Florida Panthers set to take step back?

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Pretty hard not to take a step back when they are trying to match a year like they had last season. They were too good and too many guys hit career years that they likely won’t beat this season. I think they can still make the playoffs pretty easily though.
 
They will regress. They can't really get better than last year, and they lost a good defenseman, and downgraded from Huberdeau to Tkachuk. Also, Bob had a great year in net last year, but he's had so many bad years recently, they are probably wondering how he will do.

Their big issue is the blueline. It's Ekblad and depth guys. Gudas on the 2nd pair is a bit...well...dicey.

How much of a downgrade is Huberdeau to Tkachuk in your opinion?
Bob has been getting better and Knight should be ready and more consistently ready to step up when need be.

Also, Gudas is left out and one of the more underrated defensemen in the league.
Gudas does what he does, leads the league in hits and is average or so on defense.
Montour wasn't exactly horrible either.

Just because they're not big sexy names doesn't mean they're due a massive drop off in GA/G, which was 12th last year.
 
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How much of a downgrade is Huberdeau to Tkachuk in your opinion?
Bob has been getting better and Knight should be ready and more consistently ready to step up when need be.

Also, Gudas is left out and one of the more underrated defensemen in the league.
Gudas does what he does, leads the league in hits and is average or so on defense.
Montour wasn't exactly horrible either.

Just because they're not big sexy names doesn't mean they're due a massive drop off in GA/G, which was 12th last year.
I think it is a significant drop off. I think Tkachuk has actually become very overrated. To me, the biggest difference between Huberdeau and Tkachuk is that Huberdeau is a play driver and can make plays on his own and make his line mates better. Tkachuk hasn't shown that he can do that. Don't get me wrong, he's absolutely a top notch contributor on a good top line, but if you take away the skilled players that are out there with him, he tanks pretty hard. In some ways he's like a complimentary player, in that he really needs good players around him to be his best. His skill level is high enough that I wouldn't actually call him a complimentary player, but its a good thing there are good playmakers in Florida to help build the play for him.
 
You're actually one of the more level headed CGY fans so I'll bite.
I get most Panthers players had career years as well

Tkachuk - don't really need to say much, has the ability to score 35+ and be a PPG or above player for most of that deal.

Verhaeghe - is a pretty solid top 6 guy, ideally he's a really good 2nd line guy but has found chemistry with Barkov so he plays up a line.
Speed for days, deceiving shot, 33rd in ESG and 37th in ESP.

Reinhart - has the ability to score 30 as well and flirt with PPG again with PP time. Has the versatility to play C if need be. Him and Lundell created some good magic offensively together when 5 on 5.

Duclair - injured of course but brings elite speed and 20+ goal scoring touch but does disappear in playoffs.

That's a solid top 6 winger unit there, I agree the bottom 6 is a lot more meh but they will work hard, compete, crash and bang along the boards or in front of the net and generally be pests to play against.

Lomberg, Balcers, Cousins, Hornqvist etc
Fair enough, I see 4 top 6 wingers there. I most looking at some of the recent line projections, it seems Florida is gambling a ton on White and Balcers turning into good top 6 options and having Reinhart cause matchup problems as a "3rd liner" and (presumably) play top PP minutes. When is Duclair coming back exactly?

There is no question they are very good down the middle, but I don't think it is unfair to say they lost a ton of talent up front and on the backend. I don't think they are a threat to miss the playoffs, but I wouldn't be extraordinarily shocked if they did either.

I think it is a significant drop off. I think Tkachuk has actually become very overrated. To me, the biggest difference between Huberdeau and Tkachuk is that Huberdeau is a play driver and can make plays on his own and make his line mates better. Tkachuk hasn't shown that he can do that. Don't get me wrong, he's absolutely a top notch contributor on a good top line, but if you take away the skilled players that are out there with him, he tanks pretty hard. In some ways he's like a complimentary player, in that he really needs good players around him to be his best. His skill level is high enough that I wouldn't actually call him a complimentary player, but its a good thing there are good playmakers in Florida to help build the play for him.
He did have a very good season with Backlund and Frolik in 2018-19 (77 pts), but the big Asterix with that is that his ES production wasn't that much better than Backlund's that season either (who couldn't buy a PP point to save his life).
 
