F Ivan Demidov - SKA St. Petersburg, KHL (2024, 5th, MTL)

[Kshahdoo]

On raw talent alone, Demidov is the 2nd or 3rd highest-skilled player in the draft, imo. That said, I don't think he'll be one of the top 5 most valuable players in the draft when we reflect five years from now. Of course, this is simply a gut hunch. I think he'll be flashy and highly productive but more in the prime Phil Kessel mold than a team carrier like Celebrini.

I also think there's going to be a few players who end up higher-impact NHLers based on putting it all together and tapping into intangibles. And this will knock Demidov down a bit, no fault of his own.

I think Mack Celebrini is an automatic. I think Buium will end up the second most dominant player in the draft, ultimately having an Adam Fox-like impact. I feel that Silayev could end up challenging for multiple Norris Trophies as the premier shutdown defenseman in the NHL with 50+ points offensively... think Pronger without the criminal element but better skating. And I think Iginla will end up punching above his weight class and be the type of leader who matches elite character with high-end skills like Daniel Alfredsson. If Lindstrom can keep that hulking frame healthy and put it all together, he could resemble Ryan Getzlaf.

All of that said, I can see a case for Demidov being selected as high as 2nd overall by the Hawks (even though I believe they pass and he slides to 5th overall). I would also be more than fine if my team drafted him above any of the players I mentioned above, based on his dynamic skill set.

Ultimately, I think he ends up going 5th overall to the Habs... and the draft falling like...

1. SJS - Celebrini
2. CHI - Levshunov
3. ANA - Silayev
4. CLB - Lindstrom
5. MTL - Demidov

Again, no fault of Demidov, but I think these teams will put extra weight on drafting for "need" instead of pure talent. I feel CHI will covet that big, multi-purpose RHD and lick their chops thinking about a Korchinski-Levshunov pairing for a decade.

I think the Ducks are stacked with young talent in all positions but won't be able to pass up an elite, shutdown D monster who can log 26 minutes a night and compliment offensive D titans like Mintyukov and Zellweger. With Silayev, those two guys, Luneau and LaCombe, etc. the Ducks D will be the undisputed greatest on the planet in 4 years.

CLB likely can't pass up a center ice core that features Fantilli, Lindstrom, and Sillinger.

That's why I feel Demidov drops to 5th overall and the Habs pounce. Unless they get brazen and take a future leader in Iginla. But I think a good percentage of Canadiens fans are still salty over them passing on Michkov last year and some may lose their minds if they don't take Demidov if he's there.

Welcome to Montreal, Ivan Demidov.

And I say he'll end up as the best player of the draft... Celebrini will be on the level of Eichel while Demidov will be about as good as Kaprizov.

 

[Boxscore]

And I say he'll end up as the best player of the draft...

And there's nothing wrong with that. That's the best part of being a fan and spending endless hours obsessing over prospects and trying to predict their careers. I certainly can't tell you that you're wrong.

And, I understand your perspective. I still insist that Michkov will end up the 2nd or 3rd most dominant player from last year's draft when it's all said and done... and only 3rd if Carlsson ends up a Mats Sundin/Anze Kopitar type of impact center.

Because I honestly think Michkov will score 60+ goals in the NHL more than once.

Ride your intuition and enjoy it.

 

[Zine]

That seems like a small population of players and not sizeable enough to completely alter the level of competition he faced. I checked the top scorers for the MHL playoffs this year and 10 of the top 15 were still U20 with just a couple players being drafted prospects.

All of the CHL, USHL, U20 SM-sarja, J20 Nationell and MHL are excellent junior leagues.
Sure some differences exist, but they're all relatively on the same level in the big picture.
It's not like Demidov is dominating the Austrian U20 league or whatever.

And don't forget Demidov was really good during KHL preseason. He didn't look out of place whatsoever on a line with Michkov and Gritsyuk.

 

[Garbageyuk]

All of the CHL, USHL, U20 SM-sarja, J20 Nationell and MHL are excellent junior leagues.
Sure some differences exist, but they're all relatively on the same level in the big picture.
It's not like Demidov is dominating the Austrian U20 league or whatever.

And don't forget Demidov was really good during KHL preseason. He didn't look out of place whatsoever on a line with Michkov and Gritsyuk.

This is just not true.

NCAA
CHL
USHL

CJHL/USHS/MHL/European junior leagues

The leagues on the bottom tier all have one thing in common: the best junior players generally don’t play in them.

 

[spfan]

Same with Michkov last year will see in a few years if teams were right or wrong but today im still hurt that we picked Reinbacher over him we better not make the same mistake this year

Demidov no matter what

If they get Lindstrom or Iginla, won't be as crazy as Reinbacher over Michkov though.

 

[majormajor]

This is just not true.

