Management Claude Julien: "He's Still Here"

[bp13]

I haven't thought he's the right one since the end of last year. I know Baseball is a different animal, but forgive me if I'm skeptical about a flawed team making a surge; it certainly didn't do my Yankees much good. The Football Giants were leading their division at one point too.

Well I think we may agree on the quality of this overall team (I'm skeptical of it myself), as well as whether he's necessarily the right coach for a team that claims it wants a more up-tempo style.

However, I think what he's done with this team has been remarkable. Before they lost their two best offensive players and by far their best (Krejci), they looked like a legitimate team. When those guys are back, I expect they'll regain that form in due time. So, I think CJ deserves a ton of credit and we should keep an open mind on whether he's still the best option. And at the very least, there is absolutely no need to be talking about the coach right now. Everything wrong with this team, this morning, has nothing to do with him. The fact he's even considered on this board this morning is just because Boston fans are overly obsessed with blaming coaches. It's absurd.

 

[The Special K]

Again, stack up his record against any active coach. Ten years. Take a look at the very similar, and complimentary, quotes featured in both the LeBrun & DJ Bean articles.

The grass is always greener. Until, alack, it's not.

Let's get effing Tortorella in here, by all means. Or maybe Ron Wilson. Or maybe Mike Babcock. Or maybe Dave Hakstol. Or maybe Adam Oates. Or maybe Mike Milbury.

Or maybe your grandmother.

This is A ROSTER PROBLEM, not a COACHING PROBLEM.

yes, but you are not acknowledging the fact that ALL his teams have had the same problems...with different rosters. That is a "COACHING PROBLEM".

 

[The Special K]

10 days ago when this team was surging and about to lead the division and folks were mentioning him as a strong Coach of the Year candidate since he had basically half of a new roster and was still near the top of the division, was he the "right one for the Bruins anymore"?

yeah, those people do not seem to pick up on trends. This team is young and as such is prone to peaks and valleys. We have gone through this a few times already this year. I don't blame CJ for that, he is doing his best. My issue with him has always been his strategy and his personnel decisions.

 

[Spanky185]

Well I think we may agree on the quality of this overall team (I'm skeptical of it myself), as well as whether he's necessarily the right coach for a team that claims it wants a more up-tempo style.

However, I think what he's done with this team has been remarkable. Before they lost their two best offensive players and by far their best (Krejci), they looked like a legitimate team. When those guys are back, I expect they'll regain that form in due time. So, I think CJ deserves a ton of credit and we should keep an open mind on whether he's still the best option. And at the very least, there is absolutely no need to be talking about the coach right now. Everything wrong with this team, this morning, has nothing to do with him. The fact he's even considered on this board this morning is just because Boston fans are overly obsessed with blaming coaches. It's absurd.

all pro team sports have coaching carousels now, now whether that is right or wrong is a philosophical discussion for another topic. With Claude though i don't believe he always gives the team the best chance to win. This isn't a case of a last place team firing their coach because they finished in last place; the bruins are a transitional team -middling right now- and claude keeps using players who have no future with the club.

 

[bp13]

all pro team sports have coaching carousels now, now whether that is right or wrong is a philosophical discussion for another topic. With Claude though i don't believe he always gives the team the best chance to win. This isn't a case of a last place team firing their coach because they finished in last place; the bruins are a transitional team -middling right now- and claude keeps using players who have no future with the club.

If you knew your job was dependent on winning games, who would you play? The guy was left twisting in the wind for a month this summer. And he's no dummy..he knows how this business works. He loses, he gets fired. Roster be damned. So any suggestion that he's going to play guys in the name of the future is ridiculous. None of us would either. There's not a shot in hell I play a guy like Khoko over a guy like Talbot because he's supposed to be good in the future. He sucks right now, and Talbot sucks less AND has a ton more experience. Easy call.

You and I can disagree with 1-2 roster choices and ice time (typically of marginal importance, guys like Connolly, Spooner or both Millers), but overall preparation is much more important when it comes to "giving them the best chance to win". And I think he has always done an excellent job of preparing this team and kept up a consistent, high-level performance from season to season. I can't name a season he underperformed with a roster, and can think of several he has overperformed with, including this season. So nitpicking ice time and which mediocre player gets scratched is typically just B.S..

 

[Spanky185]

Based on DS' comments pver the summer I actually was expecting more kids and less plugs. Obviously I don't think DS' would not want to win, but if things continue south and plugs are still getting iced, well coaches/managers who don't get along well with the GM usually don't last* anyway.

