Bandwagon...... Is that the one that has the wheel issues? Don't they keep falling off sometime around the end of the 1st round year after year?Just a reminder that it's not the Toronto Maple Leafs' or their fans' fault that you are not satisfied simply being a fan of your own team. There's room on the bandwagon when you get older and mellow in the barrel enough.
Barkov not better than Matthews or Crosby he is in the 6-10It's
McDavid
Draisaitl
Mackinnon
Barkov
The rest
Barkov not better than Matthews or Crosby he is in the 6-10
Worse performance over the past two years. He has hasnt played well in the playoffs like Crosby and doesnt have as much game breaking ability as MatthewsWhy not?
That’s a valid point under these circumstances but not really what I was questioning. Other people might be. I’m not even pointing at Auston specifically. My point is more that PPG isn’t the only consideration and should take a back seat to actual production. Auston has plenty of both if he can stay healthy, which he has the last two years including this one
Those same player rate Carey Price #1 goalie year after year when he had trouble cracking the top 30 in GAA or SP for a few seasons in a row, they are terrible at this
This is a terrible way to evaluate a players ability.That’s a valid point under these circumstances but not really what I was questioning. Other people might be. I’m not even pointing at Auston specifically. My point is more that PPG isn’t the only consideration and should take a back seat to actual production. Auston has plenty of both if he can stay healthy, which he has the last two years including this one
Barkov gets no respect.
Or make a fool of ourselves trying to diminish the context of that.It is. 318/368 x 331 points is an accurate number to describe his actual production. So he is good for about 75 points each season. Which is impressive considering his rookie year is included. There is just no reason to overstate it.
Worse performance over the past two years. He has hasnt played well in the playoffs like Crosby and doesnt have as much game breaking ability as Matthews
Defensively the gap is smaller than people try and make it to be with Crosby and Matthews both being good defensive players
Replace Barkov with Spezza and this is a good list.Should be:
1. Mcdavid
2. Matthews
3. Mackinnon
4. Crosby
5. Marner
6. Draisatl
7. Tavares
8. Barkov
9 . Point
10. Hyman
PPG is actual production. So is P/60.
I didn't post the RAPM charts to make any bold declarations but just wanted to add more data to the discussion outside point production...obviously no data should be evaluated in isolation.
A few thoughts:
1) See those three bold blue bars on the McDavid 2020-21 chart? The ones that are exploding off the page? That is why he's the world's best...when he has even a mediocre support system around him, he simply cannot be contained.
2) Draisaitl's offensive metrics are of course all-world. I would say defensively, of this elite group - he's the worst...or...to put it another politically correct way - he's put into position in terms of role and usage in a way that has the least positive impact on defensive metrics. Assuredly, some of the orange and red is team and role based but you can see that McDavid, on a better team this year, has taken a big jump in xGA and CA while Big Drai hasn't.
3) MacKinnon is a possession and Corsi monster. He simply tilts the ice like nobody else - and that's why, outside of raw point totals - he's widely viewed as the #2 center in the league. But McDavid's season this year should put to rest any hipster notion that there is a race for #1.
4) Barkov was rightfully criticized for a poor 2019-20 season by his standards but has come roaring back with an epic season - his xGF and CF are outrageous and his defensive metrics are back top being elite and the best of this illustrious group.
At this top end I disagree on P/60.
Every coach is going to play a top 5 center every chance they can unless they:
1) aren’t suited to all situations play, in which case re-evaluate their top 5 status, or
2) don’t have the conditioning, in which case re-evaluate again.
These guys are all played in all situations thus I disregard P/60.... show me absolutes.
the only time you should look at rates among comparing the ELITE is PPGF/60 and PKGA/60 since in both cases a positive outcome influences TOI (eg if you can score in 25 seconds of a PP credit to you... if you can elapse the full shift of your PK credit to you)
After that, TOI is a function of the coaches decision and so the denominator gets larger for all of these guys based on a desire to have them out there as much as possible.
Draisatl, while deserving his recognition as one of the best, has such a huge asterisk next to his name. He has it far easier than any center in the top 10 lost, by far. Over 70% of his total TOI this season, has been with 97, and when it’s not, his metrics take a dip. I’d like to see he would be doing if he was the #1 center on a team that didn’t include the undisputed best player in the world.
PPG is actual production. So is P/60.
Draisatl really shouldn't be included, since 70% of his time is with McDavid.
That means 70% of the time, he's not playing C.