Proposal: Edmonton and Washington

[Double Dion]

Good thing Puljujarvi is a solid 3rd liner and a tweener and not a 4th liner then.

You could get your point across better if you weren’t soo disingenuous. Puljujarvi never used in the 4th line.

No he isn't. Alex Chiasson played with McDavid and put up 25 goals. He was a 4th liner. Puljujarvi played with McDavid and put up 14 goals. Puljujarvi is essentially an equivalent player to Trevor Lewis. He's good defensively but even the best offensive player in the game can't turn him into a scorer when he's turned replacement level players like Kassian and Chiasson into scorers.

I mean you're an Oilers fan. Who is better, Ryan McLeod or Jesse Puljujarvi? Puljujarvi is 4 times the cap hit McLeod is.

 

[BudBundy]

No, 4th liners who make 3M aren't in demand for any team. The play killer nickname has been widely publicized for those who care to look.

Were you “looking” when Anthony Stewart said McDavid wanted JP on the team?

Push your agenda elsewhere. We’ve seen your act too often to buy it.

 

[Double Dion]

Were you “looking” when Anthony Stewart said McDavid wanted JP on the team?

Push your agenda elsewhere. We’ve seen your act too often to buy it.

The same Anthony Stewart who picked Campbell for the Vezina? Stewart is not an insider. Both Friedman and Seravelli said the Oilers tried hard to trade him this offseason and couldn't find a taker. Seravelli said they were asking for a mid round pick.

Do you think the GM is looking to move him? It's well known that McDavid makes a lot of their hockey decisions. Like how hard he pushed for Kane.

 

[GOilers88]

Cap space isn't nothing. Teams are moving out top picks for it. I get it. He was a 4OA pick, but a defensive specialist can't make 3M. You won't accrue any deadline space with the roster as constituted. You're correct that you need a shutdown D. As it stands that can't happen. Oilers are already playing without a full roster 2 games in. Ask Vegas how that went. I'd say Foegele is a better player than JP. You almost have to move one of them.

What good does trading a decent NHL player for capspace do for a team trying to contend if they sit on it for months until the deadline?

Makes zero sense to free up cap space by trading decent players unless there is a deal on the books to fill his spot as soon as he is traded. In which case he won't be traded for essentially nothing, he'll be packaged with other assets for a definite upgrade somewhere.

 

[Double Dion]

What good does trading a decent NHL player for capspace do for a team trying to contend if they sit on it for months until the deadline?

Makes zero sense to free up cap space by trading decent players unless there is a deal on the books to fill his spot as soon as he is traded. In which case he won't be traded for essentially nothing, he'll be packaged with other assets for a definite upgrade somewhere.

If you can get out from that contract you do it immediately. Then you add the best shutdown defenseman you can with the cap space at the deadline.

The Oilers as constituted will be a borderline playoff team. They'll become a contender with a shutdown defenseman and if McDavid makes a commitment to a team game instead of cheating for offense.

 

[GOilers88]

If you can get out from that contract you do it immediately. Then you add the best shutdown defenseman you can with the cap space at the deadline.

The Oilers as constituted will be a borderline playoff team. They'll become a contender with a shutdown defenseman and if McDavid makes a commitment to a team game instead of cheating for offense.

Removing JP from the roster to sit on some cap space for 5 months does nothing to help the team make a run. Who takes his spot? He's a good defensive winger who will put up some points, albeit underwhelming.

This doesn't help the team at all, unless they have a trade lined up the same day to bring in another player. Sitting on capspace just because makes no sense.

Better yet, what awesome shut down defenseman is going to be available for 3 mil and worth sitting around for for over half a season while trying to make the playoffs? How do you ensure anyone you might like is even available to you 5 months from now?

This is mind boggling. Nevermind the fact you keep ragging on Edmonton's team defense while advocating to trade one of their better defensive forwards immediately for the sake of removing him from the roster to sit on his capspace for 5 months.

 

[Double Dion]

Removing JP from the roster to sit on some cap space for 5 months does nothing to help the team make a run. Who takes his spot? He's a good defensive winger who will put up some points, albeit underwhelming.

This doesn't help the team at all, unless they have a trade lined up the same day to bring in another player. Sitting on capspace just because makes no sense.

Benson can bring that same thing and plays a more physical game. Losing Puljujarvi doesn't hurt the roster at all.

 

[GOilers88]

Benson can bring that same thing and plays a more physical game. Losing Puljujarvi doesn't hurt the roster at all.

