Speculation: Fire Rob Blake Blow it Up Offseason Thread (update: Robitaille, Blake and Hiller stay)

[Sol]

I kinda feel like Clarke has been ruined by this team already.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

Yes, they are in their own island in their own head. And a lot of goaltending is their focus, processing, and, wait for it, in their own head.

I actually started playing hockey as a goalie. So what even if I never did? You're pretending to be a coach AND goalie savant now?


And once more you're putting words in my mouth. I never said put a goalie out there to save us. I never said to that to any player. Not even Byfield. Frankly, nobody has. The closest is Kudelski suggesting that throwing Portillo out there for some games may be the only option if we see collapses of multiple vets in front of him.

Even those who advocated trading Kopitar and Doughty have suggested signing vets to a bridge contract. And I apparently have to specify this because you either struggle to understand differing talking points or you like to make up arguments, but I'm not one of those people advocating trading Kopitar and Doughty.

I HAVE said, time and time again, that prospects should get appropriate challenges and opportunity, which is what I said for Portillo here. I (and others) HAVE argued handling all skater prospects with a similar attitude is rigid and thus will lower the chance of developing star players if their treated like grinders. I HAVE argued that it's a disservice to the prospects to put countless resources and efforts into trying to let PLD find his game, but the moment a prospect has a bad shift or game, it's time to consider where to move him. Because then you have rookies playing scared to make a mistake.

You had months off from needing to spend time apologizing for Blake, and apparently none of it was spent digesting previous discussions. You're still under some assumption that people are advocating throwing prospects in without purpose. You're the equivalent of someone yelling at their partner after dreaming that their partner cheated.

I don't know how to help you with that.

You literally had pages of people pumping up Portillo, saying put him in this year etc etc. But yea, no one is saying that.....minus the people...who actually said that.

As far as goaltending savant, only played the position for 25 years, other than that, don't know shit about it.

It's a disservice to any kid to throw them out there and say save us, but that is the argument that some have, that we should have done that to Clarke, Turcotte, Byfield etc, that players of that caliber get thrown into those situations all the time, etc.

I don't need to apologize for Blake about anything, love you how bitch about people putting words in your mouth and in the same f***ing post you do exact same.

 

[funky]

OK, my day just got brighter. I am all good with with the Edmundson signing.

I finally sat down and played a game of hockey on the PS5. Of course I update my Kings team to make it look like the current one.

Let’s say last year I started off by doing the infamous Winnipeg trade and Vilardi came back and scored five points against me. I actually lost my fourth game in the last five years because of it. Should’ve took that as a sign.

However, this year I started out Edmundson is a total monster. He absolutely has been destroying opposition players come in close to the defensive zone.

Therefore, by putting one plus one together, this must be a sign that he’s going to be exactly what we need

In other news Kaliyev is no longer on my team as he asked for $12 million a year as an RFA. Maybe the game is a little off. Haha

Just glad we’re getting back to hockey

 

[Surf Nutz]

6 days away from Rookie Tourney. Kind of surprised Clarke is playing. One of the first things I think of....oh great, he'll be run by goons that may never get a pro contract. Saw that Beckett Sennecke broke his ankle and out 6-8 weeks. Tough break for him and Ducks. I saw Pronman made a list of top NHL prospects under 23 and he had Byfield at #27 OA. He had Senneke, Nikishin, Catton, Silayev, Yakemchuk, Levshunov, Luke Hughes and Leo Carlsson ahead of him. That's lunacy, for most all of those, ranked ahead of QB.

This is about the least pumped I am, going into camp in all my decades of being a King fan.
There are several reasons...one being that the chances of making the playoffs is less than any recent year and much of that hinges on goaltending. I guess Talbot / Rittich / Copley VS Kuemper / Rittich / Copley is not much different, though. I actually felt better with Talbot 23-24, than I do Kuemper 24-25.

I was hoping for better upgrades than Foegele, Jeannot, Edmundson...and Jones, Burroughs, Studnika, are nothing to get excited about. I will say that jettisoning PLD was a minor miracle and just NEVER seeing him on the ice for the Kings ever again, is a win....but a loss in what could have been, if that deal never happened.

