Does skating speed and foot speed translate?

[rangersfansince08]

Or is it so different that there is no relation? If there is a correlation what kind of 40 times would guys like McDavid, Larkin, Kreider run?

 

[TGWL]

Or is it so different that there is no relation? If there is a correlation what kind of 40 times would guys like McDavid, Larkin, Kreider run?

There's skating speed and acceleration. Top speed is usually from power in your legs, although constantly moving your feet can help if you don't have powerful legs.

Quick feet can get you accelerating faster, although powerful legs can get you that first push off you need to get going. So no, being fast in the 40 doesn't completely translate to ice.

 

[rangersfansince08]

There's skating speed and acceleration. Top speed is usually from power in your legs, although constantly moving your feet can help if you don't have powerful legs.

Quick feet can get you accelerating faster, although powerful legs can get you that first push off you need to get going. So no, being fast in the 40 doesn't completely translate to ice.

Thanks. Does it translate better the other way?

 

[tarheelhockey]

A little bit, because there’s a common element of having strong musculature in the legs and core.

But strong skating has a lot to do with technique. All the muscles in the world don’t translate to an iota of technique.

 

[57special]

I always thought so. My son(college athlete) was a fast runner, and an unorthodox, but very fast skater. Once he got some technique training he could keep up to guys that were drafted, even though he was not a serious hockey player after about 14yo.

However, a friend of mine, an ex NHL'er, said that skating and running speed have less correlation than you'd think. He had average speed as a NHL'er(which equals blindingly fast compared to most hockey players), but average footspeed as a recreational athlete growing up playing baseball, soccer, and the like. He thinks that skating technique and training can make a big difference in speed.

 

[TGWL]

Technique absolutely matters. I mean it matters when you run as well. But having good Technique and power in you legs will give you strong powerful strides and on ice won't translate to running because it's different.

 

[not a troll]

I want to know the hot dog king’s 40.

 

[EdJovanovski]

Definitely.
Skating mechanics & technique obviously can increase your speed greatly, but it still operates within the realm of what your athletic ceiling is. For example I didn't play ice hockey until later than some of my friends but I've always been an incredibly fast sprinter. After a couple years even though they were still technically better skaters than me, I was faster than some of them because of that athletic advantage.

 

[bigdog16]

Theres different kinds of fast. The most drastic I could think of would be watching Nik Ehlers skate in comparison to Jack Eichel. Both are very fast skaters but in very different fashions

 

[JuJu Mobb]

Some players may not have the best foot speed but have a great explosion to compensate.

 

[kmart]

There's skating speed and acceleration. Top speed is usually from power in your legs, although constantly moving your feet can help if you don't have powerful legs.

Quick feet can get you accelerating faster, although powerful legs can get you that first push off you need to get going. So no, being fast in the 40 doesn't completely translate to ice.

wrong !

Technique absolutely matters. I mean it matters when you run as well. But having good Technique and power in you legs will give you strong powerful strides and on ice won't translate to running because it's different.

again wrong, its not a matter of technique as we have to assume its on the same level for everyone and in that case more powerful legs are an advantage if we are talking about speed... be it food speed or skating speed and its not really about top speed anyway as it doesnt matter if u take a few laps to reach ur top speed as bures/mcdavids beat u between the blue lines. - the question about skating speed in hockey is actually a question about who can accelerate faster which is a debate about muscle memory and muscle cross sections.

 

[1989]

Some of the best/fastest skaters in the league have very choppy, unorthodox styles. Other great skaters have smoothness built in to their strides. I think technique, while important, mostly speaks to efficiency and edgework versus pure speed.

 

[Dicky113]

Quick feet is important for acceleration, and especially for rapid cross overs where each push makes you accelerate faster.
But straight ahead speed is actually about lengthening strides and extending the leg back as far as possible, so usually you don’t want quick feet as it means you aren’t extending and will develop an inefficient stride.

so yes, quick feet = speed when starting and turning, but quick feet hurts speed when going north south.

 

[OilersCoffeeArtBeer]

I won 100 and 200 meter dashes in junior high. I had a very good acceleration and top speed while playing hockey. My edge work was not the best but then again, they didn't really teach that when I was younger.
So yes, I'm gonna say it translates.

 

[LakeLivin]

It seems like there would be some correlation given how fast twitch muscle fibers work. With no appreciation for how much impact technique plays regarding speed, I have no idea how strong that correlation might be.

 

[DingDongCharlie]

The body mechanics aren’t similar. Would it typically translate though?Yes probably as both require the same muscle fibres. There’s slow twitch muscle fibres which lead to power and fast twitch that lead to endurance. I’d assume the fastest skaters fall somewhere in the middle. Power for explosion and endurance to maintain a fast glide over time.

Pavel Bure is an example of slow twitch. Highly explosive (probably the most explosive for initial start of his era) but when recording lap times, he was fast but not the fastest.

Sami Kapanen wasn’t as explosive but overall was insanely fast on lap times due to being able to reach high speed and maintain it over distance.

