Proposal: Fowler and Stoner to New Jersey

[WesMcCauley]

Possible to find a deal between these two teams maybe? What would the return be?

Click to read more...

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Outside of Boucher and Zacha NJ doesn't have a cheap enough top 6 LW that would entice BM to make a deal. BM can do better then Boucher in a deal for Cam Fowler and Shero is definitely not moving Zacha in a deal for Fowler. I don't see NJ being a good fit for Fowler with what they've to offer.

 

[Zippy316]

Outside of Boucher and Zacha NJ doesn't have a cheap enough top 6 LW that would entice BM to make a deal. BM can do better then Boucher in a deal for Cam Fowler and Shero is definitely not moving Zacha in a deal for Fowler. I don't see NJ being a good fit for Fowler with what they've to offer.

You just about summed it up here, but I guarantee this thread will go on for three plus pages anyways.

There isn't a deal to be made here unless Anaheim is willing to take a serious hit on value for Fowler. NJ likely can't absorb both Fowler and Stoner either.

I could potentially see NJ taking on Stoner if Anaheim is sending something very enticing back to NJ. The only problem is NJ would almost certainly be buying him out next summer and I doubt Anaheim is willing to pay what it will take for NJ to do that.

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

You just about summed it up here, but I guarantee this thread will go on for three plus pages anyways.

There isn't a deal to be made here unless Anaheim is willing to take a serious hit on value for Fowler. NJ likely can't absorb both Fowler and Stoner either.

I could potentially see NJ taking on Stoner if Anaheim is sending something very enticing back to NJ. The only problem is NJ would almost certainly be buying him out next summer and I doubt Anaheim is willing to pay what it will take for NJ to do that.

Totally agree i see more or less Stoner in NJ then i would Fowler, Just don't see NJ having the pieces that Bob Murray would want for Fowler. Obviously Fowler is one of the better young D men in Anaheim along with Lindholm and Vatanen and even capped out Murray wont just give Fowler away and he shouldn't.

Anaheim would need to add at least a 2nd round pick with Stoner to move that contract, And like you said Shero would probably buy out Stoner next summer any ways and giving up a 2nd for Stoner only to have him bought out might not be something that Murray would want to do.

I think before all is said and done, That Fowler winds up in Boston and possibly Stoner winds up with the Devils. Just my humble opinion there.

 

[thedoughboy]

Totally agree i see more or less Stoner in NJ then i would Fowler, Just don't see NJ having the pieces that Bob Murray would want for Fowler. Obviously Fowler is one of the better young D men in Anaheim along with Lindholm and Vatanen and even capped out Murray wont just give Fowler away and he shouldn't.

Anaheim would need to add at least a 2nd round pick with Stoner to move that contract, And like you said Shero would probably buy out Stoner next summer any ways and giving up a 2nd for Stoner only to have him bought out might not be something that Murray would want to do.

I think before all is said and done, That Fowler winds up in Boston and possibly Stoner winds up with the Devils. Just my humble opinion there.

Considering what the hawks, your wings, and the panthers have had to trade to get capspace off the books its going to have to be A LOT more than a 2nd

 

[Number1RedWingsFan52]

Considering what the hawks, your wings, and the panthers have had to trade to get capspace off the books its going to have to be A LOT more than a 2nd

That's true unless Bob Murray wants to move Stoner+Montour/Theodore or add a 1st rounder there. That Stoner contract is unmovable you want to create the space you need to figure something out.

 

[thedoughboy]

That's true unless Bob Murray wants to move Stoner+Montour/Theodore or add a 1st rounder there. That Stoner contract is unmovable you want to create the space you need to figure something out.

That isn't really an "unless" thats more just fitting the bill of what the other 3 trades actually were. Considering this is mid season I think Anaheim would have to pay more than the other 3 to be frank. Really could see arizona pulling something like this for theodore. they could have the capspace if they LTIR datsyuk. If they can do that?

 

[Machinehead]

I like it

 

[krt88]

Anaheim needs the cap help. The offer is super low ball and when the Ducks say no, simple reply. You know our number. Call us up when you are willing to change your position.

