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GWT: EPL - Matchweek 31

bluesfan94

bluesfan94

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Jan 7, 2008
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Matchweek 31! We get a sneaky relegation six pointer, as a Wolves lost at Ipswich would suddenly thrust them back into the relegation conversation. We also get a fun derby between Palace and Brighton and a less fun derby when United host City. On the European front, the big game is Villa-Forest.

HomeAwayTime and Date (CT)Venue
EvertonArsenalSat., Apr. 5, 6:30 AMGoodison Park
Ipswich TownWolverhampton WanderersSat., Apr. 5, 9:00 AMPortman Road
Crystal PalaceBrighton & Hove AlbionSat., Apr. 5, 9:00 AMSelhurst Park
West Ham UnitedBournemouthSat., Apr. 5, 9:00 AMLondon Stadium
Aston VillaNottingham ForestSat., Apr. 5, 11:30 AMVilla Park
Tottenham HotspurSouthamptonSun., Apr. 6, 8:00 AMTottenham Hotspur Stadium
BrentfordChelseaSun., Apr. 6, 8:00 AMGtech Community Stadium
FulhamLiverpoolSun., Apr. 6, 8:00 AMCraven Cottage
Manchester UnitedManchester CitySun., Apr. 6, 10:30 AMOld Trafford
Leicester CityNewcastle UnitedMon., Apr. 7, 2:00 PMKing Power Stadium
 
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A pox on whichever journalist it was the wrote about Forest being the least injured team and cursed Wood and Aina. Either getting an interesting formation or Toff at LB against Villa and I’m not looking forward to it
 
I thought long and hard the other day about including Lewis-Skelly in my top 39 under-21s, but I decided against it finally because of his recklessness, and it ends up hurting Arsenal again today. That being said that's not a penalty in my book, but VAR couldn't really overturn it as there was some contact.
 
I guess on the bright side, it's good that the league is already gone so I don't actually have to get too upset about it. But like, the direction of the flop doesn't even make sense
 
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luiginb said:
I thought long and hard the other day about including Lewis-Skelly in my top 39 under-21s, but I decided against it finally because of his recklessness, and it ends up hurting Arsenal again today. That being said that's not a penalty in my book, but VAR couldn't really overturn it as there was some contact.
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I mean, VAR only recommends they take a better look at it, technically speaking they don't overturn anything. I'd honestly like to see more refs stand their ground after going to the monitor
 
luiginb said:
I thought long and hard the other day about including Lewis-Skelly in my top 39 under-21s, but I decided against it finally because of his recklessness, and it ends up hurting Arsenal again today. That being said that's not a penalty in my book, but VAR couldn't really overturn it as there was some contact.
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What recklessness? His first red card was never a red card, his second red card came because he was fouled, and this penalty was never a penalty given that it happened outside of the box, Harrison did all the pulling and no contact made Harrison go to ground.

He’s had three bad moments and all were instances of horrific refereeing. His recklessness is a construct because people have shockingly decided they don’t like a young black player with a personality.

But he can make runs like that.
 
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luiginb said:
I thought long and hard the other day about including Lewis-Skelly in my top 39 under-21s, but I decided against it finally because of his recklessness, and it ends up hurting Arsenal again today. That being said that's not a penalty in my book, but VAR couldn't really overturn it as there was some contact.
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I mean his recklessness comes down to what?
- A red card against Wolves that was a joke call and was overturned upon appeal
- A red card against West Ham that was more justifiable, but he was also fouled by Kudus before committing the last man tackle
- Conceding a penalty against Everton that was a terrible call

Other than those, he could have potentially seen 2 yellows in the CL R16 against PSV, but that would have been harsh imo.

He'll gain some more composure with age, but I don't find him reckless right now - he's just been on the wrong end of some poor calls.
 
maclean said:
I mean, VAR only recommends they take a better look at it, technically speaking they don't overturn anything. I'd honestly like to see more refs stand their ground after going to the monitor
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VAR only sends a ref to the monitor when they believe the referee has made a clear and obvious error. They’re not saying to him “hey maybe you want to take a second look at this to make sure” they’re saying “it’s clear and obvious you made the wrong decision here and this is the evidence why we are saying that”
 
KJS14 said:
I mean his recklessness comes down to what?
- A red card against Wolves that was a joke call and was overturned upon appeal
- A red card against West Ham that was more justifiable, but he was also fouled by Kudus before committing the last man tackle
- Conceding a penalty against Everton that was a terrible call

Other than those, he could have potentially seen 2 yellows in the CL R16 against PSV, but that would have been harsh imo.

