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Detroit Redwings Downfall

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Dotter said:
Majority of Wings core is under 23 (6 NHL roster players under 23). In comparison, most of Senators core is over 24.

While "technically" Wings started their rebuild before Sens. However Ken Holland botched it and Yzerman had to go full-on scorched earth and clean up his mess when he got here. That took 2 years.

So I count this as Wings second rebuild attempt, and it started in 2019.

Despite this, DRWs outperformed Sens last season, and Sens are a smidge better than DRWs this season, with DET having the worst coach in the NHL (Lalonde) sinking them at the start of the season.

To top it off, Wings best prospects have not even yet.
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So I counted 2 not 6, as core guys under 23.
Kasper and Edvinsson, always with the hyperbole lol.
 
LEAFANFORLIFE23 said:
A


See? I KNEW you would boil it down to literally ONE draft pick because you actually believe It's that simple
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Dude, your entire premise is f***ing stupid. "We didn't have anything?!/.135" when the fact is you had substantially more in the cupboard and on the ice than detroit did. Now, go whine about something else somewhere else, or plan a parade that isn't ever going to happen, no one cares.
 
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LEAFANFORLIFE23 said:
You still made it to simple, It's not that simple, if it were why does Buffalo suck, they've had multiple 1st overall picks and multiple 2nd overall picks and they are not only not getting better they are getting worse.

The answer isn't simply Matthews because if it were Buffalo wouldn't still be last in the east, and they wouldn't be about to miss the playoffs for the 14th straight year.

As for your question about pool party It's impossible to say, there is no question Matthews is a better player, the guy is going to be in the Hall of fame.

But Pool Party was also drafted by the Oilers, they ruined him, they were arguably the worst run team in the league when they drafted him.

If he gets drafted by Toronto who knows what he becomes.
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You again didn’t answer the question lol.

Are the Leafs as good with Strome and Puljujarvi/Laine/PLD as they are with Matthews and Marner?

It’s a simple question
 
nbwingsfan said:
You again didn’t answer the question lol.

Are the Leafs as good with Strome and Puljujarvi/Laine/PLD as they are with Matthews and Marner?

It’s a simple question
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Well we know thanks to a video that was posted years years ago that the Jackets tried to acquire the Marner pick but it didn't happen because the Leafs wanted 8 and 4 2nds.

Had that deal happened there is a very good chance they end up with Werenski and Aho.

One of the reasons they passed on Aho was because they had Marner.

So in the case of Marner very likely would.

Matthews probably not.

But again making it as simple As they got Matthews isn't accurate because if that were true Buffalo wouldn't still suck seeing as they have had multiple 1st overall picks and multiple 2nd overall picks
 
dekelikekocur said:
Dude, your entire premise is f***ing stupid. "We didn't have anything?!/.135" when the fact is you had substantially more in the cupboard and on the ice than detroit did. Now, go whine about something else somewhere else, or plan a parade that isn't ever going to happen, no one cares.
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Don't lie we didn't have more to work with Yzerman had more simply because he had Larkin.

There was Larkin in Toronto.
 
Dotter said:
I honestly think Yzerman does NOT want them making the playoffs just yet. I think he is dangling a carrot, but at the end of the day, I think he wants better draft picks. That's my thought process. There's no question Wings are still in the thick of a rebuild!
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He’s glad they missed the playoffs by a point, so they could draft 16th instead of 17th?

It’s ok to say he’s doing a good job drafting and developing but the late season collapses have been disappointing
 
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LEAFANFORLIFE23 said:
Well we know thanks to a video that was posted years years ago that the Jackets tried to acquire the Marner pick but it didn't happen because the Leafs wanted 8 and 4 2nds.

Had that deal happened there is a very good chance they end up with Werenski and Aho.

One of the reasons they passed on Aho was because they had Marner.

So in the case of Marner very likely would.

Matthews probably not.

But again making it as simple As they got Matthews isn't accurate because if that were true Buffalo wouldn't still suck seeing as they have had multiple 1st overall picks and multiple 2nd overall picks
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Just because they had multiple 1st overall picks means absolutely nothing when the quality of 1st overall picks changes dramatically. Unless you think Hischier and McDavid are equal?

