Proposal: Fire DJ Smith

[jhutter]

I see your point, but a growing team like ours couldn't sustain the injuries we experienced. Chabot, Zub, Norris, to an extent Batherson, Chychryn. And yet we still almost made the playoffs. Also, if a new coach comes in with a new game plan it might take a while for them to play cohesively. I think they can with with DJ's game plan, we saw it plenty of times last season.. it just wasn't consistent.

While the team was closer to making the playoffs this year than any season since the '17 run, they were still 7pts out, so I'm not sure if that can be considered "almost". It's the coach's responsibility to ensure consistency. You can't say that they "just" weren't consistent when being consistent is such an integral part of a successful season.

After 4 seasons of meagre growth in measurable results, it's hard for me to justify keeping him around. Sometimes changes need to be made to hold people accountable and show that the team is serious about winning, and you can't fire the players.

I'm not saying that Smith is an absolutely inept coach, but I'm also quite confident that he doesn't get another HC job in the NHL for quite some time (in typical Ottawa Senators fashion).

Which still puts us nowhere near as bad as Columbus or Anaheim in terms of roster quality,

And Anaheim fired their coach for a poor record, even though they finished exactly where most people anticipated that they'd finish. Smith was rewarded with a multi-year extension after going 48-62-17. It's really hard to make the case that they're serious about improving and winning hockey games if they don't make a coaching change.

 

[Golden_Jet]

Keefe was a hard-ass in Jr. A, major junior and then the AHL. Had no issues calling out players when they played like shit.

But as soon as he got to the NHL and into a room with Marner and Matthews, he lost his spine.

"Respect in the handshake line".
Mildly critiquing Marner's play and then apologizing in the media the next day
Talking about bad luck and bounces yesterday instead of the fact that Marner, Tavares and Matthews scored what, a combined 1 goal against the Panthers?

The guy has turned into a joke. Lets the inmates run the asylum.

Yep, you saw that when he apologized for calling out his players. Then doubled down. 2 days later and had to explain his apology.

 

[Micklebot]

Losing Norris was no excuse for being last place in the league in early December,


The hole was too deep to climb out of.

We were never last in the league in Dec, so ...

 

[Senscore]

We were never last in the league in Dec, so ...

My mistake it was November 23rd.

 

[Cosmix]

While the team was closer to making the playoffs this year than any season since the '17 run, they were still 7pts out, so I'm not sure if that can be considered "almost". It's the coach's responsibility to ensure consistency. You can't say that they "just" weren't consistent when being consistent is such an integral part of a successful season.

After 4 seasons of meagre growth in measurable results, it's hard for me to justify keeping him around. Sometimes changes need to be made to hold people accountable and show that the team is serious about winning, and you can't fire the players.

I'm not saying that Smith is an absolutely inept coach, but I'm also quite confident that he doesn't get another HC job in the NHL for quite some time (in typical Ottawa Senators fashion).


And Anaheim fired their coach for a poor record, even though they finished exactly where most people anticipated that they'd finish. Smith was rewarded with a multi-year extension after going 48-62-17. It's really hard to make the case that they're serious about improving and winning hockey games if they don't make a coaching change.

I think most posters recognize the Smith has not had a competitive team since he was named head coach. Last season is probably the first time expectations were that the team would challenge for a playoff spot but probably would not get into the playoffs. That is what happened. If the first 2 months of the season could be a do-over the team might have made the playoffs.

Next season I expect the team to challenge for a playoff spot which means the team must be in a playoff position in the first 2 months of the season and going forward. Retaining Smith as head coach would be OK for me unless there was a better coach available to replace him at this time. If the team falters Smith could be let go at that time.

I am more concerned about the GM position. I would like to see a change there asap as I do not like Dorion's roster construction record.

 

[Micklebot]

My mistake it was November 23rd.

Technically, the Ducks were last, as we had the tie breaker.

The reality is we were really bad for a baker's dozen games in which Norris was out for all, Zub played just 4, and Chabot 8. For a team that lacked center depth, and depth on D, those injuries are pretty tough to overcome,

The rest of the season, we paced at 96 pts per 82 games, which would have put us in the playoffs.

 

[Flamingo]

Patrick Roy

 

[JD1]

I think most posters recognize the Smith has not had a competitive team since he was named head coach. Last season is probably the first time expectations were that the team would challenge for a playoff spot but probably would not get into the playoffs. That is what happened. If the first 2 months of the season could be a do-over the team might have made the playoffs.

