Devils team discussion (news, notes and speculation) - 2022-23 season thread part II

[Devils731]

No, I’m not going 6 years on Wood. I’d rather bite the bullet in letting him walk.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

I wouldn't even give Wood 4 years, let alone 6. Yikes.

 

[Saugus]

Very few guys should be considered for 6 year contracts. They should be impact players, an irreplaceable part of your core.

Wood is a good complementary piece, and certainly a vital cog in the machine for our current success. But he is not irreplaceable, and he is not a core player by any means. The longest contract term we should consider for guys like him is 2-3 years.

 

[MadDevil]

If Wood was a couple years younger I'd probably be fine with 6 years, but he'll be 28 at the start of next season and given his style of play he's not likely to age gracefully. Going long term on that type of player is just not a wise decision.

 

[Blender]

If Wood wants a long term contract you let him walk. I like the player but that would be a critical cap management error.

 

[AfroThunder396]

If anyone wants to give Wood 6 years then you gladly let him walk. That would (Wood?) be sill.

I'd be fine with 2-3 years. He's a 4th liner.

 

[Zippy316]

Would you guys be in favor of signing Miles Wood to a 6 year, 19.5 million (3.25mil AAV) contract extension in January?

Would mean he's under contract until 2029. His age 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33 seasons.

Would be great to have him locked in at a fair number, but I could see a world where his style of play declines in his early 30s. The good news, is that by years 4/5/6 of that deal, the salary cap should be about 95 million at a minimum - which makes 3.25 million a very easy contract to move if you have to.

Curious everyone's thoughts. Even in a game like last night, as well as all last season, you could tell the Devils miss what he brings.

I’m in favor of this as I think the Devils can do something where he makes the same amount over six years at a low AAV that a team would over him over 4 years on an inflated AAV that’s way above his worth.

But a lot of people are concerned giving term to Wood which makes sense.

 

[MasterofGrond]

I love Wood, I love him!

But he's a crash and bang 4th liner primarily reliant on speed who recently had a very serious hip injury who is going to be 28 at the start of his contract. I have concerns on any contract >3 years.

 

[Zippy316]

If anyone wants to give Wood 6 years then you gladly let him walk. That would (Wood?) be sill.

I'd be fine with 2-3 years. He's a 4th liner.

But the idea is paying him above average fourth line money over several years rather than second line money over a few years.

With the cap going up, 3.25 is a pricey fourth liner today, which admittedly is what Wood is. In five years, 3.25 is even more insignificant on the cap as it goes up.

A number in the low threes is very manageable if you’re able to continuously supplement this team with youth as well, which we’ve done a terrific job up front to date.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

its not about the money. Its the term.

I wouldn't sign him for 6 x $2 if I am being honest. I don't want to be stuck with him for that long.

Signing 4th liners longterm is one way how you get into cap trouble. And I am president of the "cap doesn't matter" crowd...but that only pertains to signing actual good high end players.

 

[AfroThunder396]

But the idea is paying him above average fourth line money over several years rather than second line money over a few years.

With the cap going up, 3.25 is a pricey fourth liner today, which admittedly is what Wood is. In five years, 3.25 is even more insignificant on the cap as it goes up.

A number in the low threes is very manageable if you’re able to continuously supplement this team with youth as well, which we’ve done a terrific job up front to date.

I'm not interested in doing either. He's just a guy, If he doesn't want to be here then find another guy.

We are no longer in a position where we are forced to cave to contract demands (in either salary or term) in order to retain talent. If someone else wants to Clarkson him then go ahead.

 

[Its Always Sundstrom]

This is cool. I love Tuna.

That was fun, thanks sharing. As I was watching, I got the notice from the Pru app about it

Tuna is a cool dude

 

[Triumph]

But the idea is paying him above average fourth line money over several years rather than second line money over a few years.

With the cap going up, 3.25 is a pricey fourth liner today, which admittedly is what Wood is. In five years, 3.25 is even more insignificant on the cap as it goes up.

A number in the low threes is very manageable if you’re able to continuously supplement this team with youth as well, which we’ve done a terrific job up front to date.

For a fourth line player, the comparison isn't some notion of what players can get paid when the cap goes up, but rather the minimum salary, and the minimum salary is going to be $775,000 from next season through 2025-26. There's downward pressure on 4th line players and the older ones get shuffled around and have to accept a minimum salary or close to it. Would I rather spend the minimum on a player like Jimmy Vesey or would I rather spend $3m on Wood, and it's barely even a question for me, I'd rather spend that $2m+ elsewhere.

