Discussion for ALL Things for Brooklyn Bound Islanders: Part V

[Hi ImHFNYR]

CMPunk wants to buy the team lol. (Probably not seriously but it was amusing to me that he mentioned it. Somehow I doubt he has "buy a sports franchise" money)

 

[MatthewBarnabysTears]

At what price point? The current tux prices most likely can't sustain the current payroll.

Ticket prices really aren't usually that necessary a component of a team's operating budget -- in the modern sports world, most team revenue comes from cable contracts, revenue sharing of league money, and corporate money (like, advertising, luxury boxes). For the most part, teams bilk the fans because it's profitable, not because it's necessary to sustain the operation.

 

[IslesFanatic]

the attendance is better, but lets be serious....there was <14k there last night....that is still terrible by most teams' standards

pretty close to 14k. Thats an excellent night for a weekday game. They sellout the weekend games. They went from 8k during the week to almost 14k. Pretty damn impressive if you ask me. If you win they will come.

 

[Bones45]

The BK crowd is getting nervous!!!!

 

[2ndGenIslander]

I don't think you should expect a complete turnaround after 25 games for a lame duck franchise after nearly 30 years of futility and mismanagment in an antiquated building. You don't rebuild a whole generation of lost fanbase overnight especially when you are about to pack up and move away from any new prospective STHs in that area.

If the rebuild had been completed 3 or 4 years earlier and we had some decent success (as in winning a few playoff rounds) I don't think the move ever happens and we would be near capacity every night. I have said it before it is incumbent upon the seller to produce a product that is desirable. There is nothing wrong with the potential fanbase out here in 2 of the wealthiest counties in the country (yes even despite the troubles with the county and taxes), they just made the product taste so bad for so long that many switched to the rangers or other sports.

As soon as the really serious talk of moving began before the announcement, I realized this was the perfect storm between the terrible team we had iced for years, the ownership not investing in the team, the coliseum in decay, the economy tanking with NIFA stepping in, nearly zero media attention and those terrible politicians who couldn't see the forest through the trees. If one or two of those things had gone better, there would be a new building in nassau/suffolk.

The 13,888 on a Tuesday last night would only be the tip of the iceberg if this team had remained and had sustained success. I have had 4-6 season tickets for a number of years now and often needed to make numerous calls to friends last minute to get people to use all of them for weekday games. This year, I am turning away people left and right as there is a real buzz and interest is growing. Many people are just discovering or rediscovering them which is sad since just when it should be the dawn of a new era for those of us who have lived through the dark years they are about to say goodbye.

it's definitely a humbling experience when you're waiting in the rain on line to take a piss in a porto-potty outside of the physically worst arena in sports

 

[BKIsles]

pretty close to 14k. Thats an excellent night for a weekday game. They sellout the weekend games. They went from 8k during the week to almost 14k. Pretty damn impressive if you ask me. If you win they will come.

Agree 100%. The crowd last night was as good as most weekend crowds last year. I expect a lot of capacity games over the college winter break into the second half of the season.

Also, I'm not sure how some of these other franchises sell out games because when I watch the highlights on NHL network, nearly all the places have open seats. I'm specifically thinking of the Red Wings game last night, there were thousands of open seats and it was allegedly a sell-out. Maybe that was a rare instance due to the power issues the town was having, but these franchises must sell more corporate tix or something to get such high attendance numbers.

 

[The Underboss]

the attendance is better, but lets be serious....there was <14k there last night....that is still terrible by most teams' standards

13,888 was the announced attendance according to Howie. I mentioned it in the GDT.

 

[stranger34]

CMPunk wants to buy the team lol. (Probably not seriously but it was amusing to me that he mentioned it. Somehow I doubt he has "buy a sports franchise" money)

Lol! Where did you see that?

My avatar is a screen shot of him and his microwave from his documentary... I noticed he had an Islanders sticker on his microwave while watching it...

