Devils discussion (news, notes and speculation) - part IV

[SansaStark]

right, and if they hadnt won the October games or played as well as they did, they wouldnt be. Which is...exactly what I said?

you dont call anything "like it is". You disappear for months at a time when Jack is having insane stretches and then as soon as he gets injured you show back up screaming how you told us so. No one takes that kind of posting seriously.



so what youre saying is, these things DO happen!

got it, glad we had this talk.



they beat the Lighting on January 11th. Playoff team. They have played 6 games vs playoff teams by my count since then.

6 games is not a big enough sample size to make any sort of claims about anything.

When was that again?
Jack has had maybe 2 insane stretches in his entire career.
And both were temporary. He has had zero insane stretches this year. ZERO.

Let us know when he hits 100points and plays a full 82.
His fellow “superstars” have all hit it, and done it. Some of them multiple times.

And when Jack started playing better earlier in the year I praised him for it. I praised the defensive structure, I praised Noesen, I praised Keefe.
And for a second there I thought they might finally be turning a corner. Unfortunately that was all smoke.

As much as you want to tell us October games are as meaningful as a early March game, for a team trying to hold a playoff spot that is very much in jeopardy, you would be literally disagreeing with every single player or coach that participates in this league.

You’re flat out wrong to say anything that happens in October matters as much as it does in Feb/March for a bubble team like us.

 

[Bleedred]

Remember when we wondered if we should just give Mercer $6 million per or possibly slightly more, just to buy more UFA years? I know not many people seriously considered it, but it was something that was thought about at the time. He's barely worth what he's making now as it is.

 

[guitarguyvic]

I never said that everything is great. If Jack is done, the season is over. Might as well pack it in.

You are the one that makes sweeping generalizations that "winning teams never have stretches like this!" or "players never have long stretches without producing consistently!" when they are not true. Over and over again you have been proven wrong.

You guys just shout about "consistency!" when you really don't even know what that is or what it looks like. If a player is a 0.5 ppg player, that doesn't mean that they will have a point every other game for all eternity. That isnt how things work. Every player has hot streaks and cold streaks.

No you are gaslighting. Look at you repeating strawmans in this very post that you have already been called out on multiple times before. How many times has it been pointed out to you that one has said those generalized statements that you’re arguing against? Players go through tough stretches - there’s obviously a range there. If your best core players are going through stretches of basically going goal-less for an entire quarter of the season, that is a bad sign. I pointed out precisely how in the past we would be besides ourselves if someone like Parise or Kovy went 5 games without a goal. It turns out I was almost spot on - that bad stretch for Parise that you sent me the longest he ever went without a goal was six games. It’s nowhere near as bad as what we’ve seen from this current group. And this isn’t the first time we see their goal scoring production dry up for way too long relative to their role on this team.

If your top guys are gonna be prone to going 20 games at a time barely scoring, then you either better get some insane depth or you better tweak the core to include guys who are gonna be more consistent than that. Stop telling us that this is just some crazy thought that has no basis in reality.

 

[RNCDevil]

Eichel stopped skating a fraction of a second after Jack stopped skating, trying to position for a tap-in. God, what a terrible sequence. I am such a big Jack fan. He's just great for this sport. I really hope he can play (even if hobbled but without further injury risk) again this year.

Best wishes to him and all the Devils fans that have had to deal with the sea of plugs on this team. Let's clone Barry Tallackson 8 times and see if we can scare someone.

 

[Bleedred]

View attachment 985901

I feel like last year it was said to be ''Not as severe as initially thought'' but he still wound up missing a lot of games anyway.

Actually, I think he got injured 3 different times, but at least two of those were probably the same injury. He was injured for a stretch early on, then he was injured again and came back right before the stadium series game. Then I think they shut him down when we were mathematically eliminated.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

When was that again?
Jack has had maybe 2 insane stretches in his entire career.
And both were temporary.

Let us know when he hits 100points and plays a full 82.
His fellow “superstars” have all hit it, and done it. Some of them multiple times.

And when Jack started playing better earlier in the year I praised him for it. I praised the defensive structure, I praised Noesen, I praised Keefe.
And for a second there I thought they might finally be turning a corner. Unfortunately that was all smoke.

As much as you want to tell us October games are as meaningful as a early March game, for a team trying to hold a playoff spot that is very much in jeopardy, you would be literally disagreeing with every single player or coach that participates in this league.

You’re flat out wrong to say anything that happens in October matters as much as it does in Feb/March for a bubble team like us.

he literally hit 99 points two years ago and averages 1.2 points per game over the last THREE seasons. That is a 98 point pace.

