D Haoxi (Simon) Wang - Oshawa Generals, OHL (2025 Draft)

[Bjorn Le]

The thing is...Wang has a low ceiling himself. Skill is the most crucial factor when it comes to ceiling. Wang is big and can skate like the wind but that alone doesn't make him a high ceiling prospect. If you wanna play big minutes in the NHL, skill is the one thing you gotta have. You don't necessarily need to have elite vision or be an elite skater. But if you wanna play top4/top6 on a consistent basis then you need skill. You need to be able to handle the puck, make plays. Whether you're a forward or a defenseman, you gotta be able to play with the puck. If plays are dying on your stick, if you keep on throwing pucks away then you're not a top4/top6 player. Skill is the area where Wang is far behind everybody else and I don't know why we're just assuming that he's gonna overtake everybody. I think at this point you'd be crazy to assume that his ceiling is high. Can he make it to the NHL? Not likely but he absolutely can. If he does, is he gonna play heavy minutes? I have zero reason to believe so.

I'm also not sure the draft is necessarily gonna be a weak one. For example, MacKenzie has Bill Zonnon listed in the 2nd round. Incredibly green and one heck of a project as well but despite that sitting 3rd in QMJHL scoring. Big, physical two way Center loaded with skill. That's what a high ceiling project looks like.

But that isn't really true, not every star defencemen needs to be a wizard with the puck on their stick. Someone like Chara was never more than just OK with the puck on his stick but with time, experience, and his physical tools, he became a number 1 defencemen. Wang does not and will never play like Chara but he's comparable in the sense that he very underdeveloped from a hockey skills perspective as a teenager but has very strong physical tools.

Wang, like Chara, lacks innate hockey talent but if he even just became serviceable with the puck and responsible in his own end, that's a top 4 defensemen in the NHL with his skating, athleticism, and size. Both those skills are very teachable, especially now that he is in a good OHL organization with a strong development track record. Hopefully he'll get drafted by a similarly good NHL organization as well. Whether he can improve his skills remains to be seen but players with his physical tools are quite uncommon.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

The fact that he is Chinese-born is the root of 90% of the criticism in this thread. He is a legit prospect. Overrated because of his size and athleticism as compared to his skill, perhaps. But if he was a white Canadian/American in the exact same situation, he wouldn't receive a tenth of the criticism that he has here.

And you shouldn’t leave out that many of his proponents wouldn’t care at all about him if he wasn’t Chinese. He’s a nice novelty story. If he was another race, he’d be yet another bad hockey player that NHL scouts overrate because he’s moderately more athletic than others.

 

[WarriorofTime]

I'm also not sure the draft is necessarily gonna be a weak one. For example, MacKenzie has Bill Zonnon listed in the 2nd round. Incredibly green and one heck of a project as well but despite that sitting 3rd in QMJHL scoring. Big, physical two way Center loaded with skill. That's what a high ceiling project looks like.

So the draft is good because a particular guy you like you think is rated too low? Not sure I'm following. I'm hearing that a lot of late 1sts this year would be 2nds in other years and that a lot of 2nds would be 3rds... just based on scouting grades.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

the basement scouts can't comprehend this - just let them keep chasing their tail and LARP as scouts

It also isn’t remotely a good comparison.

Wang is bad at hockey. Letourneau is okay at hockey. He has the type of puck skills that if Wang had would evidently have him a top 10 pick.

Letourneau is a first round project. He was a standout at SAC and decent in the few USHL games he played.

 

[bigdog16]

I fail to see why your plug would need to be 22. Your AHL team will want enough players that are in development or veteran exempt (under 25 yo & 320 pro games), but that's pretty much all value there's to it.

I'm not sure I am understanding the point you are trying to make. Are you alluding that Alexeyev, Johnson, and Wiesblatt were nothing picks? They are all on track to become full time NHLers.

 

[Hinterland]

But that isn't really true, not every star defencemen needs to be a wizard with the puck on their stick. Someone like Chara was never more than just OK with the puck on his stick but with time, experience, and his physical tools, he became a number 1 defencemen. Wang does not and will never play like Chara but he's comparable in the sense that he very underdeveloped from a hockey skills perspective as a teenager but has very strong physical tools.

Wang, like Chara, lacks innate hockey talent but if he even just became serviceable with the puck and responsible in his own end, that's a top 4 defensemen in the NHL with his skating, athleticism, and size. Both those skills are very teachable, especially now that he is in a good OHL organization with a strong development track record. Hopefully he'll get drafted by a similarly good NHL organization as well. Whether he can improve his skills remains to be seen but players with his physical tools are quite uncommon.