McDavid is a combination of explosive and high speed. That’s why he’s the best skater in my opinion

 

[LakeLivin]

Quick feet is important for acceleration, and especially for rapid cross overs where each push makes you accelerate faster.
But straight ahead speed is actually about lengthening strides and extending the leg back as far as possible, so usually you don’t want quick feet as it means you aren’t extending and will develop an inefficient stride.

so yes, quick feet = speed when starting and turning, but quick feet hurts speed when going north south.

I hear what you're saying but it seems that's more about technique. Aren't you confounding "quick feet" a bit with stride length? I mean, if two players at speed have the same stride length, and one of them completes each stride 20% faster, he's going to have more speed, no?

 

[PROGFAN66]

Or is it so different that there is no relation? If there is a correlation what kind of 40 times would guys like McDavid, Larkin, Kreider run?

I think this is a good question to be honest. Me personally having skated there are differences in the basic motions of skating and running. I think having a strong lower body though helps in how fast you are in skating and running.

Obviously running is a more natural motion than skating. You need to learn how to skate and there is more technique involved. Sorry fans of other sports. The first time I attempted to skate I fell more times than I have in all the sports combined I have attempted.

To answer your question. Running you are going one step forward at a time and in skating you are going side to side to go forward for the most part. So if you are fast runner this would not automatically make you a fast skater in my opinion. The motion and balance are different.

It sort of like if can shoot a puck at 90mph that not necessarily mean you will be able to throw a baseball pitch at 90mph.

 

[turkleton85]

when talking about a pure, olympic style sprint and the correlation to poentially fast skating, there isnt't that much transfer. In sprinting, your legs move up and down in a quarter circly mothion before you pull your heel up again as soon as you have transfered your energy to that ground. While making contact to the ground, your almost exended hamstrings "pull" you forward along the ground while your psoas (hipflexors) pull your leg up

In skating, your hamstrings play a lesser role, the abductors play a more important role togehter with your quads and glutes. To transfer energy to the ground through your skates, you have to push off your legs diagonally back.

 

[Dicky113]

I hear what you're saying but it seems that's more about technique. Aren't you confounding "quick feet" a bit with stride length? I mean, if two players at speed have the same stride length, and one of them completes each stride 20% faster, he's going to have more speed, no?

Yes.
But I guess what I’m saying (as a skating coach) is that I’m often trying to get kids to take half as many strides but to lengthen them; so moving your feet slower but engaging your thighs, pushing longer and recovering to neutral makes you go much faster (straight line) than taking twice as many strides but not doing those things. There are quite often players that you can barely see their feet they are moving so quickly but it looks like they are skating in quicksand. Conversely there are players that take three strides and blow past them.

that was my point; foot speed does not equate to straight line speed

 

[123offtheglass]

Definitely.
Skating mechanics & technique obviously can increase your speed greatly, but it still operates within the realm of what your athletic ceiling is. For example I didn't play ice hockey until later than some of my friends but I've always been an incredibly fast sprinter. After a couple years even though they were still technically better skaters than me, I was faster than some of them because of that athletic advantage.

Can say the same, it's a large advantage from a dead stop.

It's obviously different but some of that athleticism translates, reason why players do off-ice training & why it's especially important to stay diverse & not specialize in sports too early growing up, it's advantageous. Some of the motor patterns or motor unit/fiber recruitment is similar for instance.

 

[Atoyot]

If you're a fast runner but have never skated, you're not going to be a fast skater. If you're a fast skater, good chance you have the strength and twitch muscles to be a fast runner. Skating is a very difficult thing to learn properly if you don't start young.

 

[EdJovanovski]

I think OP meant does running & skating speed translate, especially given his example asking how fast the fastest skaters would run. Not does how fast your feet move determine how fast you skate lol, you could move your feet really fast and go slow if you wanted to. Longer fluid strides are considered technically better, some players have interesting strides though. Artemi Panarin sort of runs on ice, very strange strides but he gets around well. Probably because of the fact growing up he wore adult sized skates his grandpa found in a dumpster and had to wear his shoes inside of the skates because of how big they were

 

[EdJovanovski]

If you're a fast runner but have never skated, you're not going to be a fast skater. If you're a fast skater, good chance you have the strength and twitch muscles to be a fast runner. Skating is a very difficult thing to learn properly if you don't start young.

But if you take a fast runner and a slow runner, give them both skating lessons so their technique are at the same level, the fast runner will be the much faster skater

 

[TGWL]

wrong !



again wrong, its not a matter of technique as we have to assume its on the same level for everyone and in that case more powerful legs are an advantage if we are talking about speed... be it food speed or skating speed and its not really about top speed anyway as it doesnt matter if u take a few laps to reach ur top speed as bures/mcdavids beat u between the blue lines. - the question about skating speed in hockey is actually a question about who can accelerate faster which is a debate about muscle memory and muscle cross sections.

Sure...