Devils team discussion (news, notes and speculation) - part IV

[billingtons ghost]

How the hell are there still people responding to Jim? I really don't get it.

He has watched alot of hockey and actually really knows his stuff. I don't agree with his take on 'we are ahead of schedule'. Tbh, I think that's Fitz with a smart bit of setting of expectations.

We are not at all a 'top 5 team in the league' quite YET, and last night proved it. The nonsense that goaltending alone was the culprit has got to stop.

Last night and Blackwood's previous start and the whole month of December are indications that we do not have that firm ability to defend our own zone.

When teams cede us the neutral zone we have the talent to be an absolute buzz saw.

When they clog up the NZ, hit us, and take away interior stretch passes we are a mediocre team at best.

I think Marino coming back maybe gets us looking like November again, but we need interior scoring, another couple of physical, aggressive forwards and really just a whole lot of seasoning.

 

[NJDevilsFan21]

We are not at all a 'top 5 team in the league' quite YET, and last night proved it. The nonsense that goaltending alone was the culprit has got to stop.

I feel like the last ~7 games proved it. Yes we were winning, but only because Hughes and Hamilton (and to an extent, Vtek) were pulling rabbits out of their asses. That's not a sustainable way to win, nor is it even an option to win the post-season.

Seeing our players just bounce off others while they get forechecked and cycled on within our zone is frustrating. It wastes a lot of energy and would explain why, at least to me, they seem a lot slower than earlier in the season. Other teams have figured us out. Now it's our turn to counter it. Otherwise we are out in round 1.

 

[Eggtimer]

Meier-Hughes-Mercer
Palat-Nico-Bratt
Tatar-Haula-Sharangovich
Parise-McLeod-Bastian

Rotate in Z for Bastian if he can’t find his game. Let’s go Fitz.

I approve of this message and second it.
While we are at it , add Gudas or Kulikov please ,thanks

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

He has watched alot of hockey and actually really knows his stuff. I don't agree with his take on 'we are ahead of schedule'. Tbh, I think that's Fitz with a smart bit of setting of expectations.

We are not at all a 'top 5 team in the league' quite YET, and last night proved it. The nonsense that goaltending alone was the culprit has got to stop.

Last night and Blackwood's previous start and the whole month of December are indications that we do not have that firm ability to defend our own zone.

When teams cede us the neutral zone we have the talent to be an absolute buzz saw.

When they clog up the NZ, hit us, and take away interior stretch passes we are a mediocre team at best.

I think Marino coming back maybe gets us looking like November again, but we need interior scoring, another couple of physical, aggressive forwards and really just a whole lot of seasoning.

Happy to help!

 

[glenwo2]

Just thought I'd re-visit the dumb statement made last night by Jersey Fan 12. (mainly 'cause the thread is closed)

On top of that, claiming that Nashville is a better team. smh.

I don't get this thought process whatsoever.

Devils gave that game away and had nothing to do with anything the Preds did.

 

[Cheddabombs]

Where Meier

 

[Eggtimer]

I feel like the last ~7 games proved it. Yes we were winning, but only because Hughes and Hamilton (and to an extent, Vtek) were pulling rabbits out of their asses. That's not a sustainable way to win, nor is it even an option to win the post-season.

Seeing our players just bounce off others while they get forechecked and cycled on within our zone is frustrating. It wastes a lot of energy and would explain why, at least to me, they seem a lot slower than earlier in the season. Other teams have figured us out. Now it's our turn to counter it.

I think our speed and skill can beat teams like Nashville an other heavier teams that play that style. We beat ourselves with stupid mistakes and being off of our usual game . But I agree , we need to make some adjustments to teams that like to play below our goal line and crash the net .

 

[Bankers Box]

He has watched alot of hockey and actually really knows his stuff. I don't agree with his take on 'we are ahead of schedule'. Tbh, I think that's Fitz with a smart bit of setting of expectations.

We are not at all a 'top 5 team in the league' quite YET, and last night proved it. The nonsense that goaltending alone was the culprit has got to stop.

Last night and Blackwood's previous start and the whole month of December are indications that we do not have that firm ability to defend our own zone.

When teams cede us the neutral zone we have the talent to be an absolute buzz saw.

When they clog up the NZ, hit us, and take away interior stretch passes we are a mediocre team at best.