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They will regress. They can't really get better than last year, and they lost a good defenseman, and downgraded from Huberdeau to Tkachuk. Also, Bob had a great year in net last year, but he's had so many bad years recently, they are probably wondering how he will do.

Their big issue is the blueline. It's Ekblad and depth guys. Gudas on the 2nd pair is a bit...well...dicey.
Calling Forsling a depth guy is an embarassing take. It why when everyone thinks they know about our team we just laugh.
 
It will be interesting to see who Tkachuk has as his center. If he takes Huberdeau's spot and its Bennett well then I don't expect to see a 100+ pt season out of Tkachuk. If plays beside Barkov, he could do very well.
 
There was a good chance they would not have been as good with even the same roster. Hard to duplicate the year they had last season regardless of the changes. Still a pretty good team though.
 
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I think it is a significant drop off. I think Tkachuk has actually become very overrated. To me, the biggest difference between Huberdeau and Tkachuk is that Huberdeau is a play driver and can make plays on his own and make his line mates better. Tkachuk hasn't shown that he can do that. Don't get me wrong, he's absolutely a top notch contributor on a good top line, but if you take away the skilled players that are out there with him, he tanks pretty hard. In some ways he's like a complimentary player, in that he really needs good players around him to be his best. His skill level is high enough that I wouldn't actually call him a complimentary player, but its a good thing there are good playmakers in Florida to help build the play for him.

Fair enough, I don't see that much of a dropoff as I think Tkachuk is the better defensive player of the two, which keeps goals out of the net.
Yes he may not drive a line the same way but the ability to score 30+ while getting top PP time likely has him flirt with his current career 0.89 pts/game stat line at worst.

He played mostly with Backlund and Frolik in 2018-19 when he put up 77pts.
If with Barkov, the sky is the limit IMO, with Bennett it will take a dip but even if he hovers around, 30ish goals and PPG while being an absolute pest to play against, he's still young enough to improve his game, maybe not the skating so much but ability to create other ways.

Only one way to find out i guess.

And focus on Forsling the next games Florida plays against Edmonton, i think youll appreciate his speed, transition offense and ability to break up plays without big physical hits.

Fair enough, I see 4 top 6 wingers there. I most looking at some of the recent line projections, it seems Florida is gambling a ton on White and Balcers turning into good top 6 options and having Reinhart cause matchup problems as a "3rd liner" and (presumably) play top PP minutes. When is Duclair coming back exactly?

There is no question they are very good down the middle, but I don't think it is unfair to say they lost a ton of talent up front and on the backend. I don't think they are a threat to miss the playoffs, but I wouldn't be extraordinarily shocked if they did either.


He did have a very good season with Backlund and Frolik in 2018-19 (77 pts), but the big Asterix with that is that his ES production wasn't that much better than Backlund's that season either (who couldn't buy a PP point to save his life).

Just my opinion but feels like Maurice will spread the wealth again through top 3 F lines and then have a traditional 4th line of grinders.

He must get the forwards and defense to focus on team defense which may be more difficult than it sounds but the team will likely need to block shots, rely on in your face type aggression with a dump and chase mentality and all out effort back checking.

I like the potential with Balcers, feel he could replace some/most of Marchments void if paired with Lundell and Reinhart.
Don't see the White signing paying off though.

Duclair should be back around January but don't quote me. Tough to judge those types of injuries/rehabs.

Forsling replaces Weegars role
Staal, Montour, Gudas and Carlsson etc have to be consistent as possible for the bottom 4 roles which I agree gives some worry but goaltending wasn't brutal last year.
Bob should still have a fair bit of gas in the tank and Knight should shave off the odd train wreck game if he plays more often.