NCAA
CHL
USHL

CJHL/USHS/MHL/European junior leagues

The leagues on the bottom tier all have one thing in common: the best junior players generally don’t play in them.

I watched the MHL playoffs and those top teams were really good. Much closer to the top CHL teams than they are to high school hockey, lol. That's ridiculous.

 

[Garbageyuk]

I watched the MHL playoffs and those top teams were really good. Much closer to the top CHL teams than they are to high school hockey, lol. That's ridiculous.

Again, the top junior Russian players generally don’t play in the MHL in their draft year. When they do, it’s usually a handful of games at most. Demidov is an unusual case.

You don’t need to try to prop up a clearly inferior league just because you like a player there. Makar was drafted out of the AJHL, and is probably going down as the best player from his draft. That doesn’t change the fact that the AJHL, like the MHL, is an inferior league.

 

[Caser]

I watched the MHL playoffs and those top teams were really good. Much closer to the top CHL teams than they are to high school hockey, lol. That's ridiculous.

People just don't get the MHL's structure - the division into Gold and Silver divisions and, as for the playoffs, that most of the KHL's and VHL's U20 (and even some U21) players are sent down there for those.

Again, the top junior Russian players generally don’t play in the MHL in their draft year. When they do, it’s usually a handful of games at most. Demidov is an unusual case.

You don’t need to try to prop up a clearly inferior league just because you like a player there. Makar was drafted out of the AJHL, and is probably going down as the best player from his draft. That doesn’t change the fact that the AJHL, like the MHL, is an inferior league.

Generally only couple of top Russian draft eligible players play in the KHL/VHL on a regular basis. A bit more if we count at the U20 level, but still maybe like 15-20 can be called regulars at that age. And yes, when possible they still get sent back down (like for the playoffs if the KHL team is eliminated).

 

[Zine]

This is just not true.

NCAA
CHL
USHL

CJHL/USHS/MHL/European junior leagues

The leagues on the bottom tier all have one thing in common: the best junior players generally don’t play in them.

The NCAA isnt a junior league. And I stopped reading when you put the MHL and other top Euro Junior Leagues on a level with US High Schools.
Absolutely ridiculous.

 

[majormajor]

Again, the top junior Russian players generally don’t play in the MHL in their draft year. When they do, it’s usually a handful of games at most. Demidov is an unusual case.

Most of the top junior Russian players do play in the MHL, like Yegor Surin who is a great matchup center you can watch take on Demidov. And most of them that were in the KHL, like Silayev, But, and Simashev, were back in the MHL for the playoffs. All of them, the best Russian junior players, played against Demidov in the final two rounds of the playoffs.

You can watch those games for free on youtube. You might learn something.

You don’t need to try to prop up a clearly inferior league just because you like a player there. Makar was drafted out of the AJHL, and is probably going down as the best player from his draft. That doesn’t change the fact that the AJHL, like the MHL, is an inferior league.

I wasn't making an argument in favor of Demidov. I was just responding to an uninformed post about the caliber of leagues.

 

[Hanji]

This is just not true.

NCAA
CHL
USHL

CJHL/USHS/MHL/European junior leagues

The leagues on the bottom tier all have one thing in common: the best junior players generally don’t play in them.

Does not the same apply to the USHL, which is the main feeder league for the NCAA?

Our best juniors are in college, not the USHL. All but 2 guys from this year’s WJC team were NCAAers. Indeed this year there were exponentially more u20s in the NCAA than u20 regulars in the KHL/VHL.

 

[majormajor]

Does not the same apply to the USHL, which is the main feeder league for the NCAA?

Our best juniors are in college, not the USHL. All but 2 guys from this year’s WJC team were NCAAers. Indeed this year there were exponentially more u20s in the NCAA than u20 regulars in the KHL/VHL.

If all of the players from the US WJC team were in the USHL or at least there for the Clark Cup playoffs, then it actually would be comparable to the MHL, or at least the top half division of the MHL.

I actually have a hard time imagining Fargo or Chicago Steel beating Loko jr or SKA 1946.

 

[Hanji]

If all of the players from the US WJC team were in the USHL or at least there for the Clark Cup playoffs, then it actually would be comparable to the MHL, or at least the top half division of the MHL.

I actually have a hard time imagining Fargo or Chicago Steel beating Loko jr or SKA 1946.

Don’t overlook talent depth too. There are 135 u20s in college. That’s 5 teams worth of upper tier junior talent being drained from junior leagues, primarily the USHL.

 

[Kshahdoo]

Don’t overlook talent depth too. There are 135 u20s in college. That’s 5 teams worth of upper tier junior talent being drained from junior leagues, primarily the USHL.

If you're subscribed to Eliteprospects you can check how many U20 players did play in VHL and KHL in 2023-24 season. I'm not subscribed so I can't.

