dahrougem2
Registered User
I'm sorry bbg, did you want to hug it out for bitching about bitching?
Colorado Avalanche Training Camp Dates
- Thread starter LTCPain75
- Start date
- Aug 25, 2006
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Nuke still has to show that:
1. he can remain clean, and
2. he can play as good as he used to while being clean. I am still not convinced of this. There were times during the past two season that he was not as good. Was it due to injuries or was it when he was off cocaine?
We'll see.
1. he can remain clean, and
2. he can play as good as he used to while being clean. I am still not convinced of this. There were times during the past two season that he was not as good. Was it due to injuries or was it when he was off cocaine?
We'll see.
Let’s do it! I’m not sure if it’s a Canadian thing, but your continuous social justice warrior attitude is just exhausting.
Talking about a player like he’s the worst person on Earth over some minor bullshit is absolutely insane!
He didn’t hurt anybody, he doesn’t have any criminal charges, and there’s nobody that the Avs could find to replace him (both in the acquisition cost and salary), so what’s the point of your bitching and moaning?
So that you can act morally superior while still vigorously supporting this team?
If it’s that big of a deal to you, just move on! It just shows that you have no grasp of the real world.
henchman21
Mr. Meeseeks
- Feb 24, 2012
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Above all with Nuke, he has to prove he can stay clean. Dude was popped 2 times in the last 5 months of the season fully well knowing the implications of testing positive. He's going to be tested multiple times during the season. His drug of choice is typically not detected outside of 48 hours... which means he's been hammering rails pretty consistently. His next suspension is for a full year... which means it will impact 2 seasons this next go round. Say he gets popped in March, he's out for the rest of the season and for the beginning of the following season where the Avs have to keep him around until a ruling is made on his reinstatement (which is possible, just not guaranteed). That next positive test will hurt a lot. Given his history here, how can anybody think it is not just a matter of time?
henchman21
Mr. Meeseeks
- Feb 24, 2012
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Dude... do you even know who you are speaking to? I love @dahrougem2 but social justice warrior is not a label I'd put on him. @Pokecheque that's your SJW here, who I also love.
Also... Nuke has hurt people. What an absurd statement to think that his addiction hasn't hurt people. And the reason for no criminal charges are because he's a professional athlete who is taken care of.
It is perfectly okay to not be happy with the handling of Nuke by the Avs, and to not support Nuke.
CharlesPuck
Registered User
Addiction hurts a lot of people, but I think we all can agree that it hurts the people that are struggling with it the most.
Also, what are the options?
You can either support someone and believe that they’re improving until shown otherwise or you can just continually shit on them with disdain and declare them a lost cause.
I choose to believe the former, because I support this team and Val. Not to mention that I have made bunch of mistakes in my life and have enough problems of my own that I don’t believe that I have the right to judge anybody.
Ceremony
How I choose to feel is how I am
- Jun 8, 2012
- 114,226
- 17,235
Val, make sure you keep a spare cup of piss in your bag in case someone surprises you with a test. You've ruined two playoffs already, don't ruin another.
henchman21
Mr. Meeseeks
- Feb 24, 2012
- 67,013
- 53,441
I'd argue addiction hurts the family the most. Especially his wife and young child. That child is likely to have trauma they never fully understand why it exists.
There are plenty of options around it... and it isn't black and white/either or sort of things. You can support the Avs while thinking Val is a POS. You can think both are POS. You can support both. Each person can make their own decision on how they want to view and reflect upon it. Any of us who have been impacted by addiction either directly or indirectly know that it is not a binary thing. There is a lot of grey.
Personally, I'm not blind to the fact that the Avs have a number of questionable characters currently in the org and have had in the past. The professional sports world has a really seedy underbelly to it, that if things really came to light, would shock people. The Avs are definitely not immune to it. I have things that I know that are very distasteful, and I understand it is just the tip of the iceberg. To me, I'll cheer for the Avs with or without Nuke. His morals or addictions really don't have any impact on my fandom. Nuke pisses me off personally because he's had a direct impact on the last two playoff runs in a row. Odds are he'll relapse and do it again too. Maybe not this year, but could be. Could be 2026. But I can understand that cheering for him leaves a bad taste in other peoples' mouths. It is not for me to judge whether people should or should not cheer for him.
On your last line, then you shouldn't be judging @dahrougem2 for his objection either.
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Yep, that's me!
FTR I am 100% on board with what Henchy and dahrougem have said.
And really, the SJW slant would be more toward empathy, hoping he can get the help he needs, blah blah blah, not wholesale condemnation of an addict. And really, there can be some level of that while also acknowledging that he's let the team down twice now, and both instances at the worst possible time.
