Player Discussion Filip Chytil: Part II

[kovazub94]

I think the real question with Chytil at this point isn't whether he'll be a good player --- it's how good will he be.

Right now he definitely looks like has the potential to be a 25 goal, 60-65 point player. But can he be more than that? If he going to be a very good second line center/1A-1B type? Or can he take it up a level beyond that, not unlike what Zibanejad has done? Can he round out those other areas of his game at center?

Those will be the things to watch for this season and over the next couple of years.

Based on what he's doing right now as a barely 20-year old, I'd say emphatically YES to being a center of Zibanejad caliber or better.

 

[True Blue]

Based on what he's doing right now as a barely 20-year old, I'd say emphatically YES to being a center of Zibanejad caliber or better.

He is very young and it is very early. Considering how long it took ZBad to develop the all around game he has now, we could be waiting for a while for Chytil to match that. Time will tell

 

[Edge]

Based on what he's doing right now as a barely 20-year old, I'd say emphatically YES to being a center of Zibanejad caliber or better.

I freely admit that I am somewhat on the fence.

There is part of me that sees in Chytil a player who has a lot of the components to be a top-tier player. There's also part of me that does wonder if they all come together to the extent that's easy to dream about.

 

[kovazub94]

He is very young and it is very early. Considering how long it took ZBad to develop the all around game he has now, we could be waiting for a while for Chytil to match that. Time will tell

I freely admit that I am somewhat on the fence.

There is part of me that sees in Chytil a player who has a lot of the components to be a top-tier player. There's also part of me that does wonder if they all come together to the extent that's easy to dream about.

Because what he's doing right now is basically just scratching the surface of his potential. Yeah, his development curve could unexpectedly flatten out for no reason but I'd just don't have any basis for such a turn of events in his development because he has all of the tools and the toolbox as we like to say.

 

[Edge]

Because what he's doing right now is basically just scratching the surface of his potential. Yeah, his development curve could unexpectedly flatten out for no reason but I'd just don't have any basis for such a turn of events in his development because he has all of the tools and the toolbox as we like to say.

And that scratching the surface component could go either way for me.

I can see the piece falling into place like Zibanejad. He finds his niche, builds confidence, and becomes a first line center who other centers fall in line behind.

I can also see a scenario where he's kind of our next generation's Chris Kreider. By that I mean a player where you see all the pieces, and they come together nicely, but maybe not to the extent everyone feels they should based on the combination. Depending on where people fall along that spectrum, I could see a scenario where there's a group of people who really love him, and a bunch of people who like him but feel frustrated that the sum of the parts doesn't quite equal what it should.

 

[kovazub94]

And that scratching the surface component could go either way for me.

I can see the piece falling into place like Zibanejad. He finds his niche, builds confidence, and becomes a first line center who other centers fall in line behind.

I can also see a scenario where he's kind of our next generation's Chris Kreider. By that I mean a player where you see all the pieces, and they come together nicely, but maybe not to the extent everyone feels they should based on the combination. Depending on where people fall along that spectrum, I could see a scenario where there's a group of people who really love him, and a bunch of people who like him but feel frustrated that the sum of the parts doesn't quite equal what it should.

I guess this is just emphasizes my point more. It is referred to as hockey IQ, or hockey sense or toolbox. Some players can’t catch up to a play, others can mostly keep up but generally not anticipate, and at elite level players anticipate well before play even happens. Kreider never gave an indication of having the high-end toolbox, his shot never been particularly accurate either. Everything else has been pretty good to make him a player that he’s right now. Being disappointed in what type of player Kreider became was a matter of excessive expectations (maybe he could have done better with his accuracy).

Taking a step back and circling back to Chytil I see an exceptionally high IQ and don’t see areas that could drag him down to expect a “lesser” player. As always I must say that I could be wrong, but I had set my expectations here toward the end of last season but with lesser level of confidence making a reference to how big of a step in development Chytil were to take this season.