 

[Eric Sachs]

That isn't really an "unless" thats more just fitting the bill of what the other 3 trades actually were. Considering this is mid season I think Anaheim would have to pay more than the other 3 to be frank. Really could see arizona pulling something like this for theodore. they could have the capspace if they LTIR datsyuk. If they can do that?

they can't LTIR Datsyuk considering he is A) not on their roster and B) not injured. The 35+ cap hit penalty stays no matter what happens.

Anaheim needs the cap help. The offer is super low ball and when the Ducks say no, simple reply. You know our number. Call us up when you are willing to change your position.

there hasn't even been an offer made yet in this thread..?

 

[Not So Mighty]

Maybe NJ can just take Stoner as a thank you for Palmieri?

 

[xxreact9]

Anaheim needs the cap help. The offer is super low ball and when the Ducks say no, simple reply. You know our number. Call us up when you are willing to change your position.

And this right here is the #1 best way to throw away an opportunity

 

[eternalbedhead]

If Stoner is packaged with Fowler, we're not getting a top 6 forward back.


Maybe a mid-round draft pick if someone's feeling generous.

Stoner's not a bad #6-7, but obviously those guys are a dime a dozen and you can pick up one easily without having to pay them like princesses to play on your bottom pairing. Fowler might entice a team that doesn't have any cap issues for the next 2 years to take Stoner on, but that means we're also giving up on getting some more forward help.

 

[Zippy316]

If Stoner is packaged with Fowler, we're not getting a top 6 forward back.


Maybe a mid-round draft pick if someone's feeling generous.

Stoner's not a bad #6-7, but obviously those guys are a dime a dozen and you can pick up one easily without having to pay them like princesses to play on your bottom pairing. Fowler might entice a team that doesn't have any cap issues for the next 2 years to take Stoner on, but that means we're also giving up on getting some more forward help.

If you're trading both Fowler and Stoner to one team, you are going to have to find a team that needs LD that badly for starters, but also doesn't have anyone Fowler and/or Stoner are blocking this year or next.

For example, the Devils have Greene, Moore, Merrill, Auvitu, and Quincey as LD this year. Sure it's not the best group, but does it make sense to add both Fowler and Stoner? The Devils could likely send Stoner down and play him in the AHL because their LD side is lacking prospects right now at the pro level, but that's an expensive salary to pay to play in the AHL. That's not going to come cheap.

 

[Hictor Vedman*]

A good player and a bad player doesn't equal a very good return. You're moving both to get the cap space to sign Lindholm, not trying to acquire someone really good that continues to make it harder to sign him.

Funny how people lose sight of that.

 

[eternalbedhead]

If you're trading both Fowler and Stoner to one team, you are going to have to find a team that needs LD that badly for starters, but also doesn't have anyone Fowler and/or Stoner are blocking this year or next.

For example, the Devils have Greene, Moore, Merrill, Auvitu, and Quincey as LD this year. Sure it's not the best group, but does it make sense to add both Fowler and Stoner? The Devils could likely send Stoner down and play him in the AHL because their LD side is lacking prospects right now at the pro level, but that's an expensive salary to pay to play in the AHL. That's not going to come cheap.

Exactly. I can dream, but any trade moving Stoner out, if it even happens at all, probably will hurt. Stoner can play in the AHL if necessary and he's a good locker room guy, so any team in the midst of a rebuild that could use that kind of veteran on their youth squad might be interested, but once again, those guys aren't exactly hard to find and nearly all of them can be gotten on two-way deals that don't have a hefty salary to pay.

I remember seeing the news of the signing on NHLN and thinking that this deal was sure to screw us over. Funny how things turn out that way, eh, Murray?

 

[hidek91]

If Stoner is packaged with Fowler, we're not getting a top 6 forward back.

You're in absolute cap hell (zero cap space) and need to re-sign Lindholm, which will take 4.5M at the VERY least (given that it's one year bridge deal), how can you even think about adding top 6 forward?

The only way you guys could fit top6 forward for Fowler was if he was on ELC but no team is going to trade forward like this for Fowler, unless you settle for someone of Reid Boucher quality. You guys seem to have no idea about how bad your situation is now, you either:

- add something very signifact to Stoner to dump him,
- trade Fowler way below his market value (similiar to Palmieri trade).
- pull out magic Bernier trade (very unlikely to happen).