I think Marino coming back maybe gets us looking like November again, but we need interior scoring, another couple of physical, aggressive forwards and really just a whole lot of seasoning.

I agree with a lot of this.

We fans tend to be prone recency bias and exaggerate both the ups and downs of the season.

This Devils team has given us an exciting season and a lot more hope for the following 5-6 years. I couldn't have asked for more.

The playoff experience they will get this year will be invaluable for this young group. I hope I'm wrong but personally wouldn't be surprised if they get bounced in the first round.

Dynamic offensive teams tend to struggle a bit more in the post season (remember all of the Caps juggernauts). The Devils will have to adjust their game and they will be going into the playoff as the youngest team.

These playoffs are a bonus and a reward for their hard work this year.

The next 2-6 years will be the real test, imo.

 

[Devs3cups]

I feel like the last ~7 games proved it. Yes we were winning, but only because Hughes and Hamilton (and to an extent, Vtek) were pulling rabbits out of their asses. That's not a sustainable way to win, nor is it even an option to win the post-season.

Seeing our players just bounce off others while they get forechecked and cycled on within our zone is frustrating. It wasted a lot of energy and would explain why, at least to me, they seem a lot slower than earlier in the season. Other teams have figured us out. Now it's our turn to counter it.,

If other teams having figured us out leads to us getting a 9-2-2 record (like we’ve done in the last month), sign me up! I’d say we’ve pretty much countered teams figuring us out some way or another. I’d expect Marino coming back to bring some sort of balance back on the backend also.

We have a good team. Is it perfect? Nope. We’re still one of the youngest teams in the league that needs some patching. We’re trending upwards though.

Thing is, the saying “good teams find ways to win” never seems to apply to us from the fanbase. We always say that stuff about other successful teams, but it’s true for us too. Things aren’t always going to go well. But the team figures out ways to win and that, for a young team, should be used as a positive at times.

 

[Saugus]

Meier-Hughes-Mercer
Palat-Nico-Bratt
Tatar-Haula-Sharangovich
Parise-McLeod-Bastian

Rotate in Z for Bastian if he can’t find his game. Let’s go Fitz.

It would be weird as hell seeing Parise back as a fourth liner. But I don't hate this at all.

 

[billingtons ghost]

Just thought I'd re-visit the dumb statement made last night by Jersey Fan 12. (mainly 'cause the thread is closed)

On top of that, claiming that Nashville is a better team. smh.

I don't get this thought process whatsoever.

Devils gave that game away and had nothing to do with anything the Preds did.

Meh. Saw Nashville take our toys away for two plus periods. We were whining about reffing. Forwards didn't win a puck battle and every zone entry was one shot and then done against a pretty inferior team.

It wasn't just mistakes and breakdowns, they pretty much waited for us to turn it over and then counter attacked. Kinda like Seattle game.

 

[Guttersniped]

Yeah, I don't expect anything to happen with Timo for quite some time. I don't know if they run it all the way to the deadline, but I'd be surprised if it was completed weeks before the deadline or something

Vegas didn’t get to negotiate with Mark Stone’s agent until they agreed upon what the trade was with Ottawa first.

I remember reading Vegas & Stone’s agent ended up starting their negotiations about 45 minutes before the TDL. They worked out the basic numbers of the extension in a lot less time then that.

Dorian wanted time left open to trade Stone to someone else in case they couldn’t agree on an extension.

Calgary reportedly refused to trade Juuso Valimaki, their 2017 1st Rd pick (#16), for Stone. Valimaki ended up playing 82 games for them before Arizona grabbed him off the waiver wire last October 9th.

 

[NJDevs26]

Arguing over whether the Devils are ‘top five’ or not is the definition of a first world problem and a weird hill to die on. Top ten would be outstanding and there’s every chance we finish as such. There’s also a decent chance we face another top ten team and get bounced in the first round, which isn’t the end of the world this year.

They obviously need more size and physicality, anyone who isn’t a blind ‘twelve most talented players you can find’ believer no matter if all of them are small, finesse forwards understands you need some form of balance to your lineup. We were never going to fix all our holes from the last few years in one offseason, it’s amazing as many have gotten fixed as we have from the D (for the most part) to finding a legit 1A goalie.

 

[NJDevs26]

Meh. Saw Nashville take our toys away for two plus periods. We were whining about reffing. Forwards didn't win a puck battle and every zone entry was one shot and then done against a pretty inferior team.