Benson is hurt and has never shown the ability to be anything more than a fringe 4th liner. And again, he's out with injury so he isn't taking anyone's spot. He isn't close to JP, even if you think JP sucks. Which he doesn't. Even if he isn't a top six scorer, he's still a productive and useful hockey player. You don't trade those to sit on cap space while trying to contend and think you're going to replace him with an AHL tweener at the best of times.

 

[Double Dion]

Benson is hurt and has never shown the ability to be anything more than a fringe 4th liner. And again, he's out with injury so he isn't taking anyone's spot.

He's out for now yes. What has Puljujarvi ever showed? Nothing more than Benson with 10 times the opportunity. Klim Kostin can do the same thing as Puljujarvi too. Big, fast and erase opportunities both ways.

 

[GOilers88]

He's out for now yes. What has Puljujarvi ever showed? Nothing more than Benson with 10 times the opportunity. Klim Kostin can do the same thing as Puljujarvi too. Big, fast and erase opportunities both ways.

So remove a player and wait for who knows how long until another player comes back from injury. Solid.

We're done here.

 

[BudBundy]

The same Anthony Stewart who picked Campbell for the Vezina? Stewart is not an insider. Both Friedman and Seravelli said the Oilers tried hard to trade him this offseason and couldn't find a taker. Seravelli said they were asking for a mid round pick.

Do you think the GM is looking to move him? It's well known that McDavid makes a lot of their hockey decisions. Like how hard he pushed for Kane.

JP is still an Oiler, you’re still an Oilers troll, and this proposal is still laughable.

 

[Double Dion]

So remove a player and wait for who knows how long until another player comes back from injury. Solid.

We're done here.

Remove a 4th line level player. Gain 3M in accruing cap space and replace him with a sub 1M player who does the exact same thing. Add a shutdown D that is desperately needed and be a better team.

I know Oilers fans don't like defensive D, but they are critical to team success. Look at all the crap guys like Klefbom and Larsson took. Those are the exact players you need now to contend.

 

[PuckG]

JP is still an Oiler, you’re still an Oilers troll, and this proposal is still laughable.

Not even a good troll. Repeats the same thing over and over again while forgetting his team got bent over by the Oilers not long ago.

 

[Double Dion]

JP is still an Oiler, you’re still an Oilers troll, and this proposal is still laughable.

He was offered around the league. Holland didn't want to add to dump the contract. It's not because they wanted him. We would have loved to dump Neal for nothing but we couldn't.

If you can get rid of a bad contract and not take one back that's a huge win. The Oilers won't qualify him at seasons end anyway. Why not get the space now if you can?

Not even a good troll. Repeats the same thing over and over again while forgetting his team got bent over by the Oilers not long ago.

It's not trolling. It's recognizing the Oilers have 3 years left to potentially contend. They are wasting them with no shutdown D.

 

[GOilers88]

Remove a 4th line level player. Gain 3M in accruing cap space and replace him with a sub 1M player who does the exact same thing. Add a shutdown D that is desperately needed and be a better team.

I know Oilers fans don't like defensive D, but they are critical to team success. Look at all the crap guys like Klefbom and Larsson took. Those are the exact players you need now to contend.

Klefbom wasn't a defensive specialist. He was a solid two way defender. Him and Larsson are also both worth way more than 3 million anyways so you still haven't provided any shut down guys who will be worth sitting on 3 million in cap for almost an entire season for, let alone whether they will even still be available that far down the line.

And JP is better than a 4th line AHL tweener. Even with his lack of finish, he brings a good solid defensive role to a team who by all accounts gets roasted for it's overall defensive play.

You don't make any sense.

Teams trying to contend don't trade decent young players just to sit on capspace all year in the hopes someone might be available at the deadline. This is beyond stupid.

Putting JP in a package for this mystery defender would make far more sense. I don't think your valuation of players is at all credible, and I'll cite this thread where you argued both Valimaki and JP would easily clear waivers. Lo and behold Valimaki was claimed like a day later. JP has value. He's not a shitty hockey player.

Proposal: - CGY/EDM

Jesse Puljujarvi (50% retained) for Juuso Valimaki. Flames are searching for a RW, Oilers are looking for a D. Both players could use a change of scenery. @ 50% would make the cap hit the same. Probably not going to happen because of the teams involved. Nevertheless.. discuss.

forums.hfboards.com

 

[PuckG]

It's not trolling. It's recognizing the Oilers have 3 years left to potentially contend. They are wasting them with no shutdown D.

