Post-Game Talk: - End of the Shanascam? | Leafs Blown Out at Home Again | Page 34 | HFBoards - NHL Message Board and Forum for National Hockey League

Post-Game Talk: End of the Shanascam? | Leafs Blown Out at Home Again

Well, if there’s one good thing I can say about the Leafs organization, it’s that following this team has brought me together with all of you for the past 20 years or so. I think I’m on my third username by now. I’ve left this board a few times after painful exits like the one we just witnessed, only to return years later with a new handle after forgetting my login.


My favorite stretch here was probably during the Tank Nation days, then winning the draft lottery, back when it felt like a Cup was finally within reach. And yet, here we are.


Anyway, I just wanted to say thanks. This place has genuinely been cathartic over the years. The posts after each Game 7 meltdown helped me cope with the unique horror of cheering for this cursed, dysfunctional franchise.


It’s been a blast hanging out in the GDTs with the regulars (you know who you are). I’ll definitely miss you all, but I’ve hit my limit. I can’t give this team any more of my time or money. I’m officially in “believe it when I see it” mode. If we ever make it to a Cup Final, maybe I’ll pop back in. If not, well, it’s been a slice.


Take care, my friends.
Don’t forget, you can always use the forum as a fun place to talk other things too; like what good food you’re having on the weekend with that bottle of wine i might like when ya mention it

Just an idea. God speed
 
Matthews: "Too many passengers"
Marner: "Cant have passengers in a game 7"

What kind of leadership is that given what those two produced this game, series, this playoff?
But to be fair the worst of them all have been Rielly this series.
 
Had two primary assists in the final game and both were 5 on 5.
He was also benched that same tournament by a coach that loves him. His NHL stats speak for themselves when the series start to get tough and it's not like it's a small sample size either. He's not a bad player but teams/coaches clearly know what to do to shut him down because they always do.
 
Blame can go on dubas for giving mitch a no move clause which kept us from maybe trying to get rantanen instead of 2 useless stiffs in Carlo and Laughton and who hired that genius Brendan Shanahan maybe the leafs should see if Clark gilmour or sundin want to president they can't do any worst than what Shannny did
 
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That's what the politically correct soy-infused MLSE culture does to you. lol
didn't wanna say it but yup. They're more concerned about making Nylander change his twitter handle from Snizzbone and desserting Lupul on an island because he's not a married man or telling the players they can't have beards. When you don't give the players an opportunity to build an identity that they can play inspired behind instead of corporate or bullshit, they won't.
Look, I know this is hearsay/rumors and it very well may get deleted. I wasn't even going to share it (I've been sitting on this for over 48 hours) but since the passengers comment I feel it merits being aired in here. My cousin has an uncle, unrelated to me, who went to game 6 in Florida, and ended up in the same hotel as them. Spent a lot of time bumping shoulders with them. Here's what he said...
This does not at all surprise me as disappointing as it is to hear. Matthews always gave me "big spoiled bitch" vibes. He's always complaining, taking subtle shots, never much accountability, and overall just comes across as an ungrateful person. His post game 6 interview against Ottawa where the first thing that he blurted was whining about the outside noise after beating an average team really said a lot to me about his true character. Compare this with Adam Lowry of the Jets.

His bitching about the fans noise at the arena also speaks to his sense of entitlement. Other players would say they need a reason to cheer and we need to earn it.

Mildly hot take but I've seen this all my life. Matthews parents come across to me as genuinely good people who love their son but also as people who never said NO once to their son. When you do that you often create the worst humans in society who are extremely selfish and annoying to be around. I'm not saying Matthews is anywhere close to the worst humans in society. Overall he's a pretty decent human being who does a lot to help sick kids and so forth. But at the same time it's pretty obvious to see the negative effects from that kind of parenting in him.
 
didn't wanna say it but yup. They're more concerned about making Nylander change his twitter handle from Snizzbone and desserting Lupul on an island because he's not a married man or telling the players they can't have beards. When you don't give the players an opportunity to build an identity that they can play inspired behind instead of corporate or bullshit, they won't.

This does not at all surprise me as disappointing as it is to hear. Matthews always gave me "big spoiled bitch" vibes. He's always complaining, taking subtle shots, never much accountability, and overall just comes across as an ungrateful person. His post game 6 interview against Ottawa where the first thing that he blurted was whining about the outside noise after beating an average team really said a lot to me about his true character. Compare this with Adam Lowry of the Jets.

His bitching about the fans noise at the arena also speaks to his sense of entitlement. Other players would say they need a reason to cheer and we need to earn it.