It wasn't just mistakes and breakdowns, they pretty much waited for us to turn it over and then counter attacked. Kinda like Seattle game.

This idea people can’t complain about the reffing when the team is outplayed is silly, more than one thing can be true. You can be outplayed and still get denied calls that can lead to a momentum shifting power play. And people aren’t just complaining about the reffing off of one game, it’s a few in a row now where teams have been allowed to obstruct and interfere with us like it’s 1999. It changes the complexion of the game when teams are allowed to…take liberties outside the rules.

 

[Guttersniped]

Just from those comments from Lebrun speculating that Fitz wants Bratt somewhere in between Jack and Nico:
"Fitzgerald wouldn’t say, but I’m guessing he hopes to get Bratt signed long-term somewhere in between Hughes and Hischier, AAV-wise."

Just because of that it feels like the sides shouldn't be really too far off like if Bratt's agent wants to use Hintz as a comparable that is 8.3 (and even if he wants somewhat more than that but still in the 8 range) that's around or less than a million between for most values between Nico's and Jack's contracts. We would be talking about a separation between the two sides of less than a UFA depth player (Brendon Smith at 1.1). Just compromise and get this done, it's not like Meier if the Devils do get him is going to be between those two contracts either -- Lebrun reported that the ask will start in the 9mil range.

"Fitzgerald wouldn’t say, but I’m guessing he hopes to get Bratt signed long-term somewhere in between Hughes and Hischier, AAV-wise."

LeBrun has said this before, at some point over the summer IIRC.

 

[NJDevilsFan21]

Thing is, the saying “good teams find ways to win” never seems to apply to us from the fanbase. We always say that stuff about other successful teams, but it’s true for us too. Things aren’t always going to go well. But the team figures out ways to win and that, for a young team, should be used as a positive at times.

It's a huge positive, especially considering where we've been the past decade. But fans like to ignore the fact that the regular season enables teams to win in ways that just flat out don't exist in the post-season.

Whoever plays us in the playoffs will be clogging the neutral zone and forechecking just to gas us. They'll put two guys on Jack because they know Haula or whoever isn't really a threat. Or that nobody is going to do a thing if someone cheap shots Nico, or even worse if it be Jack.

I will be thrilled if we end up in the second round, but I'm not expecting it. Either way, it's still a huge improvement and net positive. We're only going to get better. I will admit that I myself need to be more patient too.

 

[NjDevsRR]

View attachment 642560

Where Meier

He out there

 

[billingtons ghost]

This idea people can’t complain about the reffing when the team is outplayed is silly, more than one thing can be true. You can be outplayed and still get denied calls that can lead to a momentum shifting power play. And people aren’t just complaining about the reffing off of one game, it’s a few in a row now where teams have been allowed to obstruct and interfere with us like it’s 1999.

I think this is a bad take and you know it. Objectively you might be right that we've had some calls go against us, but nothing egregious.
We need to get respect in the league before we start getting the calls. I think that another year of man strength and Jack doesn't go down as easily, and he'll get ALL the calls, bc I think he's getting them already.

I think Nico is getting the benefit of some calls when he goes down.

Palat will get calls on rep alone.

I think the rest of the team needs to learn to fight through their checks, initiate physical play and win battles. Nobody is going to *give* Boqvist, Rango, Mercer, etc al anything.

As the stakes get higher it will just get worse unless we adjust our game.

 

[billingtons ghost]

If other teams having figured us out leads to us getting a 9-2-2 record (like we’ve done in the last month), sign me up! I’d say we’ve pretty much countered teams figuring us out some way or another. I’d expect Marino coming back to bring some sort of balance back on the backend also.

We have a good team. Is it perfect? Nope. We’re still one of the youngest teams in the league that needs some patching. We’re trending upwards though.

Thing is, the saying “good teams find ways to win” never seems to apply to us from the fanbase. We always say that stuff about other successful teams, but it’s true for us too. Things aren’t always going to go well. But the team figures out ways to win and that, for a young team, should be used as a positive at times.

You're absolutely right.

The resiliance thing is a phenomenal trait and will get us far.

I'd like for us not to play trash hockey for 40 minutes leading up to it before beating powerhouses like San Jose though...

