GDT: Game 14: Canada Vs Germany | 9AM EST 3PM CET

[Oddbob]

Proud of my Germans, thought we were close to tying the game at 1 and then it was kinda unfortunate.
Just hope that we can make it to Quarters somehow. Maybe even win against Russia

Meh, they were outplayed pretty hard today. Germany is great at clogging up the middle of the ice and seem to be well coached, but they didn't deserve a win in this one. Hane was great in net and kept this in reach all game, especially in the second half.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

The Canadians have looked really bad in this tournament. I didn’t watch this whole game. I only saw about half, but I thought the difference in the game was goaltending. Germany is much better this year than usually, but the difference between the two teams should not be goaltending. It should be every part of the game.

The Canadians did not impress me against the US either. They won, but I thought that was due to the USA’s own ineptitude in coaching and bad goaltending from a very good goaltender. They obviously got destroyed and thoroughly outclassed against Russia. Going into the next round, I’d only rank Canada ahead of Finland of the power five nations.

I’ve been thinking for years about why Canada underachieves at this tournament. The other nations are improving, but Canada still has the most talent and depth. Everyone can see that. I think what I’ve come up with is that Canada does not structure their teams well.

What we are starting to see in recent tournaments is that you win with skill and with younger players in big roles. That’s how the Finn’s have had success. Players such as Laine, Puljujarvi, Juolevi, Kakko, Lundell, Heinola all played big parts of winning teams prior to getting drafted. And some of the other power five countries, as well, have had some draft-eligibles in big roles the years they won. I think it’s not only about draft eligibles. We see this year with Canada that Harley is left off, McMichael has been one of the 2-3 best players in the CHL this year but it took an injury for him to not be on the 4th line.

Canada has a problem where they feel like they need to include relatively average talents like Thomas, Dellandrea, Foudy, Dudas, Bahl, McIsaac, Addison because they are older players who’ve been good soldiers for Hockey Canada and often times have better pedigrees than a lot of the better players on the other teams.

Canada needs to get away from this philosophy. They need to pick their most talented teams. It doesn’t mean Shane Wright, Matt Savoie and Brandt Clarke are guaranteed spots years in advance because they’ll be top picks, but there’s no reason than they should have to wait their turn until they are 18-19, so Canada’s version of grinders can have a spot. As we’ve seen, it doesn’t work, even if Canada’s grinders have good pedigrees.

And there’s no guarantee that picking the most talented teams will lead to Gold every year because Canada has the most natural talent of every country. But there will be some years where you have a group of players who produce and lead you to Gold. It’s important to give your best talents more responsibility. They might not succeed, but the philosophy is what will lead to better results in the future.

To relate this to this year’s team, Byfield, Mercer and Drysdale should all be in bigger roles. Harley, Newhook and Krebs should’ve made the team. McMichael should be in a bigger role. Players such as Perfetti, Zary, Poirier should’ve had a chance to make the team.

 

[JackSlater]

Really? Maybe you don't give Germany enough credit.

I expect more of Canada than just going through the motions and playing the percentages. I can add as a plus that the team was positionally sound for the most part but that's pretty much it.

 

[snipes]

The Canadians have looked really bad in this tournament. I didn’t watch this whole game. I only saw about half, but I thought the difference in the game was goaltending. Germany is much better this year than usually, but the difference between the two teams should not be goaltending. It should be every part of the game.

The Canadians did not impress me against the US either. They won, but I thought that was due to the USA’s own ineptitude in coaching and bad goaltending from a very good goaltender. They obviously got destroyed and thoroughly outclassed against Russia. Going into the next round, I’d only rank Canada ahead of Finland of the power five nations.

I’ve been thinking for years about why Canada underachieves at this tournament. The other nations are improving, but Canada still has the most talent and depth. Everyone can see that. I think what I’ve come up with is that Canada does not structure their teams well.