Next season I expect the team to challenge for a playoff spot which means the team must be in a playoff position in the first 2 months of the season and going forward. Retaining Smith as head coach would be OK for me unless there was a better coach available to replace him at this time. If the team falters Smith could be let go at that time.

I am more concerned about the GM position. I would like to see a change there asap as I do not like Dorion's roster construction record.

You're right about the first two months and the do over. Injuries. Norris and some D man games lost.

But I think around game 65 we had ourselves in the thick of things. Around that point we were in control of our destiny. And then...injuries. Again. Goaltending. We needed a push. There were about 6 teams that could have finished strong and made it. And we lost it on that western swing with no goalies

Let's hope for better health next season.

 

[otown]

I can't get over the poor starts year after year! Time for a change. New ownership should take care of this by bringing in their own people .

 

[swiftwin]

I can't get over the poor starts year after year! Time for a change. New ownership should take care of this by bringing in their own people .

This has been debunked many times:

In DJ's first season, the Sens had their best record of the season in November and 2nd best record of the season in December.

Second season was the COVID season where the Sens were literally the only team in the division that didn't play hockey in 11 months, and had no pre-season. Also started the season with three rookies in the top 6.

Third season, the team had a COVID outbreak in November, and the league forced them to play with 15 regulars out of the lineup, and the team couldn't practice for 3 weeks.

Fourth season (last year), was the first one where maybe you could blame him. Although the team did start well for the first few games, until they lost Zub and Norris.

 

[OD99]

This has been debunked many times:

In DJ's first season, the Sens had their best record of the season in November and 2nd best record of the season in December.

Second season was the COVID season where the Sens were literally the only team in the division that didn't play hockey in 11 months, and had no pre-season. Also started the season with three rookies in the top 6.

Third season, the team had a COVID outbreak in November, and the league forced them to play with 15 regulars out of the lineup, and the team couldn't practice for 3 weeks.

Fourth season (last year), was the first one where maybe you could blame him. Although the team did start well for the first few games, until they lost Zub and Norris.

How about we all agree that regardless of the circumstances, if the team comes out of the gate flat that it won't be acceptable?

Last year we lost our 1st 2 games then won 4 in a row on the backs of some great goaltending and some abysmal goaltending against. We then lost 7 in a row. I agree losing Norris hurt but the team looked brutal in our own end. Completely disjointed. I was at everyone one of those first 5 home games as well so had a very good look at the entire picture.

I am cool with him starting out but I really hope we see consistency above all else. NHL level goaltending will help.

 

[JD1]

How about we all agree that regardless of the circumstances, if the team comes out of the gate flat that it won't be acceptable?

Last year we lost our 1st 2 games then won 4 in a row on the backs of some great goaltending and some abysmal goaltending against. We then lost 7 in a row. I agree losing Norris hurt but the team looked brutal in our own end. Completely disjointed. I was at everyone one of those first 5 home games as well so had a very good look at the entire picture.

I am cool with him starting out but I really hope we see consistency above all else. NHL level goaltending will help.

We also lost Talbot in training camp. I can't remember the numbers but Forsberg had a heavy heavy workload to start the year.

At least to me, everything that possibly could have gone wrong in the first 6 weeks went wrong.

Missing veteran starting goalie. Check.
Missing first line centre. Check
Missing top right D. Check.
Missing top left D. Check.

I 100% agree with you though. We cannot have a flat start next year.

 

[swiftwin]

then won 4 in a row on the backs of some great goaltending

Survey shows this is a flagrant lie. These were our first 7 games of the season:

4-1 Loss to Sabres (two empty net goals) - Shots were 36-36
3-2 Loss to Leafs - Shots were 32-28 for Leafs
7-5 Win against Bruins - Shots 34-31 for Bruins
5-2 Win against Caps - Shots 44-22 for Sens (!!!)
6-2 Win against Coyotes - Shots 32-22 for Sens <-Norris is injured here
4-2 Win against Stars - Shots 32-31 for Sens
4-2 Loss against Wild - Shots 40-29 for Wild <-Zub is injured here

4-3-0 to start the season. Two close losses. Outshot the opposition in 3 of the 4 games we won, twice by a huge margin. How exactly were those wins on the backs of some great goaltending?

