Do we buy-out Richards and make a play for Stastny?

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

And he will. As of right now he's nowhere near ready to be a 2nd line center on a contending team.

Well, with Richards, Stepan, and Brassard ahead of him, I don't see the room for him to make an impact.

Richards is OK, but he definitely should not be kept moving forward because of the lack of an immediate replacement. He doesn't provide enough to justify it, IMO. Brassard is becoming an important part of the locker room/chemistry on this team with Zucc, IMO. I'd keep him over Richards for sure, and I think he'd play just as well at 2C as Richards has.

The most dangerous forwards we have are wingers, so I really don't think Richards to Miller will be as much of a downgrade as you expect. Stepan also has room to improve, so that could also help lessen the blow.

 

[mas0764]

Says who?

Says everyone on this board you are arguing with on this subject.

That's the whole reason.... if we thought Brad Richards or Paul Stastny meant legit Cup contention, I assure you, there would be no opposition to keeping/signing him, recapture provisions be damned.

Obviously, there are a lot of people who don't see this team as a contender yet without a center upgrade. I'm one of them.

Or at least, as you pointed out, without another elite winger.

We just traded for MSL. Our defense is leaps and bounds better than Pittsburgh's (so is our goaltending). I'm more scared of Boston than Pittsburgh, but I don't think that MSL has been here long enough to get a good gauge on how well we can compete with them.

Our defense and goaltending has been leaps and bounds better than Boston and Pittsburgh for a couple seasons now and it hasn't mattered much, we are consistently beaten by those teams.

If MSL takes this team to another level, we can re-consider. Based on the available evidence, I don't think we're that close.

Hank may have 6-8 years left. But are you seriously suggesting that this team will be remotely the same in 6-8 years? We have no idea who will leave, who will get hurt, who will break out (and demand a huge contract), etc.

Right, so all the more reason to prolong your window by making financially prudent moves. The best teams in every sport do not overpay talent unless it's truly, truly elite. The bad teams are the ones who scramble in free agency to overpay marginal players and then get pennies on the dollar in return.

The other thing is, I'm not even convinced we'd be that much worse off without Richards.

You have to deal with the cards you currently have. We have a very good team that can do some real damage if Hank gets hot in the playoffs. This is absolutely a Cup contending team if Hank plays as well as he should play.

Well I'd say he has the next 3-4 months to prove that to us. In all his playoff runs so far, we've never had the talent in front of him for his stellar play to matter. If he still can't take this team over the hump, on his Xth try, I would say that strategy may be one no longer worth pursuing.... and that it may be time to make plan A getting an elite center in here.

 

[Beer League Sniper]

Looking at lists of young RFA Cs over the next couple seasons yields some intriguing names.

ROR
Berglund
B. Schenn
Kadri
Johansson

You would have to think one of those guys might be available for a decent price.

 

[silverfish]

Looking at lists of young RFA Cs over the next couple seasons yields some intriguing names.

ROR
Berglund
B. Schenn
Kadri
Johansson

You would have to think one of those guys might be available for a decent price.

Forgot about Berglund. I'd make a big push for him. Johansson, too - but I don't see that happening. No to Kadri and Schenn, but that's me.

 

[Beer League Sniper]

I think Miller remains wildly overrated on these boards. He's hardly solidified himself as an every-day NHL third-liner, and people are penciling him into a full-time top-9 center spot on a team looking to compete?

I don't think so.

I'm as excited as anyone about Miller, but young Cs need time to grow into the role. That time is normally spent on the wing, since defensive coverages and responsibilities for a winger are generally much simpler. To simply throw Miller in the deep end with no viable backup plan is the height of lunacy.

 

[kovazub94]

I think that we should trade for a top notch, young center, a top notch young defenseman, and a top notch young GM. I have no idea what we would trade, who we would trade with, and what people I'd trade for. So let's just let someone else fill in those less important aspects.

You're being facetious in this subject. There is no scenario that retaining Richards is a good strategy for the Rangers. Even sitting pat with Stepan / Brass for a bit (until a good option avails itself) is a better option. How big of a downgrade is it compared to Stepan / Richards one-two combo anyway? Shouldn't it be an opportunity to evaluate Miller / Fast as a 3rd line combo, at least at the start of next season?

Otherwise plenty of other ways to proceed re. upgrade for 1C / 2C should be available if the organization (not myself personally) itches to make such upgrade. For example, going for an all-star 1C for a package that features Stepan (+ additional high value asset(s)) could be an option. Similarly going for a good 1C for a package that features Brass is another option. Can't give you any names - I don't do hypothetical trades since I don't watch much hockey beyond where NYR players / prospects are involved - however based on the value of assets going the other way, it should make you feel confident that such trade options should be available.