I'll miss Arvy and Roy. Lizotte and Grundstrom, not so much. Letting go of Roy, is understandable and to me, he played his most lackluster hockey a good portion of last year. Despite that, he's a good player. I just now wish the Kings were a few points out of the playoffs at the deadline and they dealt him for a #1 pick. The depleted pipeline needs more standouts than Greentree, Ziemmer, Dvorak, Slukynsky, George. Another 20-32 OA pick could have really been huge.

Things to be (somewhat) excited about:
1. QB taking 2C or 3C and building on last yr
2. Clarke taking a fulltime slot. Hope he never sits a shift for an error and gets AMPLE pp time.
3. Turcotte, Thomas (Lee, Fagemo?) getting a fulltime slot. I hope both Turcotte and Thomas surprise to the upside, in actually contributing in all areas. I will even add Laferriere here and hope his experience helps in that his overall play and production takes a step.
4. New players: Foegele, Jeannot, Edmundson. I think Foegele is a bit underrated and his 5 on 5 numbers are pretty good. Hard worker, decent skill, can finish. At 27, may yet have some more upside. Jeannot? A wildcard, but it's a contract yr for him and I have moderate high hopes that a 15 g 15 a year is a good bet. Some talk about the enforcer part and the Kings needed a legit enforcer that can skate a shift and put more fear into opponents than Englund. Few have mentioned that his 211 (on memory) hits in 57 games, is massively higher than any Kings player last year. Some games, the Kings as a team were not physical and Jeannot and Edmundson will change that. Not an Edmundson fan and was not happy with the signing - especially the number and term...but if he can be an ok 3rd pair (help PK) and help Clarke break in and protect him...? I will live with that.
I cannot imagine him playing out 4 yrs and 70+ games in any season.
5. Keeping tabs on prospects Greentree, Ziemmer, Dvorak, Conmy, Slukynsky, George...hoping Pinelli, Lee, Helenius, Portillo, take big steps in the AHL. Hope to see Lee up.
Will be interesting to see how Lawrence and Booth do, as pros...and where Dvorak and Ziemmer end up playing, If they will not get decent icetime in the AHL, send them back to WHL.
6. Kirill Kirsanov. I hope he has a big season and signs (with the KINGS!) in Spring and comes over. Other Spring signings? Conmy, Wright, Connors.

And....I suppose we'll know Arty's fate soon. I am so terribly saddened and sickened by the Johnny and Matthew Gaudreau tragedy. After a week, I was wondering if Waddell will be looking to add and made me think Arty could be a target, albeit not any kind of replacement for Gaudreau or Laine. They didn't get a forward back for Laine...so 2 holes. I think Arty for a #3 2025 would be good. CBJ #3 will be in the top 5....so #65-70 range. I don't think they'd deal a second rd. I'd prefer to see Arty sign here and get a chance.

Potential upsides unforeseen: 1. Kevin Fiala FINALLY staying on 1 line all year. I hope it is with QB and he and QB form a duo that is lethal. Add Foegele, I think would be good for him as well and a 25 goal yr is not out of the realm, with the space he would get.
2. Alex Turcotte. I'd love nothing more than to see Alex be a minor force all year and put up 15 g and 15 assists. Just be a huge asset and surprise.

Prospect polls like Kings Prawn's are frustrating between hope and I like to grade on high of league they have reached and what they have done.

I have done my annual unblocking of some guys but the list I left blocked has grown longer.

If I have you blocked please do not read my post and comment you are personna nor grata!

A lot to be excited about with new vet additions, PLD cancer surgically removed, and spots for young players to compete for.

It is also risky for those reasons that the Kings could fall out of the playoff picture and the loss of some important players if the new and young don't mesh

with the core that remains.

 

[Surf Nutz]

I kinda feel like Clarke has been ruined by this team already.

Ruined by age 21?

Why? Is that what happens to you?

 

[Sol]

Ruined by age 21?

Why? Is that what happens to you?

if you played any competitive sports youd know how delicate a players future is in their early years.

 

[tigermask48]

All this talk of goalies made me think, wouldn't it be the most Bluc thing ever to send one of Rittich, Kuemper, Copley to Ontario and then play him 50-60 games in the AHL?

 

[King'sPawn]

You literally had pages of people pumping up Portillo, saying put him in this year etc etc. But yea, no one is saying that.....minus the people...who actually said that.

To play. Not to save the team. I wasn't sure if your inability to grasp nuances in discussions was an act or just natural obtuseness, but...

