Avs2022
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Mueller worked really well with Duchene also.
[COL, CAR, CHI] Rantanen-Hall to CAR, Necas-Drury-25 2nd-26 4th to COL, Chi 25 3rd to Chi (Ret 50% on Mikko)
- Thread starter Bill Peckerskull
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- Apr 25, 2006
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People keep saying Necas is perfect fit for the Avs and I'm not debating that but he had higher PPG with the Canes this season than with the Avs.
Also I know he had 9 points last year but he's often seen as someone who fades away in the playoffs, unlike Rantanen. Hopefully this season will tell a different story.
Also I know he had 9 points last year but he's often seen as someone who fades away in the playoffs, unlike Rantanen. Hopefully this season will tell a different story.
John Mandalorian
2022 Avs: The First Dance
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You’re forgetting Brad Paisley.
Went from peak system/teammate familiarity to nothing, so takes some time to acclimate to the different pace, timing, angles and configurations he's seeing on the ice
John Mandalorian
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The Avs might be slowing/preventing what would have been his inevitable regression to the mean if still with Carolina.
Foppa2118
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Yeah, Marty had a dip in production recently after the honeymoon period from the trade. Had 1 point in 4 games. He's produced a little better lately with 4 pts in 3 games.
Like Mitts, and Nelson, and Mikko IMO, you need a bigger sample to really evaluate properly.
Marty was still doing a lot of the same things during the dip, but his zone entries weren't working quite as well, and his shots stopped going in as often.
Hopefully he can keep it going in the playoffs. I've noticed him putting in the effort to defend down low in the D zone when needed too. Good to see him round out his game.
expatriatedtexan
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Sample size queen!
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dahrougem2
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Being able to score at a PPG pace on a brand new team after a mid-season trade is exceptional. How many guys do that? I'd say his play is extremely impressive right now.
If anyone thought we were acquiring a top-5/10 scorer they are sorely mistaken. I love Necas but he isn't THAT good production wise.
Now, if he can be a consistent 75-80 point guy on the 2nd line that is MASSIVE for this team. Not many teams have that luxury.
Eh, I don’t really count that guy. Softest skill player I ever witnessed in the NHL, and with good reason. One (dirty) Rob Blake hit after an extensive history of concussions, and he was done.
It was really quite remarkable that he was able to accomplish anything in the NHL because that guy was as perimeter as you could get, and yet he was still reasonably effective.
- Apr 25, 2006
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You missed the point. I wasn't saying he isn't good, I was saying he's good but it's not because he's a good fit. He was as good in a completely different system with different linemates.
This isn't like Lehky, Nuke, Toews or Drouin.
Foppa2118
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Mueller had a lot of concussions before the Blake hit though remember? That's why that one was so devastating.
The Canes as a whole fade in the playoffs. But yeah, that’s definitely a concern that will play out this postseason.
flyfysher
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- Mar 21, 2012
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Well if playing for the Avs improves his production like those other players then maybe we should be patient and wait and see if the situation will have the same effect on his production.
I know, that’s precisely WHY he avoided contact like the plague, and why pretty much everyone knew he wasn’t going to last.
Side note, Mueller not panning out in Arizona did a lot to sink that franchise’s fortunes. Not as much as all the arena/ownership garbage, but it played a part. Obviously Wolski was damaged goods at that point too and the other top prospect they had around that time, Martin Hanzal, did pan out but his ceiling was a lot lower.
Foppa2118
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Yeah, it did kinda feel like it was only a matter of time.
Also, I misread your post, my bad. I didn't see the "after an extensive history of concussion" part for some reason.
I always liked Martin Hanzal, but it felt like he just perennially underperformed. Lots of injuries, stuck in Arizona on bad teams, and then It think that back injury ended his career. Too bad.
Freaky Styley
Registered User
Necas burst out of the gate this year with 37 points in his first 24 games. He had 8 points in his next 13 games (December) before the trade and just under a point per game since. That's skewing those numbers. Most likely a PPG guy going forward, outside a career year or 2
Foppa2118
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That's kinda what I'm expecting as well. He was under a pt/gm every season until this year where he's been slightly over.