I agree, they could finish top 3, wildcard or miss. I tend to fall in the 3rd to WC spot range myself.
I see an obvious drop in offense to top 10ish and them to hover around the same GA/G as last year (12th).
Now a major injury to Ekblad or Barkov and that changes everything but most teams would see a drop without 2 of their best players on the ice.

Florida has had a knack for resurrecting down years in players so we'll see.

Cheers!
 
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What is the reason 11 players had career years? Surely it is not something that simply happened out of nowhere like many are suggesting. Maybe….there’s someone who knows how to assemble team chemistry at the head of this whole operation? Don’t be naïve. The Panthers are still a top team in the league. The tears about their defense because of Weegar being fired are greatly exaggerated by ignorant fan bases looking to stir the pot. Everyone knows this.
If the team chemistry was so awesome, then why the massive roster shakeup? If this chemistry is negatively impacted, don't you think it will have a huge impact on the standings?
 
I also find it somewhat funny that everyone says the Sens are unlikely to make the playoffs because even though their forward core looks good, the defense is bad.

But meanwhile, people are arguing that the Panthers will be good despite their bad D because their forward core is great, despite the fact that it's comprised of Sens rejects like Tierney, White, Balcers, etc. (and also MDZ on D).

Fair enough, I don't see that much of a dropoff as I think Tkachuk is the better defensive player of the two, which keeps goals out of the net.
Yes he may not drive a line the same way but the ability to score 30+ while getting top PP time likely has him flirt with his current career 0.89 pts/game stat line at worst.

He played mostly with Backlund and Frolik in 2018-19 when he put up 77pts.
If with Barkov, the sky is the limit IMO, with Bennett it will take a dip but even if he hovers around, 30ish goals and PPG while being an absolute pest to play against, he's still young enough to improve his game, maybe not the skating so much but ability to create other ways.

Only one way to find out i guess.

And focus on Forsling the next games Florida plays against Edmonton, i think youll appreciate his speed, transition offense and ability to break up plays without big physical hits.



Just my opinion but feels like Maurice will spread the wealth again through top 3 F lines and then have a traditional 4th line of grinders.

He must get the forwards and defense to focus on team defense which may be more difficult than it sounds but the team will likely need to block shots, rely on in your face type aggression with a dump and chase mentality and all out effort back checking.

I like the potential with Balcers, feel he could replace some/most of Marchments void if paired with Lundell and Reinhart.
Don't see the White signing paying off though.

Duclair should be back around January but don't quote me. Tough to judge those types of injuries/rehabs.

Forsling replaces Weegars role
Staal, Montour, Gudas and Carlsson etc have to be consistent as possible for the bottom 4 roles which I agree gives some worry but goaltending wasn't brutal last year.
Bob should still have a fair bit of gas in the tank and Knight should shave off the odd train wreck game if he plays more often.

I agree, they could finish top 3, wildcard or miss. I tend to fall in the 3rd to WC spot range myself.
I see an obvious drop in offense to top 10ish and them to hover around the same GA/G as last year (12th).
Now a major injury to Ekblad or Barkov and that changes everything but most teams would see a drop without 2 of their best players on the ice.

Florida has had a knack for resurrecting down years in players so we'll see.

Cheers!

My dude... Balcers was waived by the Sens when they were at the bottom of the league, and bought out by San Jose last season. He's not replacing Marchment.
 
If the team chemistry was so awesome, then why the massive roster shakeup? If this chemistry is negatively impacted, don't you think it will have a huge impact on the standings?
If you didn’t see chemistry in the regular season, and how overwhelmingly successful it was, but it wasn’t built for playoff success, and required a new formula, then I cannot help you understand why they are expected to be a better playoff team but a lesser regular season team.
 
A lot of Panther fans here are mistaking the term step back for being garbage.

If the Panthers win 5 less games and score 40 less goals, they're still a 112 point team with a 300 Goals For. That's basically the season the Leafs/Lightning had last year.