He'll gain some more composure with age, but I don't find him reckless right now - he's just been on the wrong end of some poor calls.
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You almost wonder whether he just got on the refs' bad side before ever seeing the field. Getting the treatment for being branded a trouble-maker is the most British shit ever
 
hatterson said:
VAR only sends a ref to the monitor when they believe the referee has made a clear and obvious error. They’re not saying to him “hey maybe you want to take a second look at this to make sure” they’re saying “it’s clear and obvious you made the wrong decision here and this is the evidence why we are saying that”
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Enh, OK, in my defence it's become so muddled what VAR actually does because it's practically never what they claimed it was supposed to do
 
hatterson said:
VAR only sends a ref to the monitor when they believe the referee has made a clear and obvious error. They’re not saying to him “hey maybe you want to take a second look at this to make sure” they’re saying “it’s clear and obvious you made the wrong decision here and this is the evidence why we are saying that”
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Which as many of us have said, is a dumb standard. VAR's standard is basically just "well if I can see contact between players then I can understand why he called it a penalty live, check complete" instead of actually getting the call right.
 
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KJS14 said:
Which as many of us have said, is a dumb standard. VAR's standard is basically just "well if I can see contact between players then I can understand why he called it a penalty live, check complete" instead of actually getting the call right.
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Yea they haven’t really held consistent and I don’t think it’s a good standard in the first place.

Although theoretically overturns at the monitor should be insanely rare.
 
maclean said:
You almost wonder whether he just got on the refs' bad side before ever seeing the field. Getting the treatment for being branded a trouble-maker is the most British shit ever
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I don't know if that had anything to do with it (maybe), but I'd place more blame on the media vilifying an 18 year old for "disrespectfully celebrating" an impressive goal against the defending champions, ignoring the fact that their best player said "who the f*ck are you?" to him in the previous game.
 
KJS14 said:
I don't know if that had anything to do with it (maybe), but I'd place more blame on the media vilifying an 18 year old for "disrespectfully celebrating" an impressive goal against the defending champions, ignoring the fact that their best player said "who the f*ck are you?" to him in the previous game.
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Equally British shit
 
hatterson said:
Yea they haven’t really held consistent and I don’t think it’s a good standard in the first place.

Although theoretically overturns at the monitor should be insanely rare.
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I get them not wanting to re-referee the game with slo-mo replays, but I just think the standard to send them to the monitor should be somewhat lower than what it currently is where they do their best to find reasons for not overturning calls.

The best analogy I can think of right now is the US criminal vs civil court standards. We currently have "beyond reasonable doubt" when it should be "more likely than not" that VAR thinks the referee made the wrong call.
 
KJS14 said:
I get them not wanting to re-referee the game with slo-mo replays, but I just think the standard to send them to the monitor should be somewhat lower than what it currently is where they do their best to find reasons for not overturning calls.

The best analogy I can think of right now is the US criminal vs civil court standards. We currently have "beyond reasonable doubt" when it should be "more likely than not" that VAR thinks the referee made the wrong call.
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I think more likely than not (50%) might be a little too loose a standard but something like 75-80% that it was a mistake would be good instead of the current 99% or whatever.

Although I’d want them to also limit the length VAR can take to decide to send the ref to the monitor and the amount of time the ref can take at the monitor.

If you have to start going to slo-mo zoom ins from multiple angles, the original call should stand.
 
hatterson said:
I think more likely than not (50%) might be a little too loose a standard but something like 75-80% that it was a mistake would be good instead of the current 99% or whatever.

Although I’d want them to also limit the length VAR can take to decide to send the ref to the monitor and the amount of time the ref can take at the monitor.

If you have to start going to slo-mo zoom ins from multiple angles, the original call should stand.
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Sure, that >50% may be a bit low, but I think we're on the same page. Something like if both the VAR and assistant VAR agree that they independently wouldn't have made the same call, then send him to the monitor to look at it. Whatever gets us away from "oh I see contact, check complete."
 
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