News Article: Contract talks for Senators’ Matt Duchene: update - no numbers [Part 2]

[danielpalfredsson]

Pittsburgh has apparently inquired.

Do they even have anything left to offer? Lol

It depends what the market is like.

They aren't deep with prospects, but they have their 1st round pick both this year and next year. They also have been rumoured to be shopping Brassard. While Brassard's value is likely depressed compared to where it was last year, they still probably could get a decent piece back for Brassard as a rental. I think someone would bank on Brassard bouncing back with a change of environment and a top 6 role and give the Penguins at least a 2nd+B-Prospect type return.

-2019 PIT 1st Round Pick
-2020 XXX 2nd Round Pick (From an unknown team, acquired in a Brassard trade. Becomes PIT 1st if Duchene re-signs or the Penguins win the Cup in 2019)
-Tristan Jarry (Unless the Penguins are considering moving Murray, they need to move a goalie sooner rather than later. DeSmith helped himself by signing a good contract that helps him fit into Pittsburgh in the mid term, he is also performing better than Jarry)
-B Prospect (late 2nd/early 3rd tier prospect)
-Tanner Pearson (Cap dump/weird underperforming overpaid veteran who scored at one point in his career like Boedker)
-Depth fringe NHL player or inconsequential prospect

Anything can happen, and I guess a team could bid up the price on Duchene as a rental, but looking at traditional rental prices it wouldn't be hard for just about any team to acquire Duchene. It just comes down to a willingness to give up draft picks. I'd imagine it's basically player+pick+prospect and a few more small pieces so that we can brag about "6 assets".

If Duchene is willing to extend, then it takes a lot of teams out of the running, because they have to compete price wise with whatever teams Duchene is willing to extend with. Those teams he is willing to extend with would drive the price up since he's worth more extended. I'd be surprised if he'd sign an extension at the deadline.

 

[swiftwin]

Brisson at the asg said he met Dorion two time. Have good talk and said for finish the sens go in good direction and have good young coming not in 6 month but one two year. Sound for me Duchene agreed to be part of a rebuild

I have no doubt Duchene would love to stay here if a fair offer was made. It really comes down to whether Melnyk can/wants to sign him.

 

[FunkySeeFunkyDoo]

Could be a third team involved and Pittsburg sending Brassard to let’s say Winnipeg and us getting a prospect and pick from WPG as well.

Why wouldn't a straight up deal with Winnipeg happen instead?

 

[Handles1919]

I have no doubt Duchene would love to stay here if a fair offer was made. It really comes down to whether Melnyk can/wants to sign him.

didnt he say he did not want to be in another rebuild or couldnt do it again. id think duchene wanting to play for a good team has a big part to play outside of gene

 

[slamigo]

Maybe Dorion is just asking what it will take to sign Duchene on behalf of other teams. Lol
So he can tell the teams that he's negotiating the trade with.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

Why wouldn't a straight up deal with Winnipeg happen instead?

If a deal like the above happens, it is because whoever is acquiring Brassard doesn't want to pay for Duchene, but is fine with paying less for Brassard.

Brassard has only 26 points in 65 games in Pittsburgh. That includes the playoffs. He's going to be a lot cheaper to acquire than Duchene asset wise.

There's also the greater possibility of extending Brassard. If Brassard joins a team, fits in well, and starts producing like a top 6 forward in a small sample size, he might be able to be extended to a contracted in the 5 million range over a shorter term like 3 years. He also would be a lot easier to extend, because he's not going to have a lot of suitors willing to risk that term and money on him.

WPG would not want to extend Brassard, but a team like Dallas for example might like the idea of giving up Honka and a 2nd for Brassard, and then being able to extend him to a much more manageable term/dollar than Duchene if it works out, than giving up "6 assets" for Duchene and having a lot more difficult of a time extending him because he's a few months away from being one of the biggest free agents of this era.

 

[danielpalfredsson]

Another consideration with the Penguins, if they really liked Duchene and there was mutual interest in an extension after the season, they could deal Kessel in the off season to recoup a big chunk of what they gave up for Duchene in order to clear the cap room to ink a Duchene extension. There's been rumours about Kessel on and off in terms of Pittsburgh trading him.

 

[Pancakes Pancakes]

Pittsburgh has apparently inquired.

Do they even have anything left to offer? Lol

Does that even matter to PD?

 

[The Lewler]

Brisson at the asg said he met Dorion two time. Have good talk and said for finish the sens go in good direction and have good young coming not in 6 month but one two year. Sound for me Duchene agreed to be part of a rebuild

That just sounds like platitudes uttered to maintain the veneer of professionalism and hope for the org and to maintain a good relationship with the GM.

You know... The stuff you say when you might want to still.. I don't know.. Have some input on where you are traded.

Agents very rarely start ripping GMs and orgs. Bad for buisness. Bad for their clients.

