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Do You Think The Oilers Have Done Enough To Help McDrai Win The Cup?

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PainForShane said:
He also does other things, like 200 foot game, locker room leadership, helping make undrafted linemates into decent top 6 players etc.

No one cares about this Crosby obsession some of you McDavid fans seem to have. I'm sure Sid respects Connor, and I'm sure Connor respects Sid. I'm also sure most if not all hockey appreciate both players and realize we've been extremely fortunate to be able to watch them in their prime (if we've had that chance, which hopefully most of us have been able to do)
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Crosby would be Cupless on Edmonton. Not even he could overcome their utter incompetence.
 
Coffey said:
Nah, don't get it twisted.
I don't mention Crosby unless someone else does, which always happens in threads like these.
I just gotta remind them that what they want McDavid to do, Crosby hasn't always done either.
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No, you were the one who brought up Crosby this time without any prompting from me. It's in the post history.

In my opinion, trying to trash Crosby doesn't make you look good or help your argument. In my opinion, it just makes you look desperate. I'm sure I'm not the only one who feels this way
 
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PainForShane said:
No, you were the one who brought up Crosby this time without any prompting from me. It's in the post history.

In my opinion, trying to trash Crosby doesn't make you look good or help your argument. In my opinion, it just makes you look desperate. I'm sure I'm not the only one who feels this way
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But Crosby would still be Cupless on Edmonton. That fact hasn't changed.
 
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PainForShane said:
No, you were the one who brought up Crosby this time without any prompting from me. It's in the post history.

In my opinion, trying to trash Crosby doesn't make you look good or nor does it help your argument. In my opinion, it just makes you look desperate. I'm sure I'm not the only one who feels this way
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I was referring to this comment "not go pointless in the most important game of his life." And yea, you didn't mention Crosby, but plenty of others have using that same argument.
That's why I posted my stats.

Either way, this conversation isn't going anywhere.
 
I like to shit on Edmonton as much as anyone here, but don’t they have the best record in the league going back to the Knoblauch hire?

Credit where credit is due, it seems since 2021 they’ve done reasonably well at building around McDavid (1 conference finals, 1 SCF). But to be frank I think a lot hinges on the next two playoffs for McDavid to stay.
 
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waitin425 said:
Fact:
1. A thing that is known or proved to be true.

It is not known and will never be proven to be true. Therefore, what you have stated is a.....

Hypothesis:
1. a supposition or proposed explanation made on the basis of limited evidence.
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Fact: The Oilers are much more poorly managed and run than the Penguins. Not exactly a leap of logic to say that Crosby would not drag this carcass of a front office to glory.
 
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KeithIsActuallyBad said:
Fact: The Oilers are much more poorly managed and run than the Penguins. Not exactly a leap of logic to say that Crosby would not drag this carcass of a front office to glory.
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Okay...Ill give that to you as a fact. But that fact is a piece of evidence used to form your hypothesis.

Fact: No one knows for sure if prime, rookie, or current Crosby drafted by the 2015 Edmonton Oilers would have won a Stanley Cup by now.

The fact here is in the statement "No one knows". If someone does know than they are a clairvoyant and I don't believe in that mumbo jumbo.
 
waitin425 said:
Okay...Ill give that to you as a fact. But that fact is a piece of evidence used to form your hypothesis.

Fact: No one knows for sure if prime, rookie, or current Crosby drafted by the 2015 Edmonton Oilers would have won a Stanley Cup by now.

The fact here is in the statement "No one knows". If someone does know than they are a clairvoyant and I don't believe in that mumbo jumbo.
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Okay, then it is extremely likely that he would not have. Hell, the Oilers probably would've passed on Crosby and Malkin had they the ability to draft them.
 
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Absolutely not

They have never had a reliable goaltender

Although the D-core is better, it was a complete disaster for most of their time there. It's better but still not truly elite.

The depth has always been an issue. People will bring up Hyman/RNH, and it would be valid if they were producing without McDavid + Draisaitl. I don't consider them depth, rather complementary pieces to play with McDavid and Draisaitl.

Best example I can think of is the old Hawks teams of the 10s, or when the Penguins added Kessel/Hagelin, it was guys capable of producing at a very respectable level, without the help of the teams top guys.

The good news, despite all of that, they were 1 goal away from winning the Stanley Cup. But overall, the GMs have been pretty horrendous.
 
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AvroArrow said:
Absolutely not

They have never had a reliable goaltender

Although the D-core is better, it was a complete disaster for most of their time there. It's better but still not truly elite.

The depth has always been an issue. People will bring up Hyman/RNH, and it would be valid if they were producing without McDavid + Draisaitl. I don't consider them depth, rather complementary pieces to play with McDavid and Draisaitl.

Best example I can think of is the old Hawks teams of the 10s, or when the Penguins added Kessel/Hagelin, it was guys capable of producing at a very respectable level, without the help of the teams top guys.

The good news, despite all of that, they were 1 goal away from winning the Stanley Cup. But overall, the GMs have been pretty horrendous.
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As an Oiler fan, I would be a lot more comfortable with one more 2nd pair defensemen, and another goalie. I think forward depth is fine. There's always room for improvement, but I think it could be fine if the other issues are fixed.
 
