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GWT: EPL - Matchweek 20

hatterson

hatterson

Registered User
Apr 12, 2010
37,245
14,555
North Tonawanda, NY
Since World War 2 United were clearly better than Liverpool and Arsenal in the 40s and 50s. It's a bit of a push with Liverpool in the 60s although Liverpool spent the first 2 years outside the top flight, with Arsenal a bit behind in average finish and points. The 70s and 80s obviously belonged to Liverpool. In the 70s neither Arsenal nor United were very good although United were worse, getting relegated for a year. In the 80s Arsenal and United were pretty level on avg points and league finish. The 90s and 00s obviously belonged to United with Arsenal being better than Liverpool on average those decades. The 2010s edge to United on average points and finish as well as quality of trophies (I'll take 2 PLs, a league cup, and a Europa league trophy over 3 FA cups any day) with Liverpool getting close with the crazy 97 and 99 points years at the end of it.

So yea, the idea that somehow United is some historic middling club that is reverting to form but Liverpool and Arsenal are two top clubs just doing their usual thing is laughable at best.
 
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al secord

al secord

Mustard Tiger
Jun 26, 2013
13,159
15,299
Toronto
S E P H said:
That's so funny you wrote that because I found a YouTube channel that shows every single CL winner, FA winner, and EPL winner ever in the history of FA football and Man United only had the SAF era where they won most if not all their major trophies. Arsenal gets made fun of a lot, but we had some legendary teams in the 1930s, some in the 1950s, 80s, 90s, and 2000s. You are 100% right to say that Man United was a nothing club for most of their history.
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It warms my heart that you quoted Savant with this ignorant post.
 
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Savant

Savant

Registered User
Oct 3, 2013
38,750
11,699
al secord said:
It warms my heart that you quoted Savant with this ignorant post.
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I also never said LFC and Arsenal were top bastions clubs for the entirety of their history. Just that the Ferguson era was a favorable outlier for United. It was their best sustained period. Without Ferguson, their highs and lows are pretty similar to the other upper echelon teams
 
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S E P H

S E P H

Cloud IX
Mar 5, 2010
32,802
18,263
Toruń, PL
hatterson said:
So yea, the idea that somehow United is some historic middling club that is reverting to form but Liverpool and Arsenal are two top clubs just doing their usual thing is laughable at best.
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I'm not calling United a bad club by any means, but they are in the same category as Chelsea before they got their blood money and American bloody money after that. That is...a top 4 challenger who went on a title/FA cup run one year in about a decade. Hell, even Man City was able to win an FA Cup in 1903, a title in 1967, and they were known as a second-rate club for almost their entire existence before 2008.

The matter of story is that Preston North End and Everton are historically bigger clubs than Railroading United. Arsenal and Liverpool are the next tier above if you talk about long-term success since the 1880s.
 
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S E P H

S E P H

Cloud IX
Mar 5, 2010
32,802
18,263
Toruń, PL
Jussi said:
They won one title in 1989 and one title in the 50's...
Edit: beaten by Blender to it.
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I am not talking about just titles. I am talking about every single available cup.


@Savant I also never said LFC and Arsenal were top bastions clubs for the entirety of their history. Just that the Ferguson era was a favorable outlier for United. It was their best sustained period. Without Ferguson, their highs and lows are pretty similar to the other upper echelon teams
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United is a lot worse, like a LOT worse if you take away the SAF era, which at this point looks like an ultra mega fluke.
 
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1865

1865

Alpha Couturier
Feb 28, 2005
16,959
5,769
Chester, UK
Jussi said:
There's been injury breaks, 3 goals, VAR checks, Gibbs-White booking and that one booking incident that WAR was used for.
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There were no lengthy injuries of note, no lengthy var checks on anything, the booking took no time at all and there was nowhere near enough subs made. There was absolutely no reason for ten minutes (played nearly eleven too!) except for that United were losing. Fortunately, they were too crap to capitalise on it.
 
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Savant

Savant

Registered User
Oct 3, 2013
38,750
11,699
1865 said:
There were no lengthy injuries of note, no lengthy var checks on anything, the booking took no time at all and there was nowhere near enough subs made. There was absolutely no reason for ten minutes (played nearly eleven too!) except for that United were losing. Fortunately, they were too crap to capitalise on it.
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Careful, you can get tarred and feathered for not agreeing with time keeping of and during stoppage time
 
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Blender

Blender

Registered User
Dec 2, 2009
53,151
47,076
S E P H said:
I'm not calling United a bad club by any means, but they are in the same category as Chelsea before they got their blood money and American bloody money after that. That is...a top 4 challenger who went on a title/FA cup run one year in about a decade. Hell, even Man City was able to win an FA Cup in 1903, a title in 1967, and they were known as a second-rate club for almost their entire existence before 2008.

The matter of story is that Preston North End and Everton are historically bigger clubs than Railroading United. Arsenal and Liverpool are the next tier above if you talk about long-term success since the 1880s.
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Blender said:
@S E P H in the 1950s Manchester United won 3 titles with an average position of 4th over the decade. Arsenal won 1 title with an average position of 6th. You're going to have to explain to me how you determined Manchester United was a nothing club here and Arsenal a top club.
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How convenient of you to just ignore factual information that doesn't align with your narrative. Are you going to answer how you came to these conclusions or not?
 
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maclean

maclean

Registered User
Jan 4, 2014
9,100
3,000
I would just like to go on record as not agreeing with Seph's narrative. United is definitely the bigger team. In *my* view, we are actually underdogs :cool:
 
spintheblackcircle

spintheblackcircle

incoming!!!
Mar 1, 2002
67,673
13,495

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Paulie Gualtieri

Paulie Gualtieri

R.I.P. Tony Sirico
May 18, 2016
12,904
3,383
Feel bad for Sarr getting injured right before AFCON.

Hope Spurs can see this through. Bournemouth sure are playing physically.
 
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