Again, Chara played mostly vs men in his draft year. He was miles ahead of where Wang is now. Wang would get eaten alive playing vs men. Also in terms of skill. Also, Chara is a three times 50 point and six times 40 point scorer in the NHL. Your description of him is, quite frankly, an insult. I'd bet any amount of money Wang is never gonna be a 40 point scorer in the NHL. Not a chance. You'd be nuts to believe he has that kind of offensive upside.

 

[Namejs]

Some of you guys act like you’ve never heard the term “project.” Big kids with decent skating get drafted higher. Hell, Zdeno Chara couldn’t skate and he got drafted in the third round. Sounds like this kid has good drive, so some scouts think they could turn him into something. Maybe he becomes a pro player, or maybe not, but that’s what projects are.

Can you list me a few similar projects that were, you know, succesful?

Because if these 'projects' never end up being succesful, they're not projects, they're a waste of a pick.

Chara was one of the leading junior Dmen in respectable junior leagues/Slovakian men's league.

No one has really brought up even a single valid comparison so far.

 

[MeHateHe]

Again, Chara played mostly vs men in his draft year.

Not really. He split his time in his draft year between the second division in Slovakia (15 games), the Slovakian U20 league (22 games) and the Czech U20 league (15 games).

 

[Albatros]

I'm not sure I am understanding the point you are trying to make. Are you alluding that Alexeyev, Johnson, and Wiesblatt were nothing picks? They are all on track to become full time NHLers.

Yeah, I see them all as having nothing above replacement level. Happy to be wrong, but even Wiesblatt is turning 23 and so far has 19 points in 35 AHL games this season as an offensively minded forward. Johnson has been mostly reliable in the AHL but is a non-physical defenseman without much offense, off to Europe as well in a couple of years. Alexeyev I'm not sure if he's even taking part in any team activities anymore, might be retired from hockey.

 

[Bjorn Le]

Again, Chara played mostly vs men in his draft year. He was miles ahead of where Wang is now. Wang would get eaten alive playing vs men. Also in terms of skill. Also, Chara is a three times 50 point and six times 40 point scorer in the NHL. Your description of him is, quite frankly, an insult. I'd bet any amount of money Wang is never gonna be a 40 point scorer in the NHL. Not a chance. You'd be nuts to believe he has that kind of offensive upside.

Again, not true. In Chara’s draft year (1995), he split time between the Slovak U18 and U20 league, both of which were very low level hockey. He went undrated and in his D+1 season (where he was actually drafted), he played a little over a dozen games mostly in the second tier Slovak league. He then went to the WHL in his D+2 where he remained very raw. He was a bottom pairing defensive defencemen, regarded as a very poor skater with no puck skills until he broke out in Ottawa who put him and his booming slapshot on the powerplay. Chara was 25 by the time anyone viewed him as someone who was more than a bottom pairing no skill plug. If this board existed in the 1990s, someone like you would have said the bolded line about Chara.

Wang is big, extremely mobile, and very athletic. You would be nuts to write him off because he is very raw 17 year old. You can say he’s too big of a risk to waste a 1st or even 2nd round pick on. But to dismiss him as a no upside non-prospect either suggests that you don’t know what you’re talking about, or that there is something non-hockey about him that you don’t like.

 

[Coaches Coroner]

the basement scouts can't comprehend this - just let them keep chasing their tail and LARP as scouts

It's a little weird. I haven't seen him like the other posters shitting on him, which is why I don't have much of an opinion of him. The, what appears to be outrage couple with over zealous confidence that he's a total bust at 18 because some scouts rank him as a late 1st rounder is something I've not seen before on these boards.

It would be nice to come to this thread to see some opinions from people who have actually seen him play, preferably live, rather than the boo hooing and guffawing by people who admit to not having seen him play in a game.

 

[VeteranPresence]

It's a little weird. I haven't seen him like the other posters shitting on him, which is why I don't have much of an opinion of him. The, what appears to be outrage couple with over zealous confidence that he's a total bust at 18 because some scouts rank him as a late 1st rounder is something I've not seen before on these boards.

It would be nice to come to this thread to see some opinions from people who have actually seen him play, preferably live, rather than the boo hooing and guffawing by people who admit to not having seen him play in a game.

It is a really strange debate though. I can't remember the last prospect who had a top 60 grade from so many reputable sources/services but also had such abysmal counting stats and (from my amateur POV) very underwhelming video.

This is the kind of player the later rounds of the draft was made for, and I don't think anyone would care if McKeen's or Central Scouting had tagged him in the 100s. He's a home run shot, whatever, teams take those every year. But in the first two rounds, maybe even the FIRST round? I think personally a prospect needs a whole lot more than "big" and "skates good". That this isn't a weak draft puzzles me even more. It feels like Hugh Jessiman all over again.

