For 4 years, I watched this forum denigrate Quenneville...

[RememberTheRoar]

Burying and chasing dmen capable of playing top4 minutes on cup winners out of town WILL have a negative impact on roster quality, that is true.

To be fair, both guys have had roles in this team losing talent. In the Kempny case, it was on Q.

 

[LDF]

There were rumblings as far back as 2012 that Stan and Q were not on the same page. 2013, 2014, & 2015 silenced that for awhile. In any organization usually the "underling" is sacrificed for the boss, and Q was the underling of Stan.

I reiterate though, I think both should have been jettisoned in this past off season. Both made plenty of blunders between 2016 and the start of the 2019 season. I can't see that as an either/or.

But I have to say I think that any semi-educated fan would not gain or lose faith in the team if the management came out and said the team is at the bottom and rebuilding. Any reasonable fan would know that (a) The core is aged, has a ton of miles on them, and isn't able to carry players for extended periods and (b) the cost of the 3 cups is reflected in the high cap prices of said core--and is the cost of doing business. You pay your stars and that's what the 'hawks did. One could of course argue Seabs' deal--but you resign Toews and Kane every day of the week given the knowledge at the time.

Honestly though, I'm not buying what the upper brass is saying and I really think Stan is in the hot seat. The players really haven't reacted in the usual way to JC becoming the head coach and the team is arguably worse. That's on Stan. The team currently resides in last place. That's also on Stan. With the team going down faster than Pamela Anderson at a Motel 6 the natives are getting restless, and that will affect season tickets. They had issues this past summer with selling them, and the team is in a worse place. I seriously think if this keeps up Stan, and probably by proxy JC is out of a job at the end of the season if the 'hawks are still warming the cellar. I don't think he will have the chance to "rebuild" if over the bulk of the season the team went from 20th under Q to 31st under Stan/JC--nor should he.


To be 100% fair to both Keith and Joker--they were playing well off of each other. Keith looked better with Joker and Joker looked better with Keith. I don't think either was really shielding the other.

I think JC's "audience" is Stan, and possibly McDonut and Rocky. JC to me seems nothing more than a puppet. Kinda sucks for him because at this point I have to wonder how much of the slide is Stan/McDonut's meddling, his coaching, or on the players. As I mentioned in another thread, when JC was trying to talk to Kane on the bench a few games ago Kane had the look on his face of a child asked to sit on his creepy uncle's lap. I think outside of one or 2 guys the players never even tried to buy into JC--but that doesn't excuse JC's poor coaching.

When it comes to the core of the team itself I don't say anything, definitively, but it looks to me like they don't want to play for JC or Stan (speculation on my part). Part of me can't help put wonder if (big if and I'm still speculating) the team sees completely new management--like from GM on down if the core's play won't improve from what it is right now.

Again, speculation.

excellent pov and in my opinion something to not believe that this is not possible. i agree with your pov btw.

 

[ChiHawk21]

Burying and chasing dmen capable of playing top4 minutes on cup winners out of town WILL have a negative impact on roster quality, that is true.

yea they would be great with daley and kempny on this team. forget panarin, leddy, tvr, tuevo, hartman, or hammer. Daley would make this thing a powerhouse.

 

[ChiHawk21]

Why do you think they haven’t made any big signings since then? The FO knew this team was on the downhill. They have clearly focused on what they need going forward, D. Do people just think it is an accident that our D prospects hit right around the same time that we have a mountain of cap space?

Bowman’s biggest mistake other than Seabrook was not starting to rebuild sooner but you can’t just rip it apart in plain view after the Nashville season because the won the west. Most fans would not get it.

As fans losing sucks but I will take two losing seasons then a resurgence over going the Detroit method 11/10 times. This team dominated for a decade.

u realize our best players will be old by the time ur prospects hit. u are looking to buy panarin back when you could have signed him in the first place....they were trying to win with saad bowman has said it himself he was brought in for the playoffs.

 

[BK]

u realize our best players will be old by the time ur prospects hit. u are looking to buy panarin back when you could have signed him in the first place....they were trying to win with saad bowman has said it himself he was brought in for the playoffs.

Toews and Kane will be 31-32 not 35.

We are looking to bring him back because we can now afford him. No I am not implying this was the long play.

 

[RememberTheRoar]

Toews and Kane will be 31-32 not 35.

We are looking to bring him back because we can now afford him.

Even if they were going to be 35, you can still count on them having a role on a competitive team.

Burns is 33, Pavelski is 34 and Thornton 39 (not a huge role at this point) and the Sharks are still going for it. Lower 30's is still a fine age for vets to contribute for several years when you have a strong core of young players.

I question whether Crawford and Keith will have any role on the competitive team, but I don't mind the idea of Keith shepherding along Jokiharju, Boqvist, and Mitchell.

