys to really play out of their skin to get results. Last year we got that, to a point at least, now we're not.

Sweeney is asking a lot of this roster and a lot of its coaches. He's built a roster that's very much against trend in the league. The Bruins are an outlier which instantly makes it harder to succeed. Not impossible, just difficult. I don't think Monty has done very well either but it's looking more and more likely that he will wear blame some of which at least should be directed higher up. I don't think there are any quick fixes here but they will surely try one (or two) before facing up to the longer term consequences.

Well said.

Something that I don't understand though. Because you mention career years from many guys.

Last season they ran Zacha-Coyle-Geekie-Beecher up the middle most of the season. And while it at time struggled in the face-off dot against strong face-off teams, overall they got the job done.

And how did they attack the off-season? Trying to beef up the center-ice position. Spent their best trade asset (Ullmark) to bring in a 4th line C with strong face-off results. Used a large bulk of their cap space to bring in ANOTHER two-way center with face-off ability.

And did this knowing Poitras was a potential player for this season.

So they spent all those assets and cap space to beef up a position that seemed just fine for the most part. Pushed Zacha, Geekie and Beecher to the wing. Geekie in particular looks like David Backes 2.0 on RW, he needs to be in the middle where he's forced to keep his feet moving. It's the same reason Coyle sucks on RW. Zacha seems to be more productive in the middle especially when paired with Pasta. Beecher lead the NHL among rookies last year in FO % I believe I read the other day (I'm too lazy to go back and look). Now you have a bunch of players push to the wing for the new shiny toys and it's not working. What team overhauls their entire center ice position in this manner after what was a good season?

Their focus this past off-season should of been to add more reliable scoring wingers. Better shooters. Better skaters. Not 4th line Cs, or two-way centers, or physical left-shot D-men. Just a maddening approach given they let Debrusk and Heinen go, and knew what Marchand's age was.

 

[HumBucker]

He’s a dozen games into his Bruins tenure. A little patience perhaps necessary here

True, but that's also true of Kastelic and Koepke and I'd say they've made an impact. Maybe EL's wingers aren't finishing, but I'd say 12 games in is enough time for an experienced #1 centre to at least show their quality. I'm not saying he's invisible, but he's not very noticeable out there.

E. Lindholm 2-6-8
M Kastelic 3-4-7
C Koepke 3-4-7
J Beecher 2-4-6

 

[mjhfb]

True, but that's also true of Kastelic and Koepke and I'd say they've made an impact. Maybe EL's wingers aren't finishing, but I'd say 12 games in is enough time for an experienced #1 centre to at least show their quality. I'm not saying he's invisible, but he's not very noticeable out there.

E. Lindholm 2-6-8
M Kastelic 3-4-7
C Koepke 3-4-7
J Beecher 2-4-6

I still can't believe he scored 40+ goals one year. Even prime Marchand never did that. I'd settle for a solid 20+ now.

 

[DarrenBanks56]

Well said.

Something that I don't understand though. Because you mention career years from many guys.

Last season they ran Zacha-Coyle-Geekie-Beecher up the middle most of the season. And while it at time struggled in the face-off dot against strong face-off teams, overall they got the job done.

And how did they attack the off-season? Trying to beef up the center-ice position. Spent their best trade asset (Ullmark) to bring in a 4th line C with strong face-off results. Used a large bulk of their cap space to bring in ANOTHER two-way center with face-off ability.

And did this knowing Poitras was a potential player for this season.

So they spent all those assets and cap space to beef up a position that seemed just fine for the most part. Pushed Zacha, Geekie and Beecher to the wing. Geekie in particular looks like David Backes 2.0 on RW, he needs to be in the middle where he's forced to keep his feet moving. It's the same reason Coyle sucks on RW. Zacha seems to be more productive in the middle especially when paired with Pasta. Beecher lead the NHL among rookies last year in FO % I believe I read the other day (I'm too lazy to go back and look). Now you have a bunch of players push to the wing for the new shiny toys and it's not working. What team overhauls their entire center ice position in this manner after what was a good season?

Their focus this past off-season should of been to add more reliable scoring wingers. Better shooters. Better skaters. Not 4th line Cs, or two-way centers, or physical left-shot D-men. Just a maddening approach given they let Debrusk and Heinen go, and knew what Marchand's age was.

that is a great post

 

[Aussie Bruin]

Well said.

Something that I don't understand though. Because you mention career years from many guys.

