Prospect Info: Cossa Crushing it in Grand Rapids

ShelbyZ

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Apr 8, 2015
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As far as having a crowd in net behind his NHL options, I can kind of see where Yzerman would want to play it safe depth wise:

-Rightfully so, GR decided pretty early on last season that they didn't want to have to rely on Brattstrom or Fulcher whenever possible, so they ran Pickard into the ground until he got called up by the Red Wings and then injured. They then had to toss a largely untested Brattstrom to the wolves who, to his credit, did play somewhat better after getting a regular role (.903 after 2022 started). But then they still didn't want to play Fulcher if they didn't have to, so they ran Brattstrom into the ground as well and had no other option than to hope Pickard could get healthy and take back over after Hellberg came in to give them insurance at the NHL level.

-All 3 options outside of the NHL guys are or are pretty close to unknowns at the AHL level (where contrary to popular belief, the team is trying to win games and be successful and doesn't solely exist for NHL prospects to sink or swim):

Olkinuora: Sure he's played great to fantastic overseas, but he hasn't played regularly on NA ice in over 6 years, and his AHL/ECHL resume from back then isn't much better than Fulcher's... It's certainly possible that he could struggle in the AHL like others that have come over from long tenure's overseas (Liv, Sateri, etc.) and open the need for someone else to take over.

Cossa: He's 19 years old and coming over from Jr. His start in the pros could be all over the map. Anywhere from stellar or all the way down to what happened the last time the Wings took a goalie from Jr's in the first round (I can't be the only one that remembers).

Brattstrom: He's the only real known quantity at the AHL level (and not a great one at that), yet still largely not established.

I certainly wouldn't view Cossa being sent to Toledo as disappointing... He has more opportunity to move up than if they had simply sent him back to the WHL as an overager. And he'll likely get more playing time in Toledo than if he started in GR as Olkinuora's back up (while still having a worthwhile challenger there in Lethemon). He's also likely the first called up to GR when an injury happens there or in the NHL.

And if no injuries happen but he tears it up in the ECHL, he probably won't stay there long. Yzerman has a pretty good track record of making the necessary adjustments when guys seem to outgrow the farm team (see Vasilevsky, Andrei and Kucherov, Nikita as examples). And I trust that more than some Lowe/Tambellini/MacT stuff like simply entitling spots to guys because of where they were drafted.
 

Henkka

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Olkinuora: Sure he's played great to fantastic overseas, but he hasn't played regularly on NA ice in over 6 years, and his AHL/ECHL resume from back then isn't much better than Fulcher's... It's certainly possible that he could struggle in the AHL like others that have come over from long tenure's overseas (Liv, Sateri, etc.) and open the need for someone else to take over.

I think Olkinuora, as an experienced veteran, who has played regularily in different rink size of hockey, has the best chances to be great straight from the bat.

KHL has NHL sized rinks at some arenas and for last 2 seasons Olkinuora played for Magnitogorsk, which was hybrid-sized rink, 28 meters wide. (NHL is 26M, European normal 30m). Ilya Sorokin had the same history, and he adjusted straight to NHL very fast.

In Finland majority is also 28 meters "compromize rinks".

Also last Olympics were held at NHL sized rink, even though NHL players weren't there. Team Finland, of course we will win gold, because we had so many KHL players, familiar to some KHL sized "NHL" rinks and goalies, who were familiar for that. Säteri played majority for Olympics, but Olkinuora was there too as his backup. For WHC the roles changed.

So, finnish and KHL goalies in general are not anyhow in a new ground at NA sized rink, it has been their normal for several years. As well as Olkinuora. There's nothing special in North America for a goaltender than the rink size. And mostly, Finns, and especially KHL-experince Finns, are better prepared for that than anyone outside North America.

They can adjust to any rink, because they play in an environment where are rinks from 30 to 28 to 26 meters wide. It's every day a different rink size where they go, and nobody is having that 30m European sized wide rink at home. They have to live with that thinking and adjustment all the time.
 
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heyfolks

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The Wings had already signed 2 for GR. I suspected Cossa would go back to his junior team. A top prospect in the ECHL? I just don't see it. if this were the entire year plan, I think they'd have sent him back to the WHL. They'll likely move one of the GR netminders and move him up within 60 days.

He's always said to be cocky. This could be a bit of humble pie and get to work message.
 

ricky0034

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Jun 8, 2010
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Wow, who was the last top 15 pick in the draft to play in an ECHL game as a teenager?

Not saying it’s a dumpster fire idea or anything…
Just seems like this is a historically rare path for a blue chip prospect at this age.

Dubnyk pretty similar here I guess but also stayed in Juniors a year longer

was 14th overall and played 43 games in the ECHL his first pro season as a 20 year old
 
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Roomba With a Bauer

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Looks like they may just be getting him reps. Playing in a variety of environments behind a couple different kinds of teams will give him an opportunity to implement what he is (hopefully) learning from our goalie coach. Splitting time between the ECHL/AHL may let him get 50-60 games this year.
 

ricky0034

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I think it’s smart to bounce him back and forth. He basically lost a season of development to COVID so getting him as many games as possible is a good idea.