As far as goaltending savant, only played the position for 25 years, other than that, don't know shit about it.

If after 25 years of playing goalie you still don't understand how much the mental aspect of the game affects goalies more than others, and why it's different from having other skaters with similar overall responsibilities on the ice, it appears this isn't an act.

It's a disservice to any kid to throw them out there and say save us, but that is the argument that some have, that we should have done that to Clarke, Turcotte, Byfield etc, that players of that caliber get thrown into those situations all the time, etc.

To be put into positions to succeed. Not to be thrown out there to "save us." It's coming to light you really do struggle to understand the difference, because I don't believe it's possible to be this intentionally thick after I just explained the complete opposite.

I don't need to apologize for Blake about anything, love you how bitch about people putting words in your mouth and in the same f***ing post you do exact same.

There's a difference between making up arguments (i.e. "you said this, so I'm going to argue with you") versus summarizing overall behavior (i.e. your behavior is that of an apologist). I'd discuss this more, but given your progress on understanding goalie after 25 years, I am afraid I don't have the time hoping you'll catch up.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

To play. Not to save the team. I wasn't sure if your inability to grasp nuances in discussions was an act or just natural obtuseness, but...

If after 25 years of playing goalie you still don't understand how much the mental aspect of the game affects goalies more than others, and why it's different from having other skaters with similar overall responsibilities on the ice, it appears this isn't an act.

To be put into positions to succeed. Not to be thrown out there to "save us." It's coming to light you really do struggle to understand the difference, because I don't believe it's possible to be this intentionally thick after I just explained the complete opposite.

There's a difference between making up arguments (i.e. "you said this, so I'm going to argue with you") versus summarizing overall behavior (i.e. your behavior is that of an apologist). I'd discuss this more, but given your progress on understanding goalie after 25 years, I am afraid I don't have the time hoping you'll catch up.

I don't even know where to start....people were suggesting playing Portillo this year, not just a cup of coffee, but actually playing him, that's a horrible idea, Bland said that, I responded to bland tongue in cheek, asking what's the difference, because that's what people wanted with Byfield, Turcotte, Clarke, to come in and be Kopitar, Doughty etc without regard that they weren't ready, so the same people saying it's a bad idea to do that to Portillo, were ok with doing it to Clarke and Byfield....it's not a good idea for ANY young player to have that kind of pressure put on them.....

As far as goaltenders in general and in specific Portillo, I have no idea of his mental makeup, he might be the goaltender to shrug off a misread or a bad rebound, he might not be, that will hopefully determine how they use him and how he reacts....keep thinking though I don't understand goaltenders.....

 

[Statto]

deleted as the discussion had moved on

 

[Sol]

You literally had pages of people pumping up Portillo, saying put him in this year etc etc. But yea, no one is saying that.....minus the people...who actually said that.

As far as goaltending savant, only played the position for 25 years, other than that, don't know shit about it.

It's a disservice to any kid to throw them out there and say save us, but that is the argument that some have, that we should have done that to Clarke, Turcotte, Byfield etc, that players of that caliber get thrown into those situations all the time, etc.

I don't need to apologize for Blake about anything, love you how bitch about people putting words in your mouth and in the same f***ing post you do exact same.

You’re the same guy who let it slip your goaltending experience was NHL 2007 EASHL mode where you played goalie on the Xbox 360. Chill out.

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

You’re the same guy who let it slip your goaltending experience was NHL 2007 EASHL mode where you played goalie on the Xbox 360. Chill out.

Says the guy with more hot takes than Mike Milbury, not sure you are the person to be commenting on anything hockey related, hope those ankles are treating you well....

 

[Surf Nutz]

if you played any competitive sports youd know how delicate a players future is in their early years.

Dude I did like 3 months of competitive beach yoga!

Don't go all soft on us Sol!

 

[Surf Nutz]

I don't even know where to start....people were suggesting playing Portillo this year, not just a cup of coffee, but actually playing him, that's a horrible idea, Bland said that, I responded to bland tongue in cheek, asking what's the difference, because that's what people wanted with Byfield, Turcotte, Clarke, to come in and be Kopitar, Doughty etc without regard that they weren't ready, so the same people saying it's a bad idea to do that to Portillo, were ok with doing it to Clarke and Byfield....it's not a good idea for ANY young player to have that kind of pressure put on them.....