I’d be more concerned with your team. Trading away youth for aging players with a few season of prime hockey left is much more of a waste than whatever you consider the Oilers are doing.

I do agree though, a shutdown defenseman likely means the Flames get swept as opposed to the gentlemen’s sweep and likely propels us into the next tier of contenders.

 

[Double Dion]

Klefbom wasn't a defensive specialist. He was a solid two way defender. Him and Larsson are also both worth way more than 3 million anyways so you still haven't provided any shut down guys who will be worth sitting on 3 million in cap for almost an entire season for, let alone whether they will even still be available that far down the line.

And JP is better than a 4th line AHL tweener. Even with his lack of finish, he brings a good solid defensive role to a team who by all accounts gets roasted for it's overall defensive play.

You don't make any sense.

Teams trying to contend don't trade decent young players just to sit on capspace all year in the hopes someone might be available at the deadline. This is beyond stupid.

Putting JP in a package for this mystery defender would make far more sense.

I agree Klefbom wasn't solely a defensive specialist like Larsson is, but you could play him against top competition.

Yes those D generally come in around 4 or 5M. But you're accruing cap space. You'd actually be able to go just over 6M if you accrue it to the deadline.

I don't know whether you genuinely don't understand what I'm saying or just disagreeing with the obvious because I'm a Flames fan.

Do you genuinely believe the Oilers need a bottom 6 winger more than shutdown defenseman? I don't know how anyone rational could believe that.

I’d be more concerned with your team. Trading away youth for aging players with a few season of prime hockey left is much more of a waste than whatever you consider the Oilers are doing.

I do agree though, a shutdown defenseman likely means the Flames get swept as opposed to the gentlemen’s sweep and likely propels us into the next tier of contenders.

Flames are chasing the Avs not the Oilers. Vegas is pretty smart. Have you looked at who the current cup favorite is?

Back on point. The Oilers desperately need a shutdown defenseman. If dumping Puljujarvi gets them the space for it why would Oilers fans be against it? If Trevor Lewis made 3M I'd want to dump him to accrue space for the top 9 RW our team clearly needs.

 

[GOilers88]

I agree Klefbom wasn't solely a defensive specialist like Larsson is, but you could play him against top competition.

Yes those D generally come in around 4 or 5M. But you're accruing cap space. You'd actually be able to go just over 6M if you accrue it to the deadline.

I don't know whether you genuinely don't understand what I'm saying or just disagreeing with the obvious because I'm a Flames fan.

Do you genuinely believe the Oilers need a bottom 6 winger more than shutdown defenseman? I don't know how anyone rational could believe that.

I understand what you're saying.

I think it's stupid to remove a player that brings any sort of production to a team thats trying to contend, offensive or defensive, for the sake of sitting on his cap space for 5 months in the hope that a very specific player shakes free that far down the line.

It would make far more sense to trade JP at the deadline in a deal for said player so he can continue to help the team in the meantime, and at which point he will be owed even less money for the acquiring team. His deal is up after this season anyways so it's not like anyone would even have to commit to him for any length of time at all.

Or it would be equally less puzzling to suggest you trade him asap if you have someone lined up to put that capspace to use over the next 5 months to help put the team in a better position when they finally reach the deadline.

The only scenario that makes no sense to me is the one you proposed. Where the Oilers dump a player who at least helps them defensively overall (their biggest weakness) so that they can throw Tyler Benson (who is out with injury) onto the third line despite the fact he has never even shown the capability to be a mainstay on the 4th line, so that they can sit on some cap space for 5 months and then put it to use by acquiring a solid shut down defender that they hope will not only be available at a relative discount price but will help solidify their top 4 (which is what they need). Clearing cap space is only productive if you fill it with a useful player for as long as possible. It's not useful at all if you just clear cap to sit on it for the majority of the season.

You being a Flames fan is irrelevent to the entire discussion.

 

[PuckG]

Flames are chasing the Avs not the Oilers. Vegas is pretty smart. Have you looked at who the current cup favorite is?

This is why everyone considers you a troll. Either that, or it’s borderline delusion. Your one victory against the Oilers this season in no way trumps the outcome of a full playoff series. Not only that, but the Flames were fortunate to be as healthy as they were last year.

 

[Double Dion]

I understand what you're saying.

I think it's stupid to remove a player that brings any sort of production to a team thats trying to contend, offensive or defensive, for the sake of sitting on his cap space for 5 months in the hope that a very specific player shakes free that far down the line.

