F Charlie Stramel - Michigan State University, NCAA (2023, 21st, MIN)

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

So you think he’s going anywhere that isn’t telling him he’ll have a good chance to be top 6?

I'm sure they'll tell him they hope he plays in the top 6. Just like Wisconsin probably told him.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Hard to say without knowing where he's going.

He could literally play anywhere. NCAA, AHL, CHL, Europe. All paths are open.

And these NCAA teams know that if they get the player the Wild and plenty of others thought was deserving of his draft slot that they are getting the best or one of the best players on their team.

His agent cannot be that incompetent that he can’t secure him a good top 6 spot somewhere.

 

[OilersFanatics505]

North Dakota and Boston University were the two other schools in his top three when he originally committed to Wisconsin.

Unless we’re talking about a different ND team that I just saw, he’s way too slow and clunky to fit their style.

 

[WarriorofTime]

He could literally play anywhere. NCAA, AHL, CHL, Europe. All paths are open.

And these NCAA teams know that if they get the player the Wild and plenty of others thought was deserving of his draft slot that they are getting the best or one of the best players on their team.

His agent cannot be that incompetent that he can’t secure him a good top 6 spot somewhere.

Can a player play as a CHL overager if they didn't play in the league previously? Not sure I've ever seen that. He is not ready for the AHL, that's silly to even think as an option. In no way should he be signing an NHL contract right now. You have a bad habit of holding onto former USNDTP kids too long, and making excuses to rationalize when they don't live up to expectations, like claiming Tyler Boucher playing 4th line AHL minutes is fine for a top 10 pick because "his game isn't about points".

My assumption is Stramel plays for a different NCAA team, what team and what role he has on that team are all just speculation. For all we know, the best teams are offering to bring him in with plans for a bottom six role and less than a 100% scholarship. There is not a lot of outward facing information when it comes to college hockey recruiting.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

He could literally play anywhere. NCAA, AHL, CHL, Europe. All paths are open.

And these NCAA teams know that if they get the player the Wild and plenty of others thought was deserving of his draft slot that they are getting the best or one of the best players on their team.

His agent cannot be that incompetent that he can’t secure him a good top 6 spot somewhere.

Now we'll find out, I guess.

Hoping for >12 points next year at least.

 

[MMC]

 

[William H Bonney]

Good landing spot for him. Time to step up.

 

[Jersey Fan 12]

Two more upperclassmen transfer from CCHA into Wisconsin while three underclassmen recruited by the previous staff leave. Tough to argue with this past season's results but will be interesting to see how things go in the long run.

 

[WarriorofTime]

Hopefully Levshunov can take him under his wing.

 

[Herby]

Another one of those guys that never would have been drafted as high if the old rules (drafted after freshman year) were in place. I know why the rules changed, but so many teams have just been totally burned by guys like Stramel, Turcotte, Boucher. A few have gone the other way (Faber for example), but most of the times it’s guys who just really disappoint right away.

 

[WarriorofTime]

Another one of those guys that never would have been drafted as high if the old rules (drafted after freshman year) were in place. I know why the rules changed, but so many teams have just been totally burned by guys like Stramel, Turcotte, Boucher. A few have gone the other way (Faber for example), but most of the times it’s guys who just really disappoint right away.

Maybe not the best example, considering due to Stramel's late birthday, he WAS drafted after his freshman year. It wasn't very good but they rolled the dice that it wasn't representative.

 

[Herby]

Maybe not the best example, considering due to Stramel's late birthday, he WAS drafted after his freshman year. It wasn't very good but they rolled the dice that it wasn't representative.

You are correct. Poor example, as I forgot he wasn’t taken out of the NTDP.

I still think we would be better off returning to the way it used to be.

I loved the Hastings hire for UW, but I expected more of a hybrid where he kept many of the things that worked at Mankato but was able to bring in more higher end guys than he did at Mankato. But maybe with the way Minnesota and Michigan are recruiting and now the re-emergence of MSU he thinks the best chance is doing it with more older guys. You have to think Hensler has to be re-considering his options.

It’s definitely been an interesting start to the off-season in Madison so far.

 

[JiricekSaveUs]

I hope he proves everyone including myself wrong

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Good landing spot for him. Time to step up.

His freshman year wasn't great, but it was a down year for Wisconsin in general - he actually finished t-5th among Wisconsin forwards in scoring. Still disappointing, but not a disaster.

But this year, on a much improved Wisconsin team, he fell to 13th in scoring among WIisconsin forwards, with a team worst -4. He was leapfrogged by multiple freshman (Whitelaw, Finley), returning players (Lindmark, Horbach), as well as pretty much every Mankato transfer (Fitzgerald, Silye, Tassy). It's pretty telling that as his role was significantly reduced, his team got that much better.

I think he'll at least get back to being a middle 6 NCAA center by the time his NCAA career is over. Mark Jankowski had a similar kind of trajectory - late first rounder who didn't light up the NCAA his first year. But by the time he graduated, he was one of the most dominant 200 foot centers in the NCAA.

