Disney Star Wars General Discussion

[kingsfan28]

I don't think we can say any decision with Solo was a right decision. That was just a complete failure.

When you tell Lucasfilm you will shoot the film this way, then turn up on set [sometimes hours late] and shoot it a completely different way or in many cases not know how to shoot a scene at all, that is a big problem. For example, there were days when they needed to shoot several scenes to keep on budget [the Fort Yspo scenes] and the production moving and they couldn't do it which was costing Lucasfilm a ton of extra money per day. The best thing to happen to Lorde and Millers career was getting fired from that movie. Had it come out the way they were shooting it, it would've been the biggest Star Wars bomb of all time. Ron Howard save that movie.

 

[Osprey]

There's only so much you could have done with those OT characters given the actors ages though. You can't really have them running around on adventures like the OT. And I'm not sure those people that loved those characters would have been any happier if they weren't in it at all. There is a way to pass the torch from Han, Leia, and Luke to Poe, Finn, and Rey. They just screwed it up.

That's what I was getting at, that there was a way to include them and pass the torch that didn't involve having them run around as the heroes of the films. I was agreeing with Richard's examples.

 

[kingsfan28]

Which brings up the question, why the hell did they hire them to begin with?

they were a good young directing duo that pitched them an idea for Solo they liked. The problem was they didn't know how to execute it and got in over their heads. Kennedy gets all the flack, but Bob Igor, the pres. of Disney admitedly said it was on him for the hiring, and basically didn't know they were gonna try to 21 Jump Street a star wars movie. You can afford to do 20-30 takes in a comedy when it only cost say 10k and hour. With Star Wars it may cost close to 500k an hour with all the extras in hair, make up and costumes and expensive sets. You can't spend 3 days shooting a single scene and still not get it right, then say we'll fix it in the edit.

 

[x Tame Impala]

I still think a major issue with the new trilogy was that JJ ABrams (and subsequently Rian Johnson in the next film) did no world-building or setup to explain how we got from the end of RoJ to the beginning of TFA.

We went from Han, Luke, Leia, & Co. defeating Darth Vader, the Emperor, and the evil Empire so peace was restored to the galaxy...then The Force Awakens starts and it's all gone. No explanation. Just gone. Not even a hint of a backstory, just a brand new war for control of the galaxy between the First Order and the Rebellion.

I personally thought it was really weak and it was basically Disney saying "f*** you here's another Star War, don't ask questions"

 

[bleedblue1223]

I still think a major issue with the new trilogy was that JJ ABrams (and subsequently Rian Johnson in the next film) did no world-building or setup to explain how we got from the end of RoJ to the beginning of TFA.

We went from Han, Luke, Leia, & Co. defeating Darth Vader, the Emperor, and the evil Empire so peace was restored to the galaxy...then The Force Awakens starts and it's all gone. No explanation. Just gone. Not even a hint of a backstory, just a brand new war for control of the galaxy between the First Order and the Rebellion.

I personally thought it was really weak and it was basically Disney saying "**** you here's another Star War, don't ask questions"

Yeah, they just wanted to reboot ANH, and they just thought everyone would just go along with the ride and not question what lead to the events. The original Star Wars didn't have this issue because there was nothing before it.

Imagine if WW1 and WW2 were movies, and after the WW1 set of movies ends with the Treaty of Versailles, the next movie in the series immediately picks up with this group called the Nazis invading Poland, and there is nothing presented about what happened in Germany between WW1 and WW2 and why the Nazis rose to power or who the Nazis even are.

The ST didn't need much time to setup where the galaxy is, but you at least have to try to make it convincing without outside media and head canon.

 

[bleedblue1223]

And RoS just makes it more complicated. If Palpatine created Snoke, then what was the purpose of the Sith Fleet and why did Palpatine have to offer that to Kylo, since Palpatine was basically the real mastermind behind the First Order. If that isn't the case, and Snoke just took control of the First Order and had his own free will from Palpatine, then why did the First Order just let him control everything. The First Order just doesn't make a ton of sense based on what we learned with Palpatine and Snoke.

 

[x Tame Impala]

And RoS just makes it more complicated. If Palpatine created Snoke, then what was the purpose of the Sith Fleet and why did Palpatine have to offer that to Kylo, since Palpatine was basically the real mastermind behind the First Order. If that isn't the case, and Snoke just took control of the First Order and had his own free will from Palpatine, then why did the First Order just let him control everything. The First Order just doesn't make a ton of sense based on what we learned with Palpatine and Snoke.