I pretty strongly disagree for a Goalie there's just too many moving pieces there mentally, bouncing a Goalie from league to league and a first year pro one at that just sounds like a recipe for disaster

I don't think there's enough evidence yet to say whether or not that's what they're even doing though
 

FissionFire

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I pretty strongly disagree for a Goalie there's just too many moving pieces there mentally, bouncing a Goalie from league to league and a first year pro one at that just sounds like a recipe for disaster

I don't think there's enough evidence yet to say whether or not that's what they're even doing though
The problem really is that it’s a numbers game. Olkinoura will be in GR unless he completely implodes, and he will be given lots of time to pull it together if he starts to struggle. Brattstrom I’m pretty sure can’t be sent to Toledo without his permission, and I doubt he’d give it. That means Cossa is the odd man out and the only one who can go there.

I’ve seen some people talk about loaning Brattstrom to Europe to open a spot, but that’s not a great idea either. Husso and Ned have a history of getting hurt and I don’t think Yzerman wants Cossa anywhere near the NHL this year. That’s why it’s important to have 2 other goalies ahead of him in case a couple injuries pop up. I don’t think they want to be stuck in a position having to dumpster dive for someone like Hellburg again or waste a draft pick on some 3rd string goalie from another team to fill-in.
 

ricky0034

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The problem really is that it’s a numbers game. Olkinoura will be in GR unless he completely implodes, and he will be given lots of time to pull it together if he starts to struggle. Brattstrom I’m pretty sure can’t be sent to Toledo without his permission, and I doubt he’d give it. That means Cossa is the odd man out and the only one who can go there.

I’ve seen some people talk about loaning Brattstrom to Europe to open a spot, but that’s not a great idea either. Husso and Ned have a history of getting hurt and I don’t think Yzerman wants Cossa anywhere near the NHL this year. That’s why it’s important to have 2 other goalies ahead of him in case a couple injuries pop up. I don’t think they want to be stuck in a position having to dumpster dive for someone like Hellburg again or waste a draft pick on some 3rd string goalie from another team to fill-in.

yeah i'd definitely agree with not wanting to see Cossa forced into the NHL due to injuries this year so I don't really have any issues with the way the Goalie rosters around him are set up at the moment

I think it'd probably be worse for his development this year to be bouncing around between the ECHL and AHL every week than it would to just stay in the ECHL though so if there isn't a longer term spot in Grand Rapids available whether that's through an injury or something like Cossa playing so well the Wings decide to basically just dump Brattstrom i'd rather he just stay put there

I also don't really think playing in the ECHL is that big a deal for a 19/20 year old Goalie coming from Juniors though
 

FissionFire

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Someone asked about other top pick goalies (1st rounders) who spent early age development time in the ECHL so I did a little digging and here’s what I found.
NOTE: Not counting Dan Blackburn who tried to make a post-injury comeback

19OA 1989 - Olaf Kolzig (Ages 20-21)
21OA 1994 - Evgeni Ryabchickov (Ages 21-22)
16OA 1995 - Martin Biron (Age 20)
24OA 1997 - Jean-Francois Damphousse (Age 20)
6OA 1999 - Brian Finley (Age 21)
9OA 2000 - Brent Krahn (Age 21)
29OA 2001 - Adam Munro (Ages 21-22)
6OA 2004 - Al Montoya (Age 20)
14OA 2004 - Devan Dubnyk (Age 20)
17OA 2004 - Marek Schwarz (Ages 21-22)
15OA 2006 - Riku Helenius (Age 20)
26OA 2006 - Leland Irving (Age 21)
18OA 2008 - Chet Pickard (Ages 21-22, 24)
30OA 2008 - Thomas McCollum (Ages 20-22)
11OA 2010 - Jack Campbell (Ages 23-24)
27OA 2010 - Mark Visentin (Age 20)

Also of note is the IHL, which was probably a little better than the current ECHL but not as good as the AHL so it’s a weird case but worth noting.
NOTE: Not counting Dan Cloutier’s age 24 1 game conditioning stint

8OA 1987 - Jimmy Waite (Ages 19-22, 25-26, 29)
21OA 1988 - Jason Muzzatti (Ages 21-22)
11OA 1990 - Trevor Kidd (Age 20)
1OA 1990 - Rick DiPietro (Age 19)
7OA 1994 - Jamie Storr (Ages 20-22)
16OA 1994 - Eric Fichaud (Ages 22-23)

Please not that by the way they determine a players age each year, this season Cossa is considered Age 20.

Should be noted there have only been 68 goalies selected in the first round ever, and in the past decade only Vasilevskiy (2012), Subban (2012), Samsonov (2015), Oettinger (2017), Knight (2019), Askarov (2020), Cossa (2021), and Wallstedt (2021) have been drafted. With such a small sample size compared to other positions it’s hard to really draw any good conclusions on whether ECHL games are a positive or negative sign for a goalies future.
 

Henkka

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I think it’s smart to bounce him back and forth. He basically lost a season of development to COVID so getting him as many games as possible is a good idea.

Pretty sure he will just practise with GR environment, and will go to play games for Toledo, when there's games.
 

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