Salary Cap: Dr Dubas Cap Thread: He wants the Nurse

[eXile3]

If we get him we’ll have 82 games next season so we’ll all get a good look.

 

[MayorofWBS]

Pretty funny how many people care about adding cap to this team tbh.

It's also weird how many people insist that this team needs to keep acquiring picks and prospects suddenly have an issue with it now that they'd be taking back Nurse. I totally get being completely opposed to trading assets for Nurse, but if it's like Brazeau for Nurse and 2 2nds, what's the issue there?

It sucks that the market is so bad for LD that it makes sense to trade for Nurse, but that's the reality with this off-season and where the Penguins are at as an organization.

It's the contract term left along with the high AAV, 4 years for Nurse and 6 for EP that some people don't like. I'm not very keen on those terms for declining assets. If they had 2 years left, I wouldn't care. Liquid assets should be the name of the game during this transitional period until the 2-3 player new core is obtained.

 

[Koivunsons]

If we get him we’ll have 82 games next season so we’ll all get a good look.

84

 

[Peat]

I’m not arguing whether it was a good idea or not. I’m arguing that if NHL GMs thought Nurse was always this terrible defenseman, he never would have gotten the contract that he got in the first place. The same GM that gave him that contract is still a GM in the NHL.

It the same argument for whether he’ll have value in the future. Will there still be a dinosaur GM in the NHL in 2-3 years that gets aroused by the idea of trading for Nurse with the Penguins retaining? Yeah, I’d bet so. Until he loses that speed or becomes unplayable, his speed and size will create a market for him. Just probably not at $9.25 million.

Not just dinosaur GMs tbh. K'Andre Miller isn't all that removed from Nurse as a player archetype.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

I think the pens have had a lot of success rehabbing players that fit that player type. Also trust Muse to know how to fit that type of player in his system.

Turning Darnell Nurse into an effective top 4 defenseman would pay huge dividends in a trade in two years or so.

First of all, you're counting on Nurse regaining a ton of value because his contract is so terrible.

Second, Nurse will be 33 at that point. Diminishing returns because of his age even if he were to bounce back, which is anything but guaranteed.

Third, he has an NMC limiting the number of suitors and the size of the return.

Fourth, he's a bad fit. You're likely counting on him regaining form beside a riverboat gambler in Karlsson or Letang, which isn't a calculated risk for a "really low IQ" player.

With all those negatives, EDM better be awfully generous with the add ons.

 

[Ugene Magic]

I just can't wait until the Draft and July 1st and to an extent, pre-season, and see we never even thought about attaining Nurse.

 

[DesertedPenguin]

I’m not arguing whether it was a good idea or not. I’m arguing that if NHL GMs thought Nurse was always this terrible defenseman, he never would have gotten the contract that he got in the first place. The same GM that gave him that contract is still a GM in the NHL.

It the same argument for whether he’ll have value in the future. Will there still be a dinosaur GM in the NHL in 2-3 years that gets aroused by the idea of trading for Nurse with the Penguins retaining? Yeah, I’d bet so. Until he loses that speed or becomes unplayable, his speed and size will create a market for him. Just probably not at $9.25 million.

One GM gave him that contract. One. And the old boys network protects their own.

It's not proof of anything.

 

[KrisLetAngry]

You guys are f-ing weirdos sometimes with searching for people's old posts to try and gotcha them with their takes like 8 years after the fact. Or do you have people's posts saved up for the eventuality? I don't know what's worse.

I'm too lazy for that. I know I have bad takes at times and you can all free to search and pin me to the wall with them if you want.

Like yeah maybe Emp had a take that didn't age well years ago. Who gives a shit. He clearly has good takes sometimes too. None of us are f-ing wizards in here. If I cared to I could find a bad take from literally every single poster on here but I'm entirely too lazy to do so and don't give a shit. Judge his current opinions based on the merit of them. Stop trying to drag in dirty laundry to try and make him feel bad.

I think people just remember stuff. I also think EMP has a humiliation fetish. Though I think a few of us here have it.

When I see Nurse i see a 7 million dollar UFA defensemen that is a #4. He has warts to his game but he is probably the most affordable UFA Dman we can get to improve our team.

Through out the 9.25 Million cap hit and 7.25 million cash a year. He's a legit NHL defensemen

Interesting retention means we may be out of the market. I only want him cheap at full cap hit.

Personally.

I'd be way more upset if we paid value for Byram than added a 3rd to Graves for Nurse tbh.

Agreed. I do not want to pay the price to give Byram his UFA deal.

First of all, you're counting on Nurse regaining a ton of value because his contract is so terrible.

Second, Nurse will be 33 at that point. Diminishing returns because of his age even if he were to bounce back, which is anything but guaranteed.

Third, he has an NMC limiting the number of suitors and the size of the return.

Fourth, he's a bad fit. You're likely counting on him regaining form beside a riverboat gambler in Karlsson or Letang, which isn't a calculated risk for a "really low IQ" player.

With all those negatives, EDM better be awfully generous with the add ons.

I just want 2nd pair Nurse and if he sucks so bad he is 3rd pair he becomes tank Commander. We gotta hit the floor

 

[Empoleon8771]

Not just dinosaur GMs tbh. K'Andre Miller isn't all that removed from Nurse as a player archetype.

Exactly, these hyper athletic types are always desirable players until their athleticism goes. Nurse just has the added benefit of being big and physical too. Look at JJ, he was a regular NHL defenseman for another 4 seasons after the Penguins bought him out.