As far as goaltenders in general and in specific Portillo, I have no idea of his mental makeup, he might be the goaltender to shrug off a misread or a bad rebound, he might not be, that will hopefully determine how they use him and how he reacts....keep thinking though I don't understand goaltenders.....

It depends on how you look at it.

Pressure situations are a growth opportunity.

Like if the indicated possible pair of Byfield and Fiala.

QB knows Byfield is a potential dynamo they want playing up the lineup and a lot of minutes.

He is also one of the highest paid and Byf know it.

The pressure is already there without a word from the coaches,

QB is like bring it on , not like "oh no!"

 

[Sol]

Says the guy with more hot takes than Mike Milbury, not sure you are the person to be commenting on anything hockey related, hope those ankles are treating you well....

All I’m saying is that at least I don’t flaunt my “goalie” experience to get leverage in an argument when your experience came from an Xbox

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

It depends on how you look at it.

Pressure situations are a growth opportunity.

Like if the indicated possible pair of Byfield and Fiala.

QB knows Byfield is a potential dynamo they want playing up the lineup and a lot of minutes.

He is also one of the highest paid and Byf know it.

The pressure is already there without a word from the coaches,

QB is like bring it on , not like "oh no!"

You are looking at it now, and at this stage, QB should feel some pressure, absolutely,

That's like taking Ziemmer, putting him on the 2nd line this year, and saying, go score 15, get 15 apples, and 200 PIMs, you do that, and we win, you don't and we lose, there's no chance he's ready for that....you but QB in the situation he is in now, his FIRST year, and it's a disaster.

You put Clarke in that situation last year, it's a disaster if he doesn't perform, now he could have performed, he might not have, we will never know, if he doesn't, that hurts him a helluva lot more than it would help him, so you wait, I expect Clarke to be on the 3rd pair D this year with spots of PP time, and then adjust per his play.

You throw Portillo in there this year and say, save our season (because you only play him on a consistnent basis if your three veterans shit the bed) that's not a good situation for Portillo to be in, he's not ready, it'd be good for him to get a game or two in, maybe 3-4 etc, I'd do it early in the season and say, here you go, we are using these to see where you are at in the NHL game vs the AHL game, and you are going to get 3 games, after those 3 you are gonna go to the AHL and work on your game/weaknesses etc, Now that's all easier said than done given cap constraints roster constraints, and waivers etc....but ideally thats what you do with Portillo.

All I’m saying is that at least I don’t flaunt my “goalie” experience to get leverage in an argument when your experience came from an Xbox

Still stuck on stupid eh? Never got those ankles corrected, did you?

 

[Surf Nutz]

You are looking at it now, and at this stage, QB should feel some pressure, absolutely,

That's like taking Ziemmer, putting him on the 2nd line this year, and saying, go score 15, get 15 apples, and 200 PIMs, you do that, and we win, you don't and we lose, there's no chance he's ready for that....you but QB in the situation he is in now, his FIRST year, and it's a disaster.

You put Clarke in that situation last year, it's a disaster if he doesn't perform, now he could have performed, he might not have, we will never know, if he doesn't, that hurts him a helluva lot more than it would help him, so you wait, I expect Clarke to be on the 3rd pair D this year with spots of PP time, and then adjust per his play.

You throw Portillo in there this year and say, save our season (because you only play him on a consistnent basis if your three veterans shit the bed) that's not a good situation for Portillo to be in, he's not ready, it'd be good for him to get a game or two in, maybe 3-4 etc, I'd do it early in the season and say, here you go, we are using these to see where you are at in the NHL game vs the AHL game, and you are going to get 3 games, after those 3 you are gonna go to the AHL and work on your game/weaknesses etc, Now that's all easier said than done given cap constraints roster constraints, and waivers etc....but ideally thats what you do with Portillo.



Still stuck on stupid eh? Never got those ankles corrected, did you?

I get it but one of my points was I don't think the coaches say go score x goals and assists.

It's an approach that sets a player up for failure and could lead to loss of confidence.

The players know expectations by who they are slotted with.

Also the Kings rarely push players too soon.

Laferriere was an exception last year and I think they should have sent him down when he slumped and saved his waiver eligibility for this season.

I am hoping his play this season will discount my theory.

People seem to turn a blind eye to Clarke's defensive struggles last year.

He may be sent down again in lieu of Burroughs but I hope he is a starter in LA by the trade deadline moves.