 

[Hinterland]

Again, not true. In Chara’s draft year (1995), he split time between the Slovak U18 and U20 league, both of which were very low level hockey. He went undrated and in his D+1 season (where he was actually drafted), he played a little over a dozen games mostly in the second tier Slovak league. He then went to the WHL in his D+2 where he remained very raw. He was a bottom pairing defensive defencemen, regarded as a very poor skater with no puck skills until he broke out in Ottawa who put him and his booming slapshot on the powerplay. Chara was 25 by the time anyone viewed him as someone who was more than a bottom pairing no skill plug. If this board existed in the 1990s, someone like you would have said the bolded line about Chara.

Wang is big, extremely mobile, and very athletic. You would be nuts to write him off because he is very raw 17 year old. You can say he’s too big of a risk to waste a 1st or even 2nd round pick on. But to dismiss him as a no upside non-prospect either suggests that you don’t know what you’re talking about, or that there is something non-hockey about him that you don’t like.

I like Wang as a project but having watched his OHL games I have to admit that I like exactly nothing about his game with the puck except his skating. That's the problem I have with this player. That's also why I think you must be nuts to think he has a high ceiling. He has a decent chance to make the NHL as a 3rd pairing stay at home defenseman. I don't see him drive play at NHL level though as it would require him to not only catch up to his draft class but also overtake most of them in terms of skill...which, quite frankly...is very unlikely to happen. Like it or not but Chara was a much better player at the same age. A worse skater and very green as well but much more skilled, much more assertive, much more refined than Wang is right now.

We all know it's unlikely he makes it to the NHL but in case he does become a regular in the NHL for at least one season...ready for a bet? I say there's no chance he ever makes it to 40 points. You seem to believe in his upside? Chara reached 40 points nine (!) times. Should be doable for a defenseman with high ceiling?

 

[Bjorn Le]

I like Wang as a project but having watched his OHL games I have to admit that I like exactly nothing about his game with the puck except his skating. That's the problem I have with this player. That's also why I think you must be nuts to think he has a high ceiling. He has a decent chance to make the NHL as a 3rd pairing stay at home defenseman. I don't see him drive play at NHL level though as it would require him to not only catch up to his draft class but also overtake most of them in terms of skill...which, quite frankly...is very unlikely to happen. Like it or not but Chara was a much better player at the same age. A worse skater and very green as well but much more skilled, much more assertive, much more refined than Wang is right now.

Because he doesn’t have to become anymore than just OK with the puck to become an NHL player. And if he comes a steady, responsible player too and develops a feel for the game that many players do once they are older and more experienced, he could become a very good NHL player. All of that is very teachable with the right coaching and summer programs so no wonder why Oshawa and certain scouts are all over him.

I do not agree at all that Chara was more advanced than Wang. People simply do not remember what Chara was like when he was young. He was very raw and no one thought he had any skill. People would’ve shocked Chara ever scored more than 20 points in a season. Chara got playing time in men’s leagues earlier than Wang will because the game was very different back then. Every team had a plug like Chara that they stashed on the fourth line or the bottom pairing. Chara developed from a plug into a top pairing defencemen because he was a very hard working, smart person who put in the time to develop his skills, responsibility, and discipline so that he could make use of his physical tools. Wang might never be able to do the same, but he could and at the very least he has a leg up because, unlike Chara, Wang is an excellent skater.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

I think Wang’s athleticism is also getting overplayed.

You want to see a great athlete? Go watch Anton Silayev. Like two inches taller and skates just as well.

Is Wang a better athlete than Carter Amico from this draft?

He’s not LeBron James on skates.

And as many have said, the rest is not that of an NHL draft pick.

 

[Hinterland]

I think Wang’s athleticism is also getting overplayed.

You want to see a great athlete? Go watch Anton Silayev. Like two inches taller and skates just as well.

Is Wang a better athlete than Carter Amico from this draft?

He’s not LeBron James on skates.

And as many have said, the rest is not that of an NHL draft pick.

I don't know about that one. Silayev is obviously an excellent skater in his own right but I don't think he's as dynamic or mobile as Wang. Now, this may be a bit unfair because Silayev is facing much tougher competition but still...Wang is a rather unique skater for his size. He's fun to watch. I don't know if that's also because he's completely unable to do anything with his wheels but he's definitely fascinating to watch.

 

[Rabid Ranger]

How many "physical specimens" with no feel for the game make it in professional hockey? That's the issue. If you want to spend a low round pick on him, fine. A first round selection though? That's big brain thinking.

 

[WarriorofTime]

Again, Chara played mostly vs men in his draft year. He was miles ahead of where Wang is now. Wang would get eaten alive playing vs men. Also in terms of skill. Also, Chara is a three times 50 point and six times 40 point scorer in the NHL. Your description of him is, quite frankly, an insult. I'd bet any amount of money Wang is never gonna be a 40 point scorer in the NHL. Not a chance. You'd be nuts to believe he has that kind of offensive upside.