Nine guys had 100 points last year. Eleven the year before. Eight the year before. You acting like NOT hitting 100 points is somehow a diss against Jack is SUPER weird stuff.

if the Devils did not play well in October/November/December, they wouldnt be in this position and thus the games WOULDNT matter. So yes, all games count the same. 2 points for a win and 1 point for an OTL/SOL.

 

[SansaStark]

No you are gaslighting. Look at you repeating strawmans in this very post that you have already been called out on multiple times before. How many times has it been pointed out to you that one has said those generalized statements that you’re arguing against? Players go through tough stretches - there’s obviously a range there. If your best core players are going through stretches of basically going goal-less for an entire quarter of the season, that is a bad sign. I pointed out precisely how in the past we would be besides ourselves if someone like Parise or Kovy went 5 games without a goal. It turns out I was almost spot on - that bad stretch for Parise that you sent me the longest he ever went without a goal was six games. It’s nowhere near as bad as what we’ve seen from this current group. And this isn’t the first time we see their goal scoring production dry up for way too long relative to their role on this team.

If your top guys are gonna be prone to going 20 games at a time barely scoring, then you either better get some insane depth or you better tweak the core to include guys who are gonna be more consistent than that. Stop telling us that this is just some crazy thought that has no basis in reality.

Thank the lord someone has some damn sense in here.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

No you are gaslighting. Look at you repeating strawmans in this very post that you have already been called out on multiple times before. How many times has it been pointed out to you that one has said those generalized statements that you’re arguing against? Players go through tough stretches - there’s obviously a range there. If your best core players are going through stretches of basically going goal-less for an entire quarter of the season, that is a bad sign. I pointed out precisely how in the past we would be besides ourselves if someone like Parise or Kovy went 5 games without a goal. It turns out I was almost spot on - that bad stretch for Parise that you sent me the longest he ever went without a goal was six games. It’s nowhere near as bad as what we’ve seen from this current group. And this isn’t the first time we see their goal scoring production dry up for way too long relative to their role on this team.

If your top guys are gonna be prone to going 20 games at a time barely scoring, then you either better get some insane depth or you better tweak the core to include guys who are gonna be more consistent than that. Stop telling us that this is just some crazy thought that has no basis in reality.

You absolutely 100% have said "winning teams don't have stretches like this" in some form or another. Yes you have. You were proven wrong with facts, not feelings.

You also claimed that teams don't go on runs out of nowhere when 3 of the last 6 finals featured a team 12th or lower in the standings. You were proven wrong with facts, not feelings.

 

[britdevil]

"Not as severe" could mean anything. Ranging from week to week or career ending.

Who the hell even is that jabroni?

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

"Not as severe" could mean anything. Ranging from week to week or career ending.

Who the hell even is that jabroni?

respect "Gabe Trevino" please, thank you!!!

 

[longislanddevil]

Can we just super glue Jack’s shoulder back together? I’m glad to sacrifice my own shoulder for the sake of the team. Hell, if he needed a kidney…..yeah, I’d ask my girlfriend.

"Not as severe" could mean anything. Ranging from week to week or career ending.

Who the hell even is that jabroni?

I smell what you’re cookin’.

 

[SansaStark]

he literally hit 99 points two years ago and averages 1.2 points per game over the last THREE seasons. That is a 98 point pace.

Nine guys had 100 points last year. Eleven the year before. Eight the year before. You acting like NOT hitting 100 points is somehow a diss against Jack is SUPER weird stuff.

if the Devils did not play well in October/November/December, they wouldnt be in this position and thus the games WOULDNT matter. So yes, all games count the same. 2 points for a win and 1 point for an OTL/SOL.

Yes that’s exactly what I am saying.
He’s not as good as you think he is.

Excellent skater, great passer, yes. But he is soft as butter both mentally and physically.

 

[guitarguyvic]

You don't even have to resort to dishonesty, Patrik Elias had 1 goal in 18 games to start off 99-2000 and had a stretch of 1 goal in 19 games in 2002-2003. Different scoring environments and all that, but it's just how hockey is, it is a game of streaks. The problem isn't just that Timo isn't scoring, it's that while Timo is having a downturn in scoring, the other players also aren't scoring.

Also weird how my scoring-without-Jack Hughes post went unremarked upon but I guess @guitarguyvic missed it. Oh well.

You have to go back 20 years to a different era of lower scoring to come up with this, wow ok. Hockey is streaky, you guys keep repeating this generalized drivel as if we don’t all know that.