I'm expecting him to be around a pt/gm player with the production bump on the Avs going forward.
flyfysher
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85-90+ points? Someone teach that boy how to seal the deal and shoot ENGs and pad his stats to superstardom. (Sorry, I couldn’t resist).
I liked his skill set (also didn’t realize just how big he was…6’6”!, cue the Hasbro reply) but wasn’t really a huge fan. I know, big surprise here, but I wasn’t fond of how dirty he played.
But it’s still awesome that by the time his back was failing, the Minnesota Wylde, in one of the panickiest panic deals of all time, paid a first rounder and two more picks for him as a rental. And then he signed as a UFA in Dallas.
Foppa2118
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I liked his skill set (also didn’t realize just how big he was…6’6”!, cue the Hasbro reply) but wasn’t really a huge fan. I know, big surprise here, but I wasn’t fond of how dirty he played.
But it’s still awesome that by the time his back was failing, the Minnesota Wylde, in one of the panickiest panic deals of all time, paid a first rounder and two more picks for him as a rental. And then he signed as a UFA in Dallas.
Hanzal had the talent and defensive commitment to be a pt/gm two way center with size and physical play. That's my favorite kind of player. That kind of player makes a team so much better in so many ways.
But with all the injuries, and being stuck in Arizona, it just never materialized, and the production just never quite got there.
It's too bad when players never really reach their potential, because of things out of their control.
Duchene was such a weird player. Henchy and I talked about it once on here. I always felt like Peter Forsberg was one of those few star players who had chemistry with literally anyone you put on his line (much as I love Joe Sakic, I don’t think the same could be said about him). But Matt Duchene was the opposite. He had NO chemistry with Landeskog and when they first paired him with MacKinnon, it was a disaster. Of course when they did it again it worked, probably because they made Duchene play RW the second time around.
He was always a winger, even when he lined up at center, he played like a winger. That’s probably why he did best with wingers who could play center (Fleischmann, O’Reilly, Mueller, even Galiardi). But it was still weird how some linemates didn’t click with him at all. Won’t be surprised if he and Mikko don’t match up either but I haven’t watched him play in a long, long time.
flyfysher
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This is going to be fascinating in terms of inevitable comparisons. How many points will Rantanen and Necas accrue in the POs assuming we make it there as well as throughout a full RS? I’m guessing Rants will score 85-90+ points in the RS. it wouldn’t surprise me if Necas is a PPG given his history and skill but more importantly inflated scoring stats for Avs players.
flyfysher
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I respectfully disagree with your post because I think it lacks context and puts a spin on this. 1. No one denies Rants is supremely talented and an elite player or that he racks up points even when he puts out low effort. For the Avs he produced. No question. 2. Nor do I disrespect all that he accomplished in Colorado as a member of the Avs as you ably and rightfully pointed out. Avs don’t win that SC without Rants. He was dominant as a player. I’ll always be grateful to him. 3. But does having Rants make the present team better with all that background? In terms of production? Team/line balance? Cost/value? Etc.? That’s the only relevant question to be addressed and CMac already answered it for the Avs. 4. The part that I don’t get is how we can say we should have bought out EJ and kept Kadri for another run but act like the Avs and their fans owe Rants. If we owed anyone it was EJ and in retrospect I would have bought him out. 5. No.4 reinforces this is a results oriented biz as JB pointed out. CMac’s primary responsibility is to the team and organization and not the individual player. The only real remaining question for me is whether Necas, playing for the Avs, will produce in the POs or disappear? But I suspect the ultimate disparity in points during the entire next RS between Rants and Necas isn’t going to be significant. The other part that people overlook is the player fit aspect under each team’s systems. Rants, despite being an elite player isn’t a natural fit under the Canes’ or Stars’ system with their personnel. Perhaps with the exception of Mitts, Jost and Newhook, skilled players tend to fit in JB’s system. So I’m optimistic about Necas being with the team. Like I said, I think Rants’ talent will inevitably lead to scoring breakout. He’s that exceptional despite the shade people like me are throwing at him. But I will be surprised if Rants reaches the same offensive heights with the Stars that he did with the Avs. If he does then kudos to him. I will always cheer for Rants except to the extent he negatively impacts the Avs. As an Avs fan, I owe him that much.
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