 

[Edge]

I guess this is just emphasizes my point more. It is referred to as hockey IQ, or hockey sense or toolbox. Some players can’t catch up to a play, others can mostly keep up but generally not anticipate, and at elite level players anticipate well before play even happens. Kreider never gave an indication of having the high-end toolbox, his shot never been particularly accurate either. Everything else has been pretty good to make him a player that he’s right now. Being disappointed in what type of player Kreider became was a matter of excessive expectations (maybe he could have done better with his accuracy).

Taking a step back and circling back to Chytil I see an exceptionally high IQ and don’t see areas that could drag him down to expect a “lesser” player. As always I must say that I could be wrong, but I had set my expectations here toward the end of last season but with lesser level of confidence making a reference to how big of a step in development Chytil were to take this season.

I would say that when I see Chytil, I see a guy who has a lot of very good and great check boxes consistently across the board and not many, if any, that would rank average or lower. On the flip side of that, I'm not sure I see "exceptional" either.

I think that's that weird little gray area that has me on the fence between whether I'm looking at a 1B/excellent second line center vs. a guy projectible as a first liner on better teams.

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

I would say that when I see Chytil, I see a guy who has a lot of very good and great check boxes consistently across the board and not many, if any, that would rank average or lower. On the flip side of that, I'm not sure I see "exceptional" either.

I think that's that weird little gray area that has me on the fence between whether I'm looking at a 1B/excellent second line center vs. a guy projectible as a first liner on better teams.

I mean, this is part of what I love about the rebuilding process: watching a guy like Chytil, and seeing how far he can go.

 

[Edge]

I mean, this is part of what I love about the rebuilding process: watching a guy like Chytil, and seeing how far he can go.

And nothing that's been said is out of line when it comes to Chytil. Make no mistake, a lot of the ingredients are there.

It's also one of the reasons why I feel that center might not quite be as much of a priority for the Rangers, as it is a focal point for this board.

 

[brakeyawself]

I think the real question with Chytil at this point isn't whether he'll be a good player --- it's how good will he be.

Right now he definitely looks like has the potential to be a 25 goal, 60-65 point player. But can he be more than that? If he going to be a very good second line center/1A-1B type? Or can he take it up a level beyond that, not unlike what Zibanejad has done? Can he round out those other areas of his game at center?

Those will be the things to watch for this season and over the next couple of years.

I think he looks like a 65 point player minimum. His ceiling though is sky high. Others have suggested also, he could turn out better than Zibanijad. Wouldn’t surprise me. Maybe their future 1C?
At least, I’d expect he and Zibanijad to be 1C and 2C in either order.

Strome will likely be fit in somewhere if he sticks around longer term.

And yes, I’d love to see Chytil line with Kakko on one side, Kreider on the other. Then Zibanijad, Panarin and Strome or eventually Kravtsov. Can switch Kreider and Strome maybe.

But really, I’d put a bit of money that Chytil eventually becomes 75 to 85 point type of player with possibly some years over 85 points even. 25- 35 goals and 40 to 60 assists.

Prefer him to guys who had more hype and “pedigree” like Glass, Jost, Zadina, Dach, Suzuki, Kotkeniemi etc..

Maybe I am a homer.. but still

 

[Barnaby]

I think Chytil has the tools to develop into a competent 2C, but like Edge I’m not sure if he has a level beyond that. He might and he might not. I tend to bounce back and forth on that. He should be fun to follow regardless.

 

[ElLeetch]

It's also one of the reasons why I feel that center might not quite be as much of a priority for the Rangers, as it is a focal point for this board.

It was a focal point just a few short weeks ago, when Chytil was still in the AHL and Andersson & Howden were doing very little up here. Its only still since his call-up that the priority looks, on the surface at least, a little bit less critical. I mean, i still want a C with our top pick (all else being equal), but if Chytil can *at least* hold down the 2C spot behind Zib, i think we are in decent shape.

 

[motopanekeku]

He is very young and it is very early. Considering how long it took ZBad to develop the all around game he has now, we could be waiting for a while for Chytil to match that. Time will tell

I think Chytl will come up quicker than Zbad. Remember how dismal of a place Ottawa has been for players in the recent past. NY is a much better environment more conducive to success imo.

