Fasel unhappy with NHLers skipping Turin

[bigbadbruin77]

I think every player has the right to decline the Games. If a player decideds to stay home and rest, or spend time with his family. Then It's there call.

 

[Connorrhea]

I think every player has the right to decline the Games. If a player decideds to stay home and rest, or spend time with his family. Then It's there call.

Their decision? I don't think so. Amateur athletes have regular day jobs and wait 4 years to have a chance to compete in an event, and they might not even qualify for the medal round. They work hard for 4 years, but NHLers with all their millions of dollars, are simply asked to represent their country and they refuse. Canadian athletes were ripped apart for not wanting to carry the flag, but professional hockey players are the exception?

If players are allowe to choose, then the NHl should not be allowed to participate in the Olympics and allow amateur hockey players who play for the love of the game to represent their countries the right way.

 

[Namso]

I'm very very very disappointed in Kiprusoff.

I mean its alright if he had just pulled a groin or had a small injury recently and he didn't want to further injure it. Then yeah you could say it was alright...like if Forsberg said he couldn't go, then I would understand.

BUT to announce 3 MONTHS IN ADVANCE that you dont want to go and make up a stupid excuse that ur injured and then play like 99% of your games is lame.

I hope Finland gets a medal and rub it in Kiprusoff's face.

 

[SwisshockeyAcademy]

Their decision? I don't think so. Amateur athletes have regular day jobs and wait 4 years to have a chance to compete in an event, and they might not even qualify for the medal round. They work hard for 4 years, but NHLers with all their millions of dollars, are simply asked to represent their country and they refuse. Canadian athletes were ripped apart for not wanting to carry the flag, but professional hockey players are the exception?

If players are allowe to choose, then the NHl should not be allowed to participate in the Olympics and allow amateur hockey players who play for the love of the game to represent their countries the right way.

So what amateurs are we talking about? Will they use university players? Will they have a making the cut for every country as long as you are not playing pro? The Olympic hockey tourney always had pro's just not NHLers. Not many have bowed out just because they do not feel like it.

 

[Epsilon]

So what amateurs are we talking about? Will they use university players? Will they have a making the cut for every country as long as you are not playing pro? The Olympic hockey tourney always had pro's just not NHLers. Not many have bowed out just because they do not feel like it.

When most people talk about how the olympics should be "all amateur athletes" they usually have no clue what that means, and think that anyone who isn't a player from a major North American pro team sports league is an "amateur". For instance you never hear anyone talking about how olympic skiing should use amateurs and not professionals.

 

[Mr Kanadensisk]

yes not the quality of play but maybe another winner every tournament ?

Russians love to cut up the world cup, but truth be told they would never do anything to organize a tournament where all the best players could attend. Russia isn't half the hockey nation that Canada is, and any "best on best" tournament will prove that. Whether it's tournaments being played away from their home ice, the rules, or their players not showing up, the Russians are never short of excuses as to why they don't win.
From what I hear and read about Russia, I can't blame the players for not wanting to have anything to do with the country after they get out.

Canada has by far the strongest team heading into this tournament, just check the betting odds if you don't believe me. I would take great pride in Canada winning another gold medal, but I am most proud that every Canadian player who could go, did go, and showed just how classy a nation we are!

 

[Canuck21t]

You guys do realize that guys like Kipper aren't going because the teams won't allow them to go. They can do it to European players because they don't give a damn what Finland or Sweden thinks. If a team wouldn't let Canada's number 1 goalie go, the Canadian media would be all over them.

That's bull. No one could stop Forsberg and only his injuries are stopping him. Have some balls and no NHL manager can stop you, no one.

 

[ScottyBowman]

Their decision? I don't think so. Amateur athletes have regular day jobs and wait 4 years to have a chance to compete in an event, and they might not even qualify for the medal round. They work hard for 4 years, but NHLers with all their millions of dollars, are simply asked to represent their country and they refuse. Canadian athletes were ripped apart for not wanting to carry the flag, but professional hockey players are the exception?

If players are allowe to choose, then the NHl should not be allowed to participate in the Olympics and allow amateur hockey players who play for the love of the game to represent their countries the right way.

I disagree. Forcing someone to do anything is the wrong choice. Players should be allowed to stay home and do whatever they want. The spirit of the olympics has been all about money and steroids so you can't play the amateur is working 3 jobs to win for his country slant.

 

[sarge88]

Hockey should go back to the young no-name kids instead of closing the NHL shop for 3 weeks. It didn't attract new fans in 2002, it sure ain't going to attract anymore fans in 2006.

Thank you! Olympic hockey with professionals stinks and goes against what I feel the Olympics should be.

The best part of the Olympics for me is seeing an athlete come out of nowhere to win a medal or complete at a higher level than anyone expected, regardless of the sport.