The trouble with Wood for me is that you just can't put him up in the lines for extended periods of time, he's just not good enough at puck support.

 

[Zippy316]

its not about the money. Its the term.

I wouldn't sign him for 6 x $2 if I am being honest. I don't want to be stuck with him for that long.

In a general sense, I would agree with this. But given the Devils contract situations, it could make some sense if it’s a reasonable AAV.

We have Hughes, Hischier, Siegenthaler, and Marino all signed to absolute steals at the moment. Theoretically, you have some ELCs in Holtz, Nemec, Hughes, etc. that you can delay the first big payday for another five years or so if need be.

If six years at a low AAV is what it takes to have Wood on a dominant fourth line for the next three years, I think it’s something you think long and hard about. He can be a difference maker for a playoff team on your fourth line.

 

[Zippy316]

For a fourth line player, the comparison isn't some notion of what players can get paid when the cap goes up, but rather the minimum salary, and the minimum salary is going to be $775,000 from next season through 2025-26. There's downward pressure on 4th line players and the older ones get shuffled around and have to accept a minimum salary or close to it. Would I rather spend the minimum on a player like Jimmy Vesey or would I rather spend $3m on Wood, and it's barely even a question for me, I'd rather spend that $2m+ elsewhere.

The trouble with Wood for me is that you just can't put him up in the lines for extended periods of time, he's just not good enough at puck support.

Having Wood on a fourth line versus JAG like Vesey is a massive difference though. No coach is going to take any care that Vesey is on that line, Wood on the other hand deserves at least some special attention.

If this team happens to get rid of Wood, you know damn well we’re going to spend the next two/three years spending assets at the deadline to get the flavor of the year physical presence like Deslauriers for the fourth line every year. I’d rather just bite the bullet and keep Wood

 

[Comparison Ford]

i wonder what forward with a great shot will be available around TDL (preferably righty)

 

[Its Always Sundstrom]

If Wood was a couple years younger I'd probably be fine with 6 years, but he'll be 28 at the start of next season and given his style of play he's not likely to age gracefully. Going long term on that type of player is just not a wise decision.

If he fixed his teeth he could at least look like he was aging gracefully.
I had to stop using him as my wingman.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

i wonder what forward with a great shot will be available around TDL (preferably righty)

(I know hes a lefty but he plays RW)

 

[MartyOwns]

i’d be fine signing wood for 4 years if it keeps the cap hit down. anything beyond that, i’d pass.

 

[Eggtimer]

Woods a hard player to evaluate. Yes he is a 4th liner (could be a 3rd if needed due to injuries ), but he has a skillset that is needed and is a little different than your typical 4th liner.
If he was a complete replacement level player that can easily be found, every team in the league would have their 4th line composed of Wood replicas.
I think he is a special exception here but nothing crazy like giving him 4+years of term or $$ of a stud 3rd line or second line player. Maybe a slight raise over your typical 4th liner but nothing insane like 4+ mil per.

 

[FooteBahl]

Woods a hard player to evaluate. Yes he is a 4th liner (could be a 3rd if needed due to injuries ), but he has a skillset that is needed and is a little different than your typical 4th liner.
If he was a complete replacement level player that can easily be found, every team in the league would have their 4th line composed of Wood replicas.
I think he is a special exception here but nothing crazy like giving him 4+years of term or $$ of a stud 3rd line or second line player. Maybe a slight raise over your typical 4th liner but nothing insane like 4+ mil per.

I want to see what he does when we make the playoffs since that is when I believe we’ll see his real worth. He seems to have taken on a leadership role as well, maybe he is very valued behind the scenes for these intangibles.

 

[Stephen Gionta]

Very few guys should be considered for 6 year contracts. They should be impact players, an irreplaceable part of your core.

Wood is a good complementary piece, and certainly a vital cog in the machine for our current success. But he is not irreplaceable, and he is not a core player by any means. The longest contract term we should consider for guys like him is 2-3 years.

I generally agree with the non bolded. But the bolded I disagree with.

Miles Wood IS irreplaceable. Name me one player in the league that has a similar style of play as him and is as effective as him AND also makes less than 5% of his teams salary cap. Name me just one player.

When was the last time a team got hurt salary cap wise when giving a player term on a contract worth ~3.5% of the salary cap?