What we are starting to see in recent tournaments is that you win with skill and with younger players in big roles. That’s how the Finn’s have had success. Players such as Laine, Puljujarvi, Juolevi, Kakko, Lundell, Heinola all played big parts of winning teams prior to getting drafted. And some of the other power five countries, as well, have had some draft-eligibles in big roles the years they won. I think it’s not only about draft eligibles. We see this year with Canada that Harley is left off, McMichael has been one of the 2-3 best players in the CHL this year but it took an injury for him to not be on the 4th line.

Canada has a problem where they feel like they need to include relatively average talents like Thomas, Dellandrea, Foudy, Dudas, Bahl, McIsaac, Addison because they are older players who’ve been good soldiers for Hockey Canada and often times have better pedigrees than a lot of the better players on the other teams.

Canada needs to get away from this philosophy. They need to pick their most talented teams. It doesn’t mean Shane Wright, Matt Savoie and Brandt Clarke are guaranteed spots years in advance because they’ll be top picks, but there’s no reason than they should have to wait their turn until they are 18-19, so Canada’s version of grinders can have a spot. As we’ve seen, it doesn’t work, even if they have good pedigrees.

And there’s no guarantee that picking the most talented teams will lead to Gold every year because Canada has the most natural talent of every country, but there will be some years where you have a group of players who produce and lead you to Gold. It’s important to give your best talents more responsibility. They might not succeed, but the philosophy is what will lead to better results in the future.

To relate this to this year’s team, Byfield, Mercer and Drysdale should all be in bigger roles. Harley, Newhook and Krebs should’ve made the team. McMichael should be in a bigger role. Players such as Perfetti, Zary, Poirier should’ve had a chance to make the team.

I think you make some valid points, not sure about riding younger players when we’re already so young. I’m giving you a like even though I slightly disagree with riding 17-18 year olds.

I also think a larger issue is that we have gotten away from the Canadian Way in recent years. Previous renditions of Team Canada would physically run the other team out of the building and we’ve gotten away from bullying teams physically. We saw it against the Americans in flashes but previous Team Canada teams would play that way every game for a full 60 minutes.

Another element is these are teenagers and every team, especially the hockey power countries can all beat each other in any given day. We’ll likely always have the most depth and talent but you can only put 20 guys or whatever it is on a roster.

The unpredictability of the games is what makes this tournament the best hockey tournament.

 

[Tomas W]

If the Czech's lose in regulation to both the US & Canada, are they relegated? What tiebreaker is first, Goal Differential or Head to Head?

I think only one team gets relegated, they would play Kazachstan in a relegation 3 game series.

 

[jj cale]

I think you make some valid points, not sure about riding younger players when we’re already so young. I’m giving you a like even though I slightly disagree with riding 17-18 year olds.

I also think a larger issue is that we have gotten away from the Canadian Way in recent years. Previous renditions of Team Canada would physically run the other team out of the building and we’ve gotten away from bullying teams physically. We saw it against the Americans in flashes but previous Team Canada teams would play that way every game for a full 60 minutes.

Another element is these are teenagers and every team, especially the hockey power countries can all beat each other in any given day. We’ll likely always have the most depth and talent but you can only put 20 guys or whatever it is.

The unpredictability of the game is what makes this tournament the best hockey tournament.

He does make valid points.
Though IMO the Americans woefully underachieve also.Consider their population, the fact they have about as many registered players playing as Canada, the vast resources they pump into their program, the added advantage almost exclusive to them of having the children of Ex nhl players, their built in chemistry due to their national development program and yet they still haven't overtaken Canada or can't really get better results then tiny Finland?

Everyone waxes poetically around here about them but colour me unimpressed to be honest.

 

[newfy]

Stutzle is a fantastic player but he’s pretty light on his skates. He’ll need to get stronger but he’s young lots of time to get in the gym.

4-1 now that will wrap it up for Canada.

For playing in a pro league against men I thought he was weak on his skates though. But he wont be in the NHL next year, a team will draft him and get him on a good weight program when hes not worried about making it to high school class all week lol.

I was fine with this game from Canada. Controlled most of the game, Hofer was solid which was my biggest concern and this German team is higher calibre than what they would normally be. It was a boring game but Canada did what they needed to do and they'll get some reinforcements (hopefully 2, but one for sure) with fresh legs tomorrow.

