F James Hagens - Boston College, NCAA (2025 Draft) Part 2

[Kingpin794]

Waste of words. Your point is totally illogical.

You’re trying to push this idea that Hagens has peaked at age 18, while your OHL faves are ascending.

In reality, literally none of them have performed comparatively to Hagens when they’ve went head to head. In fact, it has been drastic in Hagens favor.

If I took out the f'ing years and changed them to 1971/72 and 1972/73 would you be an honest interlocutor then? Are you really that damn dense that you won't engage with the actual points I was making? Are you just a poe?

 

[Mathieukferland]

Misa didn’t make Team Canada because he was pretty awful last year

Not to derail the thread but if he can’t make Canada whilst leading the country in goals and points, that says more about the galaxybrain WJC sélection committee than it does any type of judgement of him as a player; it would be akin to the four nations team leaving off MacKinnon.

I don’t believe any serious scouting staff would care too much about him not making the WJC team, and his historic production this year in Saginaw and fairly projectable skillset and size is why I could see some teams having him as the best forward. I’m starting to lean that way anyways.


As for Hagens, my opinion hasn’t really changed regarding him, so I have nothing further to add; I think if everything goes right he’s a 70 point selke candidate in the NHL

 

[TheGreenTBer]

If I took out the f'ing years and changed them to 1971/72 and 1972/73 would you be an honest interlocutor then? Are you really that damn dense that you won't engage with the actual points I was making? Are you just a poe?

YOU DON'T HAVE HAGENS AS A CLEAR #1 HOW DARE YOU

 

[wickedwitch]

A couple more observations about Hagens and his production this year. (For team figures, I am listing team ranks instead of actual stats to simplify)

Boston College is among the best in NCAA in overall scoring (8th). But their power play has been the pits (52nd). It is from both lack of opportunities (57th) and poor success rate (52nd).

Playing at even strength, they have done well (4th in even GF%, 10th in SF%, 12th in CF%). Especially defensively, they have kept things fairly tight (6th in shot attempts against per 60). Their team shooting percentage at even-strength has been good (12th), but on power play has been brutal (55th).

Through 27 games, James Hagens has 29 points, only 5 of them coming on the power play. He has 1 power play goal. But at even strength, he is putting up similar numbers as Celebrini and Smith last year.


Power Play (through 27 games)
Hagens (2025)......1g, 4a, 5pts
Celebrini (2024)....8g, 8a, 16pts
Smith (2024).........4g, 15a, 19pts

Even Strength (through 27 games)
Hagens (2025)......6g, 18a, 24pts
Celebrini (2024)...15g, 11a, 26pts
Smith (2024)........12g, 10a, 22pts

Boston College is youngest team in NCAA and is playing great team defense, but their power play stinks. Hard to blame one guy. Perreault (5 pts) and Leonard (6 pts) aren't faring much better.

If this is the reason an injured player has passed Hagens in draft rankings, it is a little bizzarre (and doubtful scouts are dinging him as much). And if so, I wonder if same people have moved Leonard and Perreault down their prospect lists too?

Their PP woes are making me side-eye Greg Brown (with regards to game strategy not player development). Because how can it be this bad with the talent they have?

 

[CheckingLineCenter]

A couple more observations about Hagens and his production this year. (For team figures, I am listing team ranks instead of actual stats to simplify)

Boston College is among the best in NCAA in overall scoring (8th). But their power play has been the pits (52nd). It is from both lack of opportunities (57th) and poor success rate (52nd).

Playing at even strength, they have done well (4th in even GF%, 10th in SF%, 12th in CF%). Especially defensively, they have kept things fairly tight (6th in shot attempts against per 60). Their team shooting percentage at even-strength has been good (12th), but on power play has been brutal (55th).

Through 27 games, James Hagens has 29 points, only 5 of them coming on the power play. He has 1 power play goal. But at even strength, he is putting up similar numbers as Celebrini and Smith last year.


Power Play (through 27 games)
Hagens (2025)......1g, 4a, 5pts
Celebrini (2024)....8g, 8a, 16pts
Smith (2024).........4g, 15a, 19pts

Even Strength (through 27 games)
Hagens (2025)......6g, 18a, 24pts
Celebrini (2024)...15g, 11a, 26pts
Smith (2024)........12g, 10a, 22pts

Boston College is youngest team in NCAA and is playing great team defense, but their power play stinks. Hard to blame one guy. Perreault (5 pts) and Leonard (6 pts) aren't faring much better.

If this is the reason an injured player has passed Hagens in draft rankings, it is a little bizzarre (and doubtful scouts are dinging him as much). And if so, I wonder if same people have moved Leonard and Perreault down their prospect lists too?

Would be curious to see where Fantilli is on that list.

I can buy the argument that others have done more to pass him. I can also buy that he’s maybe slightly disappointed this year. Maybe the better word is slightly stagnated against lofty expectations. Add what Celebrini did last year about 9 months or so younger, and Misa/Schaefer having good years… I get it.

But when you stop and think about it without nitpicking— shredded the U18, 1C on gold winning WJC20 team, point per game 1C on good NCAA team. Great resume with no fatal flaws like size or bad skating.

