Post-Game Talk: Ducks 4 - Jets 3 in OT

[Adam da bomb]

I was just looking at Scheifele's 5v5 minutes over the last 10 games as a shorthand for Top Line (and same for Names as L2, Lowry as L3 and Kupari/Gus as L4).

CSV is 7-7 in 133 minutes.
?SV is 1-0 in 11 minutes.
CS? is 0-1 in 11 minutes.
?S? is 2-0 in 14 minutes.
Jets are 11-6 without all three in 311 minutes.

ENP is 2-1 in 59 minutes.
?NP is 2-2 in 45 minutes.
EN? is 0-0 in 3 minutes.
?N? is 0-1 in 18 minutes.
Jets are 15-10 without all three in 331 minutes.

NLA is 1-2 in 65 minutes
?LA is 1-0 in 8 minutes.
NL? is 2-1 in 32 minutes.
?L? is 1-0 in 17 minutes.
Jets are 14-10 without all three in 336 minutes.

That's alot of work.

 

[Buffdog]

I was just looking at Scheifele's 5v5 minutes over the last 10 games as a shorthand for Top Line (and same for Names as L2, Lowry as L3 and Kupari/Gus as L4).

CSV is 7-7 in 133 minutes.
?SV is 1-0 in 11 minutes.
CS? is 0-1 in 11 minutes.
?S? is 2-0 in 14 minutes.
Jets are 11-6 without all three in 311 minutes.

ENP is 2-1 in 59 minutes.
?NP is 2-2 in 45 minutes.
EN? is 0-0 in 3 minutes.
?N? is 0-1 in 18 minutes.
Jets are 15-10 without all three in 331 minutes.

NLA is 1-2 in 65 minutes
?LA is 1-0 in 8 minutes.
NL? is 2-1 in 32 minutes.
?L? is 1-0 in 17 minutes.
Jets are 14-10 without all three in 336 minutes.

You're like a stats Rainman lol

 

[NA Hockey]

I was just looking at Scheifele's 5v5 minutes over the last 10 games as a shorthand for Top Line (and same for Names as L2, Lowry as L3 and Kupari/Gus as L4).

CSV is 7-7 in 133 minutes.
?SV is 1-0 in 11 minutes.
CS? is 0-1 in 11 minutes.
?S? is 2-0 in 14 minutes.
Jets are 11-6 without all three in 311 minutes.

ENP is 2-1 in 59 minutes.
?NP is 2-2 in 45 minutes.
EN? is 0-0 in 3 minutes.
?N? is 0-1 in 18 minutes.
Jets are 15-10 without all three in 331 minutes.

NLA is 1-2 in 65 minutes
?LA is 1-0 in 8 minutes.
NL? is 2-1 in 32 minutes.
?L? is 1-0 in 17 minutes.
Jets are 14-10 without all three in 336 minutes.

Looks relatively even to me

 

[voyageur]

The ratio of Stan haters on this thread is probably at its lowest this year. He made some nice plays out there. I imagine he had a decent expected goal rating with some of the offense he generated.

I think he's starting to separate himself from Heinola if he plays the way he has in the past couple of games.

 

[TS Quint]

Perfetti's 120th in forward points...141st in points/game (min 20 gp).

2nd line forwards should rank between 97-192 in points, with the median being 144. So Perfetti is a slightly above average 2nd line forward.

He's streaky...but that's how it goes. The Jets are 24-13 +11 when he's on the ice at 5v5 and 58-49 +9 when he's not.

I do not like how that 2nd line is built though. Something is off in the mix.

It’s not about the total points. He scores a bunch in a game then nothing for 5 or 6. At his pace in a 7 game playoff series he’s not going to score anything in 4 or 5 games. Again that’s IF he can continue his regular season play in the Playoffs.

I agree that line is not clicking most nights. I think their style might even be worse in playoff hockey. I think it is a problem of too much perimeter play by Ehlers and Perfetti. They both want to be arms length from the boards throwing sauce. I think you can have one or the other and build the line around the one you keep and trade the other. There are pros and cons to both. These guys need a real net driver. push that defense back and expose the slot for them. I thought Copp did this well for Ehlers for a small period of time. Copp doesn’t have the high end skill but he knew his role and it helped him produce more than he deserved.