*unless you're the Anaheim Angels, then you fire the GM

 

[The Special K]

Based on DS' comments pver the summer I actually was expecting more kids and less plugs. Obviously I don't think DS' would not want to win, but if things continue south and plugs are still getting iced, well coaches/managers who don't get along well with the GM usually don't last* anyway.

*unless you're the Anaheim Angels, then you fire the GM

they will get out of their current funk and reel off a few in a row and then everybody will think we are contenders. Until the next crappy streak.

Rinse. Repeat.

 

[GloryDaze4877]

they will get out of their current funk and reel off a few in a row and then everybody will think we are contenders. Until the next crappy streak.

Rinse. Repeat.

Speak for yourself please.

"Everybody" did not consider them contenders at any point this season.

 

[bruins repeat time]

If you knew your job was dependent on winning games, who would you play? The guy was left twisting in the wind for a month this summer. And he's no dummy..he knows how this business works. He loses, he gets fired. Roster be damned. So any suggestion that he's going to play guys in the name of the future is ridiculous. None of us would either. There's not a shot in hell I play a guy like Khoko over a guy like Talbot because he's supposed to be good in the future. He sucks right now, and Talbot sucks less AND has a ton more experience. Easy call.

You and I can disagree with 1-2 roster choices and ice time (typically of marginal importance, guys like Connolly, Spooner or both Millers), but overall preparation is much more important when it comes to "giving them the best chance to win". And I think he has always done an excellent job of preparing this team and kept up a consistent, high-level performance from season to season. I can't name a season he underperformed with a roster, and can think of several he has overperformed with, including this season. So nitpicking ice time and which mediocre player gets scratched is typically just B.S..

Not to mention if Sweeney didn't want the players used they don't have to be here. I think Sweeney is close to a hundred percent behind claudes decisions . The team is trying to win , you can argue who you thinks gives us the best chance but every coach tries to win with what he has. You guys should actually probably be more mad at Sweeney than him . None of the guys you hate which I don't for the record, don't have to be here.

 

[GordonHowe]

I think it's a little of both.

My personal belief is that the B's are a team in transition, but Clode is coaching them like they are legit contenders. I have been particularly disappointed in his decisions on defense. When/if Clode leaves, it won't be because he's a bad coach, it will be because it's time to go.


ps I want no part of Wilson, Torts, or MM and hope the next coach is a younger guy. Hakstol actually has PHI playing pretty well.

A good coach knows what he has and works with it, and I'm certain Claude understands that this is a team in transition. They are way too thin on defense (and are now thinner still with Adam's injury) to be anything like a contender.

The mixing & matching experiments continue with the line up, as sure a sign as any that Julien realizes the relatively weak hand he's been dealt. He's compared this year's team to the team he had to work with his first year, and the comparison is apt.

In my humble opinion, he's done everything possible to get the most out of this group.

I think you're right, though. When Claude leaves, "it won't be because he's a bad coach, it will be because it's time to go." Every coach has a shelf life, and times change.

 

[GordonHowe]

Thanks for that. I know I can come across as brash sometimes

Your points were valid.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

before julien this year, who was the last bruins coach to miss playoffs for 2 consecutives years ?

Milt Schmidt, 1964-65 & 1965-66. Schmidt missed the playoffs 7 of the 11 seasons he coached. Before the lost 60's, you have to go back to Art Ross in the early 1920's.

Pat Burns only made it 8 games into a 2nd straight playoff missed season.

 

[oreillyisgod]

If one reads the various prospects threads, it is possible that in a couple years there will be several outstanding prospects ready for the NHL. Also, there's the possibility that this year's draft (if the San Jose pick turns out to be a lottery pick) could yield another one. At that point, you have to roll over the lineup and let the young kids play. I dont see Claude Julien doing that. At that point, there has to be a new coach, right?

 

[ODAAT]

If one reads the various prospects threads, it is possible that in a couple years there will be several outstanding prospects ready for the NHL. Also, there's the possibility that this year's draft (if the San Jose pick turns out to be a lottery pick) could yield another one. At that point, you have to roll over the lineup and let the young kids play. I dont see Claude Julien doing that. At that point, there has to be a new coach, right?

