Value of: Dallas Pieces in a Potential Rebuild

[Ghost of Kyiv]

I would kind Holland taking a look at Khudobin.


Though I got to ask why Dallas fans don't think he'll be protected?

Oettinger should be exempt (unless those 6 games in the AHL at the end of 18/19 after collage cost him that?), and Bishop is 34 with a wonky knee. That doesn't inspire much confidence that he'll get back to what he once was.

Bishop has a no movement clause and will require protection, Dallas won't have a choice.

 

[BeaverSports]

I don’t think Nill will sell too much. Some of the more valuable pieces have no-trade clauses and Faksa signed a fairly team-friendly deal to stay. I could see the UFAs like Cogliano and Comeau as depth rentals and I still wonder on Gurianov in a value-for-value deal because Bowness still doesn’t seem to trust him a lot.

 

[2Pair]

Rossi + 1st

 

[AirGut]

If Seguin is ever made available expect the NYR to be interested. The problem is he's injury prone but we need a C like him really bad to form a 1-2 punch. What could it take though?

 

[Ghost of Kyiv]

I don’t think Nill will sell too much. Some of the more valuable pieces have no-trade clauses and Faksa signed a fairly team-friendly deal to stay. I could see the UFAs like Cogliano and Comeau as depth rentals and I still wonder on Gurianov in a value-for-value deal because Bowness still doesn’t seem to trust him a lot.

I don't think Dallas will sell too much either, just a few vets as you mentioned.

On Gurianov though, I think Nill might be too hesitant to move on from one of his high draft picks, he's shown to be in the past anyways.

 

[KingsFan7824]

They were a heartbeat from winning it all. They need to add talent to get over the final hump. Trying to build a all star U23 team is also a HF phenomena and no way to win a cup.

That's stretching the definition of heartbeat. A heartbeat is OT in Game 7. Not down 3-1, and lose in 6.

Here's your deadline fun; Cogliano, Comeau, Oleksiak.

Nobody is taking a soon to be 35 year old Khudobin, whose cash exceeds his cap hit the next 2 years. Pavelski can pick where he wants to go, and is probably cool with the extra money he makes in Texas. Obviously nobody is touching Benn and Seguin because of those contracts. Klingberg could be traded in the summer.

They're too far gone with Benn and Seguin to blow anything up. Not that you can blow things up quickly in a hard cap league. They'll take their lumps this year. They didn't go all in on Pavelski just to get rid of him. They clear out some space this summer. Most of it will end up going to Heiskanen, but they'll give it one more shot with Pavelski, Radulov, and Klingberg. After 21-22, those 3 are UFAs, and they take up a good chunk of space. Then they'll do something else to try and win with Benn and Seguin, because what else are they going to do? If they suck, they suck, and they get a higher pick, but they're locked into those two guys. There's no rebuilding yet in Dallas. That comes 3 or 4 years from now, when Benn is done, and assuming they've been in the black hole during that time.

Teams don't just rebuild. You fall apart over a period of years, and/or players choose to leave. That's when the rebuilding starts. Teams generally hold onto any shred of hope of being competitive. Vancouver with the twins. Calgary with Iginla. NJ wasn't rebuilding until after Parise walked away. Buffalo began their current crumbling after Drury and Briere left. SJ is now rebuilding, but they weren't trying to, and now they're stuck with a handful of terrible contracts. The Rangers publicly said they were rebuilding, and then soon after signed Panarin to a billion dollars. That's not the investment of a rebuilding team.

Dallas is nowhere near rebuilding anything. At best it's a retooling, and anyone with any value in a trade is younger, which are the guys they can't afford to trade.

 

[Magic Mittens]

If Seguin is ever made available expect the NYR to be interested. The problem is he's injury prone but we need a C like him really bad to form a 1-2 punch. What could it take though?

Not counting this season, Seguin has missed around 30 games since 2013-2014 season when he came to Dallas

I doubt they’d move him, but if they did I’d guess for a young forward, pick and a dump or something like that

 

[Mickey Marner]

If they were to actually rebuild, Benn and Seguin would be the players to go. More likely they trade off a couple contracts expiring in 2021 or 2022 and hope for better play next season.

 

[PettersonHughes]

Something around Virtanen? I feel like Dallas for once has all the picks in the next 3 drafts (they traded a lot of them in the past three years), but Virtanen could be an interesting piece for them. Middle six with a little spice. Gaudette maybe? If you're going for picks I would say a 2nd and a 5th?

Value wise I wonder if straight across would work. Also, was looking into his advanced stats, and they seem worse than previous years, has his usage changed (e.g. is he still a matchup/ shutdown C? who does he play with? also wonder if that might be due to Khudobin and others being out)?

TBH Virtanen has been slumping a bit too but we've been looking for a defensive and playmaking 3rd C so if Radek's available then Jake can be yours.