The notion that they're gonna improve on being the best offense of the last 30 years is actually far more ridiculous.
 
But meanwhile, people are arguing that the Panthers will be good despite their bad D because their forward core is great,
Floridas D wasnt very good last year either, but the team played great. It`s probably more about ppl dont know yet if Senators Top6 have chemistry? I for one think Senators will be a lock for playoffs.
 
I also find it somewhat funny that everyone says the Sens are unlikely to make the playoffs because even though their forward core looks good, the defense is bad.

But meanwhile, people are arguing that the Panthers will be good despite their bad D because their forward core is great, despite the fact that it's comprised of Sens rejects like Tierney, White, Balcers, etc. (and also MDZ on D).



My dude... Balcers was waived by the Sens when they were at the bottom of the league, and bought out by San Jose last season. He's not replacing Marchment.
probably because the Panthers have a much better set of goalies than everyone but Tampa in their own division also their forwards are considerably better Sens are counting on a ton of guys jumping in production to match a team that just outscored them by 100+goals. Panthers D is average not bad.
 
The Panthers lost Huberdeau, Weegar, Marchment, Giroux, and Duclair is expected to miss half the season with an achilles injury. Also they have Paul Maurice as the new coach. The odds are not in their favour to repeat as the Presidents trophy winner.

They were at Presidents trophy pace basically pre trade deadline.

They have less offensive talent at F but all around lot tougher to play against with Tkachuk, Cousins, Balcers, White additions.
As well as Lundell having more experience.

But it’s just about impossible to take them as serious Cup contenders for post season with Staal& Gudas eating big minutes regularly

Not saying they will take a step back, but any team that has Paul Maurice as a coach, has the potential to take a step back.

Yeah not a big fan of Maurice, thought he was their worst move.

Should still be an upgrade on their past coach who got outplayed 10/10 in the playoffs
 
Florida is gonna be stuck as a middle of the pack team for the next little while, they mortgaged the future for a playoff run and didn't work out. No 1st round pick for what, 3 years ? It's gonna be tough to add to their team.


They are not even close, the players they lost as well as the picks are just disastrous. They will be above average offensively and pretty damn bad everywhere else. Take a loot at the blue line as well as the subtractions in their forward group, no 1st round pick til 2026

How are they stuck for the near future?

At F they have
Barkov, Tkachuk, Lundell, Reinhart, Bennett, Verhaeghe all 27y or under.

At defense they have Ekblad& Forlsing 27y or younger

At G they have Bob& Knight.

They have 12-13M of useless cap dropping out next offseason with zero major re-signings.

+ those Barkov& Tkachuk contracts will be massive steals for moving forward for them.

Next year is a retool year but it’s not a years retool.

& atleast they have goalies and not cap dumps in net
 
"We're going to face two of the best three shooters in the world on Tuesday, and we're going to have to be great."
"If we play like shooters, we can score goals.”
"He knows that conference very well and he knows their shooters,"
"We got traffic there, too, and we had people at the net and we had some fine shooters coming down on him"
"We've got good shooters missing nets on real opportunities,"
“Shooters need confidence,”
"Some high-end ones, too, on high-end shooters,"
"Our shooters are not wanting to shoot the puck and that's how we got our power play going in the first place,"

-Paul Maurice, at various times.
 
Calling Forsling a depth guy is an embarassing take. It why when everyone thinks they know about our team we just laugh.

The fact Forsling has done great for the Panthers is awesome. But most people can't see past the concept that the Panthers picked him up on waivers not long prior to him breaking out.

Fair enough, I don't see that much of a dropoff as I think Tkachuk is the better defensive player of the two, which keeps goals out of the net.
Yes he may not drive a line the same way but the ability to score 30+ while getting top PP time likely has him flirt with his current career 0.89 pts/game stat line at worst.