I’m in favor of this as I think the Devils can do something where he makes the same amount over six years at a low AAV that a team would over him over 4 years on an inflated AAV that’s way above his worth.

But a lot of people are concerned giving term to Wood which makes sense.

That's exactly the idea I'm getting at. On a 3 year deal, Wood is worth about $4.5 million per season. But giving him double the length of that deal could really help lower the AAV. Our competitive window is open starting this season. And the salary cap is only going up from here.

But the idea is paying him above average fourth line money over several years rather than second line money over a few years.

With the cap going up, 3.25 is a pricey fourth liner today, which admittedly is what Wood is. In five years, 3.25 is even more insignificant on the cap as it goes up.

A number in the low threes is very manageable if you’re able to continuously supplement this team with youth as well, which we’ve done a terrific job up front to date.

This^

its not about the money. Its the term.

I wouldn't sign him for 6 x $2 if I am being honest. I don't want to be stuck with him for that long.

Signing 4th liners longterm is one way how you get into cap trouble. And I am president of the "cap doesn't matter" crowd...but that only pertains to signing actual good high end players.

So you'd rather overpay for a high end player on a long term deal and if his game goes to hell its an immovable deal? Instead of giving term to a bottom 6 player on a low AAV that if his game goes to hell, you can shed that contract WAY easier to a bottom dwelling team hoping to hit the salary cap floor as they aim to land the top prospect in the next draft?

In a general sense, I would agree with this. But given the Devils contract situations, it could make some sense if it’s a reasonable AAV.

We have Hughes, Hischier, Siegenthaler, and Marino all signed to absolute steals at the moment. Theoretically, you have some ELCs in Holtz, Nemec, Hughes, etc. that you can delay the first big payday for another five years or so if need be.

If six years at a low AAV is what it takes to have Wood on a dominant fourth line for the next three years, I think it’s something you think long and hard about. He can be a difference maker for a playoff team on your fourth line.

Completely agree with this again.

I don't think people are realizing that Miles Wood might be the best 4th liner in the entire NHL - and having a good 4th line is extremely important to team success, especially in the playoffs. (See 2012)

Having Wood on a fourth line versus JAG like Vesey is a massive difference though. No coach is going to take any care that Vesey is on that line, Wood on the other hand deserves at least some special attention.

If this team happens to get rid of Wood, you know damn well we’re going to spend the next two/three years spending assets at the deadline to get the flavor of the year physical presence like Deslauriers for the fourth line every year. I’d rather just bite the bullet and keep Wood

And again. Spot on.

Not to mention, we literally have NO IDEA if Wood's game will go to hell in 4-6 years. We think it might because it has happened in the past to players that play a physically taxing style. But there are also examples of that where guys that rely on speed and physicality have aged gracefully. (A guy like Pierre Edward Bellemare comes to mind)

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

I like what Wood brings, but you could argue he doesn’t even deserve to be in when fully healthy if Holtz actually shows he’s ready. BMW does have that special chemistry, but would they not just as good or better with Zetterlund instead of him?

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

I generally agree with the non bolded. But the bolded I disagree with.

Miles Wood IS irreplaceable. Name me one player in the league that has a similar style of play as him and is as effective as him AND also makes less than 5% of his teams salary cap. Name me just one player.

When was the last time a team got hurt salary cap wise when giving a player term on a contract worth ~3.5% of the salary cap?


That's exactly the idea I'm getting at. On a 3 year deal, Wood is worth about $4.5 million per season. But giving him double the length of that deal could really help lower the AAV. Our competitive window is open starting this season. And the salary cap is only going up from here.



This^


So you'd rather overpay for a high end player on a long term deal and if his game goes to hell its an immovable deal? Instead of giving term to a bottom 6 player on a low AAV that if his game goes to hell, you can shed that contract WAY easier to a bottom dwelling team hoping to hit the salary cap floor as they aim to land the top prospect in the next draft?


Completely agree with this again.

I don't think people are realizing that Miles Wood might be the best 4th liner in the entire NHL - and having a good 4th line is extremely important to team success, especially in the playoffs. (See 2012)



And again. Spot on.

Not to mention, we literally have NO IDEA if Wood's game will go to hell in 4-6 years. We think it might because it has happened in the past to players that play a physically taxing style. But there are also examples of that where guys that rely on speed and physicality have aged gracefully. (A guy like Pierre Edward Bellemare comes to mind)

I would rather overpay for good/elite talent than a 4th liner. Yes. That is correct. Is this a hot take?

 

[Blender]