 

[Edge]

It was a focal point just a few short weeks ago, when Chytil was still in the AHL and Andersson & Howden were doing very little up here. Its only still since his call-up that the priority looks, on the surface at least, a little bit less critical. I mean, i still want a C with our top pick (all else being equal), but if Chytil can *at least* hold down the 2C spot behind Zib, i think we are in decent shape.

In fairness, I've said for a while that I'm not sure it's as big of priority for the Rangers as it is for the board. That probably goes back to late-summer.

Having said that, I'm still not convinced the Rangers would pass on an opportunity if the right center came along. I could envision a scenario where they then view Chytil as a potential solution to giving them another top-six option on the wing. But until/unless someone comes along and forces that issue, they're going to keep focusing on developing Chytil as a center.

 

[doomscroll]

I freely admit that I am somewhat on the fence.

There is part of me that sees in Chytil a player who has a lot of the components to be a top-tier player. There's also part of me that does wonder if they all come together to the extent that's easy to dream about.

I mean, Chytil has ostensibly gone from being a third-line winger to an actual second-line center between his 19-20y/o seasons. There is room for hesitation that he is the real deal (it will never happen if you say it, per-se), but Chytil’s floor - even with reservation - is as a middle-six player with size, speed and analytical intrigue. Obviously that sounds like a younger Kreider to some extent, but Chytil is approaching Kreider’s peak with a half-decade of development in hand.

 

[doomscroll]

I think Chytil has the tools to develop into a competent 2C, but like Edge I’m not sure if he has a level beyond that. He might and he might not. I tend to bounce back and forth on that. He should be fun to follow regardless.

In terms of both broad analytics and production, Chytil is already a 2C.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

I mean, Chytil has ostensibly gone from being a third-line winger to an actual second-line center between his 19-20y/o seasons. There is room for hesitation that he is the real deal (it will never happen if you say it, per-se), but Chytil’s floor - even with reservation - is as a middle-six player with size, speed and analytical intrigue. Obviously that sounds like a younger Kreider to some extent, but Chytil is approaching Kreider’s peak with a half-decade of development in hand.

What does analytical intrigue mean?

 

[True Blue]

Obviously that sounds like a younger Kreider to some extent, but Chytil is approaching Kreider’s peak with a half-decade of development in hand.

Let's take a breath here. Kreider is a top line player. Chytil has a ways to go until he is there. Even at wing

In terms of both broad analytics and production, Chytil is already a 2C.

What does that mean? And how can such judgments be made from a very, very small sample size?

 

[doomscroll]

What does analytical intrigue mean?

Chytil is extremely good at carrying the puck into the offensive zone, his rookie carry-in pace and % was pretty much elite (though with limited minutes). There are questions as to whether or not he will transition that ability to center in the long-run, but he has been effective overall.

 

[Edge]

I mean, Chytil has ostensibly gone from being a third-line winger to an actual second-line center between his 19-20y/o seasons. There is room for hesitation that he is the real deal (it will never happen if you say it, per-se), but Chytil’s floor - even with reservation - is as a middle-six player with size, speed and analytical intrigue. Obviously that sounds like a younger Kreider to some extent, but Chytil is approaching Kreider’s peak with a half-decade of development in hand.

I definitely see a player who is capable of very good things in the NHL. How good? That's what I am still trying to wrap my head around.

If someone tells me they see a 25 goal, 60 point center or wing, I don't bat an eye.

If someone tells me they see a 30 goal, 70 point center or wing, I'm less confident about that, but can see it.

If someone tells me they think he can reach the level Zibanehad has, I'm more inclined to say no, but I wouldn't say it's impossible either.

 

[doomscroll]

Let's take a breath here. Kreider is a top line player. Chytil has a ways to go until he is there. Even at wing
What does that mean? And how can such judgments be made from a very, very small sample size?

That’s why I said Chytil is approaching Kreider, not that he has matched Kreider.