 

[KingBogo]

I don't know how you blow up the Lowry line. That's your #1 matchup line. So it has to be 3 good defensive players. Now I think if Apples were healthy you could maybe get a lot of good things out of Iafallo on a checking line. He's a guy that will battle every shift. Probably same speed as Nino. And Nino could be the moving part.

I don't like the idea of Ehlers playing against other team's best if he plays soft. Which he did last night. Look at where he was covering Trouba on the GTG, standing beside him, no effort to move him out of the way of the goalie's sight. Or block a puck. Perfetti on the 4th line is just a result of that, because there were two games in December the Jets won as a result of Perfetti playing smart below the goal line hockey, battling, and changing lines with possession that created GWGs.

He's the fall guy for Ehlers. But I agree there's not a lot of chemistry there. There is still time to experiment.

I don’t like the idea of spitting up Scheifele’s or Lowry’s line. Both are operating very well at this time. I think Chevy will solve the 2nd Center problem the way he always does by trading for one. I’m just hoping he goes more aggressive for someone younger and under team control rather than the rental route. We might need to trade a player or 2 we would prefer not to.

 

[KingBogo]

The team definitely did everything it could to bring back Monahan. Hard to fault them there. But he is having a great first half in CBJ so far. If we have to burn another first on a rental... that will sting. We could have given up four 1sts by that point... Stastny, Hayes, Monahan and possibly one more now. Gulp.

To be fair Chevy has also got 1sts back with Ladd, Trouba and Copp.

 

[NA Hockey]

It’s not about the total points. He scores a bunch in a game then nothing for 5 or 6. At his pace in a 7 game playoff series he’s not going to score anything in 4 or 5 games. Again that’s IF he can continue his regular season play in the Playoffs.

I agree that line is not clicking most nights. I think their style might even be worse in playoff hockey. I think it is a problem of too much perimeter play by Ehlers and Perfetti. They both want to be arms length from the boards throwing sauce. I think you can have one or the other and build the line around the one you keep and trade the other. There are pros and cons to both. These guys need a real net driver. push that defense back and expose the slot for them. I thought Copp did this well for Ehlers for a small period of time. Copp doesn’t have the high end skill but he knew his role and it helped him produce more than he deserved.

I agree with a lot of what you said. They need a big body to push the d back and open the middle and someone to forecheck.they are both at heir best out wide or up top making plays.

The issue I have is that it is Perfetti that goes to the net for the line and stands there taking a beating and that’s not where he is most effective. If you watch that line whenever they have zone time it is Perfetti standing in front trying to screen and look for tips while Ehlers goes around the outside. This why they don’t compliment each other and why I think Lowry would really help them so they could both play to their strengths more.

 

[Gil Fisher]

lol. Yes. I know where they are in the standings. 20 games ago the league thought we were a .900 team.

I guess the point is a 40-game sample is a better indicator of who they are than either 20-game sample.

 

[Flair Hay]

To be fair Chevy has also got 1sts back with Ladd, Trouba and Copp.

Its not about having enough 1st round picks over the years.

Or selling in non playoff years.

It's about what kind of player could we get if we were willing to give up even 2 of those 3 1sts on a good young player.

Or how much is too much for a guy like Petterson considering we have burned three 1sts on rentals to fill the same slot the past six years.

I know we tried with PLD. Just saying that is a savage amount of draft capital on rentals that could have gotten us an elite player with some term in the right situation

 

[SensibleGuy]

I guess the point is a 40-game sample is a better indicator of who they are than either 20-game sample.

Yeah. Of course. An 82 game sample will be even better. We'll see how it all plays out. In the interim, this is a sports forum and we all like to make assessments and prognostications and so forth. If all it is is pointing to where we sit right now in the standings and saying "that's what we are" we might as well just take a break and come back when the season is over and discuss what happened.

 

[KingBogo]

Its not about having enough 1st round picks over the years.

Or selling in non playoff years.

It's about what kind of player could we get if we were willing to give up even 2 of those 3 1sts on a good young player.

Or how much is too much for a guy like Petterson considering we have burned three 1sts on rentals to fill the same slot the past six years.

I know we tried with PLD. Just saying that is a savage amount of draft capital on rentals that could have gotten us an elite player with some term in the right situation

But that draft capital is spread over too many years to achieve what we need. Chevy has always seemed to try and balance the draft sheet in the good and bad years. I remember looking at it in the past and we are one up on 1st round picks under Chevy. Chevy will need to make an aggressive hockey trade IMO.

