GDT: Devils @ Flames - 9:00 PM - MSG2

Deviled

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Rewatched that bas lomberg clip.

Lomberg is quite the POS. He basically started punching Bastian as he was not even facing him and didn't even let the guy square up. Bastian didn't even have a chance to square up, he was facing the glass.

Ridiculous setup and I am a little surprised both the team didn't step up more, and also the refs let it play out like that. He got like 5 shots in like that.

Plus the head crunch on cotter while he was already in the boards.

I'm kinda pissed about the whole outcome of that.

Since Bastian went to fight we werent allowed to get chippy anymore after that. Thats not the honorable thing to do and we may have taken a penalty because of it

Or so thats what some here were blabbering about. I genuinely wonder if they watched much Devils hockey in the 90s and 00s
 

Forge

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Since Bastian went to fight we werent allowed to get chippy anymore after that. Thats not the honorable thing to do and we may have taken a penalty because of it

Or so thats what some here were blabbering about. I genuinely wonder if they watched much Devils hockey in the 90s and 00s

Nah, some aren't just so mentally fragile that they can't take an ass kicking. Play your game.

And who cares about hockey 30 years ago.

They didn't lose because bastian got plastered and they didn't try a macdermid someone in the other team for reasons. You don't need to make it a point to "go after someone" because your guy got his ass whipped
 

Whaddagoal

The Sheldon Keefe Era Begins
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The league should pass a third man in rule on checking. That’s twice now we’ve seen a guy get hit by a second guy while already engaged with someone. Lazar needed surgery and Cotter was hit up high. Hopefully someone on another team gets hurt very publicly and the idiots in charge will take that out of the game. Right now it’s just one more tactic to add to the sociopath arsenal.

Based on that "fight", id imagine Bastian's face or jaw is pretty f***ed up.

I sometimes feel your crazy psycho player theory on the team is needed to stop this.
 

Whaddagoal

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Nobody is stopping it. Crazy psychos aren't a preventative

I'm not talking about MacDermid.

I meant the team needs a player that is a bit of a loose cannon like tom Wilson who would do some crazy shit once and awhile and keep people on their toes that he has no remorse injuring a guy, or some other guy of old who would do that. My3sons has been half joking about that. Other teams take ridiculous liberties with our players.


Seeing that clip of Bastian get clocked like that 5 times while he is facing the side and no real response the rest of the game, pretty sad state of affairs.

Lomberg is the one who cheapshotted cotter on the boards too to start that.


What is your thought to get the team to stop getting the raw end here?

We got the same situation as last season and Bastian taking the literal beat down or cheapshot or cheap fight. It's f***ed up. I'm guessing Bastian will be out awhile again. Just like with the rempe/Trouba hits/fight
 
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NJDevs26

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Since Bastian went to fight we werent allowed to get chippy anymore after that. Thats not the honorable thing to do and we may have taken a penalty because of it

Or so thats what some here were blabbering about. I genuinely wonder if they watched much Devils hockey in the 90s and 00s
The ‘league’ are the ones who allow cheap shots without punishment and crack down on the retaliation penalties
 
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Cheddabombs

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Season is over. They had a nice run but now it’s gone. And Lovejoy isn’t around to rescue them. They are led by a third liner and a toddler who wears diapers. Sell now to avoid the deadline rush. Get rid of Keefe and Fitz and let @Cheddabombs ovefsee the long overdue rebuild. Maybe they get lucky and some team will take Jack in a trade before his bad attitude gets noticed around the league. This team makes thr NY Jets look like a well run and successful team.

1730559616040.png
 

NJDevs26

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Nobody is stopping it. Crazy psychos aren't a preventative
No but mutually assured destruction can make teams think twice. MacDermid going after some punk means nothing, the cheap shot artists are just sacrificial pawns 95% of the time. But if your guys retaliate against their stars THAT might get people to think twice.
 
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Forge

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I'm not talking about MacDermid.

I meant the team needs a player that is a bit of a loose cannon like tom Wilson who would do some crazy shit once and keep people on their toes that he has no remorse injuring a guy, or some other guy of old who would do that. My3sons has been half joking about that. Other teams take ridiculous liberties with our players.


Seeing that clip of Bastian get clocked like that 5 times while he is facing the side and no real response the rest of the game, pretty sad state of affairs.

Lomberg is the one who cheapshotted cotter on the boards too to start that.


What is your thought to get the team to stop getting the raw end here?

We got the same situation as last season and Bastian taking the literal beat down or cheapshot or cheap fight. It's f***ed up.

