Proposal: Free agency edition Trade Rumours/Proposals [MOD - Stay on Topic] 5

[Tuna99]

In all due respect, let's have some of what you're smoking. Try tuning into the Pens' game tonight. Karlsson is awful, doesn't give a damn about playing defense anymore and tries to create offense through reckless plays rather than the calculated/cerebrals ways he used to.

Again, last thing we need, especially at 7M/year, and a disaster waiting to happen. He has also proven time and time again he doesn't work well with shared duties on a deep d-core. The year we made it to the conference finals, it was him and the likes of Ceci, Phaneuf, Boro and Claesson. He needs to be the man and we're not the team to accommodate that anymore.


So... Jiricek? A d-core as depicted below has everything you'd want (size/physicality, balance, speed, skill) and has a chance to be one of the best un the league.

Sanderson - Jiricek
Chabot - Yakemchuk
Kleven - Zub/Jensen
Sebrango/JBD​

A rookie D learning in the lineup is the last thing this team needs.

i don’t see Jiriceck as the right player for us, we don’t need a PP RD especially with Yakumchuk who is a better PP player then Jiriceck already and Yak will be ready next season.

I’m all for getting a young solid RD, but we need a player who can upgrade the size and meanness of the group and not another offensive RD who is learning the league and not fast.

 

[2CHAINZ]

Stay far away from Karlsson. Bad contract, bad defensive play. He's tied for worse +/- on the Pens D.

My body's saying lets go, but my heart is saying no.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

And yet Karlsson would still be the best defenseman on our team. Because of his contract Karlsson had limited places to be traded too. Pittsburgh may not of been the best fit but it was probably the best of the bunch. At least coming to Ottawa there is hope of getting better where as in Pit, that team is cooked.

I don’t think you watch much hockey.

 

[Tuna99]

My body's saying lets go, but my heart is saying no.

wouldn’t it be great to have him back for a home game or two, load him up on chicken Parms and just let him play all offense for a couple of games and see where the chips land.

 

[StoicSensFan]

Let's not forget the affect having Alfie behind the bench would have to motivate Karlsson.

 

[Stylizer1]

I don’t think you watch much hockey.

You disagree with my post?

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

Erik also has a big personality and presence - especially in Ottawa. Even if he was still at the top of his game, bringing him back here would cause a lot of waves in the room. It feels like something that could easily fracture a dressing room that is already a bit fragile. Not to mention usurp our current leadership group.

It's not worth the risk.

Plus I want to remember Erik in a Sens uniform when he was in his prime. Not where's he's at now.

Not that I think it's a good idea, I don't, but the guy is 34 years old. I highly doubt that would be an issue at this stage of his career. I've always thought him and Brady would probably hit it off. They both seem like light hearted guys off the ice.

 

[Puikiou]

A rookie D learning in the lineup is the last thing this team needs.

i don’t see Jiriceck as the right player for us, we don’t need a PP RD especially with Yakumchuk who is a better PP player then Jiriceck already and Yak will be ready next season.

I’m all for getting a young solid RD, but we need a player who can upgrade the size and meanness of the group and not another offensive RD who is learning the league and not fast.

See, I don't understand where this narrative comes from. Jiricek is the furtherest thing from a "PP RD" at this point in time and is much closer to the mean player with size you're describing.

Tune into a Cleveland game, or at least watch an highlight package. Sure, Jiricek has an offensive touch, but he's much more defensive minded than the other way around. He also has a mean streak and an underated physical game.

Yakemchuk is to Bouchard/Byfuglien what Jiricek is to Pesce/Carlo. There's absolutely no cannibalism there and absolutely a spot for both on a blueline.

 

[Bileur]

So... Jiricek? A d-core as depicted below has everything you'd want (size/physicality, balance, speed, skill) and has a chance to be one of the best un the league.

Sanderson - Jiricek
Chabot - Yakemchuk
Kleven - Zub/Jensen
Sebrango/JBD​

 

[Golden_Jet]

You disagree with my post?

I think 95% would.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Erik Karlsson (7M x 3Y - PIT Retains 3M)
Sean Kuraly 1.25M x 1Y - CBJ Retains 1.25M)



David Jiricek (918k x 2Y)
Elvis Merzlikins (5.4M x 3Y)


Josh Norris (7.9M x 6Y)
Rutger McGroarty (950k x 3Y)
Mads Sogaard (775k x 2Y)


This operates under the assumption that Karlsson @ 7M has little to no value with his inconsistency and NMC, and that Norris @ 8M has little or no value due to his term and injury history.

