Currently the best & worst rebuilds ongoing

[FMichael]

Another Yzerman thread?

I didn’t realize he was so popular

 

[FriendlyGhost92]

The "Yzerplan" is about 1,000 miles off course. It's mind-boggling to me to see so many people in my fan base continue to have blind faith in this product and almost militantly push back if anyone so much as raises the slightest doubt.

This reads like you don't actually know what the "Yzerplan" is considering Yzerman has said from day one that he's building through the draft and it was gonna take awhile.

You can disagree with the way Yzerman is doing it, but to say he's not doing it the way he said he would is just flat out false.

 

[SnuggaRUDE]

If the criterion for Best/Worst is most recent in playoffs it's not a topic worth discussion. That's a simple matter of fact.

 

[John Mandalorian]

Is New Jersey excluded from this in most people’s eyes? It helps to have good centers and D when you’re picking in the top 10. Their rebuild has overlapped many teams being discussed.

 

[Rants Mulliniks]

But rebuilding is purposely sucking for a high draft pick. That doesn’t accurately describe the Sabres at all these past 3 yrs. They’ve been a middle of the pack team. Unless rebuilding means something else I am unaware of. Btw thanks for being classy about it and not being a dick. I know it’s fashionable to shit on the team that sucks

I would say the debate lies around whether "purposeful" matters or not? Like the earlier poster who asked how Montreal fits.....6 of the last 9 years they have been in the bottom 10. Not sure that picking an arbitrary date as "A HA!!! this is the exact moment the rebuild started" really matters for much.

Take solace at least no matter where you are in the standings, you'll beat Toronto 9/10.

I’ll give you everyone else but I’m not sure if Michkov would have signed with MTL

No idea, though even if he didn't his rights might be worth a fair penny.

 

[Hisch13r]

Is New Jersey excluded from this in most people’s eyes? It helps to have good centers and D when you’re picking in the top 10. Their rebuild has overlapped many teams being discussed.

Evaluating how good or bad a rebuild is is so weird because you can’t really judge it until a team comes out of it on the other side and is a contender but then you’re also not considered rebuilding anymore so you won’t be brought up by some people in a thread like this

 

[Sabre the Win]

Buffalo will never make sense to me, they've had good enough rosters for a while now, and so many of their players get poached for cup winning teams. Is it the mix? Lack of leadership?

Its being too damn young. I'm telling you being the youngest team in the league isn't good. You need more than one washed veteran in Okposo.

 

[FriendlyGhost92]

Its being too damn young. I'm telling you being the youngest team in the league isn't good. You need more than one washed veteran in Okposo.

But I've heard that bringing on washed veterans for the kids to play with is bad. And that you should just deliberately tank.

 

[TageGod]

Detroit is just not a super talented team. Ottawa is talented with poor D and G. Sabres are loaded with talent everywhere, even G with UPL looking like a top 10 long term goalie. Our complaints this season is getting Cozens and Quinn out of a slump (Cozens is now), and a steady D partner for Power. That is really it. Ottawa and Detroit are starting to look like they need to rebuild their rebuild. Sabres seem to be putting it together with a solid head coach.

Can't speak for the western conference rebuilds.

 

[TheBeerNerd]

Its being too damn young. I'm telling you being the youngest team in the league isn't good. You need more than one washed veteran in Okposo.

Seconded. Tellingly, the Sabres rank in the bottom five for free agent money spent. You need vets who can show the ropes to the youth and infuse some culture into the locker room. I'd argue springing for Hamilton and Palat went a long way towards the Devils' return to relevance.

 

[Hisch13r]

Seconded. Tellingly, the Sabres rank in the bottom five for free agent money spent. You need vets who can show the ropes to the youth and infuse some culture into the locker room. I'd argue springing for Hamilton and Palat went a long way towards the Devils' return to relevance.

Devils were still the 2nd youngest team that year. I think you’re overestimating Palat’s impact. He was injured basically right away

 

[Sabre the Win]

But I've heard that bringing on washed veterans for the kids to play with is bad. And that you should just deliberately tank.

Washed veterans are bad, but good veterans are invaluable. Deliberately tanking will get you a top pick but if he doesn't have anyone to learn from by learning how to win games and being a pro hockey player. He's going to develop bad habits, hes going to have bad body language when hes constantly losing because all he's ever done before the NHL is win. You see this in Bedard smashing sticks against goalposts as well as Celebrini already; which all happened with Eichel and the Sabres.

But yes, scorched Earth rebuilds are very bad and the Sabres should be prime example of that. They got rid of any veteran that was serviceable and drafted Reinhart and Eichel who had no one to learn from. Then they went out and traded the prospect pool for ROR, Kane and Bogosian who didn't teach the kids the pride of wearing the Sabres crest and all had questionable personalities for which they were moved from their teams but worst of all, had no depth beyond them that weren't AHL players at best.