 

[Ghost of Kyiv]

Value wise I wonder if straight across would work. Also, was looking into his advanced stats, and they seem worse than previous years, has his usage changed (e.g. is he still a matchup/ shutdown C? who does he play with? also wonder if that might be due to Khudobin and others being out)?

TBH Virtanen has been slumping a bit too but we've been looking for a defensive and playmaking 3rd C so if Radek's available then Jake can be yours.

There's been no change in role for Faksa, he just hasn't played well to start the year. And that's fine, just natural ebbs and flows of a hockey season, I have zero concern about him returning to form.

As far as the proposed swap for Virtanen. To put it frankly, Radek is just a superior player. I see no reason to downgrade.

 

[Kcb12345]

That's stretching the definition of heartbeat. A heartbeat is OT in Game 7. Not down 3-1, and lose in 6.

Here's your deadline fun; Cogliano, Comeau, Oleksiak.

Nobody is taking a soon to be 35 year old Khudobin, whose cash exceeds his cap hit the next 2 years. Pavelski can pick where he wants to go, and is probably cool with the extra money he makes in Texas. Obviously nobody is touching Benn and Seguin because of those contracts. Klingberg could be traded in the summer.

They're too far gone with Benn and Seguin to blow anything up. Not that you can blow things up quickly in a hard cap league. They'll take their lumps this year. They didn't go all in on Pavelski just to get rid of him. They clear out some space this summer. Most of it will end up going to Heiskanen, but they'll give it one more shot with Pavelski, Radulov, and Klingberg. After 21-22, those 3 are UFAs, and they take up a good chunk of space. Then they'll do something else to try and win with Benn and Seguin, because what else are they going to do? If they suck, they suck, and they get a higher pick, but they're locked into those two guys. There's no rebuilding yet in Dallas. That comes 3 or 4 years from now, when Benn is done, and assuming they've been in the black hole during that time.

Teams don't just rebuild. You fall apart over a period of years, and/or players choose to leave. That's when the rebuilding starts. Teams generally hold onto any shred of hope of being competitive. Vancouver with the twins. Calgary with Iginla. NJ wasn't rebuilding until after Parise walked away. Buffalo began their current crumbling after Drury and Briere left. SJ is now rebuilding, but they weren't trying to, and now they're stuck with a handful of terrible contracts. The Rangers publicly said they were rebuilding, and then soon after signed Panarin to a billion dollars. That's not the investment of a rebuilding team.

Dallas is nowhere near rebuilding anything. At best it's a retooling, and anyone with any value in a trade is younger, which are the guys they can't afford to trade.

I agree with this. It would take a lot to convince Stars management to rebuild after this disastrous weird ass season shortly after making it to the Stanley Cup Final. They'll mark it down as a fluke for sure and try again next year.

Truth is, if the Stars acquire a top 6 forward or 2 somehow they could be right back as a contender.

 

[Kcb12345]

Lot of interest in Faksa I see. I'd love to trade him but I doubt it happens. First year of a new big contract, no way he's being moved.

Also no way Roope Hintz is moved unless it's as part of a package for a better young top 6 player. Gurianov likely the same story.

 

[PettersonHughes]

There's been no change in role for Faksa, he just hasn't played well to start the year. And that's fine, just natural ebbs and flows of a hockey season, I have zero concern about him returning to form.

As far as the proposed swap for Virtanen. To put it frankly, Radek is just a superior player. I see no reason to downgrade.

That's honestly debatable, I think Jake's offensive ceiling is higher (in a full season last year he would've gotten to 20 goals, Faksa hasn't topped 12 goals or 33 points), but Radek is better defensively and more well-rounded. Probably agree to disagree then, each has their strengths -- anyhow, I digress. How much of an add would the Stars want in a potential sell-off?

 

[Ghost of Kyiv]

That's honestly debatable, I think Jake's offensive ceiling is higher (in a full season last year he would've gotten to 20 goals, Faksa hasn't topped 12 goals or 33 points), but Radek is better defensively and more well-rounded. Probably agree to disagree then, each has their strengths -- anyhow, I digress. How much of an add would the Stars want in a potential sell-off?

I don't think we disagree, I'd bet you realize he's better as well. Hence why you'd entertain the trade. It's a question of a better known entity vs unrealized upside. Personally I don't believe in Jake's ability to realize his potential, and as such have nothing else to add to the conversation.

 

[BrettHullsToe]

That's honestly debatable

Goes to Vancouver forum, searches for keyword "Virtanen" with thread prefix "GDT", sorts by date with most recent first, reads through several pages of results...

Is it really, though?

 

[PettersonHughes]

Goes to Vancouver forum, searches for keyword "Virtanen" with thread prefix "GDT", sorts by date with most recent first, reads through several pages of results...

Is it really, though?

Yes. Yes it is.

 

[glenbuis]

Jets will take one Klingberg please. Pretty much anything available except perfetti.

Ok scheiffle it is