Again, the point is that Richards buy out must happen if the Rangers don't want to hold their collective breath every time he steps on the ice for the next 6 years.

 

[n8]

if Statsny is your replacement plan, then nope. Also, you'll need Richards around if you want to resign MSL after next season. And you'll definitely want MSL around the season after that when Stamkos is UFA.

 

[mas0764]

if Statsny is your replacement plan, then nope. Also, you'll need Richards around if you want to resign MSL after next season. And you'll definitely want MSL around the season after that when Stamkos is UFA.

.... but you'll have no cap space to sign Stamkos if you keep Richards.

 

[silverfish]

.... but you'll have no cap space to sign Stamkos if you keep Richards.

Or Kovalchuk!!!

 

[BlueshirtBlitz]

Well, with Richards, Stepan, and Brassard ahead of him, I don't see the room for him to make an impact.

Richards is OK, but he definitely should not be kept moving forward because of the lack of an immediate replacement. He doesn't provide enough to justify it, IMO. Brassard is becoming an important part of the locker room/chemistry on this team with Zucc, IMO. I'd keep him over Richards for sure, and I think he'd play just as well at 2C as Richards has.

The most dangerous forwards we have are wingers, so I really don't think Richards to Miller will be as much of a downgrade as you expect. Stepan also has room to improve, so that could also help lessen the blow.

This is kind of where I fall when it comes to this.

I wouldn't be upset if we overpaid for Stastny- at the very least, having him and Stepan give you two 50+ point center's who are very responsible defensively. There's plenty of upside in Stepan, too. That's a great center core for your top 6.

However, Stastny will want a lot of money- money that can either go to a better player OR an equivalent player who brings a game different than Steps, as Steps and Stastny are very similar.

I'm not a fan of Brass at 2C, but I think he could replace Richards just fine. Considering MSL/Nash will be the driving force on that line, I don't see how he can **** it up too bad.

 

[eco's bones]

oofobon, pls


How would you propose fitting either Richards or Stastny under the cap?

Which is a very good question. Too many big contracts at any given time and it comes out of the team's depth one way or the other. The Rangers have some prospects who can fill some holes but the well isn't deep. The Rangers have been getting by in the last couple years by plugging holes with vet UFA's. IMO--getting rid of Richards should be a given--whether to add Stastny is not--but for those who are determined to replace Richards with Stastny it would be nice to see a projectable/realistic salary chart.

 

[JimmyG89]

Get rid of Richie. Need a capable 3C who can be physical and someone reliable in his own end while putting up 30-40 points. I think Miller can do that next season. Bring in a vet to support him who is a C/LW if he cannot make it at that spot. Solves a couple issues that way. Use the cap space to find a scoring winger or an offensive defender who can play the PP. Keep Stepan and Brassard. Both show me they are top 6 guys. The wingers we have will help them on offense.

 

[Thirty One]

Get rid of Richie. Need a capable 3C who can be physical and someone reliable in his own end while putting up 30-40 points. I think Miller can do that next season. Bring in a vet to support him who is a C/LW if he cannot make it at that spot. Solves a couple issues that way. Use the cap space to find a scoring winger or an offensive defender who can play the PP. Keep Stepan and Brassard. Both show me they are top 6 guys. The wingers we have will help them on offense.

I'd like Marcel Goc for that role.

 

[SixGoalieSystem]

I'd like Marcel Goc for that role.

Very much agree with this. Now I'm not a big fan of bringing in Stasny, but I think the team would look pretty solid if we did this. (Won't work if the cap doesn't get close to 71):

FORWARDS
Chris Kreider ($2.100m) / Paul Stastny ($7.250m) / Martin St. Louis ($5.625m)
Mats Zuccarello ($3.100m) / Derek Stepan ($3.075m) / Rick Nash ($7.800m)
Carl Hagelin ($2.250m) / Marcel Goc ($2.250m) / Benoit Pouliot ($1.600m)
Dominic Moore ($1.400m) / Zenon Konopka (Brian Boyle) ($2.250m) / Daniel Carcillo ($1.000m)
DEFENSEMEN
Dan Girardi ($5.500m) / Ryan McDonagh ($4.700m)
Marc Staal ($3.975m) / Kevin Klein ($2.900m)
Raphael Diaz ($1.400m) / John Moore ($1.350m)
Justin Falk ($1.025m) /
GOALTENDERS
Henrik Lundqvist ($8.500m)
Cameron Talbot ($0.563m)
BUYOUTS
Derek Dorsett ($0.300m)
Wade Redden ($0.000m)
Brad Richards ($0.000m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(estimations for 2014-15)
SALARY CAP: $71,100,000; CAP PAYROLL: $69,911,750; BONUSES: $0
CAP SPACE (21-man roster): $1,188,250