I disagree on Portillo, every player should be judged on present form and I read they plan to have Portillo start for the Reign.

If he solidifies that role and the Kings need him, I think he would be called up over Copley.

And that would be exciting for future implications.

The Kings seem open to it with Ritti and Cops both expiring next Summer.


Anyways we may not always agree but I respect your opinions.

I like the way you stare down to the chorus of junkyard dogs barking, every time we pee on one of their many misplaced fire hydrants.

 

[Surf Nutz]

All I’m saying is that at least I don’t flaunt my “goalie” experience to get leverage in an argument when your experience came from an Xbox

Kindergarten broomball circa 1957 doesn't count anyway.

 

[Sol]

Kindergarten broomball circa 1957 doesn't count anyway.

Sorry old timer I wasn’t around then when you were in your prime lol

 

[GoldenBearHockey]

I get it but one of my points was I don't think the coaches say go score x goals and assists.

It's an approach that sets a player up for failure and could lead to loss of confidence.

The players know expectations by who they are slotted with.

Also the Kings rarely push players too soon.

Laferriere was an exception last year and I think they should have sent him down when he slumped and saved his waiver eligibility for this season.

I am hoping his play this season will discount my theory.

People seem to turn a blind eye to Clarke's defensive struggles last year.

He may be sent down again in lieu of Burroughs but I hope he is a starter in LA by the trade deadline moves.

I disagree on Portillo, every player should be judged on present form and I read they plan to have Portillo start for the Reign.

If he solidifies that role and the Kings need him, I think he would be called up over Copley.

And that would be exciting for future implications.

The Kings seem open to it with Ritti and Cops both expiring next Summer.


Anyways we may not always agree but I respect your opinions.

I like the way you stare down to the chorus of junkyard dogs barking, every time we pee on one of their many misplaced fire hydrants.

Portillo is definitly going to play a lot in the AHL, as he should,,,I think they need to see him a few games int he NHL first to assess where his weaknesess in the NHL game lie, as the AHL game is slower, Clarke, I think they have to let him run on the 3rd and go with it, they can cover his defensive lapses, and he can staighten those out....

 

[King'sPawn]

He also had Hiller, so talking about how McLellan is a "collective tactics" coach is a copout. It sounds like he is pretending to take responsibility while blaming the org for not having clear instructions.

And is he saying he wouldn't get clear instructions from Tortorella while in Columbus? Please.

 

[bland]

He also had Hiller, so talking about how McLellan is a "collective tactics" coach is a copout. It sounds like he is pretending to take responsibility while blaming the org for not having clear instructions.

And is he saying he wouldn't get clear instructions from Tortorella while in Columbus? Please.

I am willing to buy the idea that Dubois has an inability to communicate.

 

[Herby]

I have done my annual unblocking of some guys but the list I left blocked has grown longer.

I'm sure those people are devastated.

 

[Lt Dan]

He also had Hiller, so talking about how McLellan is a "collective tactics" coach is a copout. It sounds like he is pretending to take responsibility while blaming the org for not having clear instructions.

And is he saying he wouldn't get clear instructions from Tortorella while in Columbus? Please.

Dubois is a insert expletive

No accountability. Always someone else's fault

 

[kingsboy11]

He also had Hiller, so talking about how McLellan is a "collective tactics" coach is a copout. It sounds like he is pretending to take responsibility while blaming the org for not having clear instructions.

And is he saying he wouldn't get clear instructions from Tortorella while in Columbus? Please.

I have a lot to say about this because it riles me up to no end, but ultimately its an outstanding failure all the way around.

Yes we shouldn't acquire a player that is not going to fit our style. Yes, we shouldn't expect him to get it right away. But at the end of the day, there were plenty of games last year where I couldn't tell if he was playing or not. Its not McLellan or Hiller's fault that he's not trying out there. We all had issues with Fiala at certain points last year, but at least I know he's out there. If he made a turnover that lead to an odd man rush, yeah that sucked, but at least I know he's out there trying to make something happen.

I believe there was a moment last year with Fiala where they sat him down and told him they needed him to be more responsible with and without the puck, and he responded pretty positively IIRC. Rob Blake had to an on ice 1 on 1 session with him, if that's not someone trying to get you to explain your role on the team and you don't get it, I think that's on you.

This will go down as one of the worst trades in franchise history, if not the worst.