Instead of Ottawa retaining on Norris, Columbus gets to dump Merzlikins who has considerable money and term remaining. Almost like Washington sending LAK Kuemper to subsidize Dubois.

Sogaard is currently hurt. Instead of Ottawa giving Columbus a late pick to retain on Kuraly, they give them Sogaard, who is probably worth a 4th-7th type pick.

Columbus would need to have a move on the side to bring in a cheap goalie from elsewhere. Maybe James Reimer from Anaheim? Pittsburgh could send them Nedeljkovic, but I doubt Columbus would want that contract.

McGroarty apparently stinks so far this season, but it's only been 20 or so games and he is a young prospect. He's still gotta be worth a first, and then Norris with Merzlikins going to PIT is the added value.

Man this is…not bad. You got the values pretty bang on on here I think

We lose Norris but we get karlsson. Two low value guys at the moment but in different positions of need.

 

[Tuna99]

See, I don't understand where this narrative comes from. Jiricek is the furtherest thing from a "PP RD" at this point in time and is much closer to the mean player with size you're describing.

Tune into a Cleveland game, or at least watch an highlight package. Sure, Jiricek has an offensive touch, but he's much more defensive minded than the other way around. He also has a mean streak and an underated physical game.

Yakemchuk is to Bouchard/Byfuglien what Jiricek is to Pesce/Carlo. There's absolutely no cannibalism there and absolutely a spot for both on a blueline.

Sure I just don’t see the Sens running a RD of Yakumchuk and Jiriceck over the next 2-3 years

Just not the right player at the right time for this team

 

[PlayOn]

I don’t really want Karlsson back but I have no idea what the Sens are gonna do about the RD situation, with Zub being so injury prone and Hamonic/JBD not being that good.

Ideally we should be looking to acquire a top 4 that has a lot of good years left but not sure they will find someone. I don’t think they should rush Yak either.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

In all due respect, let's have some of what you're smoking. Try tuning into the Pens' game tonight. Karlsson is awful, doesn't give a damn about playing defense anymore and tries to create offense through reckless plays rather than the calculated/cerebrals ways he used to.

Again, last thing we need, especially at 7M/year, and a disaster waiting to happen. He has also proven time and time again he doesn't work well with shared duties on a deep d-core. The year we made it to the conference finals, it was him and the likes of Ceci, Phaneuf, Boro and Claesson. He needs to be the man and we're not the team to accommodate that anymore.


So... Jiricek? A d-core as depicted below has everything you'd want (size/physicality, balance, speed, skill) and has a chance to be one of the best un the league.

Sanderson - Jiricek
Chabot - Yakemchuk
Kleven - Zub/Jensen
Sebrango/JBD​

Jiricek is not exactly all those things tho or else he would be playing.

Chabot yakemchuk no thanks lol.

 

[frightenedinmatenum2]

Man this is…not bad. You got the values pretty bang on on here I think

We lose Norris but we get karlsson. Two low value guys at the moment but in different positions of need.

When I post a trade proposal, it's not usually meant as "Look at this great idea we should do!". It's usually a thought exercise to see what could fit with all the different layers.

With that said, I think a lot of people are overrating the value of Norris without the Sens taking back a bad contract. Look at what Dubois went for...nothing and the Kings had to take Kuemper. Norris is a better player than Dubois right now and doesn't have a NMC, but Dubois doesn't have his injury history.

I would love for us to get Karlsson back because I see hockey just as much as an entertainment product as sport, and with how inconsistent the Senators have been it's not like we're ruining anything by taking the pure chaos approach. With that said, I obviously know from a hockey perspective it makes zero sense and we shouldn't acquire him.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

When I post a trade proposal, it's not usually meant as "Look at this great idea we should do!". It's usually a thought exercise to see what could fit with all the different layers.

With that said, I think a lot of people are overrating the value of Norris without the Sens taking back a bad contract. Look at what Dubois went for...nothing and the Kings had to take Kuemper. Norris is a better player than Dubois right now and doesn't have a NMC, but Dubois doesn't have his injury history.