If the Sabres had kept Vanek, Pomminville and Miller, who were all proud Sabres players they would have had Eichel and Reinhart on the right track and tought them what it meant to be a Buffalo Sabre.

That's another story tho, the Sabres should be teaching moment for GM's and fan's on what not to do. 13 years now and I could write a book on what went wrong for the Sabres and what other franchises should avoid.

 

[Chainshot]

Evaluating how good or bad a rebuild is is so weird because you can’t really judge it until a team comes out of it on the other side and is a contender but then you’re also not considered rebuilding anymore so you won’t be brought up by some people in a thread like this

I mean, the Devils are leading their division again, just a couple seasons removed from their best regular season finish. Of all recent rebuilds, they seem like the gold standard AND they still have a couple of dynamite prospects who haven't even arrived yet.

 

[NailsHoglander]

What is the criteria for being considered the best? If it's building a sustainable playoff team I'd go with the Devils.

All of the current rebuilding teams are farm teams for the rest of the league until proven otherwise

 

[Hisch13r]

I mean, the Devils are leading their division again, just a couple seasons removed from their best regular season finish. Of all recent rebuilds, they seem like the gold standard AND they still have a couple of dynamite prospects who haven't even arrived yet.

What I'm saying is that due to a phenomenal 22-23 year most saw the 23-24 downturn as a blip on the radar because of a multitude of factors and that the rebuild was over and being good this year is enforcing that so some people aren't going to bring them up in this type of thread because the rebuild is finished

 

[raymond23]

1st overall
1st overall
2nd overall
4th overall
etc

Devils win

 

[Hisch13r]

Washed veterans are bad, but good veterans are invaluable. Deliberately tanking will get you a top pick but if he doesn't have anyone to learn from by learning how to win games and being a pro hockey player. He's going to develop bad habits, hes going to have bad body language when hes constantly losing because all he's ever done before the NHL is win. You see this in Bedard smashing sticks against goalposts as well as Celebrini already; which all happened with Eichel and the Sabres.

But yes, scorched Earth rebuilds are very bad and the Sabres should be prime example of that. They got rid of any veteran that was serviceable and drafted Reinhart and Eichel who had no one to learn from. Then they went out and traded the prospect pool for ROR, Kane and Bogosian who didn't teach the kids the pride of wearing the Sabres crest and all had questionable personalities for which they were moved from their teams but worst of all, had no depth beyond them that weren't AHL players at best.

If the Sabres had kept Vanek, Pomminville and Miller, who were all proud Sabres players they would have had Eichel and Reinhart on the right track and tought them what it meant to be a Buffalo Sabre.

That's another story tho, the Sabres should be teaching moment for GM's and fan's on what not to do. 13 years now and I could write a book on what went wrong for the Sabres and what other franchises should avoid.

I mean yes bad vets are bad and good vets are good but it's not like developing "bad habits" is going to ruin anyone. The Sabres didn't suck because Eichel and Reinhart didn't have anyone to learn from and became losers (case and point what winning after being plucked from a bad scenario and going to a good scenario). The Sabres sucked because they were a bad team.

1st overall
1st overall
2nd overall
4th overall
etc

Devils win

The 1st overall picks certainly help but let's not act like they're only good because of high picks. The 2nd overall pick isn't on the team. The 4th overall pick wasn't on the team in 22-23. The Devils drafted forwards EXTREMELY well beyond the 1st round in the Shero era. Beyond the 1st they picked Bratt, Sharangovich, Zetterlund, Boqvist, Bastian. Mercer was a later 1st. That was half of our forward group for most of the 22-23 season before Zetterlund was used in a trade for Meier. Half of the 22-23 team on the backend was made up through trades. Siegs, Marino, Graves we got for like a combined 2 2nds, a 3rd, Ty Smith, and Maltsev.

 

[jfhabs]

Habs would be looking excellent had they taken Tkachuk, Michkov, Oettinger. Now that may have changed their positions but if it hadn’t, they’d be looking good with Tkachuk, Suzuki, Caufield, Michkov, Slaf, Laine. Plus other prospects

If they picked Tkachuk and still traded for Suzuki, they probably draft a bit higher and don't get to pick Caufield, Slafkovsky or Michkov.

Truth is, most team miss on draft picks, even in the top 10.

Reinbacher remains a wild card for us. It could change the outcome of our rebuild. Just like next year selection (need top2 D or top6 C). Same for Kirby Dach. If he can handle top 6 C, the rebuild will be ok.

We still need a top G too. Fowler can be that guy, but he's young. Most goalie don't peak until 27-28.

I think Demidov is our Joker. I believe he can have game breaking talent. Similar to Kaprizov.

 

[Jared Dunn]

This year has been disconcerting for the Habs but I also try to remember that probably the biggest piece of the rebuild still isn't in NA. Suzuki, Caufield, Slaf, Hutson, Guhle are looking good. Need Reinbacher's recovery to go well and have him become at least a solid #3 option and need another high end center