So I do think if he loses out on going 1st overall— he’s as good as a 2/3OA prospect on draft day as you’ll get outside of an Eichel, Michkov (I know he didn’t go #2) type of prospect. And I’d kind of say that about all of the top 3. This draft may not have the high end 1OA type like a Dahlin or Jack Hughes or Celebrini (much less a McDavid or Bedard) but Misa, Schaefer, Hagens all look like really good prospects.

 

[SannywithoutCompy]

Waste of words. Your point is totally illogical.

You’re trying to push this idea that Hagens has peaked at age 18, while your OHL faves are ascending.

In reality, literally none of them have performed comparatively to Hagens when they’ve went head to head. In fact, it has been drastic in Hagens favor.


Misa didn’t make Team Canada because he was pretty awful last year (his PPG literally went backwards). It’s kinda hard as a DY player to make a team of older players when your prior season was bad. Slate doesn’t get wiped clean each year. Prior years matter, for making the WJC team and for the NHL draft.

He didn't make Team Canada because in his d-1 year he was on a superteam that played him out of position?

 

[Langway]

I just don't see the cut-through ability to be exceptional with Hagens. I don't think he's on Cooley's level, let alone Celebrini. At times he's just like a Mikael Granlund type...underwhelming. Just seven goals on the season makes him somewhat one-dimensional offensively and he's not such a dominant playmaker or two-way player to overlook it. He's very good but definitely to this point in BC's season...not great.

 

[Juxtaposer]

Their PP woes are making me side-eye Greg Brown (with regards to game strategy not player development). Because how can it be this bad with the talent they have?

He's always been a mediocre at best coach IMO, and I might go so far as to call him actively bad. He basically deployed the freshman line last year in third line even strength minutes.

Hagens on PP2 is a new low, though.

 

[MTU34]

This thread has basically devolved into a few bad faith arguments about the season Hagens has been having and Pavel overreacting by screaming about mass conspiracy

 

[NTDP]

He's always been a mediocre at best coach IMO, and I might go so far as to call him actively bad. He basically deployed the freshman line last year in third line even strength minutes.

Hagens on PP2 is a new low, though.

Agree on Brown, like last year when he waited till about a minute left to pull the goalie in the Natty vs Denver. Like dude put your best six out there and give em an extra minute at least to have a chance. I think he's a little overrated.

 

[NikF]

He's gonna be somewhere between Turcotte and J. Hughes. 50-60 point mobile two-way support-playmaker. He over-supports linemates and puck-watches a bit too much and doesn't have puck on a string like J. Hughes either leading to more of a B-level offensive game than A.

Passing and skating are A-level but utilizing space off-puck, hands, shot, offensive timing are not, they're more of a C to B+. Utilizing space off puck might be a C which paired with a not so great shot might make him a more modest goal-scorer at the next level.

 

[Juxtaposer]

Agree on Brown, like last year when he waited till about a minute left to pull the goalie in the Natty vs Denver. Like dude put your best six out there and give em an extra minute at least to have a chance. I think he's a little overrated.

Yeah, I remember yelling at my TV over that one. Just ridiculous.

 

[WarriorofTime]

He's gonna be somewhere between Turcotte and J. Hughes.

Really going out on a limb, lol. I think he'll be somewhere between Paul Bisonette and Sidney Crosby myself.

 

[wetcoast]

I just want to do a quick thought experiment. And this is going to be a VERY extreme example to illustrate my point so don't get too caught up in the minutia:

Player A has 300 pts in 23/24. Then has 0 in 24/25.
Player B has 0 pts in 23/24. Then has 300 in 24/25.

Which player would you expect to have better odds of being selected first?

If you say player B, then you understand that selecting a player in the draft is not about what a player has done a year or 2 years in the past. Its about project out what a player will in 5, 10 years. Some guys can peak or have limited room for growth by the time they hit their draft year. Others can have exponential growth during their draft year.

If you say player A, then you're doing exactly what you accuse the Canadian media of doing. Just anointing a player as better just because you say so or because of fallacious reasoning.

Just wanted to throw that out there.

Exactly and I was going to point out that the poster you are replying too always tries to use Schafer's underwhelming 23-24 season and the gloss over the context of 2 tragic deaths in his life and the coaching philosophy of the team he is on then rag on everyone talking about statistics on Hagens.

I personally have Schaefer #1 then Hagens/Misa as a pick em but others can disagree just don't tell me there is some sort of Canadian conspiracy or all of the other crap brought into these discussions recently, it's not only a bad look, it serves zero purpose.

NHL teams are going to draft the player at every pick that they think is the best one for their organization they don't care about where he was born or where he plays, they care about what he might become for them and that's it.

 

[Favin]

Would be curious to see where Fantilli is on that list.

