Value of: Erik Karlsson to last minute contender?

[Gecklund]

Then you have your answer. You’re stuck with that contract.

Deal. Like has been said multiple times in this thread. Our team with EK playing out of his mind, Reimer playing out of his mind, Hertl/Timo playing well is still at the 5th overall pick playing more games than anyone else. Reimer will likely be traded. Timo has a possibility to be traded. Karlsson will come back down to earth a bit (he’s on pace for over 100 points that’s not likely). We don’t need to move one of like three reasons to watch the Sharks right now for shit. We are shit with him.

 

[Martin Skoula]

Retaining on Karlsson would give SJ 1 more retention spot until 2025-2026 season. That's a tough ask for a team looking to rebuild and cash in on assets, move out pieces, and partake in trades that benefits them. Couture would be the 3rd retention, I suppose. They're left with nothing after that.

This team will have some deadline cap. I think it would make more sense right now to use that and gain free assets by being a 3rd involved trade partner, retaining on 2 expiring players. You can move Karlsson in the offseason when teams can manage the cap better without SJ retaining as much.

The Karlsson retention would bring in the most assets of anyone they could retain unless they move Hertl for some reason.

 

[tapi]

Ship him off for a return bad contract (to make space for Karlsen in a contender) + great picks for rebuild. Should be good for SJS future, the bad contract will dissipate by the time those picks actualize.

 

[TheBeard]

The Karlsson retention would bring in the most assets of anyone they could retain unless they move Hertl for some reason.

Trading Hertl would be the absolute worst thing they could do from a morale standpoint and sends a pretty Vegas-like message to any would-be free agents.

 

[Bourne Endeavor]

4 more seasons after this. For me, that contract is untradeable even at 50% and even if Karlsson cracks 80 points.

That's just silly. Karlsson at 5.8M is a ridiculously fantastic salary even if this season is a one off. If he's cracking 80 points? That's more than some teams get from half their defense combined.

 

[QJL]

That's just silly. Karlsson at 5.8M is a ridiculously fantastic salary even if this season is a one off. If he's cracking 80 points? That's more than some teams get from half their defense combined.

First of all, every NHL team’s defensemen combine for 80+ points. That’s not true.

Karlsson hasn’t performed at this level for 6 seasons. If you’re expecting anything close to this player from age 33-37, I don’t know what to tell you. He also remains a defensive liability. He’s not worth 5.8m/year for 4 more years.

 

[Bourne Endeavor]

First of all, every NHL team’s defensemen combine for 80+ points. That’s not true.

Karlsson hasn’t performed at this level for 6 seasons. If you’re expecting anything close to this player from age 33-37, I don’t know what to tell you. He also remains a defensive liability. He’s not worth 5.8m/year for 4 more years.

Please re-read what I actually wrote.

"That's more than some teams get from half their defense combined."

For reference sake, Colorado got roughly 106 points from half of their top six defensemen. Three of Toronto's defensemen only reached 74 points combined. You are severely underrating how much 80 points is coming from a defensemen. 80 points would have put Karlsson at fourth place in the entire league last season,

Once again, read what I actually said. "even if this season is a one off. "

Karlsson has roughly averaged 50+ point pace every season except 2020-21. Even being lax defensive, that's easily still worth 5.8M. Especially when the cap will be going up.

Now it doesn't mean he'll go an garner a massive haul. But you're suggesting he's completely untradeable. Which is just silly. Far worse players have been moved producing far less than Karlsson has.

 

[QJL]

Please re-read what I actually wrote.

"That's more than some teams get from half their defense combined."

For reference sake, Colorado got roughly 106 points from half of their top six defensemen. Three of Toronto's defensemen only reached 74 points combined. You are severely underrating how much 80 points is coming from a defensemen. 80 points would have put Karlsson at fourth place in the entire league last season,

Once again, read what I actually said. "even if this season is a one off. "

Karlsson has roughly averaged 50+ point pace every season except 2020-21. Even being lax defensive, that's easily still worth 5.8M. Especially when the cap will be going up.

Now it doesn't mean he'll go an garner a massive haul. But you're suggesting he's completely untradeable. Which is just silly. Far worse players have been moved producing far less than Karlsson has.

There is no NHL team whose top 3 defenseman last season didn’t pace 80 combined points over the full season. A couple just missed the 80 mark total due to injuries to their top 3 producers.