Edit: You're also ignoring the other seasons before this one, which were way worse in terms of circumstances the team had to deal with early in the season.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

Staying healthy is going to be a huge factor, especially for Norris and Chychrun, but we also need to be better insulated with depth, hopefully cheap but efficient. The roster was rounding the corner, but was still thin and if not they might have had enough to push through.

 

[OD99]

Survey shows this is a flagrant lie. These were our first 7 games of the season:

4-1 Loss to Sabres (two empty net goals) - Shots were 36-36
3-2 Loss to Leafs - Shots were 32-28 for Leafs
7-5 Win against Bruins - Shots 34-31 for Bruins
5-2 Win against Caps - Shots 44-22 for Sens (!!!)
6-2 Win against Coyotes - Shots 32-22 for Sens <-Norris is injured here
4-2 Win against Stars - Shots 32-31 for Sens
4-2 Loss against Wild - Shots 40-29 for Wild <-Zub is injured here

4-3-0 to start the season. Two close losses. Outshot the opposition in 3 of the 4 games we won, twice by a huge margin. How exactly were those wins on the backs of some great goaltending?

Edit: You're also ignoring the other seasons before this one, which were way worse in terms of circumstances the team had to deal with early in the season.

You lose credibility a lot anyway but particularly when you intentionally put things out of context. Ignoring the fact shots don't tell the entire picture, you also misquoted me on purpose.

The 2nd part of my statement was brutal goaltending by the opposition.

The win against the Bruins was a farce. We took a big lead, almost lost it with terrible defensive play but won because the Bruins keeper couldn't stop a beach ball.

The win against the Caps was good but their goalie wasn't sharp and our goalie was clutch in stopping some great chances.

Win against the Coyotes was a given...plus it was Octoberfest so I was in the bag.

The win against the Stars Hellburg played great! I think we also had an empty netter to close it out.

You get a 0 on the DeservOmeter on this one.

 

[JD1]

You lose credibility a lot anyway but particularly when you intentionally put things out of context. Ignoring the fact shots don't tell the entire picture, you also misquoted me on purpose.

The 2nd part of my statement was brutal goaltending by the opposition.

The win against the Bruins was a farce. We took a big lead, almost lost it with terrible defensive play but won because the Bruins keeper couldn't stop a beach ball.

The win against the Caps was good but their goalie wasn't sharp and our goalie was clutch in stopping some great chances.

Win against the Coyotes was a given...plus it was Octoberfest so I was in the bag.

The win against the Stars Hellburg played great! I think we also had an empty netter to close it out.

You get a 0 on the DeservOmeter on this one.

Ok, so my memory isn't great at times and I was half in the bag but I was at the Bruins game (home opener) and I don't remember it being a farce.

So I looked at the game report on natural stat trick. Link Below. We had by far the better advanced data. Better cf, scf, xGF, HDCF.

Sure when a game goes 7-5, you can say the goaltending was weak. But we had all the stats in our favour and won the game.

What else is it you expect to do?
Did we win? Yes
Out shoot them? Yes
Out chance them? Yes

We even out Alfie'd them. Actually that game was definitely the best feeling I've had at a game since the pageau pageau pageau game, and I attended quite a few 2017 playoff games, including the one where we scored 4 in the 1st on Pittsburgh. It was just a game that I'll always remember attending.

Boston Bruins @ Ottawa Senators, 2022-10-18

 

[Micklebot]

We even out Alfie'd them.

I don't remember anyone checking Tucker from behind into the boards to turn over the puck and the get open for the game winning goal, or any faked stick toss.... What exactly do you mean by our Alfie'd?

 

[Tuna99]

I think it omits context.

You don't fire guys for doing what you expect them to.

DJ was asked to develop a young core, he's done that. The team and it's core players, despite what some seem to think, has mostly been taking steps forward under his tenure.

Brady is developing into a leader on the ice, has greatly surpassed most people's expectations offensively

Stützle is becoming a premier #1 center

Norris has developed into a two way goal scoring 1b

Sanderson has quickly proven to be a stud

That's what his job was, getting these kids ready for the teams competitive window. This season we would have liked to be a little closer or maybe make the playoffs, but there are some significant mitigating factors that made that a tough ask no matter who your coach was.

You look at Detroit with Blashill, he went 7 years of decline before they finally made a change, 4 years isn't that odd in the context of a rebuild, Eakins is going into year 5 if he survives with worse results. Arz went 5 years of missing with Tippett before firing him,

So cool to be like Arizona and Anaheim and use Dallas Eakins as examples of competitence around the league.

