Player Discussion David Quinn: Part VI

[JHS]

1. I played college hockey, but that's totally irrelevant to this discussion.

2. Shesterkin performed as expected. Many picked him as part of the conversation for ROY.

3. If you believe Laf and Kakko performed better statistically than expected, you're alone in that belief.

4. If faceoffs can be taught effectively, why don't players get better?

5. If you don't believe that Mika's 1st half performance negatively affected the Rangers place in the standings, you might be alone in that, too.

6. If you knew before the season that Fox would have a Norris type year in addition to what happened to their best forward, their best goal scorer, and their highest scoring defenseman, and you would have thought that would net to a better season, I would have laughed at that idea. Funny thing is, you would have, too.

But you are making my point for me-- the team had all these things HAPPEN and the results were still a missed playoff season. How does this not equate as an underperformance? Mica's injury, whether it be a virus or injury is par for the course and of course impacted the season. I said that but my exact point is, a better prepared team would have managed that situation better. Why was he still getting paraded out there with almost the same minutes he was at the end of the season? Seems like that's poor coaching to me.

Fox OVERACHIEVED and, likely so did Laf and Kappo--a 20 goal season( on pace for it) in your first and second year is not entirely common) Igor, OVERACHIEVED and played far above what could be realistically expected from second year goalie. And yet- here we are, still missing the playoffs. So if these guys all perform exactly this way again next year, which seems like a reach-- but let's just assume so for this discussion-- and the coach remains the same-- is your assumption the team will magically get better or are you of the mindset that destiny controls everything and it will "just be as it is."?

Your coach must have been awful then if you don't remember spending hours working on faceoffs during practice including how to improve off the drop of the puck. It's literally one of the most practiced skills besides shooting and skating. To each his own though-- it's a conclusion you can make but don't use it to defend Quinn because somehow, despite having over 10 different players playing center during his time with the club, poor faceoffs have been a common trend here. And, as I'm sure you are aware- faceoffs are effort plays more than many others in hockey. That's not exactly a ringing endorsement of the guy either.

 

[chosen]

I really don't understand when people say Quinn did a great job at improving players individual games. Who actually improved from the beginning of the season, to the end? Only one player (Lafraniere) He had a 10 month layoff from playing any real hockey... odds were Laff was going to figure it out regardless.
Why are people giving him credit for the summer training regimen of kakko, and buchnevich. Both actually regressed as the season went along. K'Andre Miller got worse.. Who got better?

Kakko regressed?

Buchnevich hasn't improved by light years under Quinn?

Fox hasn't improved?

Lindgren hasn't drastically improved?

Chytil looked much better until he got hurt.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

Kakko regressed?

Buchnevich hasn't improved by light years under Quinn?

Fox hasn't improved?

Lindgren hasn't drastically improved?

Chytil looked much better until he got hurt.

Give it another day or two, people are gonna start blaming Quinn for Martinez's OT winner in 2014.

 

[chosen]

Give it another day or two, people are gonna start blaming Quinn for Martinez's OT winner in 2014.

Quinn caused the Covid pandemic.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Yep, who are all of these Quinn supporters? They clearly don't exist.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

Quinn caused the Covid pandemic.

He got it just to give it to Mika.

 

[haveandare]

I don’t take too much issue with his player development honestly. A lot of guys improved, some a lot, to the point that it’s hard to think it’s all a coincidence or done in spite of coaching. Definitely some stupid ice time moves here snd there but that happens with any coach anywhere.

Having said that, he should go for two reasons. One, it’s insane to fire the GM and president because the team isn’t far enough along compared to expectations and not also fire the person who has the most to do with the on ice product day to day. Seems like Dolan thinks this team should be competing - if so we need a coach for that phase of things. I think Quinn has been effective as a development coach but even though I think Dolans expectations are delusional, I do think it’s time to start laying the foundation for a seriously competitive team in terms of strategy and identity.