Spooner/Vatrano/Pasta/Krug/C Miller/Trotman all say hello

The belief Julien doesn`t like/play kids has long been dispelled. What he demands from his players is responsible 3 zone play and most kids/prospects aren`t like Bergy when they come into the league and are immediately mature in all 3 zones

That being said, all coaches are relieved of their duties at some point but to say CJ is because of having a younger lineup I would disagree with

Most coaches would lean more towards having a vet in the lineup over an unproven or still developing kid if given the chance

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

If one reads the various prospects threads, it is possible that in a couple years there will be several outstanding prospects ready for the NHL. Also, there's the possibility that this year's draft (if the San Jose pick turns out to be a lottery pick) could yield another one. At that point, you have to roll over the lineup and let the young kids play. I dont see Claude Julien doing that. At that point, there has to be a new coach, right?

Didn't Neely recently say he was expecting more than just making the playoffs this year?

Don't think that's a signal to the coach to let the young kids play.

 

[ODAAT]

Speak for yourself please.

"Everybody" did not consider them contenders at any point this season.

in fact the majority didn`t if I may piggy back on your post

 

[oreillyisgod]

Spooner/Vatrano/Pasta/Krug/C Miller/Trotman all say hello

The belief Julien doesn`t like/play kids has long been dispelled. What he demands from his players is responsible 3 zone play and most kids/prospects aren`t like Bergy when they come into the league and are immediately mature in all 3 zones

That being said, all coaches are relieved of their duties at some point but to say CJ is because of having a younger lineup I would disagree with

Most coaches would lean more towards having a vet in the lineup over an unproven or still developing kid if given the chance

IMHO Spooner and Pastrnak were forced on him. Trotman was banished to the press box for multiple games after game 1 for some unknown reason (I think others played worse than he did). I think if you were sitting in a dark bar having a Scotch with CJ, he would confide that he wishes he still had his veteran guys.

I have a ton of respect for CJ, he seems like a very decent man who is honest with his players. And definitely brought them back from the Dave Lewis era of suck. Just not sure he would be the right coach if the situation came to pass.

 

[ODAAT]

IMHO Spooner and Pastrnak were forced on him. Trotman was banished to the press box for multiple games after game 1 for some unknown reason (I think others played worse than he did). I think if you were sitting in a dark bar having a Scotch with CJ, he would confide that he wishes he still had his veteran guys.

I have a ton of respect for CJ, he seems like a very decent man who is honest with his players. And definitely brought them back from the Dave Lewis era of suck. Just not sure he would be the right coach if the situation came to pass.

I have always shook my head when fans suggest players are forced on coaches. I think a GM calls up whomever based on injuries or maybe a struggling player and the coach then plays that player. IF Julien was forced, as you suggest to use said players, wouldn`t it be fair to say that Sweeney then would have forced Julien to play them a ton which he hasn`t?

I believe Julien has earned enough of a right to make the call as to whom to play, how much to play them and where in the lineup that player shift into. I`m not a fan of every decision CJ makes, but when it comes to younger players, the list is incredibly long of those who Julien has given ice time to over his time in Boston, helped develop, were they too all forced on him? I think otherwise

We saw early in Julien`s years here, rather than play a kid up in the lineup who might be better skilled, he`d put Yelle up in the lineup or yikes, Donovan before giving a younger player so much as a look. Krejci hurt, and he moves Spooner up, a move that makes perfect sense but one that, IMO, if this were years ago, he would have shifted Kemp/Talbot up in the lineup first

 

[bruins repeat time]

Didn't Neely recently say he was expecting more than just making the playoffs this year?

Don't think that's a signal to the coach to let the young kids play.

This is the funny part to me . The gm and the owner says they are not going through a full rebuild, yet its all Claudes fault . I don't know a coach in the league that doesn't try his best to win with what he has. Buffalo plays gionta ,georges weber etc , do people think they have young guys to fill those spots.

The young guys are all being brought along and getting various degrees of playing time on this team. Last night I was stuck with the devil broadcast and they pointed out bruins inexperience especially on the blueline. We have a lot of guys that are getting more playing time than ever before in the nhl and a lot of them wouldn't be getting it if they weren't here so relax bruin nation.

 

[Dennis Bonvie]

This is the funny part to me . The gm and the owner says they are not going through a full rebuild, yet its all Claudes fault . I don't know a coach in the league that doesn't try his best to win with what he has. Buffalo plays gionta ,georges weber etc , do people think they have young guys to fill those spots.

The young guys are all being brought along and getting various degrees of playing time on this team. Last night I was stuck with the devil broadcast and they pointed out bruins inexperience especially on the blueline. We have a lot of guys that are getting more playing time than ever before in the nhl and a lot of them wouldn't be getting it if they weren't here so relax bruin nation.

Me too, but I find the views from non-Bruin broadcasts to often be insightful.