Yeah no shit the problem is that others aren’t scoring - the whole point is that we have multiple core guys, multiple players who are supposed to be our best, going 20 f***ing games contributing goals at the same rate as fourth liners.

I don’t have enough time to respond to every friggin post you guys make trying to convince people that what they observe for themselves is not real, particularly when a good counter requires paragraphs of parsing out all the points.

We need a new term for arrogant gaslighting.

 

[Clam Jensen]

"Not as severe" could mean anything. Ranging from week to week or career ending.

Who the hell even is that jabroni?

Well we know Jack is alive, so we can rule out death being the most severe version of this injury.

 

[Bleedred]

I remember a stat posted about a week ago and I forget the exact timeline, but we led the league in save percentage since such and such date.

I can't remember if it was since Markstrom got injured or what. But whenever it was, we still had like an NHL 500 record at best in that timeframe, because the offense has been nearing levels where Cory Schneider was in net circa 2013-2014.

 

[Billdo]

not as severe as some think. Yeah, his arm hasn't been amputated, yet, but he'll be out until the end of April at minimum I bet.

 

[guitarguyvic]

You absolutely 100% have said "winning teams don't have stretches like this" in some form or another. Yes you have. You were proven wrong with facts, not feelings.

You also claimed that teams don't go on runs out of nowhere when 3 of the last 6 finals featured a team 12th or lower in the standings. You were proven wrong with facts, not feelings.

No this is very clearly not an accurate portrayal of the subtleties or context of what was actually said. You repeating strawmans does not make them true, and no one is making statements based on just feelings like you’re claiming here. The comment about teams who made the finals is a perfect example of how you misrepresent, I went line by line on each of those finalists and pointed out how they did not in fact come out of nowhere to make a run.

Again I have to ask, why do you behave like a NJ Devils PR employee?

 

[Incharge1976]

"Not as severe" could mean anything. Ranging from week to week or career ending.

Who the hell even is that jabroni?

Well when your starting point is amputation, anything is less severe.

I remember a stat posted about a week ago and I forget the exact timeline, but we led the league in save percentage since such and such date.

I can't remember if it was since Markstrom got injured or what. But whenever it was, we still had like an NHL 500 record at best in that timeframe, because the offense has been nearing levels where Cory Schneider was in net circa 2013-2014.

I believe it was since Markstrom was injured.

 

[Devils731]

Maybe we should wait for some sort of official announcement before everyone tries to dunk on information.

There was seeming consensus Luke was done for a major amount of time and he came back the next period.

 

[ZachaFlockaFlame]

Yes that’s exactly what I am saying.
He’s not as good as you think he is.

Excellent skater, great passer, yes. But he is soft as butter both mentally and physically.

What a loser this guy is apparently



Another loser here apparently



6'4 195 hulking center for 2 decades v the boards? What a chump!

Anyone who is blaming Jack for falling into the boards consecutive years has never laced skates up or is just deflecting idiotic blame to sound intelligent. The clips I linked took me 5 minutes to gather together, no one is winning a battle against boards at full speed no matter your build.

 

[NJ DevLolz]

Crazy idea. Mercer (plus a second) for Zegras. Money is pretty similar, Zegras could slide to center this year and wing next, and the Devils could trade him after next year as an rfa if the money doesn’t work on his extension.

 

[Oneiro]

Irrespective of Jack's injury, kind of seems like teams have scouted us well. You're basically just asking for a skilled, all-world sequence to generate offense going on two months now.

 

[bossram]

Remember when we wondered if we should just give Mercer $6 million per or possibly slightly more, just to buy more UFA years? I know not many people seriously considered it, but it was something that was thought about at the time. He's barely worth what he's making now as it is.

Yep. Was never in favour of the higher AAV, long-term deal. Bridge always made the most sense. Mercer never had that high-end upside to justify the gamble.

 

[guitarguyvic]

Irrespective of Jack's injury, kind of seems like teams have scouted us well. You're basically just asking for a skilled, all-world sequence to generate offense going on two months now.

why would teams be able to scout the devils any better than other teams? Could it be that it’s just because the team is mid?

 

[ZachaFlockaFlame]

Irrespective of Jack's injury, kind of seems like teams have scouted us well. You're basically just asking for a skilled, all-world sequence to generate offense going on two months now.

What I was afraid of happening where this team decides they want to play lock down defense and can't generate off of it, it's shades of what the Islanders did under Trotz after being a train wreck defensively under Doug Weight. Only redeeming quality it seems like the stars in Jack/Bratt can still generate unlike Barzal and those Islander top guys. The rest of the roster though, woof