The whole cloning thing doesn't make any sense to begin with. So Palpatine can just clone what's essentially a Sith Lord and make him super powerful but he needs Kylo and Rey still?

My biggest hope for any future Star Wars projects is that they don't handcuff themselves to old characters anymore. It leads to so many instances of stupid writing and ret-conning

 

[KallioWeHardlyKnewYe]

I still think a major issue with the new trilogy was that JJ ABrams (and subsequently Rian Johnson in the next film) did no world-building or setup to explain how we got from the end of RoJ to the beginning of TFA.

We went from Han, Luke, Leia, & Co. defeating Darth Vader, the Emperor, and the evil Empire so peace was restored to the galaxy...then The Force Awakens starts and it's all gone. No explanation. Just gone. Not even a hint of a backstory, just a brand new war for control of the galaxy between the First Order and the Rebellion.

I personally thought it was really weak and it was basically Disney saying "**** you here's another Star War, don't ask questions"

Yeah, this is very clear now. I fully admit I thought the fact that The Force Awakens was basically a remake of Star Wars was actually kinda clever at the time. What better way to reset, you know? And then I really liked The Last Jedi. It has issues, but overall I like it. Then we get to The Rise of Skywalker, which I pretty strongly rejected. Despite some concerns I was willing to give them the benefit of the doubt after the first two movies to see if they could land it. Bad bet. It clearly failed and the seeds of that failure go back to TFA.

The utter lack of creativity is pretty appalling. The thing I ultimately hate the most was the decision to basically redo Rebels vs. Empire set-up again just with new terms. That’s the original sin. It wipes out the triumph of the original trilogy for what amounts to really nothing. I am re-reading the Timothy Zahn Thrawn Trilogy and that very effectively sets up a New Republic that’s struggling to stabilize itself amid a lingering threat from the Empire. I’m not saying they should have adapted that specifically, but as a very basic set-up, it works! You keep the old victories, you have a new, ominous challenge. You keep your old actors in the background and give the new characters a new challenge. That’s much better than basically resetting everything back to the same point. (Though I have to note -- and I’m sure this has been pointed out -- but Palpatine’s secret fleet in TROS isn’t that far an idea from the Katana Fleet in Zahn’s books).

 

[RandV]

Yeah, this is very clear now. I fully admit I thought the fact that The Force Awakens was basically a remake of Star Wars was actually kinda clever at the time. What better way to reset, you know? And then I really liked The Last Jedi. It has issues, but overall I like it. Then we get to The Rise of Skywalker, which I pretty strongly rejected. Despite some concerns I was willing to give them the benefit of the doubt after the first two movies to see if they could land it. Bad bet. It clearly failed and the seeds of that failure go back to TFA.

The utter lack of creativity is pretty appalling. The thing I ultimately hate the most was the decision to basically redo Rebels vs. Empire set-up again just with new terms. That’s the original sin. It wipes out the triumph of the original trilogy for what amounts to really nothing. I am re-reading the Timothy Zahn Thrawn Trilogy and that very effectively sets up a New Republic that’s struggling to stabilize itself amid a lingering threat from the Empire. I’m not saying they should have adapted that specifically, but as a very basic set-up, it works! You keep the old victories, you have a new, ominous challenge. You keep your old actors in the background and give the new characters a new challenge. That’s much better than basically resetting everything back to the same point. (Though I have to note -- and I’m sure this has been pointed out -- but Palpatine’s secret fleet in TROS isn’t that far an idea from the Katana Fleet in Zahn’s books).

I don't see anything other than a loose coincidental connection here. I read these in the 90's but from what I recall the 'Katana Fleet' was a derelict armada from the clone wars that was known about but lost. It plays up on two elements - first space is very big so you could park a fleet like this out in interstellar space and without the coordinates no one would ever find it, and second even if you did find it having the manpower to staff it was another matter entirely. It leaves you with the question of how exactly did a fleet get there in the first place and left completely intact, but otherwise it was pretty sound. RoS' secret fleet on the other hand, you could write a book on the amount of flaws it presented.

Really what I've always liked to point out but never see anyone else do is for all the grief fans gave Disney for making the EU officially non-canon, did no one complain that Lucas unofficially did the same thing with the PT? The "Clone Wars" was a vague reference made in A New Hope, Zahn picked that up and made it pivotal plot element of his trilogy, but then Lucas did the PT and made the Clone Wars something completely different.