Mildly hot take but I've seen this all my life. Matthews parents come across to me as genuinely good people who love their son but also as people who never said NO once to their son. When you do that you often create the worst humans in society who are extremely selfish and annoying to be around. I'm not saying Matthews is anywhere close to the worst humans in society. Overall he's a pretty decent human being who does a lot to help sick kids and so forth. But at the same time it's pretty obvious to see the negative effects from that kind of parenting in him.
This could all be true about Matthews' parents, but it also probably applies to 95% of North American NHLers. I went to high school with a bunch of OHL players, several of whom played 1000+ games in the NHL. Most of them come from decent families and don't play the sport as the only viable path out of their family's socioeconomic conditions (e.g. boxing, basketball, baseball, etc.).

The sheer cost of hockey equipment, ice rink, facilities, etc. sets a pretty strong barrier to cater the game towards certain socioeconomic and demographic groups.

I'd say it's even simpler in that it just comes down to personalities. To paraphrase Teddy Atlas from boxing, "These guys didn't figure out how to win. They didn't have the resolve to really dig deep into dark, murky waters within themselves and find an extra gear. They couldn't find a way to exorcise their individual and collective demons." It's ok, sometimes your learned life experiences help you with that, sometimes they don't because it's simply your disposition and inner character. The problem is that the core players, just don't have it. Treliving even tried to literally import winners in OEL, Stolarz, Lorentz, and hoped it'd rub off. Or sign sandpaper guys in Tanev and McCabe to cover up these holes, but it didn't work.*

It's just the way it is, and I think the team needs to move on from as many of these players as quickly as possible. I wouldn't be surprised if Marner, Tavares, and Rielly (and Matthews, Nylander) find future success in organisations in which these cultures are more well-established, but they must go.

Lastly, if you look at Toronto teams over the past 30 years, here's a quick dichotomy of guys who "have it" versus those who don't. It doesn't even mean that they've won the championship or are alpha dogs versus just having that personal drive and extreme determination to win. It's not something that you can measure beyond an "eye test" and gut instinct.

Has It
  • MLB: Roy Halladay; Jose Bautista; Roberto Alomar; Chris Carpenter
  • NHL: Doug Gilmour; Ed Belfour; Gary Roberts;
  • NBA: Kawhi Leonard; Pascal Siakam
Doesn't Have It
  • MLB: Vlad Guerrero Jr (jury still out, but trending quickly in one direction);
  • NHL: Core Four; Phil Kessel; Jack Campbell;
  • NBA: Vince Carter; Andrea Bargnani

p.s. Nate MacKinnon "has it". As does Gabriel Landeskog. As does Mikko Rantanen lol...on-ice talent aside, had that Marner for Rantanen trade actually gone through, it's not a falsifiable claim, but I'm 99% sure the Leafs would be playing Carolina right now. You don't need a team full of it factor guys - but you do need at least one, and it must be a key player.
 
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would have never thought matthews would be a worst captain than tavares but here we are, this guy just sat quietly on the bench all game, then comes out with the passengers quote. Please kick the whole core out and shanny, need a reset from these losers
 
I'm being dead serious, if Marner is re-signed I am completely done with this team. We need some massive changes. Start with letting #16 walk and get rid of Rielly.
If they keep everything together and bring Shanahan back I'm putting this forum on ignore and not watching again until the core is gone. Each and every one of them.

In reality, I don't think they will do that. I don't think Shanahan will be renewed and Marner is gone. Tavares they might re-sign, who cares, they aren't winning anyways.

If there's even a slight chance that Moustache Boy will waive his NMC you shop the shit out of him. The way he insults the fans after the money he gets paid and the pathetic efforts he gives when it matters is criminal. I'm done with him mentally and definitely don't re-sign him in the future.
 
I'm being dead serious, if Marner is re-signed I am completely done with this team. We need some massive changes. Start with letting #16 walk and get rid of Rielly.
I'd rather watch them blow it up for picks and prospects and wait 5 years to watch the team struggle with the right players with the right mindset than roll the dice again next season. At least with the former, it'll be fun to watch their development and be easy to cheer them on.

Scenario A
- run with back with this core; minus Marner, bring everyone else back and use the money on 1-2 year deals for Marchand, Duchene, etc.

Scenario B
- have a serious conversation about NMC/NTCs being waived and granted
- rebuild from scratch around Cowan, Knies, etc. and watch this team struggle for 4-5 years but play with the right mindset and right approach to the game.