 

[AmericanDream]

I checked out of this thread for a while, now up to 5 pages I see...did a Preds fan hijack this one too??

 

[JaegerDice]

yea they would be great with daley and kempny on this team. forget panarin, leddy, tvr, tuevo, hartman, or hammer. Daley would make this thing a powerhouse.

Our defense is 100% the primary issue with this team, particularly their efficiency exiting the defensive zone and transitioning through the neutral zone.

Its idiotic to whine about a lack of offense from forwards when the D cant get the puck out of their zone and into the hands of forwards before the other team has already cut off the passing lanes and are basically on top of them.

 

[RememberTheRoar]

I’m starting to think @Blackhawks is Laz

Edit: never mind. It’s opens with “Let me preface this by acknowledging the obvious: This is probably going to be the most unfair story I’ve ever written.“

Blackhawks would never admit to being even slightly unfair.

 

[RememberTheRoar]

I’m starting to think @Blackhawks is Laz

Edit: never mind. It’s opens with “Let me preface this by acknowledging the obvious: This is probably going to be the most unfair story I’ve ever written.“

Blackhawks would never admit to being even slightly unfair.

“So what do the Blackhawks look like in this alternate timeline? Pretty darn good, actually.

Saad ($6M) – Toews ($10.5M) – DeBrincat ($778.3K)

Panarin ($6M) – Teravainen ($2.86M) – Kane ($10.5M)

Schmaltz ($925K) – Danault ($3.083M) – Duclair ($1.25M)

Hartman ($875K) – Kampf ($925K) – Hinostroza ($1.5M)

Extras: Kahun ($925K), Hayden ($750K)

Keith ($5.538M) – Jokiharju ($925K)

Kempny ($2.5M) – Hjalmarsson ($4.1M)

Gustafsson ($1.2M) – Seabrook ($6.875M)

Extra: Johns ($2.35M)

Crawford ($6M)
Ward ($3M)

Total cap hit: $79.4 million.”

 

[LDF]

Burying and chasing dmen capable of playing top4 minutes on cup winners out of town WILL have a negative impact on roster quality, that is true.

not really, the org has bodies in the system that will not make it to the main club, b/c of better players in front of them.

use that surplus and the talent of those prospects to entice other team via draft picks or pick up additional key players the team needs ..... and/or salary cap relief with the young talent going out as payment.

 

[LDF]

Our defense is 100% the primary issue with this team, particularly their efficiency exiting the defensive zone and transitioning through the neutral zone.

Its idiotic to whine about a lack of offense from forwards when the D cant get the puck out of their zone and into the hands of forwards before the other team has already cut off the passing lanes and are basically on top of them.

i like how the org is addressing the needs of the future but they need to bring in one additional d-men, a top pairing d-men to help with the new group. esp if Seabs or Keith may be traded or what ever.

 

[Panzerspitze]

“So what do the Blackhawks look like in this alternate timeline? Pretty darn good, actually.

Saad ($6M) – Toews ($10.5M) – DeBrincat ($778.3K)

Panarin ($6M) – Teravainen ($2.86M) – Kane ($10.5M)

Schmaltz ($925K) – Danault ($3.083M) – Duclair ($1.25M)

Hartman ($875K) – Kampf ($925K) – Hinostroza ($1.5M)

Extras: Kahun ($925K), Hayden ($750K)

Keith ($5.538M) – Jokiharju ($925K)

Kempny ($2.5M) – Hjalmarsson ($4.1M)

Gustafsson ($1.2M) – Seabrook ($6.875M)

Extra: Johns ($2.35M)

Crawford ($6M)
Ward ($3M)

Total cap hit: $79.4 million.”

But who would be behind the bench? Because if it's Quenneville, Kempny certainly won't be on the roster.

 

[RememberTheRoar]

But who would be behind the bench? Because if it's Quenneville, Kempny certainly won't be on the roster.

He has Quenneville staying. Not sure how he’s making those two things work.

Feb. 19, 2018
The move: Blackhawks trade Michal Kempny to Washington for a 2018 third-rounder.
The verdict: Ideally in this scenario, the Blackhawks wouldn’t have been sellers last spring, so this move doesn’t happen. We’re keeping Kempny.
The effect: This is clearly felt more in Washington (and in Kempny’s jewelry case) than in Chicago.

Nov. 6, 2018
The move: Blackhawks fire Joel Quenneville.
The verdict: Nope.

 

[Pez68]

Our defense is 100% the primary issue with this team, particularly their efficiency exiting the defensive zone and transitioning through the neutral zone.

Its idiotic to whine about a lack of offense from forwards when the D cant get the puck out of their zone and into the hands of forwards before the other team has already cut off the passing lanes and are basically on top of them.

