Devils discussion (news, notes and speculation) - part III

[Guttersniped]

Regarding Markstrom - Friedman said on this morning's 32 Thoughts podcast that the Devils were very concerned after the game, but that he's under the impression that it wasn't as bad as they thought and he's heard the timeline is 4-6 weeks and that "the Devils can handle that".

With the 4 nations break 4-6 weeks is actually 2-4 weeks

Yellow is 4 weeks. Blue is 6 weeks.

I like 4 weeks more lol, the two b2b after the break complicate things.

 

[NjDevsRR]

Im in the camp where particular faceoffs in moments of the gm are important. But in the grand scheme of things, faceoffs are not that important. Nothing wrong with both sides of the argument because both are true.

 

[devilsblood]

Oh well, guess the source I used wasn’t accurate. Where did you get yours? Would love to have another ressource to check out lines!

Natstattrick.

Just going by avg toi on the pp. all 3 guys are among the team leaders.

 

[MasterofGrond]

Jack is top 10 in league scoring. His defensive metrics are the best they have ever been. What else do you want from the guy?

I swear to god I think some folks would rather have konopka than mackinnon.

 

[Clam Jensen]

Jack is top 10 in league scoring. His defensive metrics are the best they have ever been. What else do you want from the guy?

I swear to god I think some folks would rather have konopka than mackinnon.

They want him to grow 3 inches and put on 20 lbs

 

[devilsblood]

Im in the camp where particular faceoffs in moments of the gm are important. But in the grand scheme of things, faceoffs are not that important. Nothing wrong with both sides of the argument because both are true.

In zone faceoffs range from fairly important to very important.

Neutral zones accept for 3v3 are not important.

 

[My3Sons]

In zone faceoffs range from fairly important to very important.

Neutral zones accept for 3v3 are not important.

It also matters if the draw is win cleanly as opposed to against the wall after a scrum and the win is contested when the puck starts moving. While faceoffs can be very important the recording of them is overly simplistic. I think that heavily clouds the argument. Nobody in thr faceoffs don’t matter crowd will ever actually address the issue below the broad brushstroke.

 

[TrufleShufle]

Basically would you rather your top line start with the puck or spend 30 seconds trying to get it?

People could use the % points to show how close to 50/50 it is, but you can do that with any stat to minimize its importance. If as many goals were scored as faceoffs taken you could lump 3 quarters of the league into the "too close to matter" category when looking at goal differential by team.

And to 3sons point, I think they should only count clean wins. and scrum type "wins" should just be draws or toss ups. Would be very interesting to see how many guys excel at winning faceoffs cleanly vs wingers coming in and scooping it out of a battle whether planned that way or not.

 

[jkrdevil]

Jack is top 10 in league scoring. His defensive metrics are the best they have ever been. What else do you want from the guy?

I swear to god I think some folks would rather have konopka than mackinnon.

He has to become a faceoff ace overnight despite rehabbing a shoulder injury during the offseason which probably limited how much he could work on them.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

Basically would you rather your top line start with the puck or spend 30 seconds trying to get it?

People could use the % points to show how close to 50/50 it is, but you can do that with any stat to minimize its importance. If as many goals were scored as faceoffs taken you could lump 3 quarters of the league into the "too close to matter" category when looking at goal differential by team.

And to 3sons point, I think they should only count clean wins. and scrum type "wins" should just be draws or toss ups. Would be very interesting to see how many guys excel at winning faceoffs cleanly vs wingers coming in and scooping it out of a battle whether planned that way or not.

you are making it seems like its one or the other when it is not, at all.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

Basically would you rather your top line start with the puck or spend 30 seconds trying to get it?

People could use the % points to show how close to 50/50 it is, but you can do that with any stat to minimize its importance. If as many goals were scored as faceoffs taken you could lump 3 quarters of the league into the "too close to matter" category when looking at goal differential by team.

And to 3sons point, I think they should only count clean wins. and scrum type "wins" should just be draws or toss ups. Would be very interesting to see how many guys excel at winning faceoffs cleanly vs wingers coming in and scooping it out of a battle whether planned that way or not.

I would like Jack to win more faceoffs, but sometimes you lose one clean and immediately win the puck back. Sometimes you win one clean and immediately give the puck up. They seem to matter a hell of a lot more on special teams. But Jack really should be able to get ~5% better over the rest of his contract, that isn’t asking for much.

 

[TrufleShufle]

you are making it seems like its one or the other when it is not, at all.

Making what one or the other? We aren't arguing yet, honestly asking because I don't know what you mean.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

Basically would you rather your top line start with the puck or spend 30 seconds trying to get it?