Had Leafs had gone down swinging and lost 2-1 in OT last night, I would have said A. After watching the 2nd period and Game 5, I want B 10 times out of 10. The scary thing is that if you don't make wholesale changes, you risk spreading it to the next generation of players...put Knies around this culture for 3 more seasons, and his inner dog will eventually retrograde into a puppy.
 
I'd rather watch them blow it up for picks and prospects and wait 5 years to watch the team struggle with the right players with the right mindset than roll the dice again next season. At least with the former, it'll be fun to watch their development and be easy to cheer them on.

Scenario A

- run with back with this core; minus Marner, bring everyone else back and use the money on 1-2 year deals for Marchand, Duchene, etc.

Scenario B
- have a serious conversation about NMC/NTCs being waived and granted
- rebuild from scratch around Cowan, Knies, etc. and watch this team struggle for 4-5 years but play with the right mindset and right approach to the game.

Had Leafs had gone down swinging and lost 2-1 in OT last night, I would have said A. After watching the 2nd period and Game 5, I want B 10 times out of 10. The scary thing is that if you don't make wholesale changes, you risk spreading it to the next generation of players...put Knies around this culture for 3 more seasons, and his inner dog will eventually retrograde into a puppy.
I 100% agree with you but they literally can't do that because we don't have our 1sts.

The best we can do is to move off Shanahan, Marner and Tavares and retool until we get our 1sts back, don't re-sign that pond scum wearing 34 and burn the rest of it down at that time.

The core era is done. It failed. It failed spectacularly. If they don't make severe changes none of us should waste our time on such an unserious organization anymore.
 
I 100% agree with you but they literally can't do that because we don't have our 1sts.

The best we can do is to move off Shanahan, Marner and Tavares and retool until we get our 1sts back, don't re-sign that pond scum wearing 34 and burn the rest of it down at that time.

The core era is done. It failed.
Yup [agree on the bolded as most likely outcome]. Treadmill team for the next 3-4 seasons until the 1sts come back. Which is why I think 1-2 year deals for vets and keep rolling the dice, hoping to get lucky. But 2nd round fodder at best under the current trajectory. Only McJesus can save this franchise lol. The Oilers winning the Cup this season may help with that.

Option B only works if Matthews and Nylander agree to waive NMC and you blow it up entirely and get some proper assets back. If that happens, I'd rather get moar picks in the future (e.g. 2028 beyond) than a single 1st rounder in 2026, 2027, etc.
 
Yup [agree on the bolded as most likely outcome]. Treadmill team for the next 3-4 seasons until the 1sts come back. Which is why I think 1-2 year deals for vets and keep rolling the dice, hoping to get lucky. But 2nd round fodder at best under the current trajectory. Only McJesus can save this franchise lol. The Oilers winning the Cup this season may help with that.

Option B only works if Matthews and Nylander agree to waive NMC and you blow it up entirely and get some proper assets back. If that happens, I'd rather get moar picks in the future (e.g. 2028 beyond) than a single 1st rounder in 2026, 2027, etc.
Why would McDavid want to come play with these losers? I know he grew up cheering for this team but this is like sleeping with a person you used to love but who contracted a bunch of diseases and shit along the way.
 
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Why would McDavid want to come play with these losers? I know he grew up cheering for this team but this is like sleeping with a person you used to love but who contracted a bunch of diseases and shit along the way.
LMAO. Yeah, that's a legit way of seeing it.

Or, if you see McDavid as a MacKinnon or Crosby type, I could actually see him entertaining this if the Oilers win the Cup this season. Something about conquering new lands, relishing a challenge, and achieving what was previously seen as being unachievable. It's not too dissimilar to Lebron leaving the Heat in the middle of a dynasty to go home and prove that he can do it for his hometown loser franchise.
 
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Don't care if they throw them on the ice, but during play was disgraceful.

Ya find out who that was and ban them. Also don't worry when they use the "you can't break up with me I'm breaking up with you." They just need to not be allowed back.
 
LMAO. Yeah, that's a legit way of seeing it.

Or, if you see McDavid as a MacKinnon or Crosby type, I could actually see him entertaining this if the Oilers win the Cup this season. Something about conquering new lands, relishing a challenge, and achieving what was previously seen as being unachievable. It's not too dissimilar to Lebron leaving the Heat in the middle of a dynasty to go home and prove that he can do it for his hometown loser franchise.
I think that if he wins the Cup with the Oilers he'll re-sign to win more, personally.

I think the ship sailed when Drai re-signed. Oh well. We have our own supersta-sorry couldn't type that without laughing.
 

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