 

[Smitty426]

If you're trading both Fowler and Stoner to one team, you are going to have to find a team that needs LD that badly for starters, but also doesn't have anyone Fowler and/or Stoner are blocking this year or next.

For example, the Devils have Greene, Moore, Merrill, Auvitu, and Quincey as LD this year. Sure it's not the best group, but does it make sense to add both Fowler and Stoner? The Devils could likely send Stoner down and play him in the AHL because their LD side is lacking prospects right now at the pro level, but that's an expensive salary to pay to play in the AHL. That's not going to come cheap.

Fowler would be #2 LD
I think the devs could retain half of stoner and move him to a team with more need. At $1.6M he is not quite the anchor he is at $3.25M
If they got a third for him, the cash is not as painful
I personally think stoner is going to cost them a young defender because of the shape they are in with Lindholm

 

[eternalbedhead]

You're in absolute cap hell (zero cap space) and need to re-sign Lindholm, which will take 4.5M at the VERY least (given that it's one year bridge deal), how can you even think about adding top 6 forward?

The only way you guys could fit top6 forward for Fowler was if he was on ELC but no team is going to trade forward like this for Fowler, unless you settle for someone of Reid Boucher quality. You guys seem to have no idea about how bad your situation is now, you either:

- add something very signifact to Stoner to dump him,
- trade Fowler way below his market value (similiar to Palmieri trade).
- pull out magic Bernier trade (very unlikely to happen).

No, that's what I'm saying; I was replying to the first couple of posters saying that Anaheim wasn't getting enough in return.

Of course the cap thing is an issue as well but New Jersey ain't giving up a young top 6 forward if we're sending Stoner back the other way. Just because I didn't mention the cap space doesn't mean I'm not aware of it.

 

[Ducks in a row]

Anaheim needs the cap help. The offer is super low ball and when the Ducks say no, simple reply. You know our number. Call us up when you are willing to change your position.

Canucks traded Kesler for Bonino + Sbisa (who they wanted) + 1st round pick when Anaheim was the only team Kesler to be traded to with Chicago having no cap space. If someone is trying to do a super low ball for Fowler then their number should be blocked. If you do that then your team misses the chance to get Fowler a good young defenseman and another team could offer something decent and get him.

 

[Zippy316]

Exactly. I can dream, but any trade moving Stoner out, if it even happens at all, probably will hurt. Stoner can play in the AHL if necessary and he's a good locker room guy, so any team in the midst of a rebuild that could use that kind of veteran on their youth squad might be interested, but once again, those guys aren't exactly hard to find and nearly all of them can be gotten on two-way deals that don't have a hefty salary to pay.

I remember seeing the news of the signing on NHLN and thinking that this deal was sure to screw us over. Funny how things turn out that way, eh, Murray?

To add to the whole mess of this situation, Anaheim is an excess of prospects that they need to make room for AND they are in no position to take even minimal salary back in return.

The best the Devils would probably be willing to offer for a package of Fowler + Stoner is Boucher + Helgeson. Even for that, Fowler adds to our glut of LD -- even though he's better than all of them sans Greene -- and Stoner would almost certainly be sent right to the AHL. That package is also selling Fowler for basically pennies on the dollar as well, which I doubt Anaheim is willing to do.

And to be completely honest, I don't even think the Devils would be willing to do that deal given how much salary they are taking on, especially since Stoner is practically dead weight.

 

[Dijock94]

Anaheim should just package a high pick to stoner and send high off for a seventh in return.

 

[RSeen]

Anaheim should just package a high pick to stoner and send high off for a seventh in return.

In a normal circumstance, I would agree, but there is the expansion draft after next season.

 

[thedoughboy]

In a normal circumstance, I would agree, but there is the expansion draft after next season.

How does that factor in? If you want to leave stoner unprotected, than leave him unprotected. He doesn't have a full NMC, so it isn't an issue in the end. It actual helps if the devils don't meet the Dman requirement of unprotected players (don't know if they do and don't care enough to look)

 

[Big Ed]

Considering what the hawks, your wings, and the panthers have had to trade to get capspace off the books its going to have to be A LOT more than a 2nd

We traded the 16th pick for the 20th and 53rd pick, that's standard trade down value.