Confirmed with Link: Ducks fire Greg Cronin

[zegrassyknoll]

Getting the news the Cronin was fired was the happiest I've felt in months.

Don't know what that says about me!

 

[zegrassyknoll]

The timing just makes it so hard to believe player feedback wasn't the deciding factor. The precedent is Eakins, who they announced wouldn't be back pretty much immediately. But Cronin only gets jettisoned in the literal middle of exit interviews, even though that decision had implicitly already been made?

There's just nothing good (from a GM perspective) that could come from saying that out loud even if it's true, though.

I also find it interesting/convenient that we didn't get the exit interviews from the players that would have the impact to fire Cronin (Killorn/Strome/Vatrano/Gudas/etc.) or from the players that probably hated him the most (Zegras/Mintyukov)

 

[Hockey Duckie]

The timing just makes it so hard to believe player feedback wasn't the deciding factor. The precedent is Eakins, who they announced wouldn't be back pretty much immediately. But Cronin only gets jettisoned in the literal middle of exit interviews, even though that decision had implicitly already been made?

There's just nothing good (from a GM perspective) that could come from saying that out loud even if it's true, though.

I forget where I heard or read it from, but our last game in 2022-23 was at home and Eakins was immediately let go. This season, we were on the road in Canada. Verbeek probably wanted to fire Cronin at home than on the road.

 

[eaterfan]

I don't think this has been asked yet in this thread:

Who do you think was a better coach, Eakins or Cronin? Not that either was good.

I actually think it may have been Eakins. While the defense was bad under both, at least Eakins let them play an exciting brand of hockey in the O zone. I also think his bad teams had less talent than this year's team and the net minders had a better season this year than pretty much any during Eakin's tenure.

 

[KelVarnsen]

My interpretation: Verbeek is saying "The players were not happy but they don't run the show. The decision was mine."

This is exactly it in my opinion. The players must have voiced their opinions on the bumbling idiot and how they can’t play for him or win with him but PV doesn’t want to appear weak so he claims responsibility.

I wonder if agents of RFA’s on the team made it know their player was done with Cro? If we go by the Chicklets (they seem more credible now since he was fired and we have other info on Cro) the locker room was dysfunctional and players probably wanted to leave.

Maybe it was a similar situation as after last season but PV didn’t pull the trigger then because he didn’t want a “players run the show” rep. There were reports he considered moving on from Cro last season.

 

[MCB]

I don't think this has been asked yet in this thread:

Who do you think was a better coach, Eakins or Cronin? Not that either was good.

Oh God prepare yourself...

 

[Firequacker]

I also find it interesting/convenient that we didn't get the exit interviews from the players that would have the impact to fire Cronin (Killorn/Strome/Vatrano/Gudas/etc.) or from the players that probably hated him the most (Zegras/Mintyukov)

If those guys were supposed to go on day two, it's kind of entertaining to think about Verbeek sitting there looking at the schedule like "if this is what the day one guys told me, oh boy..."
I don't think he could really be blamed for not wanting Zegras to go talk to the media right after this, though.

I forget where I heard or read it from, but our last game in 2022-23 was at home and Eakins was immediately let go. This season, we were on the road in Canada. Verbeek probably wanted to fire Cronin at home than on the road.

Ahh, yeah that's true, that does make sense for why it took longer. Though the fact that it was done in the middle of the interviews is still the weirder part IMO, especially since the reporters were originally told they'd be talking to Cronin after the players.
To be fair I have no idea if that's actually unusual around the league or if it just feels weird.

 

[KelVarnsen]

Oh God prepare yourself...

I don’t think he knows what’s coming lol

 

[TheDarkWingThatDucks]

Oh God prepare yourself...

Eakins in the 2021-2022 season was given a far worse roster. Cronin was given a far superior roster and just improved 1 pt. This not to mention, how he mishandled Colangelo the best goal scorer on the ducks this season. His first 11 games, he played him as a 4th line grinder and he scored 0 points. When Terry missed games, he played with Vats and Strome and got a goal.

Something along those lines ?
Edit: I forgot we were 3rd in the pacific !

 

[Mr Rogers]

I don't think this has been asked yet in this thread:

Who do you think was a better coach, Eakins or Cronin? Not that either was good.

I actually think it may have been Eakins. While the defense was bad under both, at least Eakins let them play an exciting brand of hockey in the O zone. I also think his bad teams had less talent than this year's team and the net minders had a better season this year than pretty much any during Eakin's tenure.

I agree with you. Eakins' best year imo felt better than Cronin's and Cro's worst year (last year) just felt a little worse than Eakins at his worst. Last year (23-24) was just downright painful. I also never felt like the young guys (Zegs and Mctavish essentially) were stagnating/getting worse with him - Zegs was solid offensively with him and Mctavish had a nice rookie year. Zegras is still basically as bad defensively as he was before but his offense has been obliterated.

Eakins is also just a likable person so that is helpful for our recollection of him.