I'd watch figure skating if there was a chance that the 28th ranked skater had a legitimate chance for a medal.

I don't care about which collection of NHL'ers is able to outdo which other collection of NHL'ers, in what constitutes as an exhibition game to me.

I'd be just as interested if the Olympic hockey players from every country threw their names into a hat and selected teams that way.

 

[SwisshockeyAcademy]

Thank you! Olympic hockey with professionals stinks and goes against what I feel the Olympics should be.

The best part of the Olympics for me is seeing an athlete come out of nowhere to win a medal or complete at a higher level than anyone expected, regardless of the sport.

I'd watch figure skating if there was a chance that the 28th ranked skater had a legitimate chance for a medal.

I don't care about which collection of NHL'ers is able to outdo which other collection of NHL'ers, in what constitutes as an exhibition game to me.

I'd be just as interested if the Olympic hockey players from every country threw their names into a hat and selected teams that way.

Based on your post you seem to have no idea what the Olympics are. There are professionals all over the place in many different sports. This collection of NHLers are the best in the sport that these countries have to offer. Should we be taking someone off a recreational ski hill because the top skiiers are professionals? Should we send a local curling hack to the games because many play on pro tours? The Olympics should be about the very best not a collection of merely good athletes. That is my idea of the Olympics.

 

[Connorrhea]

So what amateurs are we talking about? Will they use university players? Will they have a making the cut for every country as long as you are not playing pro? The Olympic hockey tourney always had pro's just not NHLers. Not many have bowed out just because they do not feel like it.

Ah, the NATIONAL HOCKEY LEAGUE is the PROFESSIONAL ranks in case you didn't know that.

 

[mr gib]

Thank you! Olympic hockey with professionals stinks and goes against what I feel the Olympics should be.

The best part of the Olympics for me is seeing an athlete come out of nowhere to win a medal or complete at a higher level than anyone expected, regardless of the sport.

I'd watch figure skating if there was a chance that the 28th ranked skater had a legitimate chance for a medal.

I don't care about which collection of NHL'ers is able to outdo which other collection of NHL'ers, in what constitutes as an exhibition game to me.

I'd be just as interested if the Olympic hockey players from every country threw their names into a hat and selected teams that way.

thats a very interesting take considering your country pays big bucks for athletes who bring home gold - there are no more amateurs

 

[Epsilon]

Ah, the NATIONAL HOCKEY LEAGUE is the PROFESSIONAL ranks in case you didn't know that.

Professional refers to anyone who makes a living off of their sport. The NHL is hardly the only professional hockey league.

 

[Connorrhea]

Professional refers to anyone who makes a living off of their sport. The NHL is hardly the only professional hockey league.

I know, but the poster doesn't. And going back to his post, yes, many of the amateurs who played in the past were either from University, College or just finished there before they go to the pros.

Paul Kariya was just finishing up at the Univ. of Main when he participated at the '94 Olympics.

 

[SwisshockeyAcademy]

I know, but the poster doesn't.

Really now? Are you always this brilliant or did you stay at a holiday inn express last night.

 

[Connorrhea]

Really now? Are you always this brilliant or did you stay at a holiday inn express last night.

Did you not realize the Olympics are using NHLers for only the third time, or are you still learning hockey at the swiss hockey academy.

And thanks for calling me brilliant.

 

[SwisshockeyAcademy]

Did you not realize the Olympics are using NHLers for only the third time, or are you still learning hockey at the swiss hockey academy.

And thanks for calling me brilliant.

You are making my head hurt. I need some pie and chips. Can a third party please decipher what the hell this poster is talking about?

 

[Connorrhea]

Well, since you are not brilliant enough to figure it out for yourself...I am rebutling your argument in which you said "what amateurs are you talking about."

The amateurs are those who do not receive pay for playing, thus indeed, before 1998, the majority of players were chosen from Universities, Colleges, and non-professional hockey leagues. The amateur rule is that if an athlete was found to be receiving pay for playing their sport, the olympic committee would automatically disqualify them. But hockey is one of the events with exceptions.

 

[SwisshockeyAcademy]

Well, since you are not brilliant enough to figure it out for yourself...I am rebutling your argument in which you said "what amateurs are you talking about."

The amateurs are those who do not receive pay for playing, thus indeed, before 1998, players were chosen from Universities, Colleges, and non-professional hockey leagues because if an athlete was found to be receiving pay for playing their sport, the olympic committee would automatically disqualify them.

I cannot believe you are this thick but i'll humor you. So you are saying CANADA and the US should go back to amateurs while the rest of the world use their PRO!!!!!! yes PRO!!!!! players from the SEL, DEL, Finnish league, Russian league and on and on. That is how it used to be. Where the hell do you think the Russians got their players from days gone by? University of Moscow? Sweden, Finland, West and East Germany, Czechoslovakia, Poland, Yugoslavia, Norway, and Switzerland all used pro players for the most part. My head still hurts.You are killing me.