 

[Gil Gunderson]

Does that even matter to PD?

6 shitty assets is still 6 assets.

 

[swiftwin]

didnt he say he did not want to be in another rebuild or couldnt do it again. id think duchene wanting to play for a good team has a big part to play outside of gene

Kovalchuk also wanted to play for a good team when he came over from the KHL. Duchene wanted to play for a good team when he requested a trade and came to Ottawa.

The point is that teams that are good today are not always the same teams that are going to be good 2-3 years from now. It's better to jump on a team that's on the upswing rather than try to join a team that is good today and may fall in the few couple of seasons. It's not unreasonable that Duchene believes this team is on the upswing with the players and prospects we already have in the system.

Rebuilds aren't 5+ season affairs like they used to be. Young players become impact players much sooner than they used to. The league is faster, and parity is stronger.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

Why would they want to stay?

Nothing wrong with some optimism until something official happens, but we have a terrible roster, a run of the mill prospect pool like most other teams, no impact player coming to us from a 1st rounder, and we can't afford free agents.

They're throwing away a good season or two minimum imo.

 

[coladin]

Why would they want to stay?

Nothing wrong with some optimism until something official happens, but we have a terrible roster, a run of the mill prospect pool like most other teams, no impact player coming to us from a 1st rounder, and we can't afford free agents.

They're throwing away a good season or two minimum imo.

I don't think it is as bad as you portray it, although more common around here. Matt Duchene drove to his home. Ottawa , as a city, is one of the best places to live in the world. Ottawa is always up there for that.

Things can change pretty quickly in the NHL , year to year. I like our prospects if people are willing to chalk up this year to development.

 

[IlTerrifico]

What the heck does Dorion even have to do during his all star break time besides this, and he can't even manage it??

Give him credit for a heavy schedule:

1) tummy tuck ( okay 2-3 tummy tucks)
2) Hairclub for Men
3) Surgery on both hands to repair bones broken during high fives received after acquiring Alex Burrows, who singlehandedly led them to 3 Cups over 3 seasons, for just $5M and some high draft picks
4) reading all the books on great losers throughout history to get good quotes for when everybody leaves: General Custer, Hillary Clinton, the Buffalo Bills, Justin Trudeau.....

 

[Multigrain]

Why would they want to stay?

Nothing wrong with some optimism until something official happens, but we have a terrible roster, a run of the mill prospect pool like most other teams, no impact player coming to us from a 1st rounder, and we can't afford free agents.

They're throwing away a good season or two minimum imo.

All they have to do is look at the "Karlsson trade" Everyone has to be crazy to say Stone and Duchene are not looking at the Sharks and thinking to themselves that they could have that next year, or be a member of any team that has a chance to make it to the playoffs.

 

[BonHoonLayneCornell]

I don't think it is as bad as you portray it, although more common around here. Matt Duchene drove to his home. Ottawa , as a city, is one of the best places to live in the world. Ottawa is always up there for that.

Things can change pretty quickly in the NHL , year to year. I like our prospects if people are willing to chalk up this year to development.

You bring up some fair points about Ottawa as a city, and about being close to home, but I just don't think thats enough to make required concessions on an Ottawa offer. I don't get the excitement over our prospect pool as a rebuilding team. I see Chabot, maybe Tkatchuk, and nothing but a pool of magic beans that don't have that pedigree and I think Stone and Duchene are wise enough to see it too, even if their camp comments contradict that (those were just veterans bringing positivity as required imo). Where is our star power, our studs going to come from for them to play with? Are we expecting to hit the jackpot with more stars like Stone and Hoffman coming out of nowhere? It feels like a team that made almost no steps towards improving potential star power in the future, dumped off good players for very little, and said, "hey, we're rebuilding!, now please stay."

In that respect, our prospect pool being viewed and referred to by management as anything more than an average, run of the mill pool almost every team can claim is my greatest concern and the number one reason imo they would look at this and say what the heck are you talking about rebuilding? All youve done is play kids, stink out there, and hope they can mature faster.

It sucks, but if there's any hope of rebuilding properly, and no new ownership is coming, I think as you point out, they have no choice but to scorch earth it and trade damn near everyone they can for all they can get. Tank for 2020 at this point and see what happens.

 

[Taluss]

Let's be honest, is anyone genuinely surprised? Or are we all just shaking our heads at ourselves for believing that we actually tried to get something done.

 

[Do Make Say Think]

Ottawa , as a city, is one of the best places to live in the world. Ottawa is always up there for that.

It is easily at the bottom of the 30 other options. Ottawa is mediocre with some good upside which makes it better than a lot of places on Earth, but the only comparables that matter are almost all way better.

Edmonton and Calgary might be the only ones we are ahead of.