 

[Ail]

Very much agree with this. Now I'm not a big fan of bringing in Stasny, but I think the team would look pretty solid if we did this. (Won't work if the cap doesn't get close to 71):

FORWARDS
Chris Kreider ($2.100m) / Paul Stastny ($7.250m) / Martin St. Louis ($5.625m)
Mats Zuccarello ($3.100m) / Derek Stepan ($3.075m) / Rick Nash ($7.800m)
Carl Hagelin ($2.250m) / Marcel Goc ($2.250m) / Benoit Pouliot ($1.600m)
Dominic Moore ($1.400m) / Zenon Konopka (Brian Boyle) ($2.250m) / Daniel Carcillo ($1.000m)
DEFENSEMEN
Dan Girardi ($5.500m) / Ryan McDonagh ($4.700m)
Marc Staal ($3.975m) / Kevin Klein ($2.900m)
Raphael Diaz ($1.400m) / John Moore ($1.350m)
Justin Falk ($1.025m) /
GOALTENDERS
Henrik Lundqvist ($8.500m)
Cameron Talbot ($0.563m)
BUYOUTS
Derek Dorsett ($0.300m)
Wade Redden ($0.000m)
Brad Richards ($0.000m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(estimations for 2014-15)
SALARY CAP: $71,100,000; CAP PAYROLL: $69,911,750; BONUSES: $0
CAP SPACE (21-man roster): $1,188,250

Buying out Dorsett? Signing Konopka? Where is JT Miller who is already too good for Hartford? Jesper Fast is right behind him. So many things about this roster makes no sense.

 

[Tawnos]

^^

It's more than a little uncertain, at the moment, that we will see a cap over $70m next year. That roster, more than likely, will not fit under the salary cap. I wouldn't be surprised if we needed to buyout Richards just to be able to ice a full team next season. It's going to be close. So close that, once Richards is bought out, they might be able to bring in a $4-5m player.

 

[SixGoalieSystem]

Buying out Dorsett? Signing Konopka? Where is JT Miller who is already too good for Hartford? Jesper Fast is right behind him. So many things about this roster makes no sense.

Obviously we're looking for JTM to do the job, but come on. Are you really confident he will be ready? What if he still needs more time? I would not want to go in to next year with Miller as a lock as the 3 C. If miller does earn the spot, one of the acquired C's can be traded.

If Richards, Brass, Boyle are gone, you need center depth. Goc and Konopka supplies that. I especially like Konopka for his faceoffs and he'll probably be cheaper than Boyle.

As for Dorse I don't think he has a lot to contribute anymore, and if they can't find a trade, I think it makes sense to buy him out to get some of his cap hit off the books when it's obviously is going to be tight.

 

[SixGoalieSystem]

^^

It's more than a little uncertain, at the moment, that we will see a cap over $70m next year. That roster, more than likely, will not fit under the salary cap. I wouldn't be surprised if we needed to buyout Richards just to be able to ice a full team next season. It's going to be close. So close that, once Richards is bought out, they might be able to bring in a $4-5m player.

I am aware of this, which is why I mentioned it at the start of the post.

 

[Tawnos]

Obviously we're looking for JTM to do the job, but come on. Are you really confident he will be ready? What if he still needs more time? I would not want to go in to next year with Miller as a lock as the 3 C. If miller does earn the spot, one of the acquired C's can be traded.

If Richards, Brass, Boyle are gone, you need center depth. Goc and Konopka supplies that. I especially like Konopka for his faceoffs and he'll probably be cheaper than Boyle.

As for Dorse I don't think he has a lot to contribute anymore, and if they can't find a trade, I think it makes sense to buy him out to get some of his cap hit off the books when it's obviously is going to be tight.

Why is Brassard going to be gone? That's a decision you made, but the team is more than likely going to resign him. His QO is $3.7m, but you might be able to get him to take a little less if you offer him term. I'm perfectly fine going into the pre-season with Miller and Lindberg as our 3C options and, if neither of them can hack it, making a deal to shore up the position early in the year.

That lineup you wrote up looks worse than the one we have right now, and that's my biggest problem with it. Replacing Richards with Stastny doesn't upgrade the team.

 

[Thirty One]

Obviously we're looking for JTM to do the job, but come on. Are you really confident he will be ready? What if he still needs more time? I would not want to go in to next year with Miller as a lock as the 3 C. If miller does earn the spot, one of the acquired C's can be traded.