Except it's not. The issues in the defensive zone transcend the defensemen. The forward coverage is brutal, and they blow the zone way too fast. The wingers are the single biggest problem in breaking out of their zone. They are seemingly never where they should be, or supporting the puck. Saying their problems are "100% on the defense" is missing the forest for the trees. That's not how hockey works.

 

[LDF]

Except it's not. The issues in the defensive zone transcend the defensemen. The forward coverage is brutal, and they blow the zone way too fast. The wingers are the single biggest problem in breaking out of their zone. They are seemingly never where they should be, or supporting the puck. Saying their problems are "100% on the defense" is missing the forest for the trees. That's not how hockey works.

could one say that there are several key problems with the team and the org is addressing a major important part of the problem.

i was going to wait for this game to see if i am seeing a problem. heck i will ask this question before hand. the coverage as you made a mention. remember i am not a player but a fan of hockey for over 50 yrs. this new defensive scheme is not working..... if i am seeing this the right way. players are not reacting to it. can someone tell me if i am wrong or not seeing it the team defensive scheme right. is there a man-man in hockey ??

 

[Rolo]

“So what do the Blackhawks look like in this alternate timeline? Pretty darn good, actually.

Saad ($6M) – Toews ($10.5M) – DeBrincat ($778.3K)

Panarin ($6M) – Teravainen ($2.86M) – Kane ($10.5M)

Schmaltz ($925K) – Danault ($3.083M) – Duclair ($1.25M)

Hartman ($875K) – Kampf ($925K) – Hinostroza ($1.5M)

Extras: Kahun ($925K), Hayden ($750K)

Keith ($5.538M) – Jokiharju ($925K)

Kempny ($2.5M) – Hjalmarsson ($4.1M)

Gustafsson ($1.2M) – Seabrook ($6.875M)

Extra: Johns ($2.35M)

Crawford ($6M)
Ward ($3M)

Total cap hit: $79.4 million.”

Should have went back further and not re-sign Seabrook

 

[Pez68]

could one say that there are several key problems with the team and the org is addressing a major important part of the problem.

i was going to wait for this game to see if i am seeing a problem. heck i will ask this question before hand. the coverage as you made a mention. remember i am not a player but a fan of hockey for over 50 yrs. this new defensive scheme is not working..... if i am seeing this the right way. players are not reacting to it. can someone tell me if i am wrong or not seeing it the team defensive scheme right. is there a man-man in hockey ??

Man-to-man is how most defense works in hockey. The wingers should be covering the opposing defense at the points. You watch the Hawks, and the points are ALWAYS open. The. Entire. Game. The wingers are almost always too low and out of position.

 

[LDF]

Man-to-man is how most defense works in hockey. The wingers should be covering the opposing defense at the points. You watch the Hawks, and the points are ALWAYS open. The. Entire. Game. The wingers are almost always too low and out of position.

ok i thought all this time, except for when JC took over, the defensive coverage was more of a zone.

my bad and thanks for correcting me.

 

[Pez68]

ok i thought all this time, except for when JC took over, the defensive coverage was more of a zone.

my bad and thanks for correcting me.

Q ran zone defense. JC changed it to man-to-man. But the team still isn't playing it. Lol

 

[RememberTheRoar]

Should have went back further and not re-sign Seabrook

Sept. 16, 2015
The move: Blackhawks sign Brent Seabrook to an eight-year contract extension with an annual cap hit of $6.875 million.
The verdict: This contract is Stan Bowman’s original sin in the eyes of many Blackhawks fans, and it was clearly a case of rewarding a beloved player for past performance rather than investing in future performance. Seabrook will turn 39 in April of the last year of this deal, and while an ever-increasing salary cap will make the cap hit easier to absorb as time goes on, it’s still going to be a massive overpay. It would have been a tough pill to swallow for both sides, but a four-year deal at around the same cap hit (he was making $5.8 million on his previous contract and was due for a raise, whether you like it or not) would have been a reasonable compromise.
The effect: Seabrook’s contract is no longer a long-term albatross and makes future success more attainable. It also makes Seabrook more tradeable should the bottom fall out anyway in this revisionist history.

 

[TheSting]

Toews and Kane will be 31-32 not 35.

We are looking to bring him back because we can now afford him. No I am not implying this was the long play.

No chance Panarin signs here now that Q is gone. Zero, kaput, nada, go back to start....

 

[Hawkaholic]

I don't think any big free agent is signing here.

 

[Sarava]

Q's time had come. And Stan's might be here as well. If I'm Rocky, I decide on how he does at the trading deadline for whether he still has a job going in to the draft. Stan should be selling, selling, and more selling for future picks and prospects.

Kane is the only vet I would refuse to trade.

 

[ColdSteel2]

I don't think any big free agent is signing here.

Why would they? This team is still on the way down. NHL players don’t care about prospects. Once the guys we have come up and prove something, then they’ll start to notice. That’s a few years off still.