Out of 19 kids drafted last year 18 were eligible to play in the MHL, and of course they all played either in VHL or KHL. And Michkov was top20 by PPG. In the KHL.

I'm pretty sure the picture is about the same for 2022 draft.

Atanasov was probably the best player of the MHL 2023 playoffs (his team won the cup), and he played in the KHL the whole season. It's about how they pump MHL teams up with better players in playoffs. But Atanasov still wasn't as good as Demidov despite being 20.5 year old. And just one year later he's already one of the KHL top players.

 

[Zine]

For comparison’s sake, Russia’s U18 NT played a season in the MHL a few years ago.

I think we can all agree hockey's Top 5 nations are on a basic equal footing as anybody can beat anybody on a given day. Maybe also CZE at junior level as of late.
How would Canada’s ‘A’ U18 do in the CHL?…or Sweden in the J20 Nationell? That year Russia U18 tied for 5th place in the MHL. Lost in the 1st round of the playoffs.

I know the NTDP plays in the USHL. But AFAIK they always ice a U18/U17 split squad for USHL games.

 

[Cskavars]

i kinda understand the MHL view point of being a weaker league overall but the top end teams could compete all day in the CHL. if Demidov would have been in the CHL this year he would have destroyed that league as well. Was point per game as underage player at the Hlinka last time Russia was there

 

[Caser]

i kinda understand the MHL view point of being a weaker league overall but the top end teams could compete all day in the CHL. if Demidov would have been in the CHL this year he would have destroyed that league as well. Was point per game as underage player at the Hlinka last time Russia was there

And Demidov played mostly against the top teams, I think some time ago I counted and, iirc, only 8 of his games were against the weaker teams this season.

 

[Kshahdoo]

i kinda understand the MHL view point of being a weaker league overall but the top end teams could compete all day in the CHL. if Demidov would have been in the CHL this year he would have destroyed that league as well. Was point per game as underage player at the Hlinka last time Russia was there

He was 15...

 

[Cskavars]

He was 15...

i know, thats why i dont buy the "well we havent seen him in international competition, therefore he might not be that good" will to bet he would of outscored Celebrini at the WJC pretty easily

 

[Fantomas]

Generally only couple of top Russian draft eligible players play in the KHL/VHL on a regular basis. A bit more if we count at the U20 level, but still maybe like 15-20 can be called regulars at that age. And yes, when possible they still get sent back down (like for the playoffs if the KHL team is eliminated).

Whether you play or not in the KHL at 17 is usually not even a matter of how good you are. It's all about whether your KHL club is willing to accommodate you. SKA couldn't even accommodate Michkov, so his camp basically forced the loan to Sochi.

Demidov's camp clearly didn't push for a loan. It's not like he wasn't good enough to play in the KHL. There have been guys his age who don't even go in the first round who play in the KHL as regulars!

 

[FlyguyOX]

Chibrikov played a good bit of VHL and KHL his draft year. Fyodor Svechkov played VHL his draft year.

It is odd Demidov has played I think only 1 VHL game.

 

[montreal]

And Demidov played mostly against the top teams, I think some time ago I counted and, iirc, only 8 of his games were against the weaker teams this season.

I would have liked to see him face Mamonty Ugra, I got to see a good bit of them this year and they impressed the hell out of me. They were so well structed defensively and of course I'm biased but Volokhin I thought he looked outstanding. I think he's one of the Habs top prospects as he doesn't seem to have many holes in his game. Would have been interesting to see these two face each other in a game but I would rather they end up as teammates on the Habs some day!

 

[Kshahdoo]

I would have liked to see him face Mamonty Ugra, I got to see a good bit of them this year and they impressed the hell out of me. They were so well structed defensively and of course I'm biased but Volokhin I thought he looked outstanding. I think he's one of the Habs top prospects as he doesn't seem to have many holes in his game. Would have been interesting to see these two face each other in a game but I would rather they end up as teammates on the Habs some day!

It didn't help them to advance far enough to play vs Demidov's team though...

 

[Caser]

I would have liked to see him face Mamonty Ugra, I got to see a good bit of them this year and they impressed the hell out of me. They were so well structed defensively and of course I'm biased but Volokhin I thought he looked outstanding. I think he's one of the Habs top prospects as he doesn't seem to have many holes in his game. Would have been interesting to see these two face each other in a game but I would rather they end up as teammates on the Habs some day!

Mamonty played some extremely (for a junior league) defense-based hockey, but it sort of fired back at them in the playoffs, as they struggled to score against the Chaika. But yeah, it is a bit of a shame that Eastern and Western conference teams don't face each other at all in the regular season and until the playoff semifinals. Btw, Western conference is in general considered as a slightly, but a stronger one, that's returning to the discussion about the quality of Demidov's competition.

 

[Sasha Orlov]

Please Montreal do not f*** this up