Last season they ran Zacha-Coyle-Geekie-Beecher up the middle most of the season. And while it at time struggled in the face-off dot against strong face-off teams, overall they got the job done.

And how did they attack the off-season? Trying to beef up the center-ice position. Spent their best trade asset (Ullmark) to bring in a 4th line C with strong face-off results. Used a large bulk of their cap space to bring in ANOTHER two-way center with face-off ability.

And did this knowing Poitras was a potential player for this season.

So they spent all those assets and cap space to beef up a position that seemed just fine for the most part. Pushed Zacha, Geekie and Beecher to the wing. Geekie in particular looks like David Backes 2.0 on RW, he needs to be in the middle where he's forced to keep his feet moving. It's the same reason Coyle sucks on RW. Zacha seems to be more productive in the middle especially when paired with Pasta. Beecher lead the NHL among rookies last year in FO % I believe I read the other day (I'm too lazy to go back and look). Now you have a bunch of players push to the wing for the new shiny toys and it's not working. What team overhauls their entire center ice position in this manner after what was a good season?

Their focus this past off-season should of been to add more reliable scoring wingers. Better shooters. Better skaters. Not 4th line Cs, or two-way centers, or physical left-shot D-men. Just a maddening approach given they let Debrusk and Heinen go, and knew what Marchand's age was.

It's a very good argument. I do think the centers needed a boost. As good as they were in the regular season, I thought they were found wanting in the playoffs. I'm on record as not being a fan of Zacha in the middle. But I concede there are cases to be made both ways about him. Definitely agree about Geekie and Beecher though. Have to factor in Poitras too but I understand why they were reluctant to place too much trust in him just yet.

I think what Sweeney didn't do enough was go for balance. No problems with making an add at center. Was Lindholm the right guy? Quite possibly not, but the general principle I got. But not adding skill, speed and finish as well was a glaring inadequacy. I know there is only so much money to go around, but the composition of the forward group simply isn't right and it was always going to be a tough ask for it to produce at a sufficient rate. What we're seeing now is disappointing and I would say not inevitable, but it's hardly surprising either.

 

[Nikolajs Sillers]

How did Tyler Johnson look in his debut?

There's a gif above.

 

[PatriceBergeronFan]

I said in the offseason this team is a 2 goals per game roster. That part is on Sweeney.

However then it is upon the coach to make the system work. Again, see Florida, Carolina etc. They utilize hard work systems focused on dump, chase, forecheck.

Not yet an effort to clone this in Boston however. Nor to leverage the size.

With the lacking offense, the defense and system still seemed as though it could be enough and the physicality making up some of the gap. Instead, this roster offers nothing. Nothing.

 

[Bradely]

They produced last year with only one difference. Debrusk out, Lindholm in.

Assumption: - maybe the year before momentum and elite goaltending was the reason of their success.

 

[Nothingbutglass]

Assumption: - maybe the year before momentum and elite goaltending was the reason of their success.

That doesnt explain our two best defensive defensemen being barely playable. I have no idea if we changed scheme/ zone or something

 

[Bradely]

That doesnt explain our two best defensive defensemen being barely playable. I have no idea if we changed scheme/ zone or something

I think referring to last year is risky, IMO last year Bruins success was largely on our goaltending tandem, not only with their play but also with all the vibe they brought.

I also think that last year Bruins entered the season as underdog, alot of player were in a position where they could not really fail, because of low expectation. And they respond very well.

They entered this year with way higher expectation, new guys, roster changes. Much different imo. I think they will need time.

My only concern is I am not sure this group is as united as they seemed they were the last 20 years. And IMO signs are noticeable that something in the dressing might be wrong.

In 10 games, the 2 most important core players of last season have been yelled at, pushed and bench!!!!!

 

[Nothingbutglass]

I think referring to last year is risky, IMO last year Bruins success was largely on our goaltending tandem, not only with their play but also with all the vibe they brought.

I also think that last year Bruins entered the season as underdog, alot of player were in a position where they could not really fail, because of low expectation. And they respond very well.

They entered this year with way higher expectation, new guys, roster changes. Much different imo. I think they will need time.

My only concern is I am not sure this group is as united as they seemed they were the last 20 years. And IMO signs are noticeable that something in the dressing might be wrong.

In 10 games, the 2 most important core players of last season have been yelled at, pushed and bench!!!!!

I dunno. Its weird they all are suddenly bad. Ive never seen McAvoy this bad. Carlo had stretches of wretchedness but typically much better than he has been. They dont have a ton of time. Last night was pretty disheartening if you thought the weekend was a turnaround.