Almost every NHL team has 3 randomly selected defenseman who don’t produce 80 points a season. Obviously.

No, a 50+ point pace from a defenseman is not always worth 5.8m+ a year. Examples: Tony DeAngelo, Shayne Gostisbehere, and age 33-37 likely defensive liability Erik Karlsson.

 

[BuffaloSabresSword]

You shouldn't want Karlsson anyway. You have Dahlin, and Karlsson needs to be "the guy" on defense.

The only team profiles that should be interested in Karlsson today are those that want to be competitive and don't have a #1 offensive dman / have a young top D prospect that needs a few years of sheltering. There really aren't that many that fit the profile now.

Dont really want him But Skinner has about the same length and contract and he is not good

 

[Gecklund]

Dont really want him But Skinner has about the same length and contract and he is not good

So you want us to take someone that isn’t good for someone who has been one of the best if not the best defensemen in the league this year while only adding “a couple 2nds?” Never change HF.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

The Karlsson retention would bring in the most assets of anyone they could retain unless they move Hertl for some reason.

I don't think I agree with that. A Karlsson trade from San Jose will probably require retention but the return is going to suck. Teams trading players with full NMC's don't tend to get great pieces back at all. Both Karlsson and Hertl would be in that spot until July 2025 when Hertl's NMC becomes a three team trade list. Now, if they trade Meier with retention this year or next year if they agree to a one year deal that puts him straight to UFA, that's where they'd get the most quality assets as he doesn't have such restrictions nor term obviously.

 

[BuffaloSabresSword]

So you want us to take someone that isn’t good for someone who has been one of the best if not the best defensemen in the league this year while only adding “a couple 2nds?” Never change HF.

Karlsson was bad til this season ?

 

[Gecklund]

Karlsson was bad til this season ?

No he wasn’t. Only dumbasses said he was bad.

 

[Chose]

Montreal needs a 1RD, a PP general. I know people will tell me we are in a rebuild, but Karlsson is still "young".
And the 23yo- players are proving the Habs are closer to competing than people think.

Karlsson vs 1st 2024 (top 3 protected), Justin Barron and Gallagher.

Then we dump Hoffman somewhere for (or with) a 4th (with retention) to fit the cap (And for other reasons), and we put Drouin on LTIR, since he is apparently injured again.

Karlsson would be awesome with the offensive minded/fast skating/fast playing Habs.
I think he might wave for that reason and to play under St-Louis, there is obviously a fit under his "system".

Gallagher's 6.5M$ salary is key to absorb Karlsson's cap without rentention, he can still play and be exciting to watch. A leader. I am guessing he is Grier's type of player
Barron is 21, rh pmd, tall(6'2), almost NHL ready and was a first round pick(25th 2020), can probably already log some of Karlsson's minutes and develop. 7 points in 14 AHL games this season. Played 7 NHL games last year.
2024's 1st is something SJ would be looking for (future). Top 3 protected for some obvious reasons (!).

No retention for SJ !

Montreal has been stockpiling future for awhile now, they can afford to let go the 2024 1st, and Barron...
And they have the cap space in the years to come if they dump Gallagher in the deal (lots of expiring contracts)

Open to add a B prospect in negociations (Mysak, Ylonen, Strubble, Norlinder), we have plenty of those. Open to add a better prospect instead for some retention (Roy, Kidney ? But SJ rightfully refuses to retain for 5 years)

HuGo have been thinking out of the box. I would love to see this happen !

Caufield, Suzuki, Dach
Slafkovsky, Monahan, Anderson
Dadonov Dvorak Armia
Pitlick/Pezzetta Evans Harvey-Pinard

Ghule Karlsson
Harris/Xhekaj Savard
Edmundson Kovacevic

 

[Filthy Dangles]

Doubt it. Would be too difficult to move. Sharks aren't retaining much money for half a decade.

Karlsson might be putting up points but he's far from the player he was in his heyday and he's still very prone to attrocious defensive breakdowns.

Teams aren't moving heaven and earth to fit him in, he's not putting anyone over the hump at this point

 

[Gubbhornet]

Grier utesluter inte att byta bort Erik Karlsson | NHL.com/sv

San Jose Sharks general manager: "Något som kan dyka upp längs vägen"

www.nhl.com

This is maybe a no-brainer but Grier confirms that they will listen to offers. Sorry it is in Swedish, but use google translate if you don't believe me. A Tavares deal would be best for all parties according to me, but yeah, a few too many NMCs for that to happen...