He played mostly with Backlund and Frolik in 2018-19 when he put up 77pts.
If with Barkov, the sky is the limit IMO, with Bennett it will take a dip but even if he hovers around, 30ish goals and PPG while being an absolute pest to play against, he's still young enough to improve his game, maybe not the skating so much but ability to create other ways.

Only one way to find out i guess.

And focus on Forsling the next games Florida plays against Edmonton, i think youll appreciate his speed, transition offense and ability to break up plays without big physical hits.



Just my opinion but feels like Maurice will spread the wealth again through top 3 F lines and then have a traditional 4th line of grinders.

He must get the forwards and defense to focus on team defense which may be more difficult than it sounds but the team will likely need to block shots, rely on in your face type aggression with a dump and chase mentality and all out effort back checking.

I like the potential with Balcers, feel he could replace some/most of Marchments void if paired with Lundell and Reinhart.
Don't see the White signing paying off though.

Duclair should be back around January but don't quote me. Tough to judge those types of injuries/rehabs.

Forsling replaces Weegars role
Staal, Montour, Gudas and Carlsson etc have to be consistent as possible for the bottom 4 roles which I agree gives some worry but goaltending wasn't brutal last year.
Bob should still have a fair bit of gas in the tank and Knight should shave off the odd train wreck game if he plays more often.

I agree, they could finish top 3, wildcard or miss. I tend to fall in the 3rd to WC spot range myself.
I see an obvious drop in offense to top 10ish and them to hover around the same GA/G as last year (12th).
Now a major injury to Ekblad or Barkov and that changes everything but most teams would see a drop without 2 of their best players on the ice.

Florida has had a knack for resurrecting down years in players so we'll see.

Cheers!

Not much of a drop off is still a drop off. Most posters aren't saying that the Panthers are going to be trash, but they'll very likely take a step back from what they accomplished last season. After this season, I totally agree with you that the Panthers have flexibility to really add to their very nice roster.

Forwards and defense definitely are a step back on paper and Maurice taking over is worrisome for the roster as well. IMO Maurice might muzzle too much of the aggressive offense that made the Panthers exciting and dangerous. While yes, the Panthers could improve if they found a way to add defense to their game, but trading offense for defense often comes with significant growing pains associated with a step back. A step back is not an automatic playoffs miss.

I also Hartley and Gallant to be similar type coaches. Take it from Flames fans who went from Hartley to Gulutzan. As a Flames fan, I really do hope that Maurice doesn't square peg round hole all the players like Gulutzan did for the Flames. He also benched a ton of guys who just couldn't figure out how to play under him, so we nicknamed him Glue gun. The Flames actually did respectable in the first year under Gully and then cratered when they tuned him out the year afterwards. That's the worry from picking up a guy like Maurice.

IMO the temporary roster step back for the Panthers is not worrisome. The long term implications of a coach like Maurice IMO is potentially worrisome. I think the Panthers still hit around 100 points without too much difficulty, but I think the games might be very ugly in comparison to last season if I predict this in parallel to something that happened with the Flames in the past. If I'm wrong on this prediction, I'm actually very happy for you guys. The Gulutzan through Ward era for the Flames was awful. Hartley and Gallant eras of both teams comparatively were a bit more fun to watch and I assume Brunette as a coach was similar in approach?

Tkachuk vs Huberdeau is not a great comparison. IMO they're too different. I've mentioned before MT is a great catalyst, but IMO not a driver. He's a good catalyst for amplifying the defensive games of his line mates, but he cannot do the heavy lifting of that alone. There's a fine line between catalyst and line driver, but an important one IMO. In terms of him adding to the defensive responsibilities for Barkov and Bennett, it'll be well done by MT. But if Bennett or Barkov are injured and have to divert more defensive responsibilities to MT, you'll notice it in both MT and his C. In other words, MT's success and failures amplify up and down with the successes and failures of his line mates whereas in many other typical scenarios you can identify the one player who is struggling on the line and the players attempting to jump start the line to no avail. MT isn't the type of player who can keep a line afloat or jump start that line if his line mates are in a slump... at least not that we've ever seen in Calgary. Then he'll be the lightning rod for criticism on that line vs his line mates.