Power Play (through 27 games)
Hagens (2025)......1g, 4a, 5pts
Celebrini (2024)....8g, 8a, 16pts
Smith (2024).........4g, 15a, 19pts
Fantilli (2023)........5g, 9a, 14pts

Even Strength (through 27 games)
Hagens (2025)......6g, 18a, 24pts
Celebrini (2024)...15g, 11a, 26pts
Smith (2024)........12g, 10a, 22pts
Fantilli (2023).......15g, 20a, 35pts

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Not to derail the thread but if he can’t make Canada whilst leading the country in goals and points, that says more about the galaxybrain WJC sélection committee than it does any type of judgement of him as a player; it would be akin to the four nations team leaving off MacKinnon.

I don’t believe any serious scouting staff would care too much about him not making the WJC team, and his historic production this year in Saginaw and fairly projectable skillset and size is why I could see some teams having him as the best forward. I’m starting to lean that way anyways.

I'm not saying it was the right decision, but I think people that act like "he got screwed so bad" and forget to add into this equation that he contributed to "the screwing" within the equation are not being fair to the situation.

There were two other 2025 draft eligibles on the team. I think the idea that there's nothing Misa could've done is incorrect.

Maybe nothing he could've done this year, but it's not like last season is irrelevant to the equation of who should make this year's team (probably shouldn't derail a guy having an amazing season from making it), especially when you're in your draft year.

It just is what it is. For instance, a guy like Carter Amico should make the US World Junior team next year, but he has virtually no chance because he's injured this year. It is what it is. Players can put themselves significantly behind due to a bad prior year, and sometimes it actually is due to injuries. Tage Thompson with the US Four Nations Team is sort of like that. If he just had an average season last year, he makes the team easily this year. Sucks that he was dealing with an injury last year, but I think you can't just exclude it from the equation, especially when there are other good candidates and it's competitive for spots.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

I just don't see the cut-through ability to be exceptional with Hagens. I don't think he's on Cooley's level, let alone Celebrini. At times he's just like a Mikael Granlund type...underwhelming. Just seven goals on the season makes him somewhat one-dimensional offensively and he's not such a dominant playmaker or two-way player to overlook it. He's very good but definitely to this point in BC's season...not great.

Had 5 goals in 7 games at the World Juniors this year. Has had 23 goals in 28 games at the WHC17, WJC18, and WJC20 before being drafted. Had 39 goals at the NTDP last year, but that was also shooting 2X what he's shooting now. Almost like there's this thing called SH% luck. Sometimes is working in your favor, sometimes is not, and it all tends to revert back to the mean over time. Can't believe diehards on a hockey message board don't understand this concept.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Exactly and I was going to point out that the poster you are replying too always tries to use Schafer's underwhelming 23-24 season and the gloss over the context of 2 tragic deaths in his life and the coaching philosophy of the team he is on then rag on everyone talking about statistics on Hagens.

I personally have Schaefer #1 then Hagens/Misa as a pick em but others can disagree just don't tell me there is some sort of Canadian conspiracy or all of the other crap brought into these discussions recently, it's not only a bad look, it serves zero purpose.

NHL teams are going to draft the player at every pick that they think is the best one for their organization they don't care about where he was born or where he plays, they care about what he might become for them and that's it.

Nope, not letting you get away with this emotional blackmail stuff.

YOU, yes, YOU are the one that always brings up Schaefer's personal life. You mention it literally like every post that discusses the 2025 draft. I feel bad for the kid what he experienced. That doesn't mean I have to believe that he's the best player in the 2025 draft because of that. And if poke holes in the idea that he's the best player in the draft that doesn't mean I'm insulting what he's experiencing in his personal life. I think it's a very bad faith argument to attempt to keep bringing this up. There's literally no indication anyone has made this type of argument against him. It's emotional blackmail to try to claim this. It's an attempt to shut down dissent against the hockey player.

 

[wickedwitch]

He's always been a mediocre at best coach IMO, and I might go so far as to call him actively bad. He basically deployed the freshman line last year in third line even strength minutes.

Hagens on PP2 is a new low, though.

Time to rant.

I really don't get what Brown's doing with Hagens in general and I think it's hurt his draft stock. I don't think Hagens' draft stock really matters that much to his long term development (and it'll probably be in his best interest if he's not picked by say Chicago), but it is still tough to watch.

The Perreault-Hagens-Leonard line never clicked. They could still be productive, but that's because they're all ridiculously talented and smart. And yet, it took over half the season to break them up.

I like the Perreault-Hagens-Stiga line well enough. It would not have been my first choice, as I'd try Stiga-Hagens-Leonard, but that's nitpicking. The Berard-Hagens-Stiga line is beyond dumb. Berard is not a top 6 forward. Vote is clearly the best option for a top 6 forward with Jellvik injured. I'd do Vote-Gasseau-Leonard and keep the Perreault-Hagens-Stiga line together, but there are plenty of other combos worth trying.

I haven't seen the past couple of games, so I haven't seen Hagens on PP2. But to my eye, he is not the issue. I think PP1's issues largely stem from their PPQB. I want to see them try Michael Hagens or Minnetian on PP1.

All of this has limited Hagens both from a production standpoint and from a performance standpoint which has people questioning his abilities.

And none of this gets into what I think Brown's biggest weakness which his inability to make in-game adjustments. But that's not really for this thread.