And what's most concerning is that he has yet to publicly offer up a single shred of accountability. I'm not even sure if he's apologized. That's a major step in any recovery program, and if you're not doing that, you will not be successful. So far his public comments on the first debacle squarely puts the blame on other people, and his agent lied through his teeth and said he didn't have a drug or alcohol problem.
We don't really have much choice as fans but to hope for the best, doesn't mean we have to like it, and he has lost any benefit of the doubt after last playoffs. As others have said, he needs to prove it.
Avs_19
Registered User
- Jun 28, 2007
- 85,705
- 34,464
Val has shown no indication he's willing to or able to change. The stupid Russian doc series and everything that gets leaked from people close to him gives me doubts about whether he will. He has let his team down on multiple occasions now and I can see why people don't trust him as he has given us no reason to over the last number of years.
dahrougem2
Registered User
He hurt his teammates big boi - twice.
I guess I'm bitching and moaning just so I can be called out for bitching and moaning because I truly am morally superior to you.
Wow. I think I grasped this exceptionally well. I'm gonna make myself some pizza now.
Hey it could be worse, the Avs could've hired Stan Bowman.
Girard is such an obvious guy to go with Kylington, Brannstrom and Behrens coming up.
dahrougem2
Registered User
- Apr 25, 2006
- 52,038
- 56,212
Man I'm glad that I'm not alone that have noticed this.
Last year he had a monster start of the season, got caught for cocaine and was totally unrecognizable for a month+ when he came back (presumably sober).
Then all of a sudden he was great again (like he flipped a switch) and looked like the good ol' Val...until he got caught again.
There's a decent chance that he needs coke to enter beast mode Nuke. If that's the case the Avs are f***ed.
Foppa2118
Registered User
- Oct 3, 2003
- 52,661
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I wish we could just acknowledge more often how many assumptions we're making about this situation. They could all be right, but they're still assumptions.
It's probably a safe assumption coke is at the root of the issue, but that's still an assumption.
We don't know for sure that woman was a hooker. She could have just been a local dealer someone connected him to. She certainly didn't look like the kind of hooker a millionaire athlete would get.
Now we're talking about his wife and kid being traumatized as if that's a fact? Come on now. We don't know anything about his family situation, or how functional he is.
Everyone's obviously entitled to their own opinion on this, but just ask yourself this question. If the woman hadn't gotten out of control, and/or the doctor didn't call the cops, how would you feel about Val, and how many other players, let alone Avs, let alone people in this world that you have a positive view of, have a similar story, but you don't feel the same way about, because you only know slightly less than what we know about Val?
The main difference between him and others, might just be that he got caught, and pressured into the assistance program, which triggered the additional testing, and got him caught again.
It's probably a safe assumption coke is at the root of the issue, but that's still an assumption.
We don't know for sure that woman was a hooker. She could have just been a local dealer someone connected him to. She certainly didn't look like the kind of hooker a millionaire athlete would get.
Now we're talking about his wife and kid being traumatized as if that's a fact? Come on now. We don't know anything about his family situation, or how functional he is.
Everyone's obviously entitled to their own opinion on this, but just ask yourself this question. If the woman hadn't gotten out of control, and/or the doctor didn't call the cops, how would you feel about Val, and how many other players, let alone Avs, let alone people in this world that you have a positive view of, have a similar story, but you don't feel the same way about, because you only know slightly less than what we know about Val?
The main difference between him and others, might just be that he got caught, and pressured into the assistance program, which triggered the additional testing, and got him caught again.
CharlesPuck
Registered User
LOFIN
Registered User
- Sep 16, 2011
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He just needs to convince doctors he has ADD, and start using medical grade amphetamines.
Avs9296
Registered User
- Jul 1, 2019
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Can we talk about hockey? FFS all summer we had to talk about Nichushkins situation. Now that's training camp has started can we talk about stuff that's on the ice?
So tiresome hearing the same shit over and over again.
So tiresome hearing the same shit over and over again.
Ceremony
How I choose to feel is how I am
- Jun 8, 2012
- 114,226
- 17,235
Do you think the Avalanche made a mistake keeping Manson over Kadri?
henchman21
Mr. Meeseeks
- Feb 24, 2012
- 67,013
- 53,441
Except they are working Girard up the lineup now. They’ve also shown no desire to trade G. Certainly could be argued as the right move… just doesn’t fit what we’ve seen.
Foppa2118
Registered User
- Oct 3, 2003
- 52,661
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Don't think he has, but "injured" players don't usually talk to the media, especially on the Avs.
LOFIN
Registered User
- Sep 16, 2011
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