Not sure what he likes about the Isles? I would think he should be a Black Hawks die hard

 

[stranger34]

http://espn.go.com/nba/attendance

Oh and btw the nets are under 94% attendance in their 3rd year of their brand new arena with tough draws Detroit and the Sixers coming up (I have freebies to the sixers game, ty Islanders). I wonder where that attendance will go if they continue to be bad for a few years. The Knicks are at 100%. I honestly hope I am wrong since I want the team to remain strong and leaving is a done deal, but since there was no public demand for a hockey team in a borough that is a basketball town and only a short subway ride from MSG, should we really expect the islanders to be selling out in barclay's at the insane prices they are looking for season tickets? Only time will tell but I am not optomistic and you can see small comments coming out of the media, such as this outclause, that are not all positive about the outlook.

The lowest isles ticket probably is higher than a lowest nets ticket on stub hub these days.

Brooklyn is not a silver bullet

 

[Space Herpe]

Question:

After the move to Barclay's, there are supposed to be 6 games at the Coli every year.

Can this start in the 15-16 season? Or will the Coli still be under renovations? I also wonder the implications of the supposed new size of the Coli, and how that will impact the 6 games at the 'Ol Barn.

 

[Bones45]

Question:

After the move to Barclay's, there are supposed to be 6 games at the Coli every year.

Can this start in the 15-16 season? Or will the Coli still be under renovations? I also wonder the implications of the supposed new size of the Coli, and how that will impact the 6 games at the 'Ol Barn.

I have heard the same, but really haven't heard anything concrete about it. Anything solid from Isles?

 

[PJGooch]

Question:

After the move to Barclay's, there are supposed to be 6 games at the Coli every year.

Can this start in the 15-16 season? Or will the Coli still be under renovations? I also wonder the implications of the supposed new size of the Coli, and how that will impact the 6 games at the 'Ol Barn.

This was never concrete, as far as I know. It's Ratner's way of appeasing Long Island fans during the transition. How soon it gets done depends on how much faith you have in Nassau County politics.

Best case: The stars align, the Coliseum is actually renovated and the Isles play six games here maybe 4-5 years from now.

Worst case: A Newsday article titled "Ratner, Nassau don't see eye to eye on Coliseum plans" is published about a year from now, and the Coliseum gets a slight renovation in 2030.

 

[blitzkriegs]

Question:

After the move to Barclay's, there are supposed to be 6 games at the Coli every year.

Can this start in the 15-16 season? Or will the Coli still be under renovations? I also wonder the implications of the supposed new size of the Coli, and how that will impact the 6 games at the 'Ol Barn.

That's called marketing. It ain't happening. Maybe preseason, but regular season. Don't think so.

 

[stranger34]

That's called marketing. It ain't happening. Maybe preseason, but regular season. Don't think so.

certainty on message boards is always so helpful...

just like that iron-clad lease...

 

[Islesin93*]

I really hope they are not idiots and make the new Coliseum have a capacity of at least 15,000, like they did with the Barclays Center when they made it a basketball centered building because they assumed there would not be a hockey team playing there, hope they do not have another "oh we did not know" moment

but the reality is the Isles are not going back to the Island long term, people saying "win and they will come" so what? are you saying this team has to be in first place 100% of the time and than they will get good crowds? if they are average or bad we should expect the 9,000 attendances again?

I do not think Long Island is a good place for a sports franchise, to many people move out of the Island when they are a certain age, and the lack of businesses to buy up seats like they do in pretty much every other city in sports

If there was a LIRR stop right next to the Coliseum that can get you to and from Manhattan and other NYC areas in under an hour that would help, but I am pretty sure we are never gonna know if that is what would have made the team stay on the Island

 

[stranger34]

I really hope they are not idiots and make the new Coliseum have a capacity of at least 15,000, like they did with the Barclays Center when they made it a basketball centered building because they assumed there would not be a hockey team playing there, hope they do not have another "oh we did not know" moment

but the reality is the Isles are not going back to the Island long term, people saying "win and they will come" so what? are you saying this team has to be in first place 100% of the time and than they will get good crowds? if they are average or bad we should expect the 9,000 attendances again?