Chytil’s CF%, xGF%, and 5v5 p/60, are all at or around the top of the team with 2nd-line deployments as a center. After 17 games he has played at or above the level of an average 2nd-line center, which leads me to the conclusion that he is probably a 2nd-line-center at this point. Even last season Chytil had fairly strong analytics overall, which leads me to believe his current strong analytics are not a farce or a hot-hand.

 

[True Blue]

That’s why I said Chytil is approaching Kreider, not that he has matched Kreider.

Chytil’s CF%, xGF%, and 5v5 p/60, are all at or around the top of the team with 2nd-line deployments as a center. After 17 games he has played at or above the level of an average 2nd-line center, which leads me to the conclusion that he is probably a 2nd-line-center at this point. Even last season Chytil had fairly strong analytics overall, which leads me to believe his current strong analytics are not a farce or a hot-hand.

Until he can get 50 points, he is not approaching anybody.

Look I want him to be that 2nd line center as much as anyone, but right now all we have is a small sample size and hope. Along with last year's sheltered minutes.

 

[Mac n Gs]

Until he can get 50 points, he is not approaching anybody.

Look I want him to be that 2nd line center as much as anyone, but right now all we have is a small sample size and hope. Along with last year's sheltered minutes.

I know that's not your intent here, but this comes off as pretty dismissive of a 20-year old kid who's been arguably our second best forward recently and is pacing for a 40+ point season. Even once his shooting% comes down, I don't think his low assist rate will continue, so we should see him stabilize around 40-45 points if everything keeps going well.

If we're comparing him to Zibanejad, that's slightly ahead of his pace during his D+3 season, plus Chytil has had much, much stronger on-ice impacts. I'd say that bodes favorably well for a kid that can be a 50+ point 2C going into his D+4 year, where he has an even higher ceiling to do more. What impresses me the most is that he's doing his scoring all at even strength since he gets limited powerplay time. I can't imagine it'll continue where he is stuck on the second unit forever.

 

[Edge]

I know that's not your intent here, but this comes off as pretty dismissive of a 20-year old kid who's been arguably our second best forward recently and is pacing for a 40+ point season. Even once his shooting% comes down, I don't think his low assist rate will continue, so we should see him stabilize around 40-45 points if everything keeps going well.

If we're comparing him to Zibanejad, that's slightly ahead of his pace during his D+3 season, plus Chytil has had much, much stronger on-ice impacts. I'd say that bodes favorably well for a kid that can be a 50+ point 2C going into his D+4 year, where he has an even higher ceiling to do more. What impresses me the most is that he's doing his scoring all at even strength since he gets limited powerplay time. I can't imagine it'll continue where he is stuck on the second unit forever.

My concern with Chytil is that I feel like there's desire to really push him to the moon when he's on a hot streak. It's one of the reasons I'm hesitant to do too much projecting with him as to how the rest of the season plays out.

Even now, he came up scoring, but has leveled off considerably --- 3 points in his last 9 games.

 

[True Blue]

I know that's not your intent here, but this comes off as pretty dismissive of a 20-year old kid who's been arguably our second best forward recently and is pacing for a 40+ point season. Even once his shooting% comes down, I don't think his low assist rate will continue, so we should see him stabilize around 40-45 points if everything keeps going well.

If we're comparing him to Zibanejad, that's slightly ahead of his pace during his D+3 season, plus Chytil has had much, much stronger on-ice impacts. I'd say that bodes favorably well for a kid that can be a 50+ point 2C going into his D+4 year, where he has an even higher ceiling to do more. What impresses me the most is that he's doing his scoring all at even strength since he gets limited powerplay time. I can't imagine it'll continue where he is stuck on the second unit forever.

You are right. That is not my intent. I just want to pump the breaks a bit before we declare a 20 year old a bona fined 2C in the NHL. Or at least, I am not yet ready to declare that, as I cannot speak for others.

I am not disagreeing with what bodes well for him as far as a ZBad-like trajectory. But he is not there yet. Or so I believe.