It’s actually this factor that would make me a bit surprised if the Penguins pull off Nurse in the first place. I can’t imagine they’re the only bidder and Dubas doesn’t seem like the type that would get into a bidding war for a 31 year old player. Yeah Nurse’s contract sucks, but Friedman has been adamant that there would be a notable market for him at like $7 million.

I feel like the only reason Nurse might end up with the Penguins is that they’re the only team on his NMC that can take on Nurse’s full salary without sending money back.

 

[TojoP]

It's the contract term left along with the high AAV, 4 years for Nurse and 6 for EP that some people don't like. I'm not very keen on those terms for declining assets. If they had 2 years left, I wouldn't care. Liquid assets should be the name of the game during this transitional period until the 2-3 player new core is obtained.

Exactly. Getting the same return for Nurse as we did for Clifton and Dumba feels bad. Getting a first for Nurse would feel OK. It's not the strategy that's a problem, it's the midling return.

 

[OtherThingsILike]

First of all, you're counting on Nurse regaining a ton of value because his contract is so terrible.

Second, Nurse will be 33 at that point. Diminishing returns because of his age even if he were to bounce back, which is anything but guaranteed.

Third, he has an NMC limiting the number of suitors and the size of the return.

Fourth, he's a bad fit. You're likely counting on him regaining form beside a riverboat gambler in Karlsson or Letang, which isn't a calculated risk for a "really low IQ" player.

With all those negatives, EDM better be awfully generous with the add ons.

Nurse's NMC ends after the 2026-27 season. For the last three seasons, it's a 10-team no-trade list, meaning there are feasibly up to 21 teams we could trade him to after July 1, 2027.

 

[Empoleon8771]

One GM gave him that contract. One. And the old boys network protects their own.

It's not proof of anything.

I have no clue how you can argue against the truth that NHL GMs put absurd value on Nurse type of defensemen. The list is absolutely massive of teams either trading a ton of assets or giving out huge contracts to these kind of guys.

 

[thevelvetfog]

I wonder if we can do like Nurse + 4th for Graves + Brazeau.

Opens up a forward spot. We get a minute muncher in the 2nd LH hole. And Edmonton can sell it by saying they are getting a 17 goal scorer.

I think this is a very plausible scenario. I'm hoping they want Novak (they definitely need another center) so we can pry away one of Pod, Savoie, or Howard in the deal and they can keep their 4th. I really don't like the idea of paying to get rid of Graves.

Nurse + Pod for Novak + Braz

Could also add Rakell and Graves to the mix to make it more appealing for both sides if needed.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Nurse's NMC ends after the 2026-27 season. For the last three seasons, it's a 10-team no-trade list, meaning there are feasibly up to 21 teams we could trade him to after July 1, 2027.

Ah, thanks!

 

[thevelvetfog]

Yeah, any Rust or Rakell trade (primarily Rust) is firmly in the "I'll believe it when I actually see it" camp for me at this point. So much "speculation" over the last couple of seasons of "wait until the TDL", "wait until the summer" stuff that never materialized.

Having said that, what about Rust to Edmonton as part of a bigger Nurse/Graves trade? Rust/Graves for Nurse/conditional 2nd (ie. becomes a 1st if Rust produces X amount for them)?

This is what I've been saying. They are in desperate need of secondary scoring as well as a center, so they could definitely use Rust/Rakell/Novak/Braz.

 

[Empoleon8771]

I'm not saying any of these moves were good, in fact most of these moves are flat out bad, but it's to emphasize the point for how much NHL GMs love these hyper athletic but dumb defensemen:

• Edmonton signed Nurse to an 8 year, $9.25 million AAV deal despite Nurse still being a RFA
• Philly traded pick #13, Hagg and a 2nd for Ristolainen
• Pittsburgh signed a 32 year old Johnson to a 5 year deal after he was getting healthy scratched in Columbus
• Pittsburgh signed a 35 year old Letang to a 6 year deal
• Montreal signed a 32 year old Matheson to a 5 year deal (I actually don't think this deal is bad for Montreal)
• Columbus traded a 1st and 2nd for Provorov and then gave him a long term, $8.5 million AAV deal as a 29 year old
• Florida traded Knight and a 1st for Jones despite him being a liability for years for Chicago and having a long-term deal at $9.5 million AAV (this one worked out amazingly for Florida though, the trade revitalized Jones' career)
• Carolina traded Morrow, a 1st and 2nd for Miller's RFA rights and then signed him to a $7.5 million AAV deal (this one also worked out great for Carolina, but people were downright shocked at the time of the trade and contract that Carolina did this)
• Nashville traded for Hague (which was a great trade for them) then signed him to a $5.5 million AAV deal, despite him being a regular healthy scratch for Vegas in 2024-2025
• Boston signed a journeyman Zadorov who had played for 5 teams in before age 29 a 6 year, $5 million AAV deal

You can keep going and adding onto this list. Most NHL GMs absolutely froth at the mouth at the opportunity to acquire guys who are strong skaters and have good size, even if their on-ice play doesn't warrant it.

This is not to say in any way that adding Nurse would be a good move because other teams make these kind of moves. Rather, it's saying that unless Nurse falls off a cliff, there will be a market for him in the future especially if the Penguins are willing to retain on him. The scenario right now is lining up for the Penguins to get Nurse for nothing, because he has a full NMC and Edmonton needs the cap space. But when the cap rises and Nurse's NMC turns into a 10 team NTC, I think they will have plenty of interested teams with retaining his deal down.