I do not think Long Island is a good place for a sports franchise, to many people move out of the Island when they are a certain age, and the lack of businesses to buy up seats like they do in pretty much every other city in sports

If there was a LIRR stop right next to the Coliseum that can get you to and from Manhattan and other NYC areas in under an hour that would help, but I am pretty sure we are never gonna know if that is what would have made the team stay on the Island

another person who can see the future.

This is a fun game.

The reality is that no one knows what will happen and people should feel free to speculate if they feel so inclined.

 

[Strummergas]

another person who can see the future.

This is a fun game.

The reality is that no one knows what will happen and people should feel free to speculate if they feel so inclined.

But if you were a betting man, what situation would you most likely put money on?

Isles moving to Brooklyn and staying for at least 25 years.

OR

Isles playing in Barclays for 5. Ratner pulls a fast one on Nassau County and manages to renovate the Coliseum to NHL capacity even though his proposal states it will be downsized, and the Isles move back after they're kicked out of Barclays.

Now remember, you have a lot of money riding on this, so I urge you to use your head and not your heart when making this decision.

 

[denis]

This is what is "known" from articles in Newsday and elsewhere:

1) the deal for Islanders games in the Coliseum is part of the agreement Ratner has with Nassau. If they don't happen, he's subject to a $1 million fine.

2) Nassau has already signed off, as has NIFA. It's now (or will be by the end of the year) in Hempstead's hands.

3) Construction is supposed to start in August. If it doesn't, fines to the county begin to accumulate.

4) Goal is to open the building by the "2016 holidays"

http://www.newsday.com/long-island/...-events-center-to-renovate-coliseum-1.5897194

http://espn.go.com/blog/new-york/hockey/post/_/id/14726/report-coliseum-renovation-plans-pass

http://www.newsday.com/long-island/...ion-to-hempstead-town-by-year-s-end-1.9364312

http://www.billboard.com/biz/articl...ooter-braun-charlie-walk-rosie-perez-and-nick

 

[ScaredStreit]

Attendance doesn't matter at arenas like Barclay's & MSG. Corporate suites & sponsorships do--and they get a hell of a lot more money for those than we ever could at NVMC.

People just don't get this point. Well said.



I would also add that the Isles have had PATHETIC attendance for the past 20 years or so. So it's like we had that going for us on the island.

 

[blitzkriegs]

certainty on message boards is always so helpful...

just like that iron-clad lease...

"Iron-clad" is marketing from the spinmeister owner.

 

[blitzkriegs]

The reality is that no one knows what will happen and people should feel free to speculate if they feel so inclined.

That's true, no one does know. However, when Nassau gets the corporate suites sold, corporate seats filled, and people paying more than $25 a night for tix, and an arena not filled with 8yr olds, let me know.

So, on LI the Isles get LI only - which hasn't worked. But, but, but...when Wang 'invested' in the team for the LHP the 2nd year he jacked up tix prices more consistent with the rest of the league. What did fans do? Balked, and the walk-up market (5k+ easy) died. The Isles had to tease with every night promotions to drive attendance. Something unheard in this era of sports. Yet, the team was a 'playoff' contender.

In Brooklyn, Isles get NYC + LI. Trimming off LI and pushing them to weekends is just swapping out the same weekend numbers. The weekday business is non-existent for the Isles for a zillion reasons.

I can't wait for Bob's furniture to sponsor the Isles in Brooklyn...Wait, that spot will be Chase, Amex, Capital One, whomever. Not Bethpage Federal Credit Union...

 

[PJGooch]

This is what is "known" from articles in Newsday and elsewhere:

1) the deal for Islanders games in the Coliseum is part of the agreement Ratner has with Nassau. If they don't happen, he's subject to a $1 million fine.[/url]

$1 million fine if the games are denied by the NHL or the Rangers -- unless I'm reading it wrong. There doesn't seem to be a fine if Ratner is simply full of crap.

 

[blitzkriegs]

$1 million fine if the games are denied by the NHL or the Rangers -- unless I'm reading it wrong. There doesn't seem to be a fine if Ratner is simply full of crap.