Ken Daneyko mentioned he saw who was playing on the right-side on D for the Bruins and thought the Devils would try to exploit that weakness. But it looked to him like they were just fine, keeping it simple and not being the detriment he thought they would be.

 

[GloryDaze4877]

A good coach knows what he has and works with it, and I'm certain Claude understands that this is a team in transition. They are way too thin on defense (and are now thinner still with Adam's injury) to be anything like a contender.

The mixing & matching experiments continue with the line up, as sure a sign as any that Julien realizes the relatively weak hand he's been dealt. He's compared this year's team to the team he had to work with his first year, and the comparison is apt.

In my humble opinion, he's done everything possible to get the most out of this group.

I think you're right, though. When Claude leaves, "it won't be because he's a bad coach, it will be because it's time to go." Every coach has a shelf life, and times change.

If Clode does know that this is a "team in transition", why is he not playing Morrow and Chiller at the same time? With kids like Carlo, Zboril, O'Gara, Grizz, Lauzon on the way, now is the time to find out what you have in Morrow and C Miller (and to a lesser extent Trotman).

 

[GordonHowe]

If Clode does know that this is a "team in transition", why is he not playing Morrow and Chiller at the same time? With kids like Carlo, Zboril, O'Gara, Grizz, Lauzon on the way, now is the time to find out what you have in Morrow and C Miller (and to a lesser extent Trotman).

Well, the priority is still to win. Experimenting with JM & C. Miller at the same time isn't in Julien's DNA. They are similar players, with similar strengths & weaknesses.

I'm no expert but I don't think Morrow has earned a place on the defense corps, weak as it is. C. Miller, on the other hand, is a keeper who will only get better as he matures.

 

[ODAAT]

Well, the priority is still to win. Experimenting with JM & C. Miller at the same time isn't in Julien's DNA. They are similar players, with similar strengths & weaknesses.

I'm no expert but I don't think Morrow has earned a place on the defense corps, weak as it is. C. Miller, on the other hand, is a keeper who will only get better as he matures.

Most coaches wouldn`t experiment with JM and C Miller, two young players with less than 70 NHL games between them I believe? We now have a former Norris winner who`s, IMO, almost as much of a shift by shift concern as K Miller is and there`s no other D-men in this organization they could slot in to level out some of the mistakes being made. I love watching C Miller and I also enjoy watching Morrow, but if I watch and take off the offensive production rose colored glasses, I see both with much to learn in their own end but many here seem ignore that.

I`d have no issues handing the reigns over to the kids and prepare myself to take the lumps that come with that but this place would implode when the boys can`t keep the puck outta their own net....but that`ll just be blamed on CJ for playing the kids too much and asking too much

 

[GordonHowe]

Most coaches wouldn`t experiment with JM and C Miller, two young players with less than 70 NHL games between them I believe? We now have a former Norris winner who`s, IMO, almost as much of a shift by shift concern as K Miller is and there`s no other D-men in this organization they could slot in to level out some of the mistakes being made. I love watching C Miller and I also enjoy watching Morrow, but if I watch and take off the offensive production rose colored glasses, I see both with much to learn in their own end but many here seem ignore that.

I`d have no issues handing the reigns over to the kids and prepare myself to take the lumps that come with that but this place would implode when the boys can`t keep the puck outta their own net....but that`ll just be blamed on CJ for playing the kids too much and asking too much

I'm sure many will get on me for this but really, the Kevan Miller bashing is lazy. He's a the bottom pairing guy forced into playing above his head. Period.

The dismissive derogation of Chara is likewise off base. He's older and past his prime. He's slow and gets caught out of position. Yes, he does. He's still a very good defenseman who helped bring the first Cup back to Boston since '72. It reminds of those who were pleased to kick Tim Thomas on his way out of town. No Thomas, no Cup. But never mind. What have you done for me lately?

End rant.

 

[Spanky185]

Most coaches wouldn`t experiment with JM and C Miller, two young players with less than 70 NHL games between them I believe? We now have a former Norris winner who`s, IMO, almost as much of a shift by shift concern as K Miller is and there`s no other D-men in this organization they could slot in to level out some of the mistakes being made. I love watching C Miller and I also enjoy watching Morrow, but if I watch and take off the offensive production rose colored glasses, I see both with much to learn in their own end but many here seem ignore that.

I`d have no issues handing the reigns over to the kids and prepare myself to take the lumps that come with that but this place would implode when the boys can`t keep the puck outta their own net....but that`ll just be blamed on CJ for playing the kids too much and asking too much

I would rather see them lose while giving the kids a chance instead of pretending with them on the bench