If Richards, Brass, Boyle are gone, you need center depth. Goc and Konopka supplies that. I especially like Konopka for his faceoffs and he'll probably be cheaper than Boyle.

As for Dorse I don't think he has a lot to contribute anymore, and if they can't find a trade, I think it makes sense to buy him out to get some of his cap hit off the books when it's obviously is going to be tight.

I like the idea of signing Goc and having Miller/Fast/Bourque et al fighting it out for a spot.

Either:

XXXX - Miller - XXXX
Moore - Goc - XXXX

or

XXXX - Goc - XXXX
Fast - Moore - XXXX

 

[SixGoalieSystem]

Why is Brassard going to be gone? That's a decision you made, but the team is more than likely going to resign him. His QO is $3.7m, but you might be able to get him to take a little less if you offer him term. I'm perfectly fine going into the pre-season with Miller and Lindberg as our 3C options and, if neither of them can hack it, making a deal to shore up the position early in the year.

That lineup you wrote up looks worse than the one we have right now, and that's my biggest problem with it. Replacing Richards with Stastny doesn't upgrade the team.

Brassard is most likely gone if they go after Stastny (which again I'm not really in favor of. This was an "if they go after Stastny" suggestion). It would be a very tight fit under the cap.

As for 3C, I would rather get a player like Goc signed early and then look too deal him if he isn't needed, rather than betting on Miller to be ready and having to go through FA leftovers or giving up assets to find a replacement.

 

[Ail]

Obviously we're looking for JTM to do the job, but come on. Are you really confident he will be ready? What if he still needs more time? I would not want to go in to next year with Miller as a lock as the 3 C. If miller does earn the spot, one of the acquired C's can be traded.

If Richards, Brass, Boyle are gone, you need center depth. Goc and Konopka supplies that. I especially like Konopka for his faceoffs and he'll probably be cheaper than Boyle.

As for Dorse I don't think he has a lot to contribute anymore, and if they can't find a trade, I think it makes sense to buy him out to get some of his cap hit off the books when it's obviously is going to be tight.

If you don't think Miller can play 3C you haven't watched him play in either Hartford or New York. That's besides the point because even if he doesn't play 3C he can fit on a wing somewhere. He is done in the AHL after this season. Unless he absolutely comes in to camp and blows, he will not be in the AHL next year.

You're overpaying Stastny, paying Konopka at all for some reason I can't even begin to fathom because if you let Boyle walk, but re-sign Moore, then he is your 4C. Then you sign Goc as well. I didn't even initially see that you let Brassard go, which considering the C situation is awful. Then your solution to bringing in a completely unnecessary amount of FAs is to try and trade one when Miller makes the team, which he definitely will.

The only way Brassard should go is if they can somehow package him with other assets for a C upgrade giving you:

Upgrade
Stepan
Miller
Moore/Boyle/Lindberg(Unlikely)

or

Stepan
Upgrade
Miller
Moore/Boyle/Lindberg(Unlikely)

Otherwise you need to pay Brassard. Even if you trade his rights and sign Goc, Konopka is still redundant with Moore and Miller available.

They could find someone to take Dorsett for a pick, there's no reason to buy him out.

 

[JimmyG89]

I'd like Marcel Goc for that role.

Been personally advocating for him myself. Always stood out when on Florida. Hope he doesn't command too much. Wanted him as a trade deadline move. Pens got him first. Solid skater too. I would also want Dom Moore back too. Has shown signs if being an above average 4th liner or fill in 3rd liner. Same with Boyle. He will cost more.

Filling the bottom 6 with centers who are versatile is important. Helps with injuries. Boyle, Goc, Moore, Miller. I'd want 3 of them on next year's team. Add Trevor Lewis to that list as well. C/LW more viable for the 4th line.

 

[SixGoalieSystem]

Listen. I'm a fan of Miller. He dominates in the A and does good things in the NHL too, but he still has a ways to go, especially defensively. I have a lot of faith in the kid, but that doesn't mean he's ready to play an important role over 82 NHL games plus playoffs.

I am overpaying Stastny because that's what you have to do to get him. Again, I'm not advocating signing him, but if you do it'll cost something in the area of my estimation.

I let Brass go because of the cap situation with Stastny coming in and bring in cheaper FA's. I don't know about you, but I like having two guys on the fourth line with solid face off ability. Goc and Konopka are examples, not absolutes.

As for Dorse, if they find a taker there's obviously no need for a byuyout.

Either way, I'm not married to this roster, so I'm not going to spend the rest of my night defending it

 

[Bleed Ranger Blue]

Bingo.

And I'd rather go for it full bore than half ass it. You'll never win by half assing it but you'll at least have a shot if you really go for it.

I think giving Paul Stastny $50M is half-assing it.