I would love for us to get Karlsson back because I see hockey just as much as an entertainment product as sport, and with how inconsistent the Senators have been it's not like we're ruining anything by taking the pure chaos approach. With that said, I obviously know from a hockey perspective it makes zero sense and we shouldn't acquire him.

Well we shouldn’t acquire him.

But Norris for him isn’t crazy.

And I think Sanderson can take care of karlsson. Which allows zub to take care of kleven.

It’s not that dumb.

 

[Gil Gunderson]

I don't think it would be easy to get Pittsburgh to retain significant value even if this trade is discussed.

 

[bicboi64]

Watch us get Karlsson for a steal of a deal (where Pittsburgh retains like the full amount), Karlsson plays fantastic for a game, and then gets injured.

 

[Agent Zuuuub]

Sanderson-Karlsson would be a fantastic pair.

Which leaves Chabot-Zub/Jensen which is a great 2nd pair.

Which leaves Kleven-Zub/Jensen which is a great 3rd pair.

Even Kleven-Karlsson has the potential to be a great 2nd pair.

Sanderson-Zub
Chabot-Jensen
Kleven-Karlsson

So we'd have 3 pairs that consistently drive possession. 3, top 4 pairs.

 

[Stylizer1]

Karlsson is the trump card to make the sens great again.

 

[frightenedinmatenum2]

I don't think it would be easy to get Pittsburgh to retain significant value even if this trade is discussed.

Look at the previous Karlsson trade, and consider it was coming off of a Norris winning season. They will have to retain AND take back bad contracts just to dump his cap, let alone get value. There is almost certainly no market for Karlsson, especially because he has a NMC.

I doubt they want Norris, but Karlsson @ 8M for Norris @ 8M would be like a lottery ticket for them. They either keep Norris and maybe learning under Crosby can help him develop into a better player. Or they put him in a role to pump his numbers this season, and if he remains healthy all year they can shop him with retention after July 1st when their retention slots open up.

Let's say Norris finishes the season as he projects now. No injuries. If Pittsburgh is willing to retain 2M on him, and/or take back long-term bad contracts, he could get them a 1st++, which is what they really want.

There is no universe where Karlsson gets them a 1st, or any real assets. So the trade makes sense simply to get a more dynamic asset with greater upside.

 

[Wondercarrot]

If they retained $3 million on Karl and added say a pick outside the top 10 in the 1st round it’s not the worst thing that could happen.
Reasons why Karlsson could make sense:

1. If we are looking for cap flexibility and dealing from our only potential source of strength/depth the Karlsson deal could make sense.

2. If you believe Ottawa gets more out of Karl than any other franchise b/c hometown and lives here etc.

3. If you believe Pinto is a longterm #2 centre


Norris has 6 yrs remaining (incl this yr)
Karlsson has 3 yrs remaining (incl this year)
Not sure how many of those I believe…but they aren’t pipe dreams either.

 

[frightenedinmatenum2]

If they retained $3 million on Karl and added say a pick outside the top 10 in the 1st round it’s not the worst thing that could happen.
Reasons why Karlsson could make sense:

1. If we are looking for cap flexibility and dealing from our only potential source of strength/depth the Karlsson deal could make sense.

2. If you believe Ottawa gets more out of Karl than any other franchise b/c hometown and lives here etc.

3. If you believe Pinto is a longterm #2 centre


Norris has 6 yrs remaining (incl this yr)
Karlsson has 3 yrs remaining (incl this year)
Not sure how many of those I believe…but they aren’t pipe dreams either.

They are not giving up a pick to dump Karlsson. They want to get more picks. If they really don't want him around they can always buy him out, even if there are no real cap savings.

I think if you asked every team whether they would take Karlsson at 3 years 8M or Norris at 6 years 8M, it would be split. Norris is the better player now, but he has double the term of Karlsson, which adds a lot to risk with his injury history.

Karlsson retained for Norris would be a very fair trade. Ottawa gets out of the contract sooner, while Pittsburgh gets the player with more upside who if he plays well for a year or two might be able to be flipped for an actual return.

 

[SpezDispenser]

Karlsson - no retention + 1st for Norris and we're a go.

 

[Micklebot]

Karlsson - no retention + 1st for Norris and we're a go.

Cap might present a problem.