 

[Sensmileletsgo]

It is easily at the bottom of the 30 other options. Ottawa is mediocre with some good upside which makes it better than a lot of places on Earth, but that doesn't matter cause the only comparables that matter are almost all way better.

Edmonton and Calgary might be the only ones we are ahead of.

Yup but the taxes are a lot less in Alberta.

 

[coladin]

It is easily at the bottom of the 30 other options. Ottawa is mediocre with some good upside which makes it better than a lot of places on Earth, but the only comparables that matter are almost all way better.

Edmonton and Calgary might be the only ones we are ahead of.

Easily? According to Mercer's Quality of Living report, which is well respected, only Vancouver and Toronto are ahead of Ottawa as far as NHL markets. The first American city is San Francisco , at 30th.

Ottawa is 19th on the world. I know no one wants to hear its but there you go.

 

[R2010]

Easily? According to Mercer's Quality of Living report, which is well respected, only Vancouver and Toronto are ahead of Ottawa as far as NHL markets. The first American city is San Francisco , at 30th.

Ottawa is 19th on the world. I know no one wants to hear its but there you go.

In Ottawa with the same money as elsewhere an NHL player could buy a house on the water, drive 10 mins to the rink and have access to both the downtown style or the country life. Out of the list of 30 places there, how many could you do that in for the same dollar? Think someone can get that lifestyle in Toronto, New York, LA without paying 5x as much? People always say taxes matter and they do but so does cost of living and other life things.

 

[DrEasy]

Easily? According to Mercer's Quality of Living report, which is well respected, only Vancouver and Toronto are ahead of Ottawa as far as NHL markets. The first American city is San Francisco , at 30th.

Ottawa is 19th on the world. I know no one wants to hear its but there you go.

I'd agree that Ottawa is a great city to live in, but that's true mostly for the average Joe (and that's why I live here and love it here!). But when you're a millionaire a lot of the advantages of Ottawa (free healthcare, no crime, ...) don't matter. Quality of living is great everywhere when you're young and rich. Then it's stuff like weather, nightlife, bling, low taxes, quality of healthcare, direct flights to anywhere that matter. We don't rank very high in those criteria.

 

[PoutineSp00nZ]

I'd agree that Ottawa is a great city to live in, but that's true mostly for the average Joe (and that's why I live here and love it here!). But when you're a millionaire a lot of the advantages of Ottawa (free healthcare, no crime, ...) don't matter. Quality of living is great everywhere when you're young and rich. Then it's stuff like weather, nightlife, bling, low taxes, quality of healthcare, direct flights to anywhere that matter. We don't rank very high in those criteria.

Exactly.

When you can afford insane private healthcare, live in a gated community with other millionares and can take a limo to work everyday it doesn't really matter where you live. The rich have it good everywhere.

It comes down to lifestyle of choice. Do you wanna raise a family in a quiet, safe suburban environment with middle class people? Do you wanna live it up large in mega cities with the elite of the elite? Or do you wanna live somewhere warm, near the ocean? Or do you wanna put everything aside for a chance to win the cup?

Players will take as much money as they can first and foremost, then choose whatever option and lifestyle they like second.

I really think winning a cup isn't the most important factor for the majority of NHL players.

 

[branch]

In Ottawa with the same money as elsewhere an NHL player could buy a house on the water, drive 10 mins to the rink and have access to both the downtown style or the country life. Out of the list of 30 places there, how many could you do that in for the same dollar? Think someone can get that lifestyle in Toronto, New York, LA without paying 5x as much? People always say taxes matter and they do but so does cost of living and other life things.

Totall irrelevant when you’re making an 8 figure salary. You can buy in cash a penthouse overlooking Central Park, or a beach house in Malibu, or a mid century modern case study house in Bel Air, a 20 acre ranch in Texas, a mountain chalet in Colorado, a Victorian mansion in Vancouver on that kind of money with millions still in the bank and millions more to come. They can eat at Nobu 7x a week for the rest of their lives and not have to think twice. Ottawa as a city does not have even close to the level of amenities other cities have. Sorry to bash your city (Its mine too, I have lived here 30 years), but it’s just the way it is.

 

[branch]

Exactly.

When you can afford insane private healthcare, live in a gated community with other millionares and can take a limo to work everyday it doesn't really matter where you live. The rich have it good everywhere.

It comes down to lifestyle of choice. Do you wanna raise a family in a quiet, safe suburban environment with middle class people? Do you wanna live it up large in mega cities with the elite of the elite? Or do you wanna live somewhere warm, near the ocean? Or do you wanna put everything aside for a chance to win the cup?

Players will take as much money as they can first and foremost, then choose whatever option and lifestyle they like second.

I really think winning a cup isn't the most important factor for the majority of NHL players.

Yep. Ottawa as a whole is great for the middle class. But when you have 75,000,000$ in the bank, anywhere is great.