I’m for higher standards in Ottawa. When you set the bar so low for 5 years you have no expectations that’s a losers
Mentality.

Ottawa should of been a playoff team this year and the coaches and GM deserved to be fired for saying 2 years ago we’d be a playoff team this year and not growing the team as they should and then moving the goal of making the playoffs by 1-2 years because they can’t ice a competitive team.

It’s ridiculous they have been allowed to get away with this for so many years sen everyone’s is like “yes but we suck, and these are the catch and GJ to suck with”

 

[JD1]

I don't remember anyone checking Tucker from behind into the boards to turn over the puck and the get open for the game winning goal, or any faked stick toss.... What exactly do you mean by our Alfie'd?

You weren't at the game then. It was the home opener. Lights out. On the big screen, Alfie in the dressing room. Comes out of the room into the arena. It was electric. Most exciting thing I've seen since that series against the Habs when McLean said we're going to rename the 3 bridges Jean, Gabriel and Pageau. The building was going nuts.

then we win the game. Advanced stats say we were good for the win.

you just can't ask for more

and I was responding to that win being dubbed a farce.

 

[Micklebot]

You weren't at the game then. It was the home opener. Lights out. On the big screen, Alfie in the dressing room. Comes out of the room into the arena. It was electric. Most exciting thing I've seen since that series against the Habs when McLean said we're going to rename the 3 bridges Jean, Gabriel and Pageau. The building was going nuts.

then we win the game. Advanced stats say we were good for the win.

you just can't ask for more

and I was responding to that win being dubbed a farce.

Ah, I wasn't thinking home opener, for some reason I mixed-up the two wins against Boston.

 

[OD99]

Ok, so my memory isn't great at times and I was half in the bag but I was at the Bruins game (home opener) and I don't remember it being a farce.

So I looked at the game report on natural stat trick. Link Below. We had by far the better advanced data. Better cf, scf, xGF, HDCF.

Sure when a game goes 7-5, you can say the goaltending was weak. But we had all the stats in our favour and won the game.

What else is it you expect to do?
Did we win? Yes
Out shoot them? Yes
Out chance them? Yes

We even out Alfie'd them. Actually that game was definitely the best feeling I've had at a game since the pageau pageau pageau game, and I attended quite a few 2017 playoff games, including the one where we scored 4 in the 1st on Pittsburgh. It was just a game that I'll always remember attending.

Boston Bruins @ Ottawa Senators, 2022-10-18

Farce may be too much but we took a lead, let them back in and were able to score enough to beat them. 7goals is an outlier, no matter how well a team plays.

Not a standard win by any means, regardless of advanced stats.

I was there, it was great to win and great to see such excitement for the team to kick off the season.

 

[Ice-Tray]

Farce may be too much but we took a lead, let them back in and were able to score enough to beat them. 7goals is an outlier, no matter how well a team plays.

Not a standard win by any means, regardless of advanced stats.

I was there, it was great to win and great to see such excitement for the team to kick off the season.

Come on man, that entire event was a gem. A deserving 7-5 win at Alfie home opener was pure Sens entertainment!

Not exactly what comes to mind when you think ‘farce’ in my opinion.

 

[Sens of Anarchy]

are we using the 1st 7 games of the season to indicate something about how well a team is doing and being coached?
That's a 2 week period to start a season.
won 4 in the 1st 7 and 1 in the next 7; 3 in the following 7.
We can point to injuries and lack of depth as two reasons outside the Coach's control.

It did, however, again, take a long time for the players to figure out how to win even with 2 star forward additions to the roster; and a rookie D man that surpassed even the most optimistic expectations.

 

[SpezDispenser]

Staying healthy is going to be a huge factor, especially for Norris and Chychrun, but we also need to be better insulated with depth, hopefully cheap but efficient. The roster was rounding the corner, but was still thin and if not they might have had enough to push through.

This is the way.

Tyler Kleven won't make the team out of camp, but will become an integral piece when the inevitable injuries hit.

Same thing applies to forwards. We need a 3rd line that can move up the lineup in a moment's notice and Pinto can do that now after getting some experience.

We need a lw that can move up and a rw that can move up - and then we need a 4th line that doesn't suck and can also move up.

Having a sexy top 6 is great, but without depth it means nothing.

 

[Emerica]

Ya’ll think there’s a chance the Canes are crazy enough to fire Ottawa born Brindamour if they get swept?