It would make far more sense to trade JP at the deadline in a deal for said player so he can continue to help the team in the meantime, and at which point he will be owed even less money for the acquiring team. His deal is up after this season anyways so it's not like anyone would even have to commit to him for any length of time at all.

Or it would be equally less puzzling to suggest you trade him asap if you have someone lined up to put that capspace to use over the next 5 months to help put the team in a better position when they finally reach the deadline.

The only scenario that makes no sense to me is the one you proposed. Where the Oilers dump a player who at least helps them defensively overall (their biggest weakness) so that they can throw Tyler Benson (who is out with injury) onto the third line despite the fact he has never even shown the capability to be a mainstay on the 4th line, so that they can sit on some cap space for 5 months and then put it to use by acquiring a solid shut down defender that they hope will not only be available at a relative discount price but will help solidify their top 4 (which is what they need).

You being a Flames fan is irrelevent to the entire discussion.

What you're saying is great and ideal for sure. I just don't think you get the defenseman you need for 3M in cap space and trading JP for it. There are less than a handful of shutdown D that make less than 3M and I don't think JP comes close to getting any of them.

This is why everyone considers you a troll. Either that, or it’s borderline delusion. Your one victory against the Oilers this season in no way trumps the outcome of a full playoff series. Not only that, but the Flames were fortunate to be as healthy as they were last year.

If I'm borderline delusional why are the Flames the betting favorite for the cup in Vegas right now? If anything I'm under selling them as I have both the Avs and Lightning ahead of them and the Rags even.

 

[PuckG]

If I'm borderline delusional why are the Flames the betting favorite for the cup in Vegas right now? If anything I'm under selling them as I have both the Avs and Lightning ahead of them and the Rags even.

The betting favourite can change abruptly and frequently if warranted. If that is what your basing your assessment on after 4 or 5 games this season, then it’s undoubtedly delusion.

 

[GOilers88]

What you're saying is great and ideal for sure. I just don't think you get the defenseman you need for 3M in cap space and trading JP for it. There are less than a handful of shutdown D that make less than 3M and I don't think JP comes close to getting any of them.


If I'm borderline delusional why are the Flames the betting favorite for the cup in Vegas right now? If anything I'm under selling them as I have both the Avs and Lightning ahead of them and the Rags even.

So how does dumping him now help at all then, if it only clears 3 million? How are they any closer to getting that shut down defenseman by dumping JP now as opposed to at the deadline? If a team is willing to take him now, why would they be less willing to take him when he's owed even less money with even less commitment?

I'd be more than willing to add to him however, in the form of picks and other prospects, to obtain the defenseman they need. I just can't fathom how dumping him now and doing nothing is at all beneficial to the team if they can do the same thing closer to the deadline.

 

[Double Dion]

So how does dumping him now help at all then, if it only clears 3 million? How are they any closer to getting that shut down defenseman by dumping JP now as opposed to at the deadline? If a team is willing to take him now, why would they be less willing to take him when he's owed even less money with even less commitment?

I'd be more than willing to add to him however, in the form of picks and other prospects, to obtain the defenseman they need. I just can't fathom how dumping him now and doing nothing is at all beneficial to the team if they can do the same thing closer to the deadline.

Dumping 3M now is worth 6M at the TDL assuming you replace him with a 1M player. I already explained that.

The betting favourite can change abruptly and frequently if warranted. If that is what your basing your assessment on after 4 or 5 games this season, then it’s undoubtedly delusion.

Sure, it can. But the Flames were the preseason favorite and are still the favorite. I don't think me saying I think they are tied for the 3rd most likely team to win the cup when Vegas has them as the #1 favorite to win the cup makes me delusional.

 

[TFHockey]

Dumping 3M now is worth 6M at the TDL assuming you replace him with a 1M player. I already explained that.


Sure, it can. But the Flames were the preseason favorite and are still the favorite. I don't think me saying I think they are tied for the 3rd most likely team to win the cup when Vegas has them as the #1 favorite to win the cup makes me delusional.

I think we can safely ignore the advice on our line up from a Calgary Flames fan. I mean, we could bash the crap out of your team and continually suggest you trade Huberdeau for cap space, but would you listen? Hellz no. Nor should you.

 

[Double Dion]

I think we can safely ignore the advice on our line up from a Calgary Flames fan. I mean, we could bash the crap out of your team and continually suggest you trade Huberdeau for cap space, but would you listen? Hellz no. Nor should you.

It's a bad call. My advice is always top shelf. Huberdeau was a bad signing btw (not the trade, just the signing). So was the Toffoli trade. My team should also listen to my advice.