Also you can’t just say they would have had Weresnki and Aho :laugh: you have no idea who they would have drafted :laugh:

And it’s not “probably not” unless you agree Matthews isn’t that much better than those players listed?
 
The Gr8 Dane said:
Red Wings should try a proper rebuild , never too late to start one
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The young players aren’t the problem. Kasper, Mo, Ed, Ray have been good. DeBrincat has been solid. Larkin might be playing hurt after the 4 nations. You don’t deal any of these unless you’re getting a clear upgrade.

The issue from last season was Lalonde clearly lost the room around March. It carried over to this season and the team was at one point last in the east.

Couple this with Yzerman downgrading on Fabbri, Sprong, Perron, Gostisbehere, and Walman. All were important depth pieces for the wings. Perron and Fabbri were great locker room leaders. Walman and Ghost were well liked contributors. Now that locker room is silent. There was an article about how introverted the Wings locker room is. No firebrands, no types to stand up and hype the team in the room.

Depth in Detroit has been replacement level this year.

The bottom pair for a long time was Gustafson and Holl. The absolute worst bottom pair I’ve seen in red and white my whole life.

The 4th line of Motte Veleno Fischer was as bad as De LaRose, Ehn and Glendening. Maybe worse.

Tank fell off a cliff and needs to consider retirement. Compher shit the bed. Berggren can’t figure out how to be consistent. And Rasmussen has gone back to being useless after a solid season last year.

Where Yzerman needs to improve is pro scouting and being more aggressive at pursuing real upgrades to this team. I would LOVE if we could dump Compher and get Ryan O’Reilly to be 3C. He’s who I wanted in free agency that offseason anyway. I would love for Yzerman to aggressively pursue a top 4 LD so Seider finally has a good partner.

These are the kinds of changes Detroit needs to make. Not tearing it down to the studs and full on rebuilding.
 
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The Gr8 Dane said:
Red Wings should try a proper rebuild , never too late to start one
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Yzerman’s needs a 1C, a 1D, and an elite power forward. Is Quinn Hughes a guy he could get? Pair him with Seider. Best pair in the league? Playoffs for sure. Steal an “Eichel” like Vegas did. Then that club is very close.
 
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Dotter said:
I mistyped. It was 4, not 6. I wrote 4 in another post.

Seider is 23. Soderblom is 23. +Kasper, Ed

Wings have Six 24 and under, or seven if you count Mazur... who I think will be a DRW regular when he gets healthy.
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lol I still see 2, U23 players,
maybe have a third try. Appears you don’t seem to realize U23, doesn’t include 23. That’s why it’s 2.

Here is what you said,
Majority of Wings core is under 23 (6 NHL roster players under 23). In comparison, most of Senators core is over 24.
 
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You keep being mid. Mid is why this team stays 6-10 points out of making the playoffs every year. I dont have all the proper team building answers, but DET have to learn to lose as painful as that might sound. I'm sure some of your prospects will be real players some day, but DET has to start pacing with CHI, SJS, and BUF. The day you see them at the bottom of the standings year after year, is the true beginning of their rebuild. The future is not near I'm afraid.
 
The pro scouting seems to be an issue in Detroit. A bunch of their vets are overpaid and kinda suck. There are good trades to be made with established NHLers, the Wings are just not making them yet at least.
 
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Golden_Jet said:
lol I still see 2, U23 players,
maybe have a third try. Appears you don’t seem to realize U23, doesn’t include 23. That’s why it’s 2.

Here is what you said,
Majority of Wings core is under 23 (6 NHL roster players under 23). In comparison, most of Senators core is over 24.
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Rather than splitting hairs about birthdays I think it's fair to say Detroit's core is still being built. Tentatively I'd say the main core going forward is:

Larkin Raymond
Kasper

Edvinsson Seider

Potentials: ASP, Cossa, Augustine, Danielson, Buchelnikov, MBN, etc.

The bolded are what I'd consider "established" players, they're no longer prospects or rookies.

For Ottawa it's:

Stützle Tkachuk
Norris/Cozens

Sanderson Chabot

Ullmark

Potentials: Yakemchuk

A team can make the playoffs without having the core completely locked in, but it's hard because it puts a lot of pressure on the depth pieces contributing. Detroit got some of that last season, but not so much this year.
 
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