 

[KelVarnsen]

If those guys were supposed to go on day two, it's kind of entertaining to think about Verbeek sitting there looking at the schedule like "if this is what the day one guys told me, oh boy..."
I don't think he could really be blamed for not wanting Zegras to go talk to the media right after this, though.

This is kind of funny to think about. How bad were the interviews on day 1 lol. He had to think the day 1 interviews were going to be a cake walk and bam! Smacked right in the face that his first professional hire in The NHL was despised by his team. He fired the guy without even talking to the rest of the team!!!

Of course I’m making this narrative up in my head but it is comical to think about.

 

[MCB]

Eakins in the 2021-2022 season was given a far worse roster. Cronin was given a far superior roster and just improved 1 pt. This not to mention, how he mishandled Colangelo the best goal scorer on the ducks this season. His first 11 games, he played him as a 4th line grinder and he scored 0 points. When Terry missed games, he played with Vats and Strome and got a goal.

Something along those lines ?
Edit: I forgot we were 3rd in the pacific !

Lol it wasn't me that asked, I know better than to open the can of worms that is Cronin vs eakins

 

[TheDarkWingThatDucks]

I don't think this has been asked yet in this thread:

Who do you think was a better coach, Eakins or Cronin? Not that either was good.

I actually think it may have been Eakins. While the defense was bad under both, at least Eakins let them play an exciting brand of hockey in the O zone. I also think his bad teams had less talent than this year's team and the net minders had a better season this year than pretty much any during Eakin's tenure.

 

[Firequacker]

I'd take Eakins over Cronin. Not sure who I'd bet on in a purely technical coach-off, but at least Eakins seemed to really have the room. And I'd take him as a development coach 10 times out of 10 (compare what we've heard about him helping Terry develop his confidence to what we heard from Cronin about "the defensemen have to figure out how not to play tentative on their own" and saw with pre-4-Nations Leo, among other things).

Eakins in the 2021-2022 season was given a far worse roster. Cronin was given a far superior roster and just improved 1 pt. This not to mention, how he mishandled Colangelo the best goal scorer on the ducks this season. His first 11 games, he played him as a 4th line grinder and he scored 0 points. When Terry missed games, he played with Vats and Strome and got a goal.

Something along those lines ?
Edit: I forgot we were 3rd in the pacific !

There was also "Eakins missing 36 games of Derek Grant was equivalent to Cronin missing 51 games of Zegras (and big chunks of the rest of his top 6)" for awhile there.

Fortunately(?) Cronin then took a healthier and more experienced roster and did, you know, *gestures broadly at this season*, which made the whole "is Cronin bad or was it mostly injuries?" argument moot. But if you believed year one Cronin was bad but also hampered by injuries you have to forever carry the badge of shame for... something.

 

[Mr Rogers]

I'd take Eakins over Cronin. Not sure who I'd bet on in a purely technical coach-off, but at least Eakins seemed to really have the room. And I'd take him as a development coach 10 times out of 10 (compare what we've heard about him helping Terry develop his confidence to what we heard from Cronin about "the defensemen have to figure out how not to play tentative on their own" and saw with pre-4-Nations Leo, among other things).


There was also "Eakins missing 36 games of Derek Grant was equivalent to Cronin missing 51 games of Zegras (and big chunks of the rest of his top 6)" for awhile there.

Fortunately(?) Cronin then took a healthier and more experienced roster and did, you know, *gestures broadly at this season*, which made the whole "is Cronin bad or was it mostly injuries?" argument moot. But if you believed year one Cronin was bad but also hampered by injuries you have to forever carry the badge of shame for... something.

Ah yes, how could I forget Terry. That is a big win for Eakins

 

[JAHV]

As bad as Cronin turned out to be, I felt like he had a plan. It was not a plan that worked well, but I could at least see what he was trying. And I'm hopeful that the off-ice stuff bears long-term fruit in terms of work ethic and that kind of thing.

Eakins was just a dude everyone liked who happened to coach hockey. Those rosters were bad, but Eakins did absolutely nothing to make them better. There's no question in my mind that Eakins was a worse NHL coach, but that's not because Cronin was good. It's just because Eakins was that terrible, and he proved it over multiple stints with different teams.

 

[Gliff]

I don't think this has been asked yet in this thread:

Who do you think was a better coach, Eakins or Cronin? Not that either was good.

I actually think it may have been Eakins. While the defense was bad under both, at least Eakins let them play an exciting brand of hockey in the O zone. I also think his bad teams had less talent than this year's team and the net minders had a better season this year than pretty much any during Eakin's tenure.

Different coaches, bad for different reasons. Neither should be NHL coaches.

 

[The Midnight Burrito]

I don't think this has been asked yet in this thread:

Who do you think was a better coach, Eakins or Cronin? Not that either was good.