 

[johnnyonthspot]

27-11-2 , i wouldn't say that record says typical of the Jets to lose i would say the opposite actually. It's a rare off night by Helly or we win in regulation.

Well not to be a Donny downer but take away the hot start and they are 11-10-2
I am not sure about you but that concerns me or makes me believe they really are about a .500 team

 

[Jet]

It's not an "incredible" standard, it's just noting that in the NHL it's consistency that matters, and Stanley still makes more mistakes than I would like a regular D to make, including taking penalties. If his deficits were offset by a really definable asset, that would be fine, but I don't see the benefit to offset the costs.

I have criticized Stanley plenty, but outside of some rust after coming back, he has played a very stable, puck moving game.

With the level of play of he and Heinola right now, I'm dressing Stanley if i want to win.

Heinola is doing pretty much nothing positive out there. Stanley is at least moving the puck well, generating some offense, and most of his mistakes are ones that practically every defenseman make. This isn't directed at you but some are working extremely hard to amplify everything negative he does and giving zero credit for the positives. I think he's actually playing better than Miller, and He's pretty close to Fleury, with the edge being skating.

I agree with you a lot, but not on this.

 

[johnnyonthspot]

we clearly aren't as good as a 17-3(nobody is) but to say this team is a .500 team is just plain wrong... we had a brutal stretch of travel and injuries where this team could hardly catch their breath.. have you not noticed that since the travel stopped ehlers/scheifele healed up the jets have been winning more games and looking a lot better doing it?

Until last night..let's take this 8 game homestand as a measuring stick. If they do not go 6-2 then I think even you will agree that they are not in a good place

I have criticized Stanley plenty, but outside of some rust after coming back, he has played a very stable, puck moving game.

With the level of play of he and Heinola right now, I'm dressing Stanley if i want to win.

Heinola is doing pretty much nothing positive out there. Stanley is at least moving the puck well, generating some offense, and most of his mistakes are ones that practically every defenseman make. This isn't directed at you but some are working extremely hard to amplify everything negative he does and giving zero credit for the positives. I think he's actually playing better than Miller, and He's pretty close to Fleury, with the edge being skating.

I agree with you a lot, but not on this.

I like your assessment of Stanley but having him out there defending a lead with a minute to go was indefensible add Pionk and Ehlers to the mix and disaster struck. Oh well but they are having a great regular season

 

[voyageur]

Well not to be a Donny downer but take away the hot start and they are 11-10-2
I am not sure about you but that concerns me or makes me believe they really are about a .500 team

It's almost to be expected though. You can't ride high tide forever. Jets started on time this year. Which allows them to mitigate the ebbs and flows. I think the standard for that start was that the Jets could play .500 hockey the rest of the year and still be comfortably in the playoffs.

Minnesota caught up for a minute but the injury bug is hitting them hard.

Colorado is playing their best hockey getting players back.

If the Jets are too successful on this home trip the risk is they could coast again. With a cushion. Definitely want to be firing on all cylinders at the right time of the year and that's April and May.


I think or hope the next impact is Samberg coming back, and it's a positive one.

 

[voyageur]

To be fair Chevy has also got 1sts back with Ladd, Trouba and Copp.

Stanley, Heinola and Lambert. Stan is probably the only one who will have some impact in the playoffs this year.

I don't like trading that 1st this year with Ehlers on his last contract year.

I'd rather see Chevy trade a forward prospect and a 2nd next year. If he goes another year without getting into the top 50 picks it's going to be hard to ever rebuild the defense. Unless he trades a quality forward.

I think Arny has to look at splitting up Nino and Lowry though. In spite of their success. Namestnikov might as well be a winger if he is not taking draws, he's in the middle for his speed, strong neutral zone skater, and defensive awareness.

I really don't mind the idea of Ehlers-Perfetti-Nino and Iafallo-Lowry-Namestnikov replacing Appleton to round out the top 9. That's where you are hedging on Nino having a greater top 6 value than Namestnikov, and Perfetti being able to succeed in a more sheltered C role.

Against Detroit it would be Lowry matching up against Larkin, Scheif taking on either Copp or Compher and probably generating some scoring chances, and Perfetti getting one of those two centers, who aren't likely to outskate him, if he plays the system right.