 

[blindpass]

I expect more of Canada than just going through the motions and playing the percentages. I can add as a plus that the team was positionally sound for the most part but that's pretty much it.

They weathered the 5 minutes of equal play Germany was able to put forth them controlled the rest of the game. One broken sick breakaway was the only real lapse. Not sure what the is to complain about unless you have unrealistic expectations for this group.

 

[newfy]

He does make valid points.
Though IMO the Americans woefully underachieve also.Consider their population, the fact they have about as many registered players playing as Canada, the vast resources they pump into their program, the added advantage almost exclusive to them of having the children of Ex nhl players, their built in chemistry due to their national development program and yet they still haven't overtaken Canada or can't really get better results then tiny Finland?

Everyone waxes poetically around here about them but colour me unimpressed to be honest.

Gotta agree. We always hear about how good these young Americans are and how theyre going to overtake Canada soon etc etc. This was in a down time for Canada and the States best period of prospect development in history and Canada has still come out ahead in talent if you ask me.

 

[snipes]

He does make valid points.
Though IMO the Americans woefully underachieve also.Consider their population, the fact they have about as many registered players playing as Canada, the vast resources they pump into their program, the added advantage almost exclusive to them of having the children of Ex nhl players, their built in chemistry due to their national development program and yet they still haven't overtaken Canada or can't really get better results then tiny Finland?

Everyone waxes poetically around here about them but colour me unimpressed to be honest.

In fairness to the Yanks, a lot of their best athletes play other sports.

Hockey is also so ingrained to our cultural identity and who we are as a people as Canadians. Finns are likely the only other culture as fanatical about hockey as we are.

For Americans hockey just doesn’t mean as much outside of the Northern States (Minnesota, Wisconsin, NY, Michigan, etc.). Although in recent years players are developing from all over their country.

 

[blindpass]

He does make valid points.
Though IMO the Americans woefully underachieve also.Consider their population, the fact they have about as many registered players playing as Canada, the vast resources they pump into their program, the added advantage almost exclusive to them of having the children of Ex nhl players, their built in chemistry due to their national development program and yet they still haven't overtaken Canada or can't really get better results then tiny Finland?

Everyone waxes poetically around here about them but colour me unimpressed to be honest.

If we analyze all the causal factors and you still find them wanting does that mean you've discovered some inferiority in their national hockey soul? Or have you missed some factors? I don't understand your point.

 

[NyQuil]

The Canadians have looked really bad in this tournament. I didn’t watch this whole game. I only saw about half, but I thought the difference in the game was goaltending. Germany is much better this year than usually, but the difference between the two teams should not be goaltending. It should be every part of the game.

Kind of an odd statement as Germany looked a lot better against the US than they did against Canada.

Until the Americans broke it open late, they had their hands full.

 

[The Head Crusher]

I think only one team gets relegated, they would play Kazachstan in a relegation 3 game series.

Yup, the lowest teams from both pools face off in a 3 game series.

 

[KillerMillerTime]

In fairness to the Yanks, a lot of their best athletes play other sports.

Hockey is also so ingrained to our cultural identity and who we are as a people as Canadians. Finns are likely the only other culture as fanatical about hockey as we are.

For Americans hockey just doesn’t mean as much outside of the Northern States (Minnesota, Wisconsin, NY, Michigan, etc.). Although in recent years players are developing from all over their country.

A lot? Probably 95% of our best athletes have never
played a game of organized hockey in their life.

 

[Master P]

He does make valid points.
Though IMO the Americans woefully underachieve also.Consider their population, the fact they have about as many registered players playing as Canada, the vast resources they pump into their program, the added advantage almost exclusive to them of having the children of Ex nhl players, their built in chemistry due to their national development program and yet they still haven't overtaken Canada or can't really get better results then tiny Finland?

Everyone waxes poetically around here about them but colour me unimpressed to be honest.

If hockey was the most popular sport in the United States then this tourney wouldn't even be close.