 

[x Tame Impala]

Yeah, this is very clear now. I fully admit I thought the fact that The Force Awakens was basically a remake of Star Wars was actually kinda clever at the time. What better way to reset, you know? And then I really liked The Last Jedi. It has issues, but overall I like it. Then we get to The Rise of Skywalker, which I pretty strongly rejected. Despite some concerns I was willing to give them the benefit of the doubt after the first two movies to see if they could land it. Bad bet. It clearly failed and the seeds of that failure go back to TFA.

The utter lack of creativity is pretty appalling. The thing I ultimately hate the most was the decision to basically redo Rebels vs. Empire set-up again just with new terms. That’s the original sin. It wipes out the triumph of the original trilogy for what amounts to really nothing. I am re-reading the Timothy Zahn Thrawn Trilogy and that very effectively sets up a New Republic that’s struggling to stabilize itself amid a lingering threat from the Empire. I’m not saying they should have adapted that specifically, but as a very basic set-up, it works! You keep the old victories, you have a new, ominous challenge. You keep your old actors in the background and give the new characters a new challenge. That’s much better than basically resetting everything back to the same point. (Though I have to note -- and I’m sure this has been pointed out -- but Palpatine’s secret fleet in TROS isn’t that far an idea from the Katana Fleet in Zahn’s books).

I think a newly victorious Republic struggling to establish itself while a subset of the Empire is nipping at their ankles would’ve been a significantly more compelling concept. There probably could’ve been all sorts of themes regarding nuance of regime change and the good vs evil those in power are inherently subject to.

Speaking of, I wish they gave Finn a lot more character development. We’ve never seen an ex-Stormtrooper before and instead of doing something truly interesting with it, it never amounted to anything more than him knowing something about a McGuffin because he used to mop the freaking room that it’s in.

 

[bleedblue1223]

The really weird thing to me is the difference between the New Republic in the ST and then how's it's partly shown in The Mandalorian. In the ST, I guess they meant for the New Republic to be like the United Nations, a completely toothless organization. While in The Mandalorian, it was still considered a joke at times, the way Cara Dune was running from them, and the way the X-Wings came in and blew up that space station, it presents the New Republic as being a new government with military force.

I'm completely fine with the galaxy wanting to go pacifist and having a toothless governing body like the UN as the main head, but the audience needs to at least see some of that.

 

[KallioWeHardlyKnewYe]

I think a newly victorious Republic struggling to establish itself while a subset of the Empire is nipping at their ankles would’ve been a significantly more compelling concept. There probably could’ve been all sorts of themes regarding nuance of regime change and the good vs evil those in power are inherently subject to.

Speaking of, I wish they gave Finn a lot more character development. We’ve never seen an ex-Stormtrooper before and instead of doing something truly interesting with it, it never amounted to anything more than him knowing something about a McGuffin because he used to mop the freaking room that it’s in.

Absolutely! Or even a well-established Republic dealing with some sort of challenge. Don't even have to change the Ben/Kylo origins necessarily. He could still be a Vader-worshiping leader of bad dudes. Some of the elements are already there in the story to play with.

What a waste.

 

[KallioWeHardlyKnewYe]

I don't see anything other than a loose coincidental connection here. I read these in the 90's but from what I recall the 'Katana Fleet' was a derelict armada from the clone wars that was known about but lost. It plays up on two elements - first space is very big so you could park a fleet like this out in interstellar space and without the coordinates no one would ever find it, and second even if you did find it having the manpower to staff it was another matter entirely. It leaves you with the question of how exactly did a fleet get there in the first place and left completely intact, but otherwise it was pretty sound. RoS' secret fleet on the other hand, you could write a book on the amount of flaws it presented.

Really what I've always liked to point out but never see anyone else do is for all the grief fans gave Disney for making the EU officially non-canon, did no one complain that Lucas unofficially did the same thing with the PT? The "Clone Wars" was a vague reference made in A New Hope, Zahn picked that up and made it pivotal plot element of his trilogy, but then Lucas did the PT and made the Clone Wars something completely different.

Not all the details match, but I was thinking in a very broad sense -- here's a giant unused fleet tethered together by technology sitting on the edges of space that the good guys don't want the bad guys to operate.

As to the second question, I'm probably not a good one to answer. I've never been a hard liner on canon v. non-canon especially in Star Wars which has had a pretty inconsistent history on that front. The stories still exist and I can still return to them. It is a little weird though.

 

[KingBran]

As a big SW buff growing up the only thing Disney has done that I really loved with SW is Rogue One and the Mandolorian. Episodes VII-IX were meh. I actually really liked Solo. It was just a great sci-fi adventure movie. I am not sure about it feeling like SW or Han Solo but it's a fun ride.