If the Jets have to go outside year after year to lose playoffs rounds and draft picks for 2Cs that reflects poorly on the team that Chevy himself has developed.

 

[Cotton Eye Joe]

Jets cannot have Stan or Ville in the lineup come playoff time if they hope to advance.
JoMo. ?
Slamberg. Pionk
Miller DeMelo

 

[Jet]

Jets cannot have Stan or Ville in the lineup come playoff time if they hope to advance.
JoMo. ?
Slamberg. Pionk
Miller DeMelo

Honest question, what is Miller doing better than Stan or Fleury? Bit picking a fight just genuinely want to know why you have that opinion.

For the record, I'm all for getting a 1LD to push Demelo down if the price or term is right.

 

[KingBogo]

Stanley, Heinola and Lambert. Stan is probably the only one who will have some impact in the playoffs this year.

I don't like trading that 1st this year with Ehlers on his last contract year.

I'd rather see Chevy trade a forward prospect and a 2nd next year. If he goes another year without getting into the top 50 picks it's going to be hard to ever rebuild the defense. Unless he trades a quality forward.

I think Arny has to look at splitting up Nino and Lowry though. In spite of their success. Namestnikov might as well be a winger if he is not taking draws, he's in the middle for his speed, strong neutral zone skater, and defensive awareness.

I really don't mind the idea of Ehlers-Perfetti-Nino and Iafallo-Lowry-Namestnikov replacing Appleton to round out the top 9. That's where you are hedging on Nino having a greater top 6 value than Namestnikov, and Perfetti being able to succeed in a more sheltered C role.

Against Detroit it would be Lowry matching up against Larkin, Scheif taking on either Copp or Compher and probably generating some scoring chances, and Perfetti getting one of those two centers, who aren't likely to outskate him, if he plays the system right.

If the Jets have to go outside year after year to lose playoffs rounds and draft picks for 2Cs that reflects poorly on the team that Chevy himself has developed.

To the bolded, that is why I think Chevy needs to try to solve the #2 center position in a hockey trade not with rentals. I think you take a chance on someone like Cozens, who has the pedigree, size, skating and skill set, but hasn't quite put it all together yet. Not much different when they took on a bit of risk with Vilardi.

 

[Cnile]

Just admit that Hellebuyck had a bad game. That’s a game he lost for us.

He’s more than made up for it over the last several seasons.

 

[voyageur]

Honest question, what is Miller doing better than Stan or Fleury? Bit picking a fight just genuinely want to know why you have that opinion.

For the record, I'm all for getting a 1LD to push Demelo down if the price or term is right.

IMO he plays pretty low event hockey. You see him in the rush from time to time. Last night got in for the back door chance. The game he was in the top 4, with Pionk on his offside, I notice he was a lot less aggressive than Pionk would have been in that spot. Sometimes it's good to be aggressive, but it's also where pucks get behind you if you miss.

I think Arniel probably goes back to Morrissey-De Melo, Samberg-Pionk, Stanley-Miller if he gets the chance, and that lineup was winning quite a bit, in spite of Stanley starting off slow.

 

[SUX2BU]

Honest question, what is Miller doing better than Stan or Fleury? Bit picking a fight just genuinely want to know why you have that opinion.

For the record, I'm all for getting a 1LD to push Demelo down if the price or term is right.

I’m guessing you mean 1RD cause Josh is our 1LD

 

[voyageur]

To the bolded, that is why I think Chevy needs to try to solve the #2 center position in a hockey trade not with rentals. I think you take a chance on someone like Cozens, who has the pedigree, size, skating and skill set, but hasn't quite put it all together yet. Not much different when they took on a bit of risk with Vilardi.

I understand that idea, but making those kind of trades midseason is not that easy to make. If you're Buffalo you want a RHD. Jets aren't putting Salomonsson on the table. Have to make pieces fit in big trades, and Chevy is not in panic mode where he sits. Nor has he ever traded any player off his team midseason in a hockey trade other than Kane and Bogosian and I suppose Brendan Lemieux. Job safety is one reason players stick around here.

 

[Cnile]

I have never liked Stanley’s game but it seems that he’s gaining confidence by the game.
He’s certainly had a long leash and I’m hoping that he’s had an aha moment.
He’s acquitted himself quite well the last 3 games and as a Jets fan that is encouraging.
Keep it up!