Chara was draft eligible by age in 1995. You can see this because he was born in the exact same month as Bryan Berard, who was the first overall pick in the 1995 Draft. He would have gone unselected and then drafted in 1996 in his second go around.

In 1994-95, Chara played 30 games in the Slovakia U18 division and 2 games in the Slovakia U20 division. Maybe some people have some tape somewhere to give an honest assessment of his play at that level.

When he advanced to the Slovakia 2nd Divison in 1995-96 in his second go around as a draft eligible, I figure it was primarily a U21 division as is typically a case with these 2nd division leagues where the top domestic league isn't any good.

 

[MeHateHe]

Can you list me a few similar projects that were, you know, succesful?

Because if these 'projects' never end up being succesful, they're not projects, they're a waste of a pick.

Chara was one of the leading junior Dmen in respectable junior leagues/Slovakian men's league.

No one has really brought up even a single valid comparison so far.

I'm not here to argue that projects pan out, or that I'd support my team taking a flyer on a project, especially early in the draft. I'm only saying that projects exist, and that some NHL team scouts have taken those risks.

Your recollection of Chara and mine is not the same. Chara was a poor skater when he showed up in Prince George. (I was there.) He had a tremendous attitude and work ethic and that, combined with his size and willingness to be a bit mean, made him an attractive prospect when he was drafted, but even in his first year or two in the NHL, he had big holes in his game.

That's my point: projects are players with characteristics that portend of them being something special, but they are not the complete package. I don't know this Huang player and I'm only comparing him to Chara insofar as he is a big kid who has some attractive qualities in his draft season. My sense is that there are scouts who are seeing him through the lens of being a project - the phrase "you can't teach size" remains popular among scouts - while there are folks on this thread imputing some kind of other motive for him being rated so highly. Conspiracies may exist but more often than not, a cigar is just a cigar, and a big kid with good wheels is a big kid with good wheels.

 

[BKarchitect]

I know some will nitpick Bob’s rankings because it’s only “10 scouts” and not 25, 50 or 100 and thus a single scout irrationally high on a player can carry significant weight.

That said - whether we believe in the kid’s projections or not - it’s pretty clear via his mid-season list that actual NHL personnel have this guy on their radar in a big way and that more likely than not, low levels of output or shaky game tape are not going to deter some organization from taking him way higher than I think most of the knowledgeable posters here would.

At that point, this thread is going to get even more bifurcated as it will likely see an influx of newly minted “experts” from the fanbase who takes him, proclaiming him a physical unicorn with unimaginable upside - while the opposite side will double down on the foolishness of galaxy braining a high pick on a project so raw and risky.

I can’t imagine if, for example, the Habs take him in the 2nd round.

 

[montreal]

Wang Rush Up Ice 6:40
Wang Great Chance 8:48

there's a decent amount of him in the vid

 

[Hinterland]

I know some will nitpick Bob’s rankings because it’s only “10 scouts” and not 25, 50 or 100 and thus a single scout irrationally high on a player can carry significant weight.

That said - whether we believe in the kid’s projections or not - it’s pretty clear via his mid-season list that actual NHL personnel have this guy on their radar in a big way and that more likely than not, low levels of output or shaky game tape are not going to deter some organization from taking him way higher than I think most of the knowledgeable posters here would.

At that point, this thread is going to get even more bifurcated as it will likely see an influx of newly minted “experts” from the fanbase who takes him, proclaiming him a physical unicorn with unimaginable upside - while the opposite side will double down on the foolishness of galaxy braining a high pick on a project so raw and risky.

I can’t imagine if, for example, the Habs take him in the 2nd round.

I really hope that's not gonna happen. If Wang goes in the top64 I hope it's a smaller team making that pick. Anything else might break this kid. Whether he makes it to the NHL or not, he's a project. He's gonna need and take time. He'd feel the heat should he get drafted early by a big market team.

 

[crazyfisherman]

I doubt nationality will have too much to do with him getting drafted high. Teams know (or should know anyway) that the chinese market does not care if their guy come in and become some tweener. There were other chinese players in the NBA before yao and it barely peaked any interests in the chinese market. If he is drafted high, its going to be because the team believe hes actual potential to be a top 4 D.

 

[Hinterland]

Try not to laugh watching this one.

Wang is currently the only Generals player sitting at -2 against the worst team in the OHL...with the Generals in a 6-3 lead late in the 3rd.

 

[BKarchitect]

I doubt nationality will have too much to do with him getting drafted high. Teams know (or should know anyway) that the chinese market does not care if their guy come in and become some tweener. There were other chinese players in the NBA before yao and it barely peaked any interests in the chinese market. If he is drafted high, its going to be because the team believe hes actual potential to be a top 4 D.

Sure. Maybe one or two people in this entire thread have brought nationality into this.

Both his appeal and downside have zero to do with his nationality.