I actually think it may have been Eakins. While the defense was bad under both, at least Eakins let them play an exciting brand of hockey in the O zone. I also think his bad teams had less talent than this year's team and the net minders had a better season this year than pretty much any during Eakin's tenure.

I liked Eakins better because I think he worked with the kids better. Ultimately they had the same fatal flaw, which was that they insisted on man defense for a team that wasn't built for it and they couldn't get the players to learn an offensive system.

 

[ADHB]

I also find it interesting/convenient that we didn't get the exit interviews from the players that would have the impact to fire Cronin (Killorn/Strome/Vatrano/Gudas/etc.) or from the players that probably hated him the most (Zegras/Mintyukov)

This is a good point I hadn’t even thought of. Yeah it’s super weird that the exit interviews with the media were to take place over two days, and some of the most obvious guys that you’d want to hear from never gave one. I suppose they were scheduled for day two, but really strange that there was no media availability for all the main vets (Terry, Strome, Vatrano, Killorn) and more importantly Gudas. How does the captain of the team not talk to the media after the season?

 

[Hockey Duckie]

I liked Eakins better because I think he worked with the kids better. Ultimately they had the same fatal flaw, which was that they insisted on man defense for a team that wasn't built for it and they couldn't get the players to learn an offensive system.

Eakins did help out with the kids, but also with the vets. Fowler found his scoring touch again with finding new scoring highs in two consecutive seasons. Des went from strictly pugilist to a PK'er and protector of Z in some games. Eakins was able to revive Rico's game after being waived during COVID season.

Dallas made man-defense work when he had a healthy roster to start the season in 2021-22. Once an injury hit one of Fowler, Lindholm, and/or Manson, then the youth, rookie d-men were not talented enough to keep up in Drysdale (19-year old rookie), Benoit, and Mahura. Manson missed 17 games (went on IR at all-star break when Verbeek was hired) before the TDL and 13 consecutive games between All-Star break and the TDL. Silf was riding high until he got COVID in-season, games #10-15; that affect his game much and later into the season developed blood clots. Rico missed 20 games straight due to LBI, games #26 -45.

Looking at the Chart below, we see a top defense and top offense in the first 33 games. Then the defense suffers, which makes the offense suffer. Despite the many injuries in the middle set of games, the Ducks were still only 4 points from 3rd in the Pacific at the TDL.

The problem afterwards with Eakins was the shit blueline roster Verbeek gave him for the 2022-23 season with no physicality and none were top-4 d-men save Fowler. It was so bad that almost everyone got replaced and Verbeek actually added defensive d-men with bite. Here were the new editions for Cronin's rookie season: RD Gudas, RD Lyubushkin, LD LaCombe, and LD Minty to start the season. Also, Vaak was finally healthy.

Cronin's main problem wasn't man-defense. His main problem was the lacking ability to alter his game plan, have an better offensive system, and the inability to elevate team play. With a vastly improved blueline and the additions of Killorn with Carlsson for Cronin's rookie season, he simply couldn't generate enough offense despite the improved GA and GD. He was only one point better than Eakins. That's how Cronin lost me in year 1.

Year 2 of Cronin was him doubling down and the play on ice suffered while the goaltenders propped up our standings. The man-defense can be helped greatly with great goaltending, but goalies can't score goals.

What a shame that this team has enough talent for a 21-point increase for the standings, but Cronin set that bar so low the previous year.

 

[Static]

I liked Eakins better because I think he worked with the kids better. Ultimately they had the same fatal flaw, which was that they insisted on man defense for a team that wasn't built for it and they couldn't get the players to learn an offensive system.

There was never any question that he developed our young players or that he was a good person for them to be around daily. With Cronin, that was constantly at the forefront of concern.

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

So we've had a players' coach who failed us and a hard ass who failed us. The common denominator is neither was a good hockey coach. I sure hope Pat understands that important distinction.

 

[Static]

So we've had a players' coach who failed us and a hard ass who failed us. The common denominator is neither was a good hockey coach. I sure hope Pat understands that important distinction.

The "hard ass" way isn't all that acceptable anymore, because what it really meant was this guy is an asshole. Being friendly and personable while also demanding accountability isn't mutually exclusive, it just takes a talented communicator.

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

The "hard ass" way isn't all that acceptable anymore, because what it really meant was this guy is an asshole. Being friendly and personable while also demanding accountability isn't mutually exclusive, it just takes a talented communicator.

I wasn't so much equating their styles other than to say we tried both extremes and failed for a reason they both shared which was being poor at Xs and Os.

 

[lwvs84]

I don't think this has been asked yet in this thread:

Who do you think was a better coach, Eakins or Cronin? Not that either was good.

Neither was good, but the only one I'd want in the organization is Eakins... just not as the NHL coach. He's good in the AHL or I'd have him as part of player development with helping guys transition from college/juniors to AHL and transition from AHL to NHL. I feel like he connected well with players and they felt comfortable with him. He'd be a good point of contact off the ice for advice and helping kids (and even vets) struggling with confidence issues.