I'm not even sure how many teams have that guy you're referencing. At least in a Tom Wilson capacity. He's a bit of a unicorn like that. And i think guys like Lomberg are pretty rare as well. Honestly, I just think that level of crazy is kind of rare, but I digress. Down the lineup bully guys? Sure, some teams have them, but their impact seems wholly overrated on this board and I'm not sure how much I want them actually playing and as I said before, these guys aren't preventatives. Would their retaliation lift the team up? I mean, I find it unlikely, but again, I don't know how you realistically quantify it as I doubt that it's even been tracked.

Some of this I think is just fans being fans and this is a victim complex. There's legitimately know way of knowing whether this team gets the raw end of the stick like this at a greater or lesser rate than the rest of the league. There's no real way to quantify it. Cheap shots happen all the time in every game. We've seen Dillon go psycho. Honestly, I feel like so far this team have been far faster and more aggressive in going after the other team than I can remember in quite some time because of guys like Dillon and Kovacevic.

Bastian is a big dude but he's way out of his league if he's trying to step in with some of those guys. He defended his teammate (what everyone is bitching about) and got his ass kicked. So now we have to respond to the response of the response just because he got his ass beat? I just want to win a hockey game, man.

Nobody is saying you can't be chippy and be physical like el boomer is suggesting. But don't put yourself in a disadvantageous position because defending Nate's honor become your primary goal.
 
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Whaddagoal

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I'm not even sure how many teams have that guy you're referencing. At least in a Tom Wilson capacity. He's a bit of a unicorn like that. And i think guys like Lomberg are pretty rare as well. Honestly, I just think that level of crazy is kind of rare, but I digress. Down the lineup bully guys? Sure, some teams have them, but their impact seems wholly overrated on this board and I'm not sure how much I want them actually playing and as I said before, these guys aren't preventatives. Would their retaliation lift the team up? I mean, I find it unlikely, but again, I don't know how you realistically quantify it as I doubt that it's even been tracked.

Some of this I think is just fans being fans and this is a victim complex. There's legitimately know way of knowing whether this team gets the raw end of the stick like this at a greater or lesser rate than the rest of the league. There's no real way to quantify it. Cheap shots happen all the time in every game. We've seen Dillon go psycho. Honestly, I feel like so far this team they have been far faster and aggressive in going after the other team than I can remember in quite some time because of guys like Dillon and Kovacevic.

Bastian is a big dude but he's way out of his league if he's trying to step in with some of those guys. He defended his teammate (what everyone is bitching about) and got his ass kicked. So now we have to respond to the response of the response just because he got his ass beat? I just want to win a hockey game, man.

Nobody is saying you can't be chippy and be physical like el boomer is suggesting. But don't put yourself in a disadvantageous position because defending Nate's honor become your primary goal.

I agree team is more aggressive so far this season and it is likely because of Dillon and Noesen and Kovacevic etc.

I'm not saying there's a Tom Wilson esque player and lomberg on every team, but this team has to figure out something.

In the last 14 months you have:

-Bastian getting face blasted in an uneven fight setup with lomberg after Bas trying to defend Cotter (likely out some time TBD)
-Cotter getting head smashed into boards by lomberg after already down on the ice/boards
-Lazar taking a cheapshot low to the leg by Gudas (required knee or leg surgery)

Last season:
-Sieges getting headshot concussion by Rempe (out a month)
-Bastian fighting Trouba the same game after getting a basically a concussion after Rempe cheap hit (out for like a month)
-Bastian getting railroaded by Rempe headshot/charge (see above)
-a couple boards that were wreckless plays onto our team (Luke x2) one by Colorado
-Nico getting headshot by clifton (out for 20 games or something)
-Nosek taking a massive hit to the moon (although this was his fault) but no one really responded to Trouba (nosek out like a month)

I think I'm missing a few from last season.
Just never ends - but it needs to stop somehow.

Hard to win and stay healthy-ish if you have guys unable to set a strong persistent presence of team toughness.

If the impression around the league we are punching bags and/or weak to defend against cheapshots, they will just keep happening every season, like a roulette for different players.

I don't know how to quantify this to compare against what the rest of the league deals with, month to month, but it sure feels like NJD getting the raw end the last season and a half, and it needs to end (somehow with the team setting a presence or finding the right personnel to do this)

People/fans get upset at MacDermid on the roster, but I really understand the reaction of the team to at least have a heavyweight around to keep guys like Rempe not expecting a free for all every time they play us. At least Rempe has it in the back of mind that his face can get smashed a bit as a response when he plays against.
 
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Forge

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No but mutually assured destruction can make teams think twice. MacDermid going after some punk means nothing, the cheap shot artists are just sacrificial pawns 95% of the time. But if your guys retaliate against their stars THAT might get people to think twice.
I think having those guys maybe squashes a beef a little faster after the initial act + response. Then everyone is like "okay, cool it". I could see that for sure.

But that's a different conversation because I don't think that the team lost last night because Calgary took liberties on them after the Bastian beat down and I don't think thats the primary complaint. Lomberg took care of Bastian and then they just played a hockey game that the Flames won.
 