 

[snipes]

A lot? Probably 95% of our best athletes have never
played a game of organized hockey in their life.

Exactly my point.

North American gridiron football, basketball, baseball, and even NASCAR are far more popular sports in the USA.

Football especially, we love our gridiron football up north as well but there is no doubt who the hegemonic power in NA football is.

If you guys could pull some of those athletes who are good football players into hockey it would give the Yanks a huge boost.

 

[Talus]

If hockey was the most popular sport in the United States then this tourney's wouldn't even be close.

 

[SabresSharks]

He does make valid points.
Though IMO the Americans woefully underachieve also.Consider their population, the fact they have about as many registered players playing as Canada, the vast resources they pump into their program, the added advantage almost exclusive to them of having the children of Ex nhl players, their built in chemistry due to their national development program and yet they still haven't overtaken Canada or can't really get better results then tiny Finland?

Everyone waxes poetically around here about them but colour me unimpressed to be honest.

Nothing to disagree with there. Consider the trend line though.

We finally have top-level center depth (Eichel, Matthews, Larkin) that isn't totally eclipsed by Canada's, the percentage of American NHL players continues to grow, and only recently has the WJC team suffered from losing top players to the NHL, as Canada always has.

A lot depends on if a player like Matthews, from a "non-traditional" hockey area turns out to be an anomaly or we see an increasing number of them. The combined population of states where hockey has been popular for decades at least, and which continue to provide the most elite players - Minnesota, Massachusetts, Michigan, New York, Illinois - isn't much different from Canada's.

 

[NyQuil]

If hockey was the most popular sport in the United States then this tourney wouldn't even be close.

And if we had 325 million people, this tourney wouldn't be even close.

This is fun.

If the population of Finland were all 8 feet tall, and weighed 400 pounds, boy, that tournament wouldn't even be close.

If Sweden were made up of cyborgs with artificially enhanced skeletons and musculature, this tourney wouldn't even be close.

 

[Talus]

many of the best American players come from the southern States like Arizona ,Florida and California. the Russians take hockey very seriously with the same population as the States so if you're saying population is a factor you're wrong.

 

[Master P]

And if we had 325 million people, this tourney wouldn't be even close.

This is fun.

Population doesn't mean jack shit if the sport isn't popular.

 

[NyQuil]

Population doesn't mean jack **** if the sport isn't popular.

You're saying that it wouldn't be popular in Canada if we suddenly exploded into 325 million people?

 

[57special]

If I was a cow you might be having me for dinner.

Canada looked ok. Hofer was excellent. Germany was good. Great to see a pool where there are no weak sisters. Most of the Germans could keep up to the Canadians, and were close to an even bet to win puck battles, which never happened in the past beyond a few strong players. There is something missing from this Canadian team...maybe it's just Lafreniere and Veleno.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

I think you make some valid points, not sure about riding younger players when we’re already so young. I’m giving you a like even though I slightly disagree with riding 17-18 year olds.

I go through the same process when deciding whether to like posts if I think good points are made but I slightly disagree, so no offense is taken.

I would only push back slightly. Canada has a younger team this year, but I think that stat is a misnomer. Aside from Lafrenière, one of a few returners from last year and the 1OA in 2020, all Canada’s draft eligibles are playing smaller roles now or were at some point before injuries and suspensions. The team should be built the opposite way. You fill in their spots in big roles first and then fill out the rest of the lineup with less naturally talented players for the complimentary roles.

I think people underestimate how hard it is for these first time participants at 17 or even 18 to play small roles that they will have never played before on any hockey team they’ve ever played on before. And even last year Lafrenière wasn’t given a huge role. That’s not to say they automatically get big roles over everyone. You need to find big roles for players such as Hayton, Veleno, Cozens, Smith, but the top end 17 and 18 year olds should not be in smaller roles because Canada’s version of grinders has paid their dues.

 

[Czechboy]

Yeah that would suck. Sweden’s reward for winning the group is a quarterfinal date with Russia.

The German's are looking like a classic quarter final nightmare opponent as well. Special teams are usually the difference in the quarters and Germans are great at those.