Two, the way this team was totally steamrolled in the most important games of the year was ridiculous. Losing them is one thing, whatever, you can’t always beat good teams, but they just absolutely laid down and went through the motions. We can debate a lot of what a coach is or isn’t responsible for, but I think most would agree that getting players prepared and motivated to at least put up a fight when it matters most is part of a coach’s job.

 

[SA16]

Based off the comments today it looks like the players really like Quinn's coaching. What about signing him to an extension in advance so we don't have to bid against other teams on the open market in a couple of years?

 

[Kodiak]

You realize of course that other players went down in faceoff percentage, yet they all get the same coaching.

Not clear on your point here. You said that players do not improve on faceoffs, but it's actually very common for young players to need to learn how to be successful at faceoffs at the NHL level. As for why Zibanejad regressed on faceoffs and why Strome has never been good at them, that's another question. But the idea that faceoff skill is innate is just not true, and following that line of thinking leads one to believing the only way for the team to improve on faceoffs is to replace these centers.

 

[Kodiak]

I think Quinn actually did a great job at getting players to improve their individual game. We saw alot of players making strides, becoming better defensively.

however, Quinn was terrible at making the “team” better. His system is awful, and it looked like players never new where they were supposed to be or if they should commit to forechecking. His scheme for breakouts was horrific as well.

and his player usage leaves alot to be desired.

he just isnt a coach that will make a team better, and for that he needs to be removed.

This is more or less where I am as well. Quinn has had players take significant steps forward under his tenure, but his system leaves a lot to be desired, especially in the neutral and offensive zones. It seems like the veterans go off of instinct and the young players don't have much direction in those areas. And then you group your young players together and it compounds the problem.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Based off the comments today it looks like the players really like Quinn's coaching. What about signing him to an extension in advance so we don't have to bid against other teams on the open market in a couple of years?

Inmates seem to be running the asylum.

 

[fm]

I don’t take too much issue with his player development honestly. A lot of guys improved, some a lot, to the point that it’s hard to think it’s all a coincidence or done in spite of coaching. Definitely some stupid ice time moves here snd there but that happens with any coach anywhere.

Having said that, he should go for two reasons. One, it’s insane to fire the GM and president because the team isn’t far enough along compared to expectations and not also fire the person who has the most to do with the on ice product day to day. Seems like Dolan thinks this team should be competing - if so we need a coach for that phase of things. I think Quinn has been effective as a development coach but even though I think Dolans expectations are delusional, I do think it’s time to start laying the foundation for a seriously competitive team in terms of strategy and identity.

Two, the way this team was totally steamrolled in the most important games of the year was ridiculous. Losing them is one thing, whatever, you can’t always beat good teams, but they just absolutely laid down and went through the motions. We can debate a lot of what a coach is or isn’t responsible for, but I think most would agree that getting players prepared and motivated to at least put up a fight when it matters most is part of a coach’s job.

A-the f*ck-men

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

I don’t take too much issue with his player development honestly. A lot of guys improved, some a lot, to the point that it’s hard to think it’s all a coincidence or done in spite of coaching. Definitely some stupid ice time moves here snd there but that happens with any coach anywhere.

Having said that, he should go for two reasons. One, it’s insane to fire the GM and president because the team isn’t far enough along compared to expectations and not also fire the person who has the most to do with the on ice product day to day. Seems like Dolan thinks this team should be competing - if so we need a coach for that phase of things. I think Quinn has been effective as a development coach but even though I think Dolans expectations are delusional, I do think it’s time to start laying the foundation for a seriously competitive team in terms of strategy and identity.

Two, the way this team was totally steamrolled in the most important games of the year was ridiculous. Losing them is one thing, whatever, you can’t always beat good teams, but they just absolutely laid down and went through the motions. We can debate a lot of what a coach is or isn’t responsible for, but I think most would agree that getting players prepared and motivated to at least put up a fight when it matters most is part of a coach’s job.

Well f***ing said.

 

[WojtekWolski86]

I don’t take too much issue with his player development honestly. A lot of guys improved, some a lot, to the point that it’s hard to think it’s all a coincidence or done in spite of coaching. Definitely some stupid ice time moves here snd there but that happens with any coach anywhere.