Whaddagoal

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I think having those guys maybe squashes a beef a little faster after the initial act + response. Then everyone is like "okay, cool it". I could see that for sure.

But that's a different conversation because I don't think that the team lost last night because Calgary took liberties on them after the Bastian beat down and I don't think thats the primary complaint. Lomberg took care of Bastian and then they just played a hockey game that the Flames won.

Yeah that's not my primary complaint. They lost the game because they couldn't bury those few chances they had (breakaways, other close in deflect)

My primary complaint is this team can't be dropping guys to cheapshots/injuries every 20 games and not have a response to ensure they don't tolerate cheapshot stuff. The 20-25 game frequency is rolling over season to season. It's still continuing from last season in effect.

(And you are right earlier it is hard to quantify across other teams, but it sure feels like this team has more percentage of this at its feet, would be curious to see if someone could quantify it!)

Have many times does Bastian have to get injured in 12 months all around the same root. I legit feel bad for him.
 
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Bleedred

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The biggest issue with Bastian is he just gets injured too much.

He missed I think it was 40% of the games over the last two years.

He just isn’t reliable enough to count on to play a decent amount of games at all.
 

Whaddagoal

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The biggest issue with Bastian is he just gets injured too much.

He missed I think it was 40% of the games over the last two years.

He just isn’t reliable enough to count on to play a decent amount of games at all.

But that is my point. His last injuries are directly resultant from him/this team facing dirty plays against.

He definitely isn't fit for any heavy fighting right now. If he could do it before in his early career, it looks like he needs some adjustment

Or he needs to go in with a little more deliberate intent. Don't put himself in a position to get face puddied so quickly. Draw the guy out a bit and square up more. Or he needs to beef up in offseason.
 
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Bleedred

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But that is my point. His last injuries are directly resultant from him/this team facing dirty plays against.

He definitely isn't fit for any heavy fighting right now. If he could do it before in his early career, it looks like he needs some adjustment

Or he needs to go in with a little more deliberate intent. Don't put himself in a position to get face puddied so quickly. Draw the guy out a bit and square up more. Or he needs to beef up in offseason.
Well, that and his style of play isn’t exactly conducive to having a long career. At least not a long and productive career.

The only reason he should be brought back is for depth reasons and I’m not sure he wants to sign somewhere where he’s just a depth/extra piece.

He’s good enough to be an every night player for us, he just isn’t reliable enough health wise to be able to be expected to play much more than half the games.
 

ZachaFlockaFlame

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I'm not talking about MacDermid.

I meant the team needs a player that is a bit of a loose cannon like tom Wilson who would do some crazy shit once and awhile and keep people on their toes that he has no remorse injuring a guy, or some other guy of old who would do that. My3sons has been half joking about that. Other teams take ridiculous liberties with our players.


Seeing that clip of Bastian get clocked like that 5 times while he is facing the side and no real response the rest of the game, pretty sad state of affairs.

Lomberg is the one who cheapshotted cotter on the boards too to start that.


What is your thought to get the team to stop getting the raw end here?

We got the same situation as last season and Bastian taking the literal beat down or cheapshot or cheap fight. It's f***ed up. I'm guessing Bastian will be out awhile again. Just like with the rempe/Trouba hits/fight

The reason why Tom Wilson is somewhat feared is the guy can actually play hockey at high level no matter what the narrative around him is. The guy was a first round pick, ffs, not like he's some dude just running around they got in the 7th round just running at guys and being an idiot in the process.
 
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Billdo

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The reason why Tom Wilson is somewhat feared is the guy can actually play hockey at high level no matter what the narrative around him is. The guy was a first round pick, ffs, not like he's some dude just running around they got in the 7th round just running at guys and being an idiot in the process.
Yeah this ill conceived narrative that Wilson is just some good plug isn't true. He can actually play the game with skill but will be a rat when needed. Unfortunately those players like him, the Tkachuks, etc are unicorns. Wood was close until he was neutered AND nowhere near the offensive contributors the others are.
 

Whaddagoal

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The reason why Tom Wilson is somewhat feared is the guy can actually play hockey at high level no matter what the narrative around him is. The guy was a first round pick, ffs, not like he's some dude just running around they got in the 7th round just running at guys and being an idiot in the process.

Sure. Agreed. I never said he was just a plug, but I am looking maybe for a bit of that wildness.
 

Bleedred

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Damn what happened last night ? I baled during first intermission.
Consider yourself lucky. That game was an eyesore no matter what time zone you were in/what time it was.

We played like it was one of those ''Scheduled loss'' games, where it's the second half of a back to back on the road with a fairly long travel and flight in between cities.

Like the Chicago to Winnipeg one a couple years ago.
 

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