I do think that the roster construct of the Panthers is an excellent environment for MT, perhaps moreso than Calgary. But in a vacuum, I think Huberdeau would defeat MT in a 1:1 competition 9 times out of 10. This opinion I'd hold if MT was a Flame, but perhaps a homer bias of Huberdeau winning 7-8 times out of 10. It's hard to explain without you guys seeing more of MT, but I'd consider Huberdeau a superior team player/player vs MT whereas I'd explain MT as a superior team component to Huberdeau. Again I'll repeat that I think you guys will love MT. But for different reasons that you're thinking right now.

As much as you'd be happy with around a 75 point MT, I do not completely agree. Like Flames fans, I think you might start moving goal posts even though you've never really moved goal posts before. I know I did. MT has the type of aura where if you get what you asked for, you want to see more from him because of how "easily" he does it. He has the ability to have the most well rounded game, so you want a 75 point well rounded guy. Then you want him to be the 80 point well rounded guy that improves a tiny element. And then you pray to God requesting he be a 70 point guy who doesn't get your other guys dragged into unnecessary altercations soon after returning from injury...

Being a hockey nerd with Tkachuk on your team is kinda fun. You get to see old school facets of the game return, but in both a good and bad way. You see someone who is exceptionally well balanced, but then you nitpick wishing there was that one facet to his game that was excellent instead of just really good.

I honestly do think that Panthers will deal with some serious growing pains for the 2022-2023 season. But I also do think they'll take off for the 2023-2024 season and onwards.
 
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How are they stuck for the near future?

At F they have
Barkov, Tkachuk, Lundell, Reinhart, Bennett, Verhaeghe all 27y or under.

At defense they have Ekblad& Forlsing 27y or younger

At G they have Bob& Knight.

They have 12-13M of useless cap dropping out next offseason with zero major re-signings.

+ those Barkov& Tkachuk contracts will be massive steals for moving forward for them.

Next year is a retool year but it’s not a years retool.

& atleast they have goalies and not cap dumps in net
No 1st round pick for 3 years, that means extremely low chance of a young impact player on ELC coming into the lineup for about 5 years.

Very few trade assets. They have nothing available to upgrade the roster, meanwhile every team in the league that's considered a contender will be trading futures to upgrade at the TDL. They went all in last year and failed, now they'll suffer the consequences of that.

Ekblad and Forsling are good, the other 4 D-men are dog shit

They have 10M locked up in a backup goaltender for 4 more years

lol if you think Bobrovsky is anything but a "dump" that's a top 5 worst contract in the league, absolute anchor.
 
I think it's reasonable to expect a step back in points and team goals given the coaching and personnel changes.

However "step back" doesn't mean they are suddenly crap and will plummet down the standings and struggle for the playoffs and the future is shot.
 
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No 1st round pick for 3 years, that means extremely low chance of a young impact player on ELC coming into the lineup for about 5 years.

Very few trade assets. They have nothing available to upgrade the roster, meanwhile every team in the league that's considered a contender will be trading futures to upgrade at the TDL. They went all in last year and failed, now they'll suffer the consequences of that.

Ekblad and Forsling are good, the other 4 D-men are dog shit

They have 10M locked up in a backup goaltender for 4 more years

lol if you think Bobrovsky is anything but a "dump" that's a top 5 worst contract in the league, absolute anchor.

Florida fans have explained all your worries in this thread, Florida isn't going away any time soon and you thinking missing late 1sts somehow cripples our window is laughable.

Duclair, Bennett, Reinhart, Montour aren't pieces that are valued?

Duclair could easily snag a 2nd when back healthy.
Bennett is a 1st+ if he has a similar year as before
Reinhart is a 1st+
Montour could get a 2nd.

Bob won't be here the entire 4 years.
 

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