Making what one or the other? We aren't arguing yet, honestly asking because I don't know what you mean.

It is not "win the faceoff and retain unquestioned possession" OR "lose the faceoff and chase the puck for 30 seconds". There are so many other things that can happen.

Specific faceoffs can be important. Special teams, end of game situations, etc. But overall, they are not that important and I wouldn't really make any overall decisions one way or the other based on them.

 

[Devils731]

It’s nice to have 1 good player that can win faceoffs for the few faceoffs that matter. It’s not the most important thing for team makeup but I think most teams will ensure they have at least one competent guy who can play defense and not hurt offense.

We are way over-inflating faceoffs if we are saying there are many critical faceoffs per game and that winning them is always a big advantage.

Even for most important draws, whether you win or lose it end up not having a huge impact on most games.

 

[TrufleShufle]

It is not "win the faceoff and retain unquestioned possession" OR "lose the faceoff and chase the puck for 30 seconds". There are so many other things that can happen.

Specific faceoffs can be important. Special teams, end of game situations, etc. But overall, they are not that important and I wouldn't really make any overall decisions one way or the other based on them.

Yea.... in all our times arguing have I ever once made something black and white? Of course, anything can happen. Anything can happen after a goal, like they score two, but you still want to score.

Every time there is a faceoff you would like the best odds of having the puck first. Shouldn't be controversial. You don't have to cast away a 30 goal scorer for someone who never puts up points because he wins faceoffs and nothing else. Just like just because a guy is fast, or big or tries hard. But it's something to look at a whole package and evaluate and take into consideration.

People saying they wish our best player was better at one skill shouldn't be a trigger every time.

 

[Zajacs Bowl Cut]

Yea.... in all our times arguing have I ever once made something black and white? Of course, anything can happen. Anything can happen after a goal, like they score two, but you still want to score.

Every time there is a faceoff you would like the best odds of having the puck first. Shouldn't be controversial. You don't have to cast away a 30 goal scorer for someone who never puts up points because he wins faceoffs and nothing else. Just like just because a guy is fast, or big or tries hard. But it's something to look at a whole package and evaluate and take into consideration.

People saying they wish our best player was better at one skill shouldn't be a trigger every time.

It is fine to hope he gets better at faceoffs.

the original post that started this discussion was essentially "he sucks at faceoffs, he shies away from contact, and does not forecheck". That is insane to say to me.

 

[NJDfan86]

It also matters if the draw is win cleanly as opposed to against the wall after a scrum and the win is contested when the puck starts moving. While faceoffs can be very important the recording of them is overly simplistic. I think that heavily clouds the argument. Nobody in thr faceoffs don’t matter crowd will ever actually address the issue below the broad brushstroke.

Exactly - they should only use leverage face-offs like OZ/DZ and 3v3 OT, NZ faceoffs have almost no impact on scoring long term so them being included just puts in a bunch of noise.

 

[My3Sons]

Exactly - they should only use leverage face-offs like OZ/DZ and 3v3 OT, NZ faceoffs have almost no impact on scoring long term so them being included just puts in a bunch of noise.

And they have to subdivide by wins versus clean wins.

 

[NjDevsRR]

4-2-3 in last 9 (.611 pts %)

Slowly dragged themselves out of that awful road trip, with sicknesses and injuries going on.

Gotta keep a good points pace in the next 6 gms. And then some much needed rest.

 

[DerekDevils30]

4-2-3 in last 9 (.611 pts %)

 

[Devils Trap]

4-2-3 in last 9 (.611 pts %)

Slowly dragged themselves out of that awful road trip, with sicknesses and injuries going on.

Gotta keep a good points pace in the next 6 gms. And then some much needed rest.

I thought we were going to be in a Top 5 pick spot with how the board was

 

[New Jerseys Devil]

Any way we can trade for Miller and move Palat in it for cap reasons? All of that without moving Mercer??

If so thatd be awesome!!

 

[My3Sons]

Any way we can trade for Miller and move Palat in it for cap reasons? All of that without moving Mercer??

If so thatd be awesome!!

If Miller is dogging it to force his way to the Rangers he won’t come to NJ. Beyond that thr Canucks asking price is allegedly Chytil a first and a prospect. For NJ I’m sure they’d ask for Mercer. Miller is signed until he’s older than I am now. I’d pass.

 

[amikaro]

I'd rather keep the hands off JTM and go for some cheaper and less risky assets. Somehow, trouble is following that guy ... let's focus on Nelson or Vatrano.

 

[Barry Tallackson]

Vatrano signed an extension