Having said that, he should go for two reasons. One, it’s insane to fire the GM and president because the team isn’t far enough along compared to expectations and not also fire the person who has the most to do with the on ice product day to day. Seems like Dolan thinks this team should be competing - if so we need a coach for that phase of things. I think Quinn has been effective as a development coach but even though I think Dolans expectations are delusional, I do think it’s time to start laying the foundation for a seriously competitive team in terms of strategy and identity.

Two, the way this team was totally steamrolled in the most important games of the year was ridiculous. Losing them is one thing, whatever, you can’t always beat good teams, but they just absolutely laid down and went through the motions. We can debate a lot of what a coach is or isn’t responsible for, but I think most would agree that getting players prepared and motivated to at least put up a fight when it matters most is part of a coach’s job.

Can we just sticky this post and close the thread?

 

[ArPanet]

If Quinn is not let go does that undermine Dolan’s claims about why the other guys got fired?

 

[Kane One]

If Quinn is not let go does that undermine Dolan’s claims about why the other guys got fired?

His claim as to why JD was fired makes no sense anyway.

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

If Quinn is not let go does that undermine Dolan’s claims about why the other guys got fired?

Yes 100% haha

although we already knew that

 

[SingnBluesOnBroadway]

If Quinn is not let go does that undermine Dolan’s claims about why the other guys got fired?

No. Dolan's claim has already been undermined by Drury saying there's no time table for the playoffs.

 

[will1066]

Inmates seem to be running the asylum.

Then that's a roster issue. Take your pick of analogy: warden's lost control, or teacher's lost control of the class.

 

[Jaromir Jagr]

I don’t take too much issue with his player development honestly. A lot of guys improved, some a lot, to the point that it’s hard to think it’s all a coincidence or done in spite of coaching. Definitely some stupid ice time moves here snd there but that happens with any coach anywhere.

Having said that, he should go for two reasons. One, it’s insane to fire the GM and president because the team isn’t far enough along compared to expectations and not also fire the person who has the most to do with the on ice product day to day. Seems like Dolan thinks this team should be competing - if so we need a coach for that phase of things. I think Quinn has been effective as a development coach but even though I think Dolans expectations are delusional, I do think it’s time to start laying the foundation for a seriously competitive team in terms of strategy and identity.

Two, the way this team was totally steamrolled in the most important games of the year was ridiculous. Losing them is one thing, whatever, you can’t always beat good teams, but they just absolutely laid down and went through the motions. We can debate a lot of what a coach is or isn’t responsible for, but I think most would agree that getting players prepared and motivated to at least put up a fight when it matters most is part of a coach’s job.

Good post. All I'd add is I think it's possible to believe that Quinn did a pretty decent job as a development coach while also believing that the guy to take us to the next-level needs to be someone else.

To my knowledge, Quinn wasn't brought here to win a cup, but rather to nurture our young core. The next guy needs to be someone who develops that young core into hardened professionals.

 

[RGY]

I have never seen such staunch support and deflecting for a Coach that has really not accomplished anything at the NHL level.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

I have never seen such staunch support and deflecting for a Coach that has really not accomplished anything at the NHL level.

I've made the same point. Where is this development? He played Blackwell the second half of the year on the second line and PP1 over our youngsters. I'm telling you people like him personally and therefore stick up for him. AV was a douche and even though he accomplished infinitely more for the Rangers everyone wanted him gone.

 

[Jaromir Jagr]

I've made the same point. Where is this development? He played Blackwell the second half of the year on the second line and PP1 over our youngsters. I'm telling you people like him personally and therefore stick up for him. AV was a douche and even though he accomplished infinitely more for the Rangers everyone wanted him gone.

Where is this development? Is that serious?

 

[Nickmo82]

Is he still employed because of feet dragging or because the FO has faith in the guy?

 

[haveandare]

I have never seen such staunch support and deflecting for a Coach that has really not accomplished anything at the NHL level.

Lol what staunch support? I see exactly none and my block list isn’t long