There's a reason this is not done. The NFL does it for market expansion reasons and pulls out of or to adjacent markets on a very limited basis. This would be in a former 'home' territory and on a routine basis.

The LAK play games at the Forum annually, haven't you heard? Same with SJ playing games at the Cow Palace. Two relics within the similar geographic market, yet were left behind for better pastures.

 

[Abe Vukota]

But if you were a betting man, what situation would you most likely put money on?

Isles moving to Brooklyn and staying for at least 25 years.

OR

Isles playing in Barclays for 5. Ratner pulls a fast one on Nassau County and manages to renovate the Coliseum to NHL capacity even though his proposal states it will be downsized, and the Isles move back after they're kicked out of Barclays.

Now remember, you have a lot of money riding on this, so I urge you to use your head and not your heart when making this decision.

You're arguing against emotion with reason. You can't possibly win.

Every single source connected to the team has said there's no chance of the team moving back to LI.

"Those people are hacks."

Then logic dictates that the team and county would have reached an agreement if there was serious interest on both sides.

"The team is doing better, so now there's definitely interest!"

The team has a 25 year lease. It's hard to break professional sports leases, and the lease with SMG had its own out clause. Despite years of trying, the team wasn't able to get out from under the lease. They couldn't even leave when chunks of the arena began raining down onto the ice.

"That was different."

If the team leaves Brooklyn, there's no reason it wouldn't go elsewhere.

"Bettman won't let it happen! He's trustworthy and cares about hockey history too much to allow it! Cable contract cable contract cable contract!"

The Coli renovation has already been planned. It isn't being built to support a pro hockey franchise.

"Barclays wasn't built for hockey! All they have to do is change the proposal to include 12,000 more seats, and since it was so easy for Wang to get approval, it'll be just as simple for Ratner!"

The team hasn't drawn well in Nassau since 1986, even when things were going okay. Things got better, but they weren't ever selling out regularly. The team has averaged 13,872 fans in attendance during the last five playoff years.That's 85% capacity without much supplementary corporate sales revenue.

"That's because the team wasn't a surefire Cup contender! Unfair comparison!"


Just accept that the team is moving back to bankrupt Nassau County, a place that can't support one single ****ing Islanders bar, let alone an entire franchise. Or maybe going to Suffolk, which makes total sense. Everyone thinks you go where the people ARE; a true visionary goes where the people are NOT.

 

[Thatguystevie]

You're arguing against emotion with reason. You can't possibly win.

Every single source connected to the team has said there's no chance of the team moving back to LI.

"Those people are hacks."

Then logic dictates that the team and county would have reached an agreement if there was serious interest on both sides.

"The team is doing better, so now there's definitely interest!"

The team has a 25 year lease. It's hard to break professional sports leases, and the lease with SMG had its own out clause. Despite years of trying, the team wasn't able to get out from under the lease. They couldn't even leave when chunks of the arena began raining down onto the ice.

"That was different."

If the team leaves Brooklyn, there's no reason it wouldn't go elsewhere.

"Bettman won't let it happen! He's trustworthy and cares about hockey history too much to allow it! Cable contract cable contract cable contract!"

The Coli renovation has already been planned. It isn't being built to support a pro hockey franchise.

"Barclays wasn't built for hockey! All they have to do is change the proposal to include 12,000 more seats, and since it was so easy for Wang to get approval, it'll be just as simple for Ratner!"

The team hasn't drawn well in Nassau since 1986, even when things were going okay. Things got better, but they weren't ever selling out regularly. The team has averaged 13,872 fans in attendance during the last five playoff years.That's 85% capacity without much supplementary corporate sales revenue.

"That's because the team wasn't a surefire Cup contender! Unfair comparison!"


Just accept that the team is moving back to bankrupt Nassau County, a place that can't support one single ****ing Islanders bar, let alone an entire franchise. Or maybe going to Suffolk, which makes total sense. Everyone thinks you go where the people ARE; a true visionary goes where the people are NOT.

Very well put response.

Aside from being the future owner of the Coliseum; does Rater even have any ties to the islanders? New owners, new building, why does everyone believe he'll bring the isles back to L.I.?