 

[NJDevs26]

I think this is a bad take and you know it. Objectively you might be right that we've had some calls go against us, but nothing egregious.
We need to get respect in the league before we start getting the calls. I think that another year of man strength and Jack doesn't go down as easily, and he'll get ALL the calls, bc I think he's getting them already.

I think Nico is getting the benefit of some calls when he goes down.

Palat will get calls on rep alone.

I think the rest of the team needs to learn to fight through their checks, initiate physical play and win battles. Nobody is going to *give* Boqvist, Rango, Mercer, etc al anything.

As the stakes get higher it will just get worse unless we adjust our game.

The Devils have gotten seven power play chances in the last five games, that’s abnormally low but our opponents haven’t gotten that many more. It’s not so much unbalanced officiating as it is very passive in terms of actual enforcement. Which does favor BIG BOY teams who test the limits of the refs and is perhaps a good practice for the playoffs cause we know the NHL would rather have artificially close games by letting ‘players decide it’.

 

[Devs3cups]

I’ll use my 10 000th post here to say the following message:

Jack Hughes is an elite player and deserves Timo Meier on his line.

Manifesting the trade. That is all. Thanks for listening to my TED Talk.

————

Also thanks to you guys for being such a fun bunch and turning me into an HFBoards addict.

 

[glenwo2]

Meh. Saw Nashville take our toys away for two plus periods. We were whining about reffing. Forwards didn't win a puck battle and every zone entry was one shot and then done against a pretty inferior team.

It wasn't just mistakes and breakdowns, they pretty much waited for us to turn it over and then counter attacked. Kinda like Seattle game.

It was a sh*tty game all around for us.

And it pisses me off that we STILL haven't beaten a Hynes-led team YET.

 

[glenwo2]

LeBrun has said this before, at some point over the summer IIRC.

keywords : "...but I'm guessing..."

So he still doesn't know what Fitz wants.

But let's say, for arguments sake, that's what it is.

I don't foresee Bratt gettting a deal done for anything under 8 million per.

 

[Guttersniped]

Arguing over whether the Devils are ‘top five’ or not is the definition of a first world problem and a weird hill to die on. Top ten would be outstanding and there’s every chance we finish as such. There’s also a decent chance we face another top ten team and get bounced in the first round, which isn’t the end of the world this year.

They obviously need more size and physicality, anyone who isn’t a blind ‘twelve most talented players you can find’ believer no matter if all of them are small, finesse forwards understands you need some form of balance to your lineup. We were never going to fix all our holes from the last few years in one offseason, it’s amazing as many have gotten fixed as we have from the D (for the most part) to finding a legit 1A goalie.

We aren’t “built for the playoffs”. We just aren’t. If people say anything different they being willfully obtuse or are blind (or very optimistic).

But that’s completely understandable because who knew we would be discussing how to make it to the later rounds as a contender this January?

And Palat is a fantastic add for the playoffs, so we did get him. Fitz appears to be a thoughtful team builder with a sensible long-term approach. We’re eyeing adds at the TDL. Lots of good stuff.

The team being this f***ing good as a work-in-progress is fine by me.

 

[My3Sons]

I think this is a bad take and you know it. Objectively you might be right that we've had some calls go against us, but nothing egregious.
We need to get respect in the league before we start getting the calls. I think that another year of man strength and Jack doesn't go down as easily, and he'll get ALL the calls, bc I think he's getting them already.

I think Nico is getting the benefit of some calls when he goes down.

Palat will get calls on rep alone.

I think the rest of the team needs to learn to fight through their checks, initiate physical play and win battles. Nobody is going to *give* Boqvist, Rango, Mercer, etc al anything.

As the stakes get higher it will just get worse unless we adjust our game.

I didn’t see Jack or Bratt or Nico get pushed around last night. The worst night was had by McLeod Bastian and Wood. I didn’t see Nashville generate odd man rushes of sustained offensive zone pressure. NJ had 39 shots and scored four goals and nobody played well except Hughes. The refs allow clutching and grabbing which is just bad for the game. It hurts NJ because they want to play with skill and speed but it slows them down it doesn’t force them to give away the puck randomly on defense to allow breakaways and odd man rushes. I’ve seen plenty of games where NJ has been pushed around. Last night wasn’t it. NJ just didn’t show up excoet for Hughes who was head and shoulder above every player on both teams. If he had legit top six talent to play with he might have had a five point night and win the game by himself.