 

[discostu]

Like I said before keep checking their website and I would also follow this other website called WDW News Today. If the opening hours change they will update their website and Twitter account right away once it's confirmed.

Just a loop back on this, hours did change, and I'm now planning on heading to the park an hour earlier to be there for opening. Thanks for the heads up. Will continue to monitor in case it changes further, but even if it did, I don't think I could get there any earlier with everyone. I'd just risk it at that point.

Initially, Jedi training and Star Tours (via fastpass) were going to be the main Star Wars focus we were going to have, but, I'm thinking I may attempt the line for Smugglers Run. It doesn't appear to go beyond an hour most days. We're there on a Saturday, so that may impact it, but I think my kids can handle an hour wait. My original assumption was that we'd be looking at closer to 2 hours, which would just eat up too much of the day.

 

[RobBrown4PM]

Who is this guy and just WTF!?

 

[MadDevil]

Who is this guy and just WTF!?

I usually don't mind Campea, but he's completely out to lunch with his Ahsoka hatred.

 

[bleedblue1223]

Who is this guy and just WTF!?

Yeah, posted about that in the Clone Wars thread. He's acting like all the SW fans that he hates in his head. This is why I don't respect people like this, completely hypocritical.

 

[Jussi]

Yeah, posted about that in the Clone Wars thread. He's acting like all the SW fans that he hates in his head. This is why I don't respect people like this, completely hypocritical.

He has a thing about certain characters getting jobbed. Another of his rants was how he won't watch Supergirl because of how they've jobbed Superman. I'm guessing he saw some out of context clips from a meme and took it as truth. The part where Kal-El tells Kara that she's the stronger one, which meant mentally because of how many loved one's she's lost. Although one could make the case for physically as well because she left Krypton as pre-teen/young teen girl and because the amount of solar radiation they store in their Kryptonian body is constant, she should be at least level.

 

[The Professional]

I thi k the next SW project should be a anthology film centered on Vader. Set it after episode iii, have it follow vader as he hunts down the last jedis across the galaxy and further descends to the dark side, cementing his reputation as feared imperial enforcer that he is by ep iv. Call it Vader a star wars story or something, make it dark with possibly an r rating and it would be a huge success.

 

[MadDevil]

While I've always wanted a Vader hunting Jedi movie/series, I think they need to get away from OT characters, at least for a while.

 

[x Tame Impala]

I thi k the next SW project should be a anthology film centered on Vader. Set it after episode iii, have it follow vader as he hunts down the last jedis across the galaxy and further descends to the dark side, cementing his reputation as feared imperial enforcer that he is by ep iv. Call it Vader a star wars story or something, make it dark with possibly an r rating and it would be a huge success.

I’ve been hoping for this for years

 

[LeafsNation75]

Just a loop back on this, hours did change, and I'm now planning on heading to the park an hour earlier to be there for opening. Thanks for the heads up. Will continue to monitor in case it changes further, but even if it did, I don't think I could get there any earlier with everyone. I'd just risk it at that point.

Initially, Jedi training and Star Tours (via fastpass) were going to be the main Star Wars focus we were going to have, but, I'm thinking I may attempt the line for Smugglers Run. It doesn't appear to go beyond an hour most days. We're there on a Saturday, so that may impact it, but I think my kids can handle an hour wait. My original assumption was that we'd be looking at closer to 2 hours, which would just eat up too much of the day.

Just so you know starting February 19th you can now make FastPass+ for Smugglers Run.

Additional Millennium Falcon: Smugglers Run FastPasses Just Released For Disney's Hollywood Studios

However if you are planning to go on yourself they have a single rider line, which would be shorter than the standby line. Although the only disadvantage of the single rider line is you miss the pre show with Hondo Ohnaka.

Also I think Smugglers Run is a good attraction, however if you are not assigned the job of one of the two pilots it can be disappointing. I have been on twice and the first time I was a gunner where you press buttons to shot at everything around you, the other time I was an engineer where you press buttons and I honestly don't know if doing that has an effect.

The much better atrraction is Rise of The Resistance, although to get on that you need the My Disney Experience app and to be inside Hollywood Studios before they open to get on a boarding group. The two times I went on it this past December I had boarding group 97 and was inside the park just after 7:00 AM.

Edit: I just realized you and your kids would want to go on Smugglers Run so forget everything I said about using the single rider line.

 

[Blackhawkswincup]

Thoughts on this?

Anyone familiar with work of these guys as I am not

 

[bleedblue1223]

Until production is actually going and we know that the movie would be released, I don't care what directors are linked to Star Wars because chances are, they will be fired or they'll quit.