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KeithIsActuallyBad said:
Okay, then it is extremely likely that he would not have. Hell, the Oilers probably would've passed on Crosby and Malkin had they the ability to draft them.
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I'm just having fun. Way too many variables to consider things in the past.

I believe McDavid probably ends up, if he isn't already, better than Crosby. But, I also believe that if he doesn't win a Cup then he will not have had a greater career than Crosby from a historical perspective.

I don't care if Edmonton wins a cup, although I will cheer for them under a few different circumstances. But, I do want McDavid to win a cup. It would be a shame if he didn't.

I also really....really.....want McDavid to win a gold with Canada in 2026. He has been robbed of those opportunities and we as fans have been robbed of the opportunity to watch Prime McDavid, Prime MacKinnon, Prime Makar and near Prime Crosby on the Olympic stage.

Think about Crosby for a minute and the historical moments of his career. Hockey fans will always remember him raising that cup for the first time -- as well as the 2nd and 3rd times. We will always remember the "Golden Goal".

McDavid's stats are ridiculous.....and some of his plays that have reached highlight reels are memories we all have. But, IMO nothing he has done to date will rival what Crosby has done and the historical significance of those moments.

I am rooting for McDavid to get those moments too. I believe he deserves them.
 
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They are in the mix but still overrated by media. Vegas, Dallas, Florida at least as good as them on paper. Plus a dozen other teams who could give them a series. Timely goaltending usually determines who wins the Cup.
 
PainForShane said:
You clearly don't understand what I'm talking about, despite me repeatedly presenting my claim / supporting arguments in different ways.

Meanwhile, Copp is literally (and obviously) in your top 6, he's 5th on your team in average 5v5 ice time (among forwards). And as of the most recent lines, he'll start next game playing alongside Cat and Kane, just like I said. Daily Faceoff screenshot below (taken just now).

I regret deciding to engage with you man. This conversation has been a complete waste of time, for everyone.

View attachment 961852
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Justin Abdelkader used to play on the top line for Detroit. Was he a top line forward?

Ceci is second on the sharks in ice time… he is a top pair D?

Or do teams simply have to play players where the roster allows?

What an utterly ridiculous comment :laugh:
 
PainForShane said:
He also does other things, like 200 foot game, locker room leadership, helping make undrafted linemates into decent top 6 players etc.

No one cares about this Crosby obsession some of you McDavid fans seem to have. I'm sure Sid respects Connor, and I'm sure Connor respects Sid. I'm also sure most if not all hockey fans appreciate both players and realize we've been extremely fortunate to be able to watch them in their prime (if we've had that chance, which hopefully most of us have been able to do).
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can’t you see, the question of who’s better between Crosby and McDavid is of great importance very single day. I wouldn’t be able to live my day without it being answered!.
 
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I think if the Oilers want to take a no nonsense push for the Cup they need a top 4 d-man, a goalie, and another top 6 forward unless Podkolzin can become more consistent offensively. I love his game but the Oilers need 1 more player in their top 6 who isn't named Draisaitl and McDavid that can add an offensive spark without them running the show. Arvidsson seems to be coming on and Kane will be back at some point also so they might be solid come playoff time in that area.
 
can we bump this after the TDL? We're on pace to have a decent amount of cap space for additions, so let's see what JJ and SBow do with it
 
Probably going to get some flack for this. McDavid is more uniquely talented but Crosby seems like the guy who lifts his team more. Obviously you can win with both, Crosby just seems more of a glue guy. McDavid seems more like a genius pianist who plays his own tune to his own beat, despite having a band around him. That being said Edmonton should have put a better band around him.
 
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NikF said:
Probably going to get some flack for this. McDavid is more uniquely talented but Crosby seems like the guy who lifts his team more. Obviously you can win with both, Crosby just seems more of a glue guy. McDavid seems more like a genius pianist who plays his own tune to his own beat, despite having a band around him. That being said Edmonton should have put a better band around him.
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An interesting take.

I think the NHL is massively better and has more legitimate talent than even 10 years ago. (My opinion, using the eye test)

McDavid is incredible but cannot overcome the mistakes of his management and team.

I think McDavid will be remembered as a different kind of elite than Crosby. But I don’t think he has had any fault in the Oilers not having won a cup with him.
 
Cup or Bust said:
I think if the Oilers want to take a no nonsense push for the Cup they need a top 4 d-man, a goalie, and another top 6 forward unless Podkolzin can become more consistent offensively. I love his game but the Oilers need 1 more player in their top 6 who isn't named Draisaitl and McDavid that can add an offensive spark without them running the show. Arvidsson seems to be coming on and Kane will be back at some point also so they might be solid come playoff time in that area.
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Well, they did just sign Klingberg (which to me seems like a great low-risk high reward type of signing). And like you said Kane should be ready for playoffs.

I guess Edm mgmt really does suck
 
Well they did sign Klingberg. A true unicorn. A dman only usable north of the opponent's blue line. Happy days.
 
they're winning this year 99 percent sure about it with Pickard. kane comes back and plays well it's 100 percent certain
 
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