 

[Banded Peak]

If your offer doesn’t include multiple high end futures and no retention

 

[Maple Leaf]

Retention =

 

[Peter Tosh]

Maybe a team will have to act as a buffer, taking on the retention before trading him to the real buyer. The asking price for taking in that much cap and term will be steep, though.

 

[Stewie Griffin]

Grier says they will listen to offers. They're not going out of their way to trade him. If the deal sucks for San Jose, they will keep him, easy as that. He's become a leader on the team, a very marketable player for the front office, and having a great year.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

Maybe a team will have to act as a buffer, taking on the retention before trading him to the real buyer. The asking price for taking in that much cap and term will be steep, though.

I don't see this as very likely for two reasons. One, the Sharks likely won't have a problem retaining on Karlsson. Two, that sort of buffer thing tends to only get others involved when it's a rental. Paying a team to retain millions over four seasons is asking a lot and probably not very cost-effective for them. I think if a team can't make Karlsson at 8.5-9 mil work, they just won't make a deal.

 

[themelkman]

They arent going to retain a bunch for nothing. The most obvious thing is to just keep him, so it will probably take a very risky move by another team to make this work for the sharks.

 

[Captain Mountain]

Montreal needs a 1RD, a PP general. I know people will tell me we are in a rebuild, but Karlsson is still "young".
And the 23yo- players are proving the Habs are closer to competing than people think.

Karlsson vs 1st 2024 (top 3 protected), Justin Barron and Gallagher.

Then we dump Hoffman somewhere for (or with) a 4th (with retention) to fit the cap (And for other reasons), and we put Drouin on LTIR, since he is apparently injured again.

Karlsson would be awesome with the offensive minded/fast skating/fast playing Habs.
I think he might wave for that reason and to play under St-Louis, there is obviously a fit under his "system".

Gallagher's 6.5M$ salary is key to absorb Karlsson's cap without rentention, he can still play and be exciting to watch. A leader. I am guessing he is Grier's type of player
Barron is 21, rh pmd, tall(6'2), almost NHL ready and was a first round pick(25th 2020), can probably already log some of Karlsson's minutes and develop. 7 points in 14 AHL games this season. Played 7 NHL games last year.
2024's 1st is something SJ would be looking for (future). Top 3 protected for some obvious reasons (!).

No retention for SJ !

Montreal has been stockpiling future for awhile now, they can afford to let go the 2024 1st, and Barron...
And they have the cap space in the years to come if they dump Gallagher in the deal (lots of expiring contracts)

Open to add a B prospect in negociations (Mysak, Ylonen, Strubble, Norlinder), we have plenty of those. Open to add a better prospect instead for some retention (Roy, Kidney ? But SJ rightfully refuses to retain for 5 years)

HuGo have been thinking out of the box. I would love to see this happen !

Caufield, Suzuki, Dach
Slafkovsky, Monahan, Anderson
Dadonov Dvorak Armia
Pitlick/Pezzetta Evans Harvey-Pinard

Ghule Karlsson
Harris/Xhekaj Savard
Edmundson Kovacevic

Montreal is early/mid rebuild, they are not going to pay that much for Karlsson. Karlsson has value because he's playing at an elite level now, but we already know that he hasn't been consistently elite for a while. Teams that pay may more for him are teams that want what he's doing now more than what he may do in 3-4 years.

There is a certain amount of sense to them looking to acquire him with Gallagher going the other way (see Mike Johnson's musing below), but a 1st is not something that makes any sense for them at all. Especially since Karlsson has the leverage to choose where he wants to go.



I doubt either team ends up doing that though. And I doubt Karlsson is interested in a reunion with Hoffman.

 

[TheBeard]

And I doubt Karlsson is interested in a reunion with Hoffman.

No, but I'm sure his petty side would love being the reason Hoffman gets dumped elsewhere.

 

[Captain Mountain]

No, but I'm sure his petty side would love being the reason Hoffman gets dumped elsewhere.

Montreal doesn't need to find a reason to move Hoffman, he'll be moved if/as soon as Montreal can find the right deal.