 

[Connorrhea]

I cannot believe you are this thick but i'll humor you. So you are saying CANADA and the US should go back to amateurs while the rest of the world use their PRO!!!!!! yes PRO!!!!! players from the SEL, DEL, Finnish league, Russian league and on and on. That is how it used to be. Where the hell do you think the Russians got their players from days gone by? University of Moscow? Sweden, Finland, West and East Germany, Czechoslovakia, Poland, Yugoslavia, Norway, and Switzerland all used pro players for the most part. My head still hurts.You are killing me.

I understand they used players from their leagues, but they weren't considered at the same professional level leagues. The players were all young, look at team Sweden or Russia. The players got paid, but they aren't professionally paid or playing against real professional competition. Those leagues were their forms of University/College. Just because the definition of a professional is someone who gets paid to do their job, doesn't make a i.e. 19 year old Peter Forsberg playing a 19 year old Paul Kariya, professional hockey players.

My brother is finishing high school, and he wants to become a director. A friend of ours who organizes big concerts pays my brother to film them and make a dvd. Does my brother getting paid make him a professional? He's 17. Does that make him on the same level as Steve Speilberg?

You need to give your head a shake again.

 

[mr gib]

I understand they used players from their leagues, but they weren't considered at the same professional level leagues. The players were all young, look at team Sweden or Russia. The players got paid, but they aren't professionally paid or playing against real professional competition. Those leagues were their forms of University/College. Just because the definition of a professional is someone who gets paid to do their job, doesn't make a i.e. 19 year old Peter Forsberg playing a 19 year old Paul Kariya, professional hockey players.

My brother is finishing high school, and he wants to become a director. A friend of ours who organizes big concerts pays my brother to film them and make a dvd. Does my brother getting paid make him a professional? He's 17. Does that make him on the same level as Steve Speilberg?

You need to give your head a shake again.

the eastern bloc player's were technically in the armed forces

 

[Connorrhea]

the eastern bloc player's were technically in the armed forces

Well then I guess you can say some players who played for an army team got paid for being in the army, not playing hockey for them.

 

[Tricolore#20]

It seems like there is an argument over semantics.

I think prior to 1998, the players were technically classified as amateurs. However, most European teams used professional players, who competed in professional leagues. When the Americans beat the Soviets at Lake Placid, a lot of people said it was "college students" beating a "group of professionals." It would be hard to classify such hockey legends as Kharlamov, Tretiak and Mikhailov as amateurs, considering that they were playing in professional leagues and were some of the best talents in the world. However, it seems like the North American teams fielded truly amateur teams (although since the Calgary games, it seems like some professionals decided to play for the Canadian national team because of contract issues. Those include guys like Andy Moog, Sean Burke and Petr Nedved. Would those established NHL players be considered amateur then?).

 

[Connorrhea]

It seems like there is an argument over semantics.

I think prior to 1998, the players were technically classified as amateurs. However, most European teams used professional players, who competed in professional leagues. When the Americans beat the Soviets at Lake Placid, a lot of people said it was "college students" beating a "group of professionals." It would be hard to classify such hockey legends as Kharlamov, Tretiak and Mikhailov as amateurs, considering that they were playing in professional leagues and were some of the best talents in the world. However, it seems like the North American teams fielded truly amateur teams (although since the Calgary games, it seems like some professionals decided to play for the Canadian national team because of contract issues. Those include guys like Andy Moog and Petr Nedved. Would those established NHL players be considered amateur then?).

But I do agree that maybe the argument is over symantics, but then again, guys that played on that Russian team that lost to the U.S., might have had difficulty leaving their country thus spending their careers playing against competition that wasn't considered professional at the time. Easter bloc players might not have had a choice but to join the army and play hockey, or to play hockey wherever they can because they weren't allowed to leave the country and grow up playing hockey the way North Americans do.

The overall issue with which I have is the Olympic standards, and I already mentioned hockey was the exception to the rule where they allowed established, paid player to participate. But the point is those who were paid were mainly from Eastern Bloc and the level of competition wasn't considered to be the same.

Or if you want to make this easier, professionals are considered the best players in the world at that sport, thus being the NHL. Just look at figure skating. Once you become a professoinal (i.e. Kurt Browning, Katarina Witt), you cannot compete again at the Olypmics because as the title of "profesional", you are considered to be the best at your profession, not just because you get paid. That is where some of you are getting lost with my arguments.

 

[mr gib]

Well then I guess you can say some players who played for an army team got paid for being in the army, not playing hockey for them.

right - that was the whole argument when they started rolling over the - real - amateur teams -