A Jankowski like development curve should be Stramel's goal. He'll likely have every opportunity to earn a legit top 9 spot at MSU. If he's able to turn things around, I still think he could turn into a useful bottom 6 center. But I don't see a world where he ever scores more than 20-30 points in his NHL career, assuming he has one.

 

[Hockeyville USA]

His freshman year wasn't great, but it was a down year for Wisconsin in general - he actually finished t-5th among Wisconsin forwards in scoring. Still disappointing, but not a disaster.

But this year, on a much improved Wisconsin team, he fell to 13th in scoring among WIisconsin forwards, with a team worst -4. He was leapfrogged by multiple freshman (Whitelaw, Finley), returning players (Lindmark, Horbach), as well as pretty much every Mankato transfer (Fitzgerald, Silye, Tassy). It's pretty telling that as his role was significantly reduced, his team got that much better.

I think he'll at least get back to being a middle 6 NCAA center by the time his NCAA career is over. Mark Jankowski had a similar kind of trajectory - late first rounder who didn't light up the NCAA his first year. But by the time he graduated, he was one of the most dominant 200 foot centers in the NCAA.

A Jankowski like development curve should be Stramel's goal. He'll likely have every opportunity to earn a legit top 9 spot at MSU. If he's able to turn things around, I still think he could turn into a useful bottom 6 center. But I don't see a world where he ever scores more than 20-30 points in his NHL career, assuming he has one.

Difference is Jankowski was playing HS/Prep hockey in Quebec in his DY, so he was starting from further behind. Stramel played at the NTDP for 2 years, then already at Wisconsin for 1 year before being drafted. Jankowski kept progressing, whereas Stramel has fallen further down the cliff for the last 2-3 years.

 

[bigdog16]

His freshman year wasn't great, but it was a down year for Wisconsin in general - he actually finished t-5th among Wisconsin forwards in scoring. Still disappointing, but not a disaster.

But this year, on a much improved Wisconsin team, he fell to 13th in scoring among WIisconsin forwards, with a team worst -4. He was leapfrogged by multiple freshman (Whitelaw, Finley), returning players (Lindmark, Horbach), as well as pretty much every Mankato transfer (Fitzgerald, Silye, Tassy). It's pretty telling that as his role was significantly reduced, his team got that much better.

I think he'll at least get back to being a middle 6 NCAA center by the time his NCAA career is over. Mark Jankowski had a similar kind of trajectory - late first rounder who didn't light up the NCAA his first year. But by the time he graduated, he was one of the most dominant 200 foot centers in the NCAA.

A Jankowski like development curve should be Stramel's goal. He'll likely have every opportunity to earn a legit top 9 spot at MSU. If he's able to turn things around, I still think he could turn into a useful bottom 6 center. But I don't see a world where he ever scores more than 20-30 points in his NHL career, assuming he has one.

As previously stated, it was known that Jankwoski was going to be a total project when he was drafted. He ended up carving out a nice career and was a really good NCAA player, but he still never hit his ceiling. Jankowski was drafted as a guy that could end up being a 1st liner, but still could end up being a dependable bottom 6 guy which he ultimately became.

I'm not sure anyone on draft day was saying "Stramel could be a top line forward if he hits his ceiling"

 

[MuckOG]

As previously stated, it was known that Jankwoski was going to be a total project when he was drafted. He ended up carving out a nice career and was a really good NCAA player, but he still never hit his ceiling. Jankowski was drafted as a guy that could end up being a 1st liner, but still could end up being a dependable bottom 6 guy which he ultimately became.

I'm not sure anyone on draft day was saying "Stramel could be a top line forward if he hits his ceiling"

If anyone did, they were drunk.

 

[BagHead]

If anyone did, they were drunk.

"Special thanks to Tootsie's for making me think Stramel is a top line forward if he hits his ceiling!"

 

[Chainshot]

If anyone did, they were drunk.

With how he looked at the draft, that seems like Guerin in a nut shell.

 

[WarriorofTime]

It's a disconnect where kid hockey is so dominated by skill, which often ends up being little dudes. Many of the big dudes have overrated skill and get by overpowering small kids, which they won't be able to do at higher levels. But every NHL team wants to get size, so teams will often gamble and over-reach on size because they view it as an area of need for their prospect pool.

 

[Obvious Fabertism]

It's a disconnect where kid hockey is so dominated by skill, which often ends up being little dudes. Many of the big dudes have overrated skill and get by overpowering small kids, which they won't be able to do at higher levels. But every NHL team wants to get size, so teams will often gamble and over-reach on size because they view it as an area of need for their prospect pool.

This argument would make sense if he was a top 10 pick or something, but he was a late first and literally all of the top centers were off the board when he was taken. There are exactly zero sure thing centers taken after him, then and now.

The Wild were mocked by multiple sources to take Sale at this draft, who was picked before Stramel and is having just as many struggles with production, that dudes topic doesn’t get bumped on game days, let alone days off, with trash talk.

Big guys take longer, this is a well established concept. As you mentioned, being big is less of an advantage the higher up you go, especially when you are playing against guys 3-5 years older as a teenager.

The Wild and Guerin seem to heavily stress the defensive component of the center position, rather than relying on Center for point production, the centers role for the Wild is primarily to drive possession and coverage to below the goal line at both ends. The players in any one draft that are capable of this role at an NHL level are extremely limited, you need to be very well conditioned and willing to battle.

Stramel’s physical attributes make him one of the few players at that pick position with even the potential to play that style they want. It’s not even close to a sure thing he gets there, but he was drafted for role as stated by Brackett at the draft.

Hands and finishing skill are a matter of dedicated practice and experience, getting to the minimal level required to be an NHL player will take time and effort. But you can’t teach his physical potential, and he also has enough hockey IQ that projecting him to improve is fairly reasonable IMO. He makes some genuinely strong reads, inconsistently, but with enough samples to say he does see and understand the game well.

 

[WarriorofTime]

This argument would make sense if he was a top 10 pick or something, but he was a late first and literally all of the top centers were off the board when he was taken. There are exactly zero sure thing centers taken after him, then and now.

The Wild were mocked by multiple sources to take Sale at this draft, who was picked before Stramel and is having just as many struggles with production, that dudes topic doesn’t get bumped on game days, let alone days off, with trash talk.

Big guys take longer, this is a well established concept. As you mentioned, being big is less of an advantage the higher up you go, especially when you are playing against guys 3-5 years older as a teenager.

The Wild and Guerin seem to heavily stress the defensive component of the center position, rather than relying on Center for point production, the centers role for the Wild is primarily to drive possession and coverage to below the goal line at both ends. The players in any one draft that are capable of this role at an NHL level are extremely limited, you need to be very well conditioned and willing to battle.

Stramel’s physical attributes make him one of the few players at that pick position with even the potential to play that style they want. It’s not even close to a sure thing he gets there, but he was drafted for role as stated by Brackett at the draft.

Hands and finishing skill are a matter of dedicated practice and experience, getting to the minimal level required to be an NHL player will take time and effort. But you can’t teach his physical potential, and he also has enough hockey IQ that projecting him to improve is fairly reasonable IMO. He makes some genuinely strong reads, inconsistently, but with enough samples to say he does see and understand the game well.

No need for me to belabor the point of whether he was overdrafted or not, because it is what it is. It does seem like the 4th-6th paragraph do kinda speak to what I was saying though about a guy getting drafted more for need/player type.

 

[Obvious Fabertism]

No need for me to belabor the point of whether he was overdrafted or not, because it is what it is. It does seem like the 4th-6th paragraph do kinda speak to what I was saying though about a guy getting drafted more for need/player type.

The GM and head scout came out and said day one he was drafted for need/player type. So you are right about that and I don’t think anyone is saying any differently. The Wild had a top rated prospect pool that was two deep at every position when he was picked. Gambling on role is what they were left with by that point, all of the guys that they were rumored to be interested in prior to the draft had already been selected.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

I know this website mostly focuses on points, but it’s absolutely true that Stramel is a good defensive center and has done well defensively for an elite defensive team. Also in battles, throwing hits, and some of the non-point categories.

The offensive production has to improve from the last two seasons, but many of the people on a website like this won’t credit a prospect for parts of the game that the actual NHL decision makers often are valuing to a high degree.

 

[Bye Bye Blueston]

This argument would make sense if he was a top 10 pick or something, but he was a late first and literally all of the top centers were off the board when he was taken. There are exactly zero sure thing centers taken after him, then and now.

The Wild were mocked by multiple sources to take Sale at this draft, who was picked before Stramel and is having just as many struggles with production, that dudes topic doesn’t get bumped on game days, let alone days off, with trash talk.

Big guys take longer, this is a well established concept. As you mentioned, being big is less of an advantage the higher up you go, especially when you are playing against guys 3-5 years older as a teenager.

The Wild and Guerin seem to heavily stress the defensive component of the center position, rather than relying on Center for point production, the centers role for the Wild is primarily to drive possession and coverage to below the goal line at both ends. The players in any one draft that are capable of this role at an NHL level are extremely limited, you need to be very well conditioned and willing to battle.

Stramel’s physical attributes make him one of the few players at that pick position with even the potential to play that style they want. It’s not even close to a sure thing he gets there, but he was drafted for role as stated by Brackett at the draft.

Hands and finishing skill are a matter of dedicated practice and experience, getting to the minimal level required to be an NHL player will take time and effort. But you can’t teach his physical potential, and he also has enough hockey IQ that projecting him to improve is fairly reasonable IMO. He makes some genuinely strong reads, inconsistently, but with enough samples to say he does see and understand the game well.

If they wanted center with nhl size, ritchie and